Canon 7D mk2 owners thread.

Gaz J said:
I find the most critical is the 500 f4. Given that I tend to shoot with it at around 10-15 metres sometimes less a small error can be quite noticeable. DOF at f4 at 10 metres is 8-10 cms depending on what you use to calculate it so just 2-3 increments off in MAF will show up.

I check at 25 times focal length and then check the finished result at various distances afterwards.

One of the most useful bits that i use is a nest box made from a stranded rope. If the lens is off that shows it straight away.

Finger still hovering Neil?
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Finger pressed Gaz, should be here in the morning :D
 
I think you'll be quite happy with it Neil. I never owned the original 7D but the MkII seems to be a sensible evolution bringing in the latest AF tech.

Just wish the weather would break so I can actually take something other that the moon.
 
Gaz J said:
Has anyone come across anything about some cameras having AF inconsistency where they drift between front and back focus?
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Yes, PotN has threads detailing the severe AF faults of the 7D, 70D, 7D MkII, 60D, 50D, 5DMkII, 5DMkIII and probably many, many more.
 
I've been a FoCal user since the beta days. I've never had any problems with it. But I do tend to RTFM - so I've always used steady, bright lighting as TFM advises. It seems that the vast majority of people who experience problems think that a black cat in a coal cellar at night is a good target for testing AF.
 
hollis_f said:
I've been a FoCal user since the beta days. I've never had any problems with it. But I do tend to RTFM - so I've always used steady, bright lighting as TFM advises. It seems that the vast majority of people who experience problems think that a black cat in a coal cellar at night is a good target for testing AF.
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I use a halogen flood on the target for consistency.
 
Looking forward to seeing your shots Neil, i hope they are as good as the ones you have been posting previously
 
Folks,

I posted on this a while ago. I have been playing ping pong with Canon and received the following.

My explanation of the change

Its a complex use case and you missed a key element of my original question which is the combination of exposure sim and MF with Live View.

5d3 & 7D operation

1) Put lens in MF
2) Focus using live View
3) Exposure Sim is active
4) Square focus box is present at all times and can be manoeuvred around the screen
5) Exposure sim changes the exposure as you move the box around the screen
6) You can utilise the histogram to balance the exposure

7d2 Operation

1) Put lens in MF
2) Focus using Live View
3) Square focus box is NOT present
4) Exposures sim is active
5) Press the magnify button to turn on the square focus box in x1 mode as per the manual
6) Exposure sim turns off so cannot be used to balance the exposure.

As you can see from the above cases the functionality has changed to prevent the combination of MF and exposure sim in the manner described in the 5d3 case.

The Canon Final Response

Thank you for your detailed explanation of your case. The metering mode has been changed in the new EOS 7D Mk II compared to the previous cameras, e.g. On the EOS 5D Mk III there was no option for partial metering / spot metering / centre weighted average options as in live view the evaluative metering was the only option.

In older cameras the frame in the middle had multiple functions as it is used as AF area in live mode AF, also it is a starting point for magnification and also the centre point of the metering. This has also been changed in the new camera as the frame in the middle is now only part of the magnification feature, which is only there for MF assist. (Hence why the AE Lock is applied to 5x and 10x magnifications)

In EOS 7D Mk II When you move around the 1x frame when the magnification feature is activated you are only moving the frame to an area that will be further magnified (5x or 10x) when the button pressed again.

The metering will always remain the same as previously selected. It is even more pronounced when partial or spot metering is selected in live view on the EOS 7D Mk II as there will be a circle to show the area that is metering. The circle will remain in the middle even if the magnification frame is moved around.

Unfortunately the development team do not share their plans with us for future upgrades/updates, but I will pass your feedback to them

My Comment:-

Interesting to see we now have all the metering modes but have to AEL lock and recompose to be able to take a meter reading from outside of the center of the frame. This feels like a backwards step for what is primarily used for landscape shooting.
 
So what's the general consensus here?

I've no doubt that this is an upgrade from the original 7D, but it seems like the MKII's competitor is actually the 6D, so how do those two compare especially given the big difference in price.

I think I may well have already got one of these if it had come with Wi Fi, now I'm just not quite so sure.
 
I cannot really see where 6D is competing with the MkII.

