View Full Version : Proposed changes to photo sharing/critique (plus mini-rant)
Its recently come to my attention - or rather, I went out of my way to figure it out - that a lot of people just look at pictures in the photo sharing sections but can't/won't/don't care to post any comments.
I posted two pictures yesterday, each getting two replies - one for each photo from the same person saying there was nothing there - whatever that meant??
Anyhow, after more than 70 views each and only two replies, I deleted the pictures. What's the point? I pay for bandwidth and posting pictures here increasingly seems like a waste of time/effort.
Since then I've got another 3 replies for one thread from people complaining because I've taken my picture down. I can't win!! :cuckoo:
So what's the solution? What I propose is this:
1. Limit both photo sharing and critique threads to one photo per thread.
2. Introduce a rating system for said picture so people can at least give an idea what they think of it, even if they can't be arsed to type anything.
I honestly won't be posting anything else until changes are made. I can't be bothered when I don't get any feedback.
GfK,
Couple of points, if you take the pictures down, how can people comment on them ?
Also there are web search engine robots that are constantly searching the forum and basically view every post, so they will report as read and not leave comments !
The user mentioning there was no picture could obviously not see the pictures you had posted, whether that was down to their ISP or a problem with your webspace i cant say, but it is possible people could not see your pictures to comment on them, so didnt !
How long did you leave the posts live with pictures before expecting a comment ? overnight ? 24 hours ? a couple of hours ? You do have to leave time for people to look, i know i am to busy to look at all the pictures during the day and comment on them !
We will discuss your recommendations in the admin section though !
Well just looking at one thread, the first reply was less than an hour after you posted, saying that they couldnt see the picture....
Then another posted saying that it did work, but it took an age to load...
If people can't see the picture, how can they comment?
I've just done a search on all your threads in the Photo Sharing section, and not one of them has had zero replies....
Even looking through all the threads started in there in the past two weeks, there is only one thread that has zero replies, and that was posted at 23:33 tonight.
TBH I don't think there is a problem with the way it's set up at all.
Limit the threads to one pic per thread? That would just make people post loads of threads, and you would get even less replies when your own thread gets bumped off the first page within minutes.
Sorry mate, but I think this may just be a case of much ado about nothing.
Be patient young padawan. Even I didn't bother commenting because your pictures failed to load, and I loaded the thread abour 30 mins after you posted it, (I didnt have time to reply, had a million and one things to do), so either you were very very impatient and took it down early, or your hosting failed.
Regards
Marcel
Please don't slap me, but why not use free hosting for your pics? It's reasonably reliable, and there are plenty of options which still offer you full control over your images (ie, you can delete them). Best of all though, it's not peeing away your own paid-for bandwidth!
How long did you leave the posts live with pictures before expecting a comment ? overnight ? 24 hours ? a couple of hours ? You do have to leave time for people to look, i know i am to busy to look at all the pictures during the day and comment on them !I give up all hope of getting any more replies when they're dangling on the bottom of page 1/drop onto page 2.
They were there about 36 hours or so.
Please don't slap me, but why not use free hosting for your pics? It's reasonably reliable, and there are plenty of options which still offer you full control over your images (ie, you can delete them). Best of all though, it's not peeing away your own paid-for bandwidth!
The bandwidth isn't really the issue. Although my mind remains boggled as to why photobucket want to know my academic history and other irrelevant information before they let me have a free account.
Venomator
19-07-2006, 23:02
Since then I've got another 3 replies for one thread from people complaining because I've taken my picture down. I can't win!! :cuckoo:
I honestly won't be posting anything else until changes are made. I can't be bothered when I don't get any feedback.
To the first bit GfK I would say it is quite rude and inconsiderate to post and then delete ... imo of course ... :p
... reason is as we know ... there is a huge amount of posting going on here and to waste time opening a thread to find no pictures is not good for anyone ... least of all you ...:shake: .. would have been sensible to ask Admin to remove or close the thread ... :thinking:
To the second bit I would say ... that's a bit churlish and surely it can only be your loss ... why be so impatient to receive feedback ... when there are so many people here trying to be fair to everyone ... going through many posts a day commenting and feeding back ... it is not possible to keep up with everything at all times ... :shrug:
I like to see as much of what is posted as I possibly can ... and mostly I will make some comment or other ... but to pop into a thread and find nothing ... as I did with yours is annoying ... even without knowing the post owner had deleted ... :nono: ... one cannot comment on white space too often ... ;) ... and danger is people will possibly not bother with your threads in future ... :eek:
For me I think you just need either a good :hug: ... or a slap ... or both ... imo of course ... :D
i posted that i couldnt see them cos...er...i couldnt see them? I had a lot of Red X yesterday for some reason...
