A model bike and car (Product Photography)

[Bassit]

After attending Garry Edwards generous offer of a free day at the Lencarta warehouse for a Product Photography Workshop i am keen to have a go so here is tonight's attempt and i also took a shot of the setup in case anyone is interested.

I set up the lighting for the bike and then placed the car in the same spot, it looked ok on the back of the camera but on the laptop i can see its not, ill have another go with the car tomorrow on a white background and change some of the lights around..

The Harley has had very minimal editing, whereas the Rolls has been more heavily edited, ill get it right next time.

Harley Model. by J.Garton, on Flickr

Rolls Royce Model. by J.Garton, on Flickr

10deg Gridded studio light camera left, small softbox with speedlight above and slightly right and another speedlight to the far right with a flashbender copy rolled up to act as a snoot.
Models Shot Setup. by J.Garton, on Flickr

 

[Garry Edwards]

Models are always a difficult subject
1. They are nearly always very badly finished, compared to something full size - never really shiny where they should be, and always with pretty crude casting marks. The lack of really reflective surfaces makes it easy to get diffused specular highlights (even when you point the softbox the wrong way but difficult to get them looking really good. And the rough casting marks always make the fine detail look something other than fine, especially when hard lighting is used to create interest.
2. And because they are so small, it can be difficult to light them precisely.

Because of this, every tiny mistake looks worse than it would be if you had photographed something bigger.

Anyway, enough of being nice...
1. The softbox was pointing the WRONG WAY! I showed you how it should be arranged for this kind of shot, behind the subject and tilted so that it doesn't light the front, leaving it possible to light the front separately.
2. A 10 degree honeycomb is a good choice but it is (a) too big for the subject and (b) pointing down far too much, it needs to be pretty much on the level and just skimming along the front elevation. I showed you how to make it smaller, using cinefoil/blackwrap. If you don't have any, get some. And if you're impatient, use something like black card instead - it works just as well but is less easy to use
3. Get rid of the clutter. It reflects light where it isn't wanted. You've seen my studio, it is nearly all black (except for the white wall with the office and toilets, which I can't do anything about - but I keep well away from it when I'm shooting).

All in all though, a very good first effort

 

[Bassit]

Thanks for the feedback Garry it's appreciated.

I'll have another go tomorrow taking on board your comments and move the clutter out of the way but i cant get rid of it completely, i'll buy a black sheet to cover it up.

 

[Bassit]

And today's attempts.

This time i set up the lighting separately for the car from the bike and it shows, the car was a bugger to get to show the colour properly and then trying to get lighting in the boot and to light up the bonnet (i shouldn't of bothered a it has fingerprints on it) i kind of gave up in the end and used the full gridded light (i had cut a hole in a piece of cardboard to cover most of the grid up), i was struggling without any stands and clamps to hold flags to block out small parts of light, the interior was slightly overexposing because of the full grid being used, i ended up lowering the highlights in post.

20140821-DSC_0940 by J.Garton, on Flickr

20140821-DSC_0939 by J.Garton, on Flickr

20140821-DSC_0930 by J.Garton, on Flickr

20140821-DSC_0916 by J.Garton, on Flickr

20140821-DSC_0897 by J.Garton, on Flickr

20140821-DSC_0970 by J.Garton, on Flickr

 

[Garry Edwards]

That's a massive improvement.
Your problem here seems to be equipment based. You saw the value of Cinefoil last Sunday, and although lack of stands, boom arms and the like can be a problem, Cinefoil is so light in weight that it becomes much easier to use than any other kind of flag material.

Also, consider the use of small mirrors to light hard-to- reach areas. As long as they are picking up 'spare' light, that light can be redirected. This stuff works well, we didn't need to use it last week but then I have more lights available

 

[Bassit]

Again, thank you Garry.

