View Full Version : Telephoto lens for motorsport/wildlife - £400ish - I'm all searched out!
slideordie
22-01-2009, 22:12
Hi all
Been searching the web for most of the month and am not a lot further on.
As per title, it will be used for motorsport and wildlife.
Budget of about £400 and I would buy second hand.
Do I need IS? I don't think I need it for motorsport but what about wildlife as I'll need a crisp image using a fast shutter speed?
Been looking at Canon lens but are there any Sigma worth buying around this money?
Need to order in the next few days so I have it for WRC Ireland so any help is much appreciated :)
philthejuggler
22-01-2009, 22:26
IS can be useful for sports - the more expensive lenses have a mode for stabilising in just one direction - this is ideal when you are panning a car at low shutter speeds - it will keep the horizontal steady.
For a budget of £400 second hand I'd try and fish out a 300 F4 L. If you need the flexibility of a zoom the current Canon 70-300 IS is supposed to be pretty sharp but will be a stop slower at the long end. This could be argued as more than offset by the IS although IS will not freeze motion.
I took some pictures of wildlife & motorsports with a very reasonable sigma 75-300 APO lens costing about £170 (£100 secondhand!) but your budget will allow you to access better than this. How about a 200mm f2.8 L? You could always add a teleconverter to it when funds allow and this is one sharp lens that is nice and fast too.
slideordie
22-01-2009, 22:32
I had considered the Canon EF 70-200mm f/4.0 L USM Lens which I'm sure is a great lens but was just concerned about adding a teleconverter and shooting handheld without IS?
Also spied the Canon EF 70-300mm f/4-5.6 IS USM which will give me a bit more range and has the IS but obviously isn't an L lens. Then again I'm wondering will I REALLY notice that much difference?
Those are pretty much the two lens that I am stuck between. Mate is also trying to tempt me with a Canon 70-200 F2.8 L for £600 but I'd be really skinting myself for it and again I was worried about the lack of IS. He only shoots motorsport and doesn't use IS at all.
Price range shouts 70-300 IS to me. If you're thinking of streching to £600 then stretch to £750 and get a 100-400L :D
MJ Stebbings
23-01-2009, 09:42
Try and get a used Sigma 70-200 f2.8
or a used Sigma 100-300 f4 EX
Just remeber IS/ VR is a recent innovation. Photographers both sport and wildlife managed to get great shots without it.
It's a tool but not the be all for photographers.
happysnappy
23-01-2009, 09:50
I'd agree with the Sigma 70-200 f2.8, cracking lens & can be found for not silly money. There was an older version like mine for sale on here earlier this week that was a pretty good price
What sort of motorsport and where from. 200mm is a bit on the short side really.
desantnik
23-01-2009, 10:21
70-300 IS.
No doubt, no question.
Best bang for buck out there.
slideordie
23-01-2009, 11:54
Would really be all types of motorsport from track days, rallying, off roading... thinking about it some more I don't think 200mm is enough and I'd rather not have to always use a teleconverter with it.
Thats a good point PsiFox!
slideordie
23-01-2009, 12:01
eBay amazes me, am I missing something here?
EF 70-200L USM bid up to £535 so far, yet can be bought new on Amazon for £479!
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&item=160310727212
What sort of motorsport and where from. 200mm is a bit on the short side really.
It all depends on the track ......
eBay amazes me, am I missing something here?
EF 70-200L USM bid up to £535 so far, yet can be bought new on Amazon for £479!
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&item=160310727212
The lens on eBay has IS. The same lens on Amazon costs £788 new.
hyakuhei
23-01-2009, 12:29
For that money I'd be looking at getting a used Canon 300 F/4L
Its a prime and its super sharp. Its slightly less flexible than a zoom which means you'll have to put some thought into your positioning but you will get some amazing photos out of it.
They come up on the Forsale thread here every now and again, you'll be looking at about £300-£400 depending on condition.
-Rob
Yes, it depends on the track, but I would still say that whilst there are tracks where you can get up close and personal with the action - Mallory Park being particularly good, there are places such as Silverstone, Rockingham which are less good. I find my 100-300 range as being more suitable than I would a 70-200.
pete.rush
23-01-2009, 12:45
The choice of motorsport lens will depend on how close you can get to the track, a 70-200 is fine if like at druids (Brands) your close to the action, on the other hand, if you have barriers and fences between you and the action, the 70-200 won't be much cop, you would need to focus beyond them to get the action.