Sometimes piccies dont get many comments, for whatever reason, sometimes patience really is the best way!
its coming up to the time when we have to rearrange sharing slightly, we have over 130members visit yesterday, at one point we had nearly 40 members online, so we will have to adapt
I guess it also depends on what you want? 20 replies of 'Ooo, nice!' or two or three with real comments?
Personally I'd prefer the latter, but with so many posts appearing you have to accept that some will slip through the net.
Forbiddenbiker
20-07-2006, 07:53
Yeah, It is getting very busy here now, Well done all, and although you guys are working very hard I fear you won't be able to keep up if things carry on expanding like this...which they will; from my seat its obvious the snowballs gathering momentum.
I'm sure you've pondered on this already, if I may also add my 2ps worth.
Split the sharin forum into; Landscapes, Wildlife, close/macro, ...or add, don't split, keep the sharin as general shots of interest or some-such thing.
I like the ratings/poll idea too, but only for critique though (one shot) ....perhaps some sort of 1-10 auto vote buttons for each thread. This would allow those you feel unable to critique to have a say, (sort off :lol: ) It would be rewarding for the posters too.
:)
Well as we get busier, we really don't want to lose the personal touch which makes this place different from all the rest and it's down to all of us to ensure that it doesn't become a big impersonal juggernaut. We all like to get opinions and feedback on our stuff, so if you can see a pic lacking any response, then please dive in there and give your opinion. It doesn't matter how much or how little you think you know, your opinion is valid and will be valued by the contributer. :thumbs:
TBH I've not seen one forum or photo sharing site that doesn't have this problem. I've posted pictures onto Deviant Art that have got 30+ comments on Flickr and then like 3 on DA. Its just the way thing works. Or er don't. Just post pics of hot women, then you'll get comments. :D
Just post pics of hot women, then you'll get comments. :D
Funny i noticed that with the Maria Sharapova pics i posted too ! ;)
Deviant Art that have got 30+ comments on Flickr and then like 3 on DA.
That's cos DA is crap and no one can be bothered waiting for it to load! :P
GFK, often times when I log in here there are 20 or more threads active in photosharing, too many for me to spend the time looking at never mind commenting on. I look through the threads, if I see an image that strikes me I'll make a comment. It's not the forum to criticise so if I don't like an image or if it just doesn't appeal I reckon it's better to stay silent.
That's cos DA is crap and no one can be bothered waiting for it to load! :P
Hehe true. But everyone I know on DA has had better luck than I have with it so people are clearly willing to wait.
Conversly I find I get a ton of feedback on dA, and from what little I tried Flickr I got nada - although I probably didn't give it long enough.
Most of what I get on dA is useless now, though. I used to get a fair bit of constructive crit, but now I just get lots of "Ooooooh, nice!".
Mebbe I should try flickr again!
Conversly I find I get a ton of feedback on dA, and from what little I tried Flickr I got nada - although I probably didn't give it long enough.
Most of what I get on dA is useless now, though. I used to get a fair bit of constructive crit, but now I just get lots of "Ooooooh, nice!".
Mebbe I should try flickr again!
I switched to Flickr mainly because its easier to target specific groups than it is with DA. DA feels kind of limited. Photos -> Art -> Architecture -> Interior. But with Flickr you can add your shot to any group you please. It just feels easier to find people with like minded interests. They both have their good and bad sides. I just got depressed seeing rubbish Daily Deviants :) But back on topic, its just the way places seem to work. Some people get left behind, no matter how good your shots are. Everywhere is overpopulated.
Heh at the daily deviation stuff. Most of it I think is fab - there's some of it that doesn't grab me but I can see is good vector art (or whatever)... And then there's some which I just don't get at all - I mean, what's so special about this? (http://www.deviantart.com/view/13855461/)... Other than they seem to have vomited over their keyboard when typing the title // comment :/
edit : And agreed about specific group targeting on Flickr - what little I did put there was in a "Digital Infra Red" section, which I thought was groovy. Definitely gonna have to give it another crack.
Agreed. Most of it is worthy but there is often rubbish there and when you've been there for 4 years without ever getting one when all your mates have you kinda feel depressed :) Not because mine were better, but simply because I felt left out. *sniffs* *runs to flickr support group*
GFK, often times when I log in here there are 20 or more threads active in photosharing, too many for me to spend the time looking at never mind commenting on. I look through the threads, if I see an image that strikes me I'll make a comment. It's not the forum to criticise so if I don't like an image or if it just doesn't appeal I reckon it's better to stay silent.
