Corporate portrait preferred lighting setup?

Haha! Well, maybe those photographers should leave those jobs for the ones who have only done them 20 times and find clients who want something more challenging!
 
DizMatt said:
why not just use a tripod then?
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The enviro portraits were taken at 1/20 ... guess it was the best excuse she could come up with...

Sir SR said:
SWPP member just means you pay ten quid a month.

If they have a qualification that probably holds more weight.

DOI : I have a qualification from the SWPP
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Didn't know that, just assumed there was some form of QA...

Sir SR said:
I like hurley's work (he's the only famous person who follows me on twitter).

I think you need to have the white background in your repertoire, regardless of your own personal feelings on it!
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I like Hurley a lot, he's had quite a bit of internet presence recently. Not sure if his style would be appropriate for a corporate bio headshots though, think his look is more geared towards actors? He does give some excellent advice for posing non-model clients in his videos.

I'm comfortable doing white bg and have done it a fair few times before so might be better to do something more creative / challenging in this case.
 
I don't like white BG. I think the brightest "thing" / point in the picture should be the face. I don't really plan on offering white BG at all. I like greys and gradients. There are plenty of other photographers around doing white BG (some of the only white BG), so I don't have to.
 
A few examples here where the lighting setup was white blown back at about F11 and about F8 for the subject. Key light Lencarta 120cm octabox, rim light is a gridded reflector. Tend to use this as standard to be honest if I can, although the client requested black and white here.

http://www.charterphotography.co.uk/london-corporate-portraits-estate-agents/

The shot here is perhaps not typical of a corporate headshot, but matched the look this author wanted. Similair setting as above. Key light is a lencarta gridded softbox and a lencarta snoot (I love this snoot!).

http://www.charterphotography.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/2015/03/MC1_9729-Edit.jpg

If you want a look at a mix of different types of corporate portraits a load here. I'm not saying these are the best examples you'll find, but it shows a good variety. One thing I've learnt to try and avoid is unlit white or unlit light grey,it just looks like you haven't lit or processed the white background properly, looks a bit shabby.

http://www.charterphotography.co.uk/portfolio/corporate-portrait-photographer/

HoppyUK said:
The only people that don't like white backgrounds are photographers that have done it 100 times already...
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This...... :rolleyes:

EDIT: Just looked at Hurley's work, it's nice, but all of his subjects are all soooooo good looking!
 
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Thanks Marcus, some useful stuff there, yes f/8 + 11 is what I've used for white bg before.
Just trying to decide between socked 16" beauty dish and 32" softlighter for key (yet to buy an octobox). Thinking the latter for speed as it'll need less accurate positioning between the clients.
You've persuaded me to use a gridded reflector for rim, gives a little extra polish. What do you meter yours at?
Are you using any fill or is that octo big enough to 'wrap' round? Will prob use a shoot through for fill plus a reflector at front for the mature staff.
 
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HoppyUK said:
The only people that don't like white backgrounds are photographers that have done it 100 times already...
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Not so, Hoppy. My customers have a particular dislike for them. They are viewed as an out of date fad :)
 
Sir SR said:
I like hurley's work (he's the only famous person who follows me on twitter).

I think you need to have the white background in your repertoire, regardless of your own personal feelings on it!
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Hurley's work is awful. Every shot the same. His actors shots are the worst. He isn't interested in the subject whatsoever, it's all about the great Peter Hurley.
 
Whippet said:
Thanks Marcus, some useful stuff there, yes f/8 + 11 is what I've used for white bg before.
Just trying to decide between socked 16" beauty dish and 32" softlighter for key (yet to buy an octobox). Thinking the latter for speed as it'll need less accurate positioning between the clients.
You've persuaded me to use a gridded reflector for rim, gives a little extra polish. What do you meter yours at?
Are you using any fill or is that octo big enough to 'wrap' round? Will prob use a shoot through for fill plus a reflector at front for the mature staff.
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I set it up and put an X on the floor using tape and each subject has a left and right shot taken. Once I'd nailed the lighting for the 12 estate agents actual shooting time was no more than 20 minutes. A couple of the guys just walked in, listened to the posing instructions and just got it first time, walking in and out in about 30 seconds, some needed a little more relaxing to get the best out of them which is where the dark art of people management comes in. Jokes, questions, all coming out from one half of my brain whilst the other half is ensuring the tech side of the shot is consistent with the set.