The canon 70-300mm f4-5.6 IS is a great budget lens that would get you started, sigma also do some 100-400mm lenses at about the £400-500 mark (can't comment on whether they're any good).
You don't need IS for motorsport. GOOD Technique and a steady pan is the only thing required, and don't get sucked into slow shutter speeds action shots. (i.e 1/80..1/125 second, especially for motorbikes), you success rate for good shots would be limited.
Personally I would save up some more cash (motorsport season doesn't really start until March/April) and get the next stage of lens up (sigma 100-300mm f4 £700), but it's your decision.
Most people go for the canon 100-400mm F4.5-5.6 because it's a versitile lens with a usuable focal range and would be also good for wildlife.
A 200 or 300mm lens just isn't good enough for wildlife (unless your in the zoo), a good wildlife (birds) lens is the 400mm f5.6 on a budget, so you would really need 2 lenses, one for motorsport, one for wildlife. Also remember the budget lenses will struggle in poor light conditions unless you crank up the ISO.
Peter
slideordie
23-01-2009, 14:51
The lens on eBay has IS. The same lens on Amazon costs £788 new.
I just read the title at the top! Was wondering!
Thanks for the info folks, keep it coming :)
i think i paid about 560 for my 100-400mm lens, maybe it is worth spending that little bit extra.
Hi all
Been searching the web for most of the month and am not a lot further on.
As per title, it will be used for motorsport and wildlife.
Budget of about £400 and I would buy second hand.
Do I need IS? I don't think I need it for motorsport but what about wildlife as I'll need a crisp image using a fast shutter speed?
Been looking at Canon lens but are there any Sigma worth buying around this money?
Need to order in the next few days so I have it for WRC Ireland so any help is much appreciated :)
Do you NEED a zoom or prime? I picked up the 300mm f4L (non IS) USM for £320 used. A 70-200 f4 USM is about £450 (ish) new.
For that money I'd be looking at getting a used Canon 300 F/4L
Its a prime and its super sharp. Its slightly less flexible than a zoom which means you'll have to put some thought into your positioning but you will get some amazing photos out of it.
They come up on the Forsale thread here every now and again, you'll be looking at about £300-£400 depending on condition.
-Rob
Yup they are great.
300mm f4 on a 1.3 crop body
http://img504.imageshack.us/img504/9409/932f7679mf9.jpg
Its beautiful :)
RichardtheSane
23-01-2009, 22:31
or a used Sigma 100-300 f4 EX
I agree
Sounds like it could be worth considering for your needs
Flexibility of a zoom, but a nice, sharp fast lens. Can be had used for about £400 if you look around.
jdburkedjburke
23-01-2009, 22:42
I am in the same position and just wondering if the Sigma 50 - 500mm would be worth looking at?
It is Between that or the Canon 100 - 400mm
David
slideordie
23-01-2009, 22:45
I really can't stretch the budget anymore than about £400.
Would be interested to hear more views on the Sigma 100-300 f4 EX. Finding one used might be a bit tricky though.
pete.rush
25-01-2009, 18:48
I am in the same position and just wondering if the Sigma 50 - 500mm would be worth looking at?
It is Between that or the Canon 100 - 400mm
David
Very heavy lens, handholdable for short periods, in good light I've seen some good shots with it, but lose the light though and it will struggle to focus, not as fast focusing as the canon 100-400mm, really depends what you want it for?
pete.rush
25-01-2009, 18:57
I really can't stretch the budget anymore than about £400.
Would be interested to hear more views on the Sigma 100-300 f4 EX. Finding one used might be a bit tricky though.
Fantastic lens for the money, probably one of sigma's best zooms, f4 through out the range, 100-300mm usual focal range, works ok with a 1.4x TC in good light, very sharp and not heavy, and a reasonable price.
A friend uses one, check out link below, a few of his images.
http://www.phpbber.com/phpbb/viewtopic.php?t=59&mforum=flylowforumx1z
Peter
slideordie
02-02-2009, 11:04
Well I went for the Canon 70-300 IS in the end, nice weighty lens, feels well built. With IS on it can take a few continuous shots then tends to haunt for the next one and it ends up out of focus.
First two outings with it here:
http://www.talkphotography.co.uk/forums/showthread.php?t=110122
http://www.talkphotography.co.uk/forums/showthread.php?t=110121
desantnik
02-02-2009, 11:11
Hmmm and you think it doesn't do that with IS turned off?
