question for the HiFi experts

Rowee

Rowee

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I've been looking around online for split equalisers and if people would use them but no one seems to be asking the same question as me.

I have a seperates system with a pair of loudspeakers and a pair of floorstanders. I want to be restrict lower frequencies to the loudspeakers and push more of the bass to the floor standers.

Am I crazy to want to do this? I figured an equaliser with 2 channels would solve this but a lot of posts suggest not using an eq at all.

I get a that messing with frequencies will change the sound and potentially lose some quality but my goal isn't to make the sound more bassy, merely to adjust which sounds come from certain speakers.

Any suggestions on the best way to do this?
Any help greatly appreciated :)
 
I'm no expert, but I have done something similar, just for the hell of it.

I used two integrated amps. One set of speakers for each amp. Out from first amp into second amp. I can't remember exactly which outs and ins, but was fairly obvious.

Then adjust volume of each amp to suit.

I gave up and got a decent pair of speakers.
 
You'd really need two stereo EQ's to do what you want to do and two stereo amplifiers as well (unless you wanted to run everything in mono). It's certainly doable but it seems rather a lot of hassle! :)
 
Don't you just need a some crossover filters? Low pass for the floor standers and high pass for the others if you don't want to send bass frequencies to them.

I believe that is what you're actually after, which is why you've not found them by looking for equalisers.
 
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A good home cinema style amplifier does that for you :) Just roll the microphone out and it will adjust the outputs accordingly to the capability and balance the sound...I really wouldn't take the seventies approach of the equalisers and do it myself...However don't the speakers have the filters in them anyway, they'll relay what they can and you'll loose the rest...
 
What about a DJ mixer? You would need to be able to separate the upper and lower frequencies, with upper to say speakers A and lower to speakers B.
An equaliser should be able to do the same thing, but you would need one for each set of speakers, and may need two amps. So effectively bi-amping, but instead of one amp for low and one for high frequencies as you would normally do, you would be using one amp for each pair of speakers, with each equaliser or mixer separating the frequencies.
 
dejongj said:
A good home cinema style amplifier does that for you :) Just roll the microphone out and it will adjust the outputs accordingly to the capability and balance the sound...I really wouldn't take the seventies approach of the equalisers and do it myself...However don't the speakers have the filters in them anyway, they'll relay what they can and you'll loose the rest...
Click to expand...

This :)
 
If you can bi-wire the speakers you'd get the same result for a lot less hassle. I've got my stereo set up this way, using two seperate outputs from the same amp, one for the treble and one for the bass.
 
aliengrove said:
If you can bi-wire the speakers you'd get the same result for a lot less hassle. I've got my stereo set up this way, using two seperate outputs from the same amp, one for the treble and one for the bass.
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It won't be the same result though as both speakers would receive identical signals.
With a mixer/eq you should be able to separate the frequencies going to each pair of speakers, if that is what's req'd
 
I can biwire them but haven't yet as I wanted to solve this first. Maybe that's the simplest answer, and maybe I'm underestimating how good newer kit is at balancing itself out with no input from me.

Bi-wire is certainly the cheapest option at the moment, so I think I'll pop out for some speaker cable this afternoon and see how much of a difference that makes :)
 
There are a couple of ways to do this. The first is with an active crossover which splits the signal into LF and HF and uses a separate amplifier for each: http://www.thomann.de/gb/dbx_223_xs.htm?sid=a87b43c2108559595d29d822b4f8e102

http://www.topsound.fi/images/detailed/18/DBX-223XS.jpg

The other (cheaper) option is to use a passive crossover on the output of the amplifier: http://www.thomann.de/gb/the_box_pa_10_ii_ersatz_crossover.htm

I'm not recommending either of the products in the links as suitable for your application - they are just for illustration.

However, are your speakers suitable for doing this? i.e. do you have a set of full range speakers and a set of subs?

EDIT: And there is a third, easier option which wouldn't need any crossovers.

As you probably don't need the sharp cutoff you get with pro audio crossovers, you could probably parallel up the inputs to two amplifiers and just use the amplifiers' tone controls to bias the responses.


Steve.
 