Same here, I've got 322 unread threads when you click new posts, not a hope I'll be able to go through them all. I'll skim through the titles and anything grabs my attention I'll open it.
There's an interesting article here at the Guardian (http://technology.guardian.co.uk/weekly/story/0,,1823959,00.html?gusrc=rss), that might explain what we're experiencing....
Certainly goes a way to explaining it..
minimeeze
20-07-2006, 17:44
GFK, often times when I log in here there are 20 or more threads active in photosharing, too many for me to spend the time looking at never mind commenting on. I look through the threads, if I see an image that strikes me I'll make a comment. It's not the forum to criticise so if I don't like an image or if it just doesn't appeal I reckon it's better to stay silent.
:agree:
Dod makes a very good point.
If you want peeps to view your posts or images, pick a title they can't ignore or at least put some thought into it.
I've come home to loads of unread posts tonight and I skim through until I see a title that grabs my interest.
I very rarely switch to page 2.
I sometimes make posts that don't get commented on and it is frustrating but understandable.
Just not enough hours in the day to say something meaningful and constructive on every post!
GFK...your title made me open this thread, when I saw 'mini-rant' I thought...''oooh, a kick-off' :lol:
interesting article.
very interesting!
Are you kidding me?lol
Everyone posts pics that sometimes slip through to page two very quickly. I don't think throwing a hissy fit and taking your pic down will help any. I agree with Venom, might actually turn people away and not open your pics now. It's not a big deal, we all want our pics viewed and commented on yes but there are alot of posts here to get too. You can't expect everyone to get to every post of yours. That's just not realistic at all.
The forums are getting bigger. We have all noticed the number of posts growing, it's naturally gonna lose some of that 'community feel' we've always had here, meaning less comments. That's just the way it is! I think what we got here seems to work as is.
just my opinion of course,
Jewel :D
tbh, I don't think chucking your toys out of the pram and taking your photos off is gonna help anyone and just makes you look a bit petty, sorry if that is out of line but it's how I feel.
Photosharing is exactly that, a place to show photos off, if you really want feedback then post them in the critique section of the forum. As the forum gets busier and busier it's going to get increasingly difficult for people to post opinions on every shot in the sharing section. I know I get grief if I spend too long chatting to my virtual friends. lol. By creating a thread like this you're also compounding the problem as people will no-doubt feel compelled to post in this for whatever reason, taking away time when they could've been posting comments in another area!
You have to remember that for most people this isn't the only online community they're part of, let alone real world commitments such as work, family etc. I'm sure it was nothing personal or to do with the quality of your work.
This isn't the first time this has happened and I'm sure it wont be the last, perhaps Admin could adjust the sticky/title at the top of the forum to include a caveat that says 'don't be offended if nobody comments on your pictures as this is the busiest part of the forum, if you really want feedback then post in the crique section' ????
I think that last comment is a good suggestion there Spence.
Forbiddenbiker
21-07-2006, 08:55
interesting article.
very interesting!
Yeah, very interesting indeed, makes me think that our community won't be so readily swamped by the snowball.....which Im pleased about I have to say.
I've never thought about it that way before.... we guys and girls are the trailblazers...the 1% that leads the rest....which is nice eh. :D
Good idea Gandhis last paragraph.
good idea...adding it now
This isn't the first time this has happened and I'm sure it wont be the last, perhaps Admin could adjust the sticky/title at the top of the forum to include a caveat that says 'don't be offended if nobody comments on your pictures as this is the busiest part of the forum, if you really want feedback then post in the crique section' ????
Sounds like a plan
I have experienced few comments on a couple of pics as well but as people have said its just part and parcel of such a popular forum, sure i would love 30 responses with good things to say and tips etc but it just isn't going to happen.
Equally i have had a look through pics that don't grab me and i can't think of anything useful to say about them so there is no point in me commenting or if i can't be constructive/don't have the knowledge of how to improve it i feel no need to post either.
I also find on the odd/rare occasion that i don't think the pics are very good at all, with say a lot of out of focus pics or over processed imo.
There is a current post with pics in now that i think this about, where a couple of pics are ok and rest i don't like (out of focus), i feel it is difficult to say what i feel about the pics in words and be constructive without sounding like i am putting the person down/slagging them off so i would rather not post cos i don't want it to come across wrong and offend people.
I have experienced few comments on a couple of pics as well but as people have said its just part and parcel of such a popular forum, sure i would love 30 responses with good things to say and tips etc but it just isn't going to happen.