I see the 6D as a cheapish FF entry wereas the MkII is right at the top of the crop sensor pile. Many people bemoaned the passing of the 1D MkIV which removed the high spec high build quality crop body from the range. Personally i would have loved to see the 7D MkII in a one series body but that probably didnt fit in with in with Canons target market.

Canon have tried to give the MkII as high a build quality as they can with significantly improved weather sealing, second only to the 1DX and it pretty much stands alone in the Canon line up in my view.
 
theshortstack said:
I've no doubt that this is an upgrade from the original 7D, but it seems like the MKII's competitor is actually the 6D, so how do those two compare especially given the big difference in price.
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I can't imagine why you think the 6D is a "competitor" to the 7D Mk2?!
 
Perhaps going over old ground in this thread, but I managed to get out today with the 7D2 and a Tamron 150-600 that I bought this week to replace the Canon 500 f/4 that I sold due to the weight.
I am not too impressed with the Tammy yet and have arranged to get a replacement lens. The AF is very erratic, yet when it gets it right its looking good, but the keeper rate due to OOF images is dismal. I have read a lot about this and its a known problem so hopefully the next one I get will be an improvement.

Here is one of the good images I got today.

Taken in harsh late afternoon winter sunlight. Canon 7D2, Tamron 150-600. 1/1000, f/6.3, ISO 3200, 600mm. The only PP is converting from RAW to JPEG, 50% crop, sharpening for screen when I resized it to up-load, no NR applied at any stage, no changes in levels.
There is room for improvement in PPI know, but I was pleased with this picture which is almost SOOC and wanted to share to see what your thoughts are on this combination.


8Y4A1604 - Nuthatch by Trev4 Photography, on Flickr
 
Trev4 said:
Taken in harsh late afternoon winter sunlight. Canon 7D2, Tamron 150-600. 1/1000, f/6.3, ISO 3200, 600mm. The only PP is converting from RAW to JPEG, 50% crop, sharpening for screen when I resized it to up-load, no NR applied at any stage, no changes in levels.
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I'm not a bird shooter myself but even I can appreciate that shot :D but I don't think that it's too surprising that you got a nice low noise or maybe even noise free shot at ISO 3200. I remember from my 20D days that once the light allowed shutter speeds into the hundreds or thousands they didn't look half bad. No surprise therefore that a much newer camera can produce a shot like this.
 
Trev4 said:
Perhaps going over old ground in this thread, but I managed to get out today with the 7D2 and a Tamron 150-600 that I bought this week to replace the Canon 500 f/4 that I sold due to the weight.
I am not too impressed with the Tammy yet and have arranged to get a replacement lens. The AF is very erratic, yet when it gets it right its looking good, but the keeper rate due to OOF images is dismal. I have read a lot about this and its a known problem so hopefully the next one I get will be an improvement.

Here is one of the good images I got today.

Taken in harsh late afternoon winter sunlight. Canon 7D2, Tamron 150-600. 1/1000, f/6.3, ISO 3200, 600mm. The only PP is converting from RAW to JPEG, 50% crop, sharpening for screen when I resized it to up-load, no NR applied at any stage, no changes in levels.
There is room for improvement in PPI know, but I was pleased with this picture which is almost SOOC and wanted to share to see what your thoughts are on this combination.


8Y4A1604 - Nuthatch by Trev4 Photography, on Flickr
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Knowing your usual standards Trev i would say that's a border line keeper, harsh light has done you no favors but for me that's the type of image quality i would expect from the mk1.
 
Neil B said:
Knowing your usual standards Trev i would say that's a border line keeper, harsh light has done you no favors but for me that's the type of image quality i would expect from the mk1.
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Thanks for your thoughts Neil. The only point I would take you to task on is that you would "expect this from the mk1". There is still a lot of information in the image to do a lot of recovery, but as you say, the light hasn't played nicely and I didn't think the picture justified any more time because its never going to be a good shot. All the other shots from this session have been binned already, this one was kept, not for its quality, but because I was interested in what the mk2 can do under difficult lighting, and it was hard to get exposures right in the harsh lighting conditions on this day, but I feel the mk2 coped better than the mk1 would have done, which has resulted in more information being retained.
I rarely went above ISO 800 on the mk1 and never got anything even approaching acceptable at ISO 3200, and that's why I posted this image up without any NR, or any serious PP really, to get reactions, its virtually SOOC, I'm certainly not posting it as a finished image that's going to gain any stars, and it certainly wont be posted in the birding section :eek:
I must admit that I was hoping for better high ISO handling from the mk2 than has proved to be the case, but, there is an improvement in this area which I feel can be seen in this image.
Thanks again for your comments (y)
 