You are right i don't have any cinefoil, ill order a small'ish (1m x 30cm x2 £10 on ebay) amount as you said it lasts forever, i have very limited funds at the moment so it is difficult needing to buy equipment, the problem being that i could probably spend £500 on just a few lighting modifiers, a boom and a shooting table.

I want a strip softbox as nearly every shot i seem to like uses one, so i think ill order one along with the cinefoil.
The mirrored vinyl you linked to i can get of a good friend that has a sign business, so no cost there at least.

The equipment i have already:

4 x lighting stands and a cheap tripod with spigot adaptor (used as a low stand).
2x flashguns.
40x40cm pop up softbox (eazyfold style)for speedlights
& an s fit adapter for the speedlight bracket.
2x 200w studio lights.
1x neweer 160w studio light. (bought for backgrounds and gels).
70x50cm universal fit softbox for neweer.
x4 yongnuo triggers.
1.5m octobox. (in a single garage).
Various umbrellas x4 and reflectors x2.
10deg grid for standard reflector.
A flashbender copy with homemade straw grid.
Lastolite posing tubs & baby poser.
And a small sheet of black perspex, scrounged of sign business mate.

So as you can see i have a load of stuff, but i am lacking s fit modifiers.

Oh! and the choice of subject was chosen because they were some of the only items i could get my hands on that were new, my dad collects em and leaves them in their boxes.

 

[=ReBeL=]

Good thing about studio is that pretty much anything can be your subject. I was recently playing with vegatables.... erm, no, not in that way. Just a small assignment... sorry, I'll start again. I went to tescos and bought couple of peppers and decided that this will be my subject (this still doesn't sound any better). Anyway, the idea was to photograph and light it (the subject) in few different ways and see what results I could get. While I can't say it was a complete success, it was a good exercise in lighting.

Another day I went to Aldi's and bought £5.99 set of small kitchen knives, just for photographing purposes, after I was finished with them it was a not too bad addition to my kitchen.

One of my subjects was a well worn and dirty safety boot.

Don't be put off by lack of amazing subjects to photograph. Learn with what you have, only then move to something more exotic/expensive.

 

[=ReBeL=]

Just to add to it: my theory is that if I can light and photograph a cheap product in a way that it makes it look good, interesting and more expensive, then I won't have a problem making a good looking, expensive product to look good. Hope it makes sense

 

[Bassit]

.

Thanks Adrian, i have very little imagination so i struggle with ideas, i will just have to spend some time when walking round the supermarket as opposed to the usual bloke way of grabbing what i went in for and leaving.

I do have a few subjects yet to go with what i scrounged off my dad.

Although i do have an idea for some food photography.

 

[Bassit]

Just to add to it: my theory is that if I can light and photograph a cheap product in a way that it makes it look good, interesting and more expensive, then I won't have a problem making a good looking, expensive product to look good. Hope it makes sense

A sound theory if you ask me, i do understand you, practice makes perfect.

 

[Garry Edwards]

Again, thank you Garry.

You are right i don't have any cinefoil, ill order a small'ish (1m x 30cm x2 £10 on ebay) amount as you said it lasts forever, i have very limited funds at the moment so it is difficult needing to buy equipment, the problem being that i could probably spend £500 on just a few lighting modifiers, a boom and a shooting table.

I want a strip softbox as nearly every shot i seem to like uses one, so i think ill order one along with the cinefoil.
The mirrored vinyl you linked to i can get of a good friend that has a sign business, so no cost there at least.

The equipment i have already:

4 x lighting stands and a cheap tripod with spigot adaptor (used as a low stand).
2x flashguns.
40x40cm pop up softbox (eazyfold style)for speedlights
& an s fit adapter for the speedlight bracket.
2x 200w studio lights.
1x neweer 160w studio light. (bought for backgrounds and gels).
70x50cm universal fit softbox for neweer.
x4 yongnuo triggers.
1.5m octobox. (in a single garage).
Various umbrellas x4 and reflectors x2.
10deg grid for standard reflector.
A flashbender copy with homemade straw grid.
Lastolite posing tubs & baby poser.
And a small sheet of black perspex, scrounged of sign business mate.