Equally i have had a look through pics that don't grab me and i can't think of anything useful to say about them so there is no point in me commenting or if i can't be constructive/don't have the knowledge of how to improve it i feel no need to post either.
I also find on the odd/rare occasion that i don't think the pics are very good at all, with say a lot of out of focus pics or over processed imo.
There is a current post with pics in now that i think this about, where a couple of pics are ok and rest i don't like (out of focus), i feel it is difficult to say what i feel about the pics in words and be constructive without sounding like i am putting the person down/slagging them off so i would rather not post cos i don't want it to come across wrong and offend people.
Although not everyone likes being told they have faults in their images, it IS the best way to learn, to be told what the problems are...
Double_Agent
21-07-2006, 12:33
I personally would rather someone slagged my picture off for what it is as long as they also provided information on how it could be improved upon. Constructive criticism for want of better words.
Saying nothing to me is as useful as a chocolate teapot stood next to an open fire. Its better to get comments whether positive or negative than to say nothing and believe that the mainstream think its ok.
My 2p's worth on this. NOW please dont be too harsh on me :P
Problem is if I don't know how they can improve it - which is down to my lack of knowledge i am better not commenting and letting someone with the knowledge comment.
If i can see a way i will happily tell people, but if something is out of focus, i can't say - "it doesn't look good and is out of focus, next time get it in focus.". So i feel it is better again on that occasion (which is super rare) to not comment.
What i will try to do is comment now regardless as you say it is better that people know the fault than go on thinking it is fine.
I personally would rather someone slagged my picture off for what it is as long as they also provided information on how it could be improved upon.
Ditto.... were all here to learn and it's the only way really.
there is always going to be a small amount of people who will take offence to constructive criticism, but as long as people bear in mind that blunt comments or non-constructive criticism wont help, we should all be fine..
Double_Agent
21-07-2006, 13:20
there is always going to be a small amount of people who will take offence to constructive criticism, but as long as people bear in mind that blunt comments or non-constructive criticism wont help, we should all be fine..
Agreed and I guess that is going to be down to the individuals personality on how they take it. I think when you submit pics to be commented upon, you really do have to accept anything thrown at you and just ignore the comments you dont think will help you in anyway.
For me, every comment no matter how small the info is on it, is a help as a novice.
Marianne
21-07-2006, 13:52
not having the energy to read all this and so I apologise if this has already been said....... I have to say that if I feel an image of mine has been overlooked I sometime 'bump' it up by adding a smiley camment to get it noticed again :naughty:
Forbiddenbiker
21-07-2006, 14:00
I'd like to see 'naughty bumber' under Marianne's user name.
:lol: :naughty:
I hope he meant 'bumper':lol: :lol: :D
Forbiddenbiker
21-07-2006, 14:26
I hope he meant 'bumper':lol: :lol: :D
:D :(
I did, honest Marianne. :| :)
Marianne
21-07-2006, 14:34
ha ha ... I had to look really hard to see what you meant! :)
How about 'Rogue thread bumper' or just plain 'Thread bumper' ? :D
Venomator
21-07-2006, 15:52
Good plan Gandhi and :clap: for being quick on the uptake Matty ... :thumbs:
Just read the Guardian article (normally against my religgiownee :lol:) ...
I think it is well worth repeating the last paragraph in that article ... (I hope this is not infringing anything ?) ... it may help some understand the problems of user groups more easily ... or not as the case may be ... with credit of course to ...
Charles Arthur
Thursday July 20, 2006
The Guardian
"So what's the conclusion? Only that you shouldn't expect too much online. Certainly, to echo Field of Dreams, if you build it, they will come. The trouble, as in real life, is finding the builders." :clap:
BTB ... what the fourex is a 'meme' ... to the thick and uninitiated ... :thinking:
The term "meme" (IPA: [miːm]), coined in 1976 by Richard Dawkins, refers to a replicator of cultural information that one mind transmits (verbally or by demonstration) to another mind. Dawkins said, Examples of memes are tunes, catch-phrases, clothes fashions, ways of making pots or of building arches. Other examples include deities, concepts, ideas, theories, opinions, beliefs, practices, habits, dances and moods which propagate within a culture. A meme propagates itself as a unit of cultural evolution analogous in many ways to the gene (the unit of genetic information). Often memes propagate as more-or-less integrated cooperative sets or groups, referred to as memeplexes or meme-complexes.
Some proponents of memes suggest that memes evolve via natural selection — in a way very similar to Charles Darwin's ideas concerning biological evolution — on the premise that variation, mutation, competition, and "inheritence" influence their replicative success. For example, while one idea may become extinct, other ideas will survive, spread and mutate — for better or for worse — through modification.