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to do what you want properly would cost a small fortune
to do it cheaply i don't think you would really benefit

the proper way would be to bypass the built in crossovers and use an active crossover between the pre and power amp using individual power amps per speaker unit its what's known as going fully active and can get very expensive

when you say you want to make certain sounds come from different speakers well thats a hard one because speakers as a whole are designed to produce a full frequency range and can't really differentiate between particular instruments or sounds

filters ( crossovers ) cut frequencies at particular points and speakers tend to have a natural mechanical cut off or should i say become very inefficient at frequencies they were not deigned to produce the filter design is tailored to the mechanics of the speaker and the cabinet is designed around both of these factors ( or the speaker is designed around the cabinet but you get my drift )
so in a perfect world upsetting this balance won't improve the sound but as we know nothings perfect and people do away with in built crossovers and go fully active but like i said it can be very expensive

to do what you want ( sort of ) you could use a graphic equaliser or 2 but you would still need to have separate amplifiers for each speaker or the graphic equaliser would only work on channels ( left and right for stereo ) so 4 speakers four amplifiers ( or 2 stereo pairs ) and a graphic for each channel which you could alter to your hearts content to try and get the sound you are looking for

the equalisers would be wired between the source ( cd palyer for example ) and the amplifier wiring the 2 equalisers together via something like tape monitor ( the chances are the equalisers would come from that time )

if you can find a surround amp with separate pre in's and outs for each channel you substitute the 2 stereo amps for one of those wiring the graphics between the pre in's and outs which would eliminate the problem of 2 separate volume controls

i'm only scratching the surface here but to do what you want to do equalisers would be the easiest route
 
Musicman said:
Don't you just need a some crossover filters? Low pass for the floor standers and high pass for the others if you don't want to send bass frequencies to them.
Click to expand...

I suspect a crossover may not really be what he's after. Standard passive crossovers have slopes of around 24dB/octave which is rather severe if the aim is just to send a bit more low end to one set of speakers and a bit more mid/high to the others. The slope can be changed to something less severe on most digital system processors but even 6dB/octave would be severe for what seems to be the aim here. :)
 
Thanks for the replies. I've bi-wired the speakers and the sound has certainly improved. I think I'll leave the cross over idea for now.
 
So how does the bi-wire work? Have you got a passive crossover at the amplifier with separate LF and HF runs to the speakers?

If all it does is allow you to send the same full range signal to both the LF and HF sections of the speaker via separate cables, I can't see this making much difference unless your cables add a significant amount of resistance to make voltage drop across them a problem.

EDIT: Explained here better than I can do it: http://www.achievum.eu/bi-wiring.html


Steve.
 
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Steve Smith said:
So how does the bi-wire work? Have you got a passive crossover at the amplifier with separate LF and HF runs to the speakers?

If all it does is allow you to send the same full range signal to both the LF and HF sections of the speaker via separate cables, I can't see this making much difference unless your cables add a significant amount of resistance to make voltage drop across them a problem.

EDIT: Explained here better than I can do it: http://www.achievum.eu/bi-wiring.html


Steve.
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iv'e always had my doubt's about bi wiring although i do believe it will/can change the sound that the speakers produce but if that sound change is for the better really is a debatable subject
we all hear things in a different way and have our own idea of what sounds good and what doesn't, i prefer a natural laid back sound when listening to quality hifi but from lesser equipment i prefer a punchy vibrant sound or an impressive sound as i call it
the problem with an impressive sounding system is i can't listen to it for long where a good quality natural sound i can listen to for hours

iv'e seen loads of arguments over the years about the benefits and shortfalls of bi wiring but bearing in mind we all have are own expectations of what we listen to but no amount of wire will change the original character of the speaker overall
i know amplifiers can change how a speaker behaves dynamically but still the overall character will remain and to get better dynamics bi amping is the way to go
bi wiring ?
never really been convinced but it does sell a lot of wire :)

if bi wiring is a benefit to the individual i have no argument there
 
I think it's mythology. If your cables are sufficiently large then exactly the same signal will appear at both sets of terminals on the speaker. In that case, there is no difference between this and a single cable.

There are many more variables within a system which will have a greater effect than changing the speaker cables.

Perhaps the placebo effect makes people think that the money they have spent on cables is having an effect!

This definitely applies to the ridiculous things you can buy which are alleged to improve the sound - such as gold plated mains fuses and power connectors in marble boxes!

http://www.kevinboone.net/hifimainscables.html
http://sound.westhost.com/cables.htm


Steve.
 
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Steve Smith said:
I never learn!
Click to expand...


:p

I fully agree on bi-wiring though, if all you're doing is running two sets of cables from the same single amplifier then it isn't going to make any difference whatsoever as long as you're using decent cables in the first place. Most people would never be firing more than about 5-10 watts into their speakers even with the thing cranked up to a decent level, even cheap rubbish cable isn't going to have a problem passing that kind of low level power a distance of 3-5 metres.
 
:D

SpeakersCorner_zpse1a97207.jpg~original
 
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