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Trev4 said:
Thanks for your thoughts Neil. The only point I would take you to task on is that you would "expect this from the mk1". There is still a lot of information in the image to do a lot of recovery, but as you say, the light hasn't played nicely and I didn't think the picture justified any more time because its never going to be a good shot. All the other shots from this session have been binned already, this one was kept, not for its quality, but because I was interested in what the mk2 can do under difficult lighting, and it was hard to get exposures right in the harsh lighting conditions on this day, but I feel the mk2 coped better than the mk1 would have done, which has resulted in more information being retained.
I rarely went above ISO 800 on the mk1 and never got anything even approaching acceptable at ISO 3200, and that's why I posted this image up without any NR, or any serious PP really, to get reactions, I'm certainly not posting it as a finished image that's going to gain any stars.
I must admit that I was hoping for better high ISO handling from the mk2 than has proved to be the case, but, there is an improvement in this area which I feel can be seen in this image.
Thanks again for your comments (y)
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You are not alone Trev, my recycle bin has never seen so much action since getting the mk2 :ROFLMAO:
I've still got my mk1 that i'm keeping for macro but this mk2 is going to be a tough one to learn, try using DPP4 if you're not already using it as i've noticed a slight improvement in image quality.
 
Neil B said:
You are not alone Trev, my recycle bin has never seen so much action since getting the mk2 :ROFLMAO:
I've still got my mk1 that i'm keeping for macro but this mk2 is going to be a tough one to learn, try using DPP4 if you're not already using it as i've noticed a slight improvement in image quality.
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Strangely enough, I have given my mk1 to my wife because she wants to do macro :oops: :$
I downloaded DPP4 last night and briefly took a look, its a whole new program compared to the previous version but I didn't go further than looking at the UI, I did like what I saw though. In theory DPP4 should be better than other software as Canon have all the camera data to design the software with, data that isn't made available to other software designers (afaik). I'll sure give that a closer look and run some images through, cheers for the heads-up.
The mk2 will take a lot longer to learn for sure, I feel like I am right at the bottom of the learning curve, and having bought the Tammy 100-600 (and a faulty one at that), its put roller boots on my feet and the slope is even steeper :thinking:
 
A shot I took on Saturday with all 65 AF pts selected on Case 5 default settings, AI SERVO, Av-mode (didn't have time to switch to Tv-mode when this chap suddenly appeared).

Canon 400mm F/5.6L on 7D Mark II, ISO 800, 0.33 ev, F/6.3 (already set on Av-mode), 1/4000th. I am always set on 10 fps but didn't machine gun this shot - Just a single shot on Partial Metering.

RAW post-processed in Aperture and Photoshop CS6. Noise reduction applied to sky background but not to the bird. It's a very substantial enlargement with the bird in the bottom righthand corner - Faster than my panning!

Legless and wingless, returning from a Christmas party! :D ....



Given the very fast, erratic and underlating flight path of Pipits I think the 7D2 AF system worked well. Of course, Lady Luck was at my side.

Separate thread in the birds section: http://www.talkphotography.co.uk/threads/pipit-bullet-id-please.571986/
 
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Yay! Thanks to an early Christmas present of PSE13 I can now process 7D2 files in ACR instead of DPP which I really don't enjoy and find very slow, and have been using for two months(ish). I upgraded to PSE 12 in August, so finding I needed 13 so soon was a bit of a blow. It's like putting a nice comfy pair of slippers back on :-D.
 
I'm quite interested in this body, perhaps I'll stump for one in the new year. I'm wondering how much of an improvement the AF accuracy is compared to original 7D and 70D, both of which I own. High ISO is much better on 70D compared to 7D and I hear 7D2 is similar to 70D in that regards. I think i'll wait until the new year as I say, only real shame for me is the lack of wifi, really really handy on the 70D for getting images out quickly on the fly via my phone.
 