So as you can see i have a load of stuff, but i am lacking s fit modifiers.

Oh! and the choice of subject was chosen because they were some of the only items i could get my hands on that were new, my dad collects em and leaves them in their boxes.

It's mainly about knowledge, followed by experience (lack of experience just means that you kiss more frogs before you find the prince, it doesn't stop you getting an equal quality of result)
Equipment just makes it easier. Obviously, I have a lot of equipment but then before I became involved with Lencarta I bought a lot of equipment from a different manufacturer, because, to me, light is everything.
Lack of equipment (and lack of space) just makes it harder, and restricts the range of things that you can do well - it doesn't impact on the quality of the things that you can do.

You will learn far more about lighting by photographing still life subjects than from any other kind of subject, there's an enormous range of things you can shoot, all with different challenges and different solutions. Basically you just need to decide whether it's going to be a product shot or a 'character' shot. A product shot needs to be perfect, because lit well (hard lighting) every mark that you can't see will become visible and every mark that you can see will jump out and hit you!b A character shot doesn't have to look pretty and you can emphasise things like wear and mud

 

[cargo]

Hiya.
Thought I would add an image I tried to light after attending the workshop. I tried to light it with a bit of drama but I got carried away with coloured gel on the back and sort of lost my path/vision. Hey ho in the spirit of sharing and learning plus the fact Garry went to a lot of trouble setting this up I wanted to show him we took something away from the day and actually tried to photogragh an object.
Lots to learn though even if it's only for fun.
Obvious probs are composition and dust (numpty I am necer even cleaned it) but there easier to fix than lighting of which I am struggling with.

ps:speedlights only at my house_led torch on background.

Gaz

 

[Bassit]

Hiya Gary

Hiya.
Thought I would add an image I tried to light after attending the workshop. I tried to light it with a bit of drama but I got carried away with coloured gel on the back and sort of lost my path/vision.

You'll improve each time you try as you learn a little bit each time, my photos aren't perfect far from it but its about learning.

Hey ho in the spirit of sharing and learning plus the fact Garry went to a lot of trouble setting this up I wanted to show him we took something away from the day and actually tried to photogragh an object.
Lots to learn though even if it's only for fun.

The reason i started this thread , although not everyone that attended may have as much free time as i have at the min.

Obvious probs are composition and dust (numpty I am necer even cleaned it) but there easier to fix than lighting of which I am struggling with.
ps:speedlights only at my house_led torch on background.

Gaz

I quite like the composition tbh and that's the thing with this kind of shot all details are on display and the slightest little bit of dust etc shows up, apparently we can just call them "character' shot's" instead of product shots.

You will struggle with just speedlights as they have no modelling light to show where the light is hitting, you have to shoot one at a time and look at the rear of the camera to see if you have got the effect you wanted (been there, its hard work), whereas with studio lights you have the modelling lights that show you instant results, not to mention the lack of lighting modifiers.

 

[Bassit]

@=ReBeL=

Adrian, i looked on your flickr the other day and you have some excellent product shot images on there, i did a bit of shopping yesterday, a spray bottle, a small bottle of glycerine and various peppers and a couple of chillis, watch this space..

 

[Garry Edwards]

Hiya.
Thought I would add an image I tried to light after attending the workshop. I tried to light it with a bit of drama but I got carried away with coloured gel on the back and sort of lost my path/vision. Hey ho in the spirit of sharing and learning plus the fact Garry went to a lot of trouble setting this up I wanted to show him we took something away from the day and actually tried to photogragh an object.
Lots to learn though even if it's only for fun.
Obvious probs are composition and dust (numpty I am necer even cleaned it) but there easier to fix than lighting of which I am struggling with.

ps:speedlights only at my house_led torch on background.