Some meme-theorists contend that memes most beneficial to their hosts will not necessarily survive; rather, those memes which replicate the most effectively spread best; which allows for the possibility that successful memes might prove detrimental to their hosts.
BTB ... what the fourex is a 'meme' ... to the thick and uninitiated ... :thinking:
I think it's us - or some of us? :thinking:
Meme
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Jump to: navigation (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Meme#column-one), search (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Meme#searchInput)
The term "meme" (IPA (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/International_Phonetic_Alphabet): [miːm]), coined in 1976 by Richard Dawkins (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Richard_Dawkins), refers to a replicator of cultural information (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Information) that one mind transmits (verbally or by demonstration) to another mind. Dawkins said, Examples of memes are tunes, catch-phrases, clothes fashions, ways of making pots or of building arches. Other examples include deities (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Deity), concepts (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Concept), ideas (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Idea), theories (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Theory), opinions (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Opinions), beliefs (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Beliefs), practices (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Practice), habits (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Habit), dances (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dance) and moods (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mood) which propagate within a culture. A meme propagates itself as a unit of cultural evolution (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cultural_evolution) analogous (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Analogy) in many ways to the gene (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gene) (the unit of genetic (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Genetics) information). Often memes propagate as more-or-less integrated cooperative sets or groups, referred to as memeplexes or meme-complexes (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Meme-complex).
Some proponents of memes suggest that memes evolve (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Evolve) via natural selection (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Natural_selection) in a way very similar to Charles Darwin (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Charles_Darwin)'s ideas concerning biological (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Biology) evolution on the premise that variation (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Variation), mutation (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mutation), competition (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Competition), and "inheritence" influence their replicative success. For example, while one idea may become extinct (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Extinction), other ideas will survive, spread and mutate (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mutation) for better or for worse through modification.
Some meme-theorists contend that memes most beneficial to their hosts will not necessarily survive; rather, those memes which replicate the most effectively spread best; which allows for the possibility that successful memes might prove detrimental to their hosts.
*blows smoke from barrell*
Fastest cutter & paster in the Southwest!
LOL. wassup Spencer! :lol:
Delete his entry CT, he'll just look like an ejit then!
Saying nothing to me is as useful as a chocolate teapot stood next to an open fire. Its better to get comments whether positive or negative than to say nothing and believe that the mainstream think its ok
For that you should post in the critique forum, photosharing is meant to be less demanding, a place to post images for others to share without the pressure.
Delete his entry CT, he'll just look like an ejit then!
Is that so you can a T-shirt with '<-----I'm with the eedjit' on it? eh? eh?
I'm perfectly capable of looking like an 'eejit' on my own without aany assistanmce from you young sir!
Rapscallion!
p.s. sorry about my rather shallow dippings into the forum at the mo, been quite busy at work this week nosing around posh folks houses!
minimeeze
21-07-2006, 21:54
Flamin' Eck... admin are on top form tonight with all the new user titles :eek:
Venomator
21-07-2006, 22:05
The term "meme" (IPA: [miːm]), coined in 1976 by Richard Dawkins, refers to a replicator of cultural information that one mind transmits (verbally or by demonstration) to another mind. Dawkins said, Examples of memes are tunes, catch-phrases, clothes fashions, ways of making pots or of building arches. Other examples include deities, concepts, ideas, theories, opinions, beliefs, practices, habits, dances and moods which propagate within a culture. A meme propagates itself as a unit of cultural evolution analogous in many ways to the gene (the unit of genetic information). Often memes propagate as more-or-less integrated cooperative sets or groups, referred to as memeplexes or meme-complexes.
Some proponents of memes suggest that memes evolve via natural selection in a way very similar to Charles Darwin's ideas concerning biological evolution on the premise that variation, mutation, competition, and "inheritence" influence their replicative success. For example, while one idea may become extinct, other ideas will survive, spread and mutate for better or for worse through modification.
Some meme-theorists contend that memes most beneficial to their hosts will not necessarily survive; rather, those memes which replicate the most effectively spread best; which allows for the possibility that successful memes might prove detrimental to their hosts.
Am I glad I asked ... :shake: :gag: :thinking: :eek:
But thanks Gandhi ... :clap:
And CT of course ... :thumbs:
No mater what it is ... you always get an answer to it on this forum ... :D
Cheers guys ... :p
im struglling to come up with one for Bachs though...
Is that so you can a T-shirt with '<-----I'm with the eedjit' on it? eh? eh?
I'm perfectly capable of looking like an 'eejit' on my own without aany assistanmce from you young sir!
Rapscallion!
Hrmph! :razz:
:p
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