Az_GTi said:
I'm quite interested in this body, perhaps I'll stump for one in the new year. I'm wondering how much of an improvement the AF accuracy is compared to original 7D and 70D, both of which I own. High ISO is much better on 70D compared to 7D and I hear 7D2 is similar to 70D in that regards. I think i'll wait until the new year as I say, only real shame for me is the lack of wifi, really really handy on the 70D for getting images out quickly on the fly via my phone.
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....I had a 70D before my 7D Mark II and think that the 7D2 high ISO is better on the 7D2 but not by a huge margin.

The 7D2 AF system is definitely superior but it's extensive range of options and their customisation makes a steeper learning curve.

There are WiFi transfer solutions for the 7D2 but I don't use WiFi in cameras so I can't tell you what they are. WiFi card?

Way back somewhere in this thread I posted a long list of pros and cons re the 7D2 vs 70D.
 
Good evening all

just upgraded to the 7dmkii from a 40d last weekend was my 1st time using it in anger shot a rugby match on Saturday afternoon due to the fading light was shooting in av mode with the iso between 3200 and 6400 and on sunday spent the morning at wicken fen photographing birds on twigs at iso 1000-2000 when I got home and downloaded the raw files into lightroom and zoomed in one to one I noticed that the files were full of noise is this normal (please note im not expecting 6400 files to be perfect but after reading about how great this camera was I low light I cant help but feel a little disappointed) your thoughts would be greatly appreciated as im thinking of sending it back or am I expecting to much I normally only to A3 size

thanking you all in advance
 
It isn't going to be known for it's iso performance.....after a couple of weeks playing with it, frankly it's about 1 stop better than the mk 1 in my opinion, poor after 5 years evolution, ISO 1600 is about as much as you'd go without noise reduction, but as an upgrade at a reasonable price it's got an excellent AF system compared to other crop cameras.

Canon really need to get their act together with their sensors IMHO, they've got over the AF debacle with the 1 Dx but they are going to get a poor reputation (if they haven't already) for sensor performance.

7D2 is an excellent camera for shooting in good light......but for me it's been a disappointing body overall, I really expected more from the sensor.....too many pixels for a 1.6 crop.

George.
 
George said:
.......7D2 is an excellent camera for shooting in good light......but for me it's been a disappointing body overall, I really expected more from the sensor.....too many pixels for a 1.6 crop.
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That's it in a nutshell, George.

I seem to remember Canon playing down the reduced pixel density of the 1Dx with the prophecy that cropping its output would still beat the 1D4 in quality (and it does IMO)...so why didn't that follow through with the 7D2 ?

Bob
 
George said:
It isn't going to be known for it's iso performance.....after a couple of weeks playing with it, frankly it's about 1 stop better than the mk 1 in my opinion, poor after 5 years evolution, ISO 1600 is about as much as you'd go without noise reduction, but as an upgrade at a reasonable price it's got an excellent AF system compared to other crop cameras.

Canon really need to get their act together with their sensors IMHO, they've got over the AF debacle with the 1 Dx but they are going to get a poor reputation (if they haven't already) for sensor performance.

7D2 is an excellent camera for shooting in good light......but for me it's been a disappointing body overall, I really expected more from the sensor.....too many pixels for a 1.6 crop.

George.
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Not sure why it's disappointing? Is there a better crop body out there? For me it does exactly what it's supposed to do and since I always process my images, having to add a bit of NR isn't really an issue.

I can't say I've researched it but are there any crop sensors out there which are far and away better?
 
Phal said:
Not sure why it's disappointing? Is there a better crop body out there? For me it does exactly what it's supposed to do and since I always process my images, having to add a bit of NR isn't really an issue.

I can't say I've researched it but are there any crop sensors out there which are far and away better?
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....For Canon system users the 7D Mark II is the crop-sensor flagship and what some may consider a disappointing ISO noise performance is surely only relative to their own expectations and other camera bodies they use (often full-frame). I am finding 7D2 ISO noise performance only slightly better than the 70D which is less than 18 months old and has the previous generation of the same sensor type but for me this is satisfactory.