Gaz

Well, OK, thedust shouldn't be there but that's easy to avoid in the future.
I think the rough sawn wood works really well, but a greater depth of it would have been better.
The gelled background may have been overdone a bit in terms of brightness, that is of course a matter of personal taste and when you're just waving a torch around it isn't easy to judge the exposure anway -but overexposure of the background has led to light contaminating the edges of the watch, you really needed both less exposure and more distance between subject and background.
The angle of the watch is causing a problem, it's leaning back and this has caused it to reflect the wooden product base where it shouldn't and has also caused those unequal reflections on the front of the watch. With shiny subjects, small differences make big differences.

 

[Bassit]

And...

Today's attempts.
I struggled with these, really struggled, its good learning though and i am kind of happy with the results, i had to burn the background in lightroom as i don't have a black background and couldn't stop some light hitting the back wall.

EDIT: for some reason, i am unable to view my photos (or editing) critically until i actually upload them to either here or flickr, all of the photos below have been re-edited, because i can now see what's wrong with the photos, i really should be more patient when it comes to posting my images.

As soon as i put this on here it looks washed out, edit in lightroom already done.
20140824-Studio Session-084 by J.Garton, on Flickr

And the re-edit of the above image.
20140824-Studio Session-084-2 by J.Garton, on Flickr

20140824-Studio Session-139 by J.Garton, on Flickr

20140824-Studio Session-055 by J.Garton, on Flickr

Just because...
20140824-Studio Session-032 by J.Garton, on Flickr

 

[=ReBeL=]

@=ReBeL=

Adrian, i looked on your flickr the other day and you have some excellent product shot images on there, i did a bit of shopping yesterday, a spray bottle, a small bottle of glycerine and various peppers and a couple of chillis, watch this space..

Thank you mate, still very much beginner to it all.

I didn't actually use glycerine, just plain water. I agree though, it is not as easy as it looks.

I went to Asda this weekend and bought a 3 quid worth small bowl. Will be playing with that soon.

I really like how it challenges me to think about a creative way to light a common plain subject. It is not as easy as throw some light on it and get the exposure right. There is so much more to it.

 

[cargo]

Hiya Gary


You'll improve each time you try as you learn a little bit each time, my photos aren't perfect far from it but its about learning.



The reason i started this thread , although not everyone that attended may have as much free time as i have at the min.



I quite like the composition tbh and that's the thing with this kind of shot all details are on display and the slightest little bit of dust etc shows up, apparently we can just call them "character' shot's" instead of product shots.

You will struggle with just speedlights as they have no modelling light to show where the light is hitting, you have to shoot one at a time and look at the rear of the camera to see if you have got the effect you wanted (been there, its hard work), whereas with studio lights you have the modelling lights that show you instant results, not to mention the lack of lighting modifiers.

Hi John.
Thanks for the feedback. Yes I did pick that up at the workshop day, that the model lights were a big benefit.For me though I just can't see a reason/justifying to buy any proper studio lights as I'm just palying around with photography and with not doing it for anyone else I can take all the time in the world. If that makes sense to you .

Gaz

 

[cargo]

Well, OK, thedust shouldn't be there but that's easy to avoid in the future.
I think the rough sawn wood works really well, but a greater depth of it would have been better.
The gelled background may have been overdone a bit in terms of brightness, that is of course a matter of personal taste and when you're just waving a torch around it isn't easy to judge the exposure anway -but overexposure of the background has led to light contaminating the edges of the watch, you really needed both less exposure and more distance between subject and background.
The angle of the watch is causing a problem, it's leaning back and this has caused it to reflect the wooden product base where it shouldn't and has also caused those unequal reflections on the front of the watch. With shiny subjects, small differences make big differences.

Well Garry. Many thanks for the reply it is way better than I expected. The background and depth of field issue I will try and remember for future tries. I am away from tommorrow untill Saturday but will do some more when back.

Gaz