Does it exhibit that problem on static subjects or just moving ones?
slideordie
02-02-2009, 11:13
Just moving ones, I didn't notice it doing it with IS off no.
Unless your lens has a specific panning mode for the IS, like "IS Mode 2" on the 100-400 and 70-200, for example, then you should not have IS turned on when panning. The IS will fight to compensate for the panning movement and you will get mixed results. The idea behind "IS Mode 2" is that it stabilises vertical camera shake but allows free motion for panning left/right. "IS Mode 1" is full IS in all directions and, as far as I know, is the only option available (other than OFF) on the 70-300 lens. Since it is the only option it is not called "Mode 1", but simply "IS On". That being the case, you should disable IS when panning with the 70-300 lens.
desantnik
02-02-2009, 11:21
If you shoot at a fast moving subject (even if panning - the distances are changing) it will be a function of the cameras AF speed and the lens focus motorspeed as to whether or not it can keep up. In AI Servo mode the camera doesn't wait for focus lock before release, just holding down the button is no guarantee AF has worked.... add in some shutter lag and there is the problem.
desantnik
02-02-2009, 11:22
PS the 70-300 IS has mode 1 and mode 2 :D
slideordie
02-02-2009, 11:25
Yes indeed it has Mode 2 for panning. Is AI Servo generally the best for motorsport?
chris250
02-02-2009, 11:25
if you search e-bay you can get a 90-300 canon lens for about £100, i used to get some really good shots (mostly wildlife) before i dropped my camera with this attached, then you can save for when the motorsport season really kicks off and have a bigger budget.
for example:
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3449/3225403794_b920c9ffda.jpg
I had a couple of outings last year with my son on a track day at Cadwell, and at Croft for the BSB using a 70-200L f4 with some good results. I'm looking forward to this year as I have now got a 70-200 2.8 L with the 1.4 converter and looking forward to see the difference.
Not wanting to thread poach, but to the motorsport guys, was this the better move?
Thanks
Jim M
PS the 70-300 IS has mode 1 and mode 2 :D
Thanks for the correction. I don't have the 70-300 and was just guessing that it might have only one mode. Of course, you do have to make sure it is set to Mode 2, which is something I sometimes overlook :)
I had a couple of outings last year with my son on a track day at Cadwell, and at Croft for the BSB using a 70-200L f4 with some good results. I'm looking forward to this year as I have now got a 70-200 2.8 L with the 1.4 converter and looking forward to see the difference.
Not wanting to thread poach, but to the motorsport guys, was this the better move?
Thanks
Jim M
Yes
desantnik
02-02-2009, 13:23
Yes indeed it has Mode 2 for panning. Is AI Servo generally the best for motorsport?
You have two choices really - "one time" focus and continuous focus. The stupid automatic thing just tries to guess for you if the subject is moving... which of course you know it is, so just forget it.
Trouble with continuous focus is that as i said earlier, it never actually achieves lock, it just keeps on trying. After each shutter release it has to start the focus process again, but if you hold down the shutter release button it may or may not find it in time, especially if your subject has moved towards you (even if its a panning shot, the straight line distance between you and the subject does change).
On more advanced camera bodies (1 series in Canon's case or D300/D700/D3/D3x from Nikon) you can set a priority for the AF - fast shutter release, wait for the AF or a half way house. That is what you need to make a difference to AI-Servo mode....
My advice to you is to stick to squeezing off single shots (from continuous shooting mode) and only spray the target when something amazing happens (crashes, Elvis coming back to life, spotting a Big Foot driving a car etc)
chris250
02-02-2009, 15:19
forgot to mention, the 90-300 canon lense i mentioned weigh's next to nothing so it is extremely easy to handle
RichardC27
02-02-2009, 15:39
I've recently bought a Sigma 120-400mm f4.5-5.6 lens for motorsport photography. They can be had brand new for around 480 quid, and they do have IS, which is very useful (at least to me anyway). Have a look at the first few pages of my Flickr for some shots taken with it. I know it's a little bit outside your budget, but it's a cracking lens that I'm very happy with.
Canon EF 70-300mm f/4-5.6 IS USM has IS mode 2 as well. I think you will be happy with the lens. I am.
I really can't stretch the budget anymore than about £400.
Would be interested to hear more views on the Sigma 100-300 f4 EX. Finding one used might be a bit tricky though.
I use a 100-300 pretty much all the time, good lens and very sharp. Would recommend it and you can pick them up for ~£400 2nd hand.
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