However, I understand George and other's expectations after a 5-year gap and when compared with say Nikon's, or dare I say Sony's, sensor performance. But you know what, I have noticed that when viewing some images which look very cold and mechanical they tend not to be shot on a Canon - Personally I much prefer pictures which don't look so.... coldly digital.

Either way, I think the 7D Mark II offers an excellent package overall and high value-for-money when you take into consideration its many other features such as AF system, rugged build quality and options to customise. My opinions are based on having now shot more than 2,000 images on mine.

But like you, Etienne, I exclusively shoot RAW and apply noise-reduction (NR) to the backgrounds of 99% of the images which I keep. At ISO 800 on a very substantially enlarged crop there has been enough in the original RAW capture to achieve satisfactory NR without the result looking unnatural or over processed on a bird's plumage.

Having too high expectations of anything (or anybody!) is always likely to end in disappointment. It actually has been known to break up marriages :D
 
If you want to shoot at ISO6400 then you're going to need a better camera than the MKII.

Canon sensors are lacking in dynamic range at low ISO's in comparison to Sony/Nikon. At higher ISO's the canon claws back a bit of ground. It would be nice if they could compete with the other sensors at all ISO but its not the case at the moment. The resolution of the 1DX is fine as far as I'm concerned. Its more that just noise control etc. With huge pixel counts then running at 12-14 frames/sec needs far more processing power and this inevitably has a cost implication. I'm sure they could do it but i've not heard anyone complain about the res of 1DX/D4S.

If sensor performance is everything for someone then buy a Nikon. They have the best sensors overall. For me its about the whole camera not about one individual bit of it.

Get out here and use it.
 
Gaz J said:
Canon sensors are lacking in dynamic range at low ISO's in comparison to Sony/Nikon. At higher ISO's the canon claws back a bit of ground. It would be nice if they could compete with the other sensors at all ISO but its not the case at the moment.
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Generally, all the comparisons I've seen that show Canon sensors lagging behind in DR have been for full frame sensor cameras. It's possible I've just missed the right articles but I just get the impression that people are expecting a bit too much from a crop sensor. Barring some big technology change like another completely different type of sensor, how much better do people think a crop sensor can get?

*edit*

More importantly, is there a better high ISO crop sensor body out there? DR is nice but when you need fast exposures then a decent high iso capability is better. All the reviews I saw seemed to praise the high ISO results despite them not being that much better than the other APS-C sensor bodies from Canon.
 
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Th D7100 easily has the edge in sensor performance over the MkII. Nikon seem to be shying away from crop sensors a bit and pushing the DX crop mode of thier FF bodies. But im sure if they do bring out a competitior to the MkII it wil have the edge in sensor performance. but thats generally a givien these days and for me not something I worry about.

I use Canon and like the ergonomics of the bodies which I think are better than Nikons. Many others will say they prefer Nikons. Byt whats right for you and is going to satisfy your photography needs. Very few bodies are launched that are genuine game changers. D800/810 is IMO the only one.

You dont need the latest and greatest to produce stunning images. Yes they can help you get them but the very best photographers will still take great images whatever they use.
 
I like to have sensor cleaning set to 'disable' & use the function manually when I feel it's required. I notice that whenever I recharge or load a fresh battery sensor cleaning occurs.
Is this a fault with my mk2 or has anyone else experienced this?
 
Isnt the default to clean each time the camera is switched on and off.
 
One thing this camera had in vast amounts was marketing hype, Canon were never going to make this perform close to the 5dmk3 due to price and it had to sit somewhere.
Add a few pro's spouting how good this was going to be but with no wow images was also a great move on top of the 5 year wait.
I was speaking to someone the other day who also has one and he sent 2 back and the 3rd is like a totally different camera, expect to see a lot of refurbs on ebay in the future and good luck to anyone who has a "golden one".
 
Gaz J said:
Th D7100 easily has the edge in sensor performance over the MkII. Nikon seem to be shying away from crop sensors a bit and pushing the DX crop mode of thier FF bodies. But im sure if they do bring out a competitior to the MkII it wil have the edge in sensor performance. but thats generally a givien these days and for me not something I worry about.
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Is that just the usual dynamic range that everyone always moans about or are there tests actually showing as better with high ISO too?
 
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