Gridded reflector is pretty cool, but if you can invest in a gridded snoot, try that. You have to meter these using back of camera, or at least I do as my flash meter just never nails it how I want it. My Octa wraps enough light around so to not use a fill and the gridded reflector does the rest. If I wasnt using this I'd prob use a shoot through brolly instead just to lift this side of the subject, used to do this however felt it looked a little flat.

Keep the lighting exactly the same for everyone throughout the set as when you put the images next to each other in a grid format as they might on a website or brochure, the differences will jump out. Unless you are 100% confident to get your framing right in camera, shoot a little loose so you can adjust them all the same in post.

JennyGW said:
Hurley's work is awful. Every shot the same. His actors shots are the worst. He isn't interested in the subject whatsoever, it's all about the great Peter Hurley.
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This guy is one of the worlds leading photographers for headshots. You could call me awful if I was making the serious amount of money he makes. I think what you need to remember is that this is his online portfolio to sell his work, I've seen a lot of his other work in the past and he is a pretty awesome photographer. You can have your opinion of course, but not many will agree. Would love to see the headshots you produce in comparison.
 
Just read the whole thread rather than picking at it. People saying the white background is a FAD and so yesterday. No it isn't. It's a choice either by...

1) The client. Perhaps because they have a white website background or maybe need something neutral so that where ever they use the images, in whatever colour background website, brochure, whatever, using a clean white background is an all rounder and does place emphasis on the subject.

2) The photographer. Client doesn't know what they want? Go for white background. It's rare that a client who is not sure will complain about the white background. Shoot in blue, green, dark grey, to try and be arty whatever and it is possible they will say that it doesn't match branding. May suit the direct intended use by the person who's crazy idea it was to commission the shoot to update a certain thing, but a few months later when someone else wants to use them for something else, they may not match and who is blamed? The photographer. Not the crazy PR and marketing guy who wanted sunflower yellow.

As for the white background, as Hoppy and Garry Edwards have talked about for years, it is two different shots. One to light the background, the other to light the subject. The clever bit is lighting the subject in an inventive way and ignoring what people consider 'standard' for white background. This is where you will stand out as a photographer when using a 'standard' white background setup.
 
What do you guys use to retouch the skin in the shots quickly and accurately? I find that this is by far the biggest time-eater for me (I do it manually in PS).
 
=ReBeL= said:
What do you guys use to retouch the skin in the shots quickly and accurately? I find that this is by far the biggest time-eater for me (I do it manually in PS).
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Corporate headshots = no.
 
=ReBeL= said:
None whatsoever?
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No mate, try and look at them and go for obvious stuff before I've shot them. If when looking on screen an obvious nose hair or something like that jumps out, may clone out, but otherwise none. Although a few of the shots have a bit of nutty processing going on, my corporate portfolio on my website have zero retouch work.
 
Marcus Geezer said:
No mate, try and look at them and go for obvious stuff before I've shot them. If when looking on screen an obvious nose hair or something like that jumps out, may clone out, but otherwise none. Although a few of the shots have a bit of nutty processing going on, my corporate portfolio on my website have zero retouch work.
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Interesting. What about other types of headshots / portraits?
 
=ReBeL= said:
Interesting. What about other types of headshots / portraits?
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If I'm taking standard portraits then may remove the odd blemish but the intent will never be to do a full rework. Actors headshots then deffo yes, it is pretty much expected but the art is to make it look like you haven't. Some stuff I may see one shot out of a set I really like and work on it to make it as good as I feel it can be. Time is the fire in which we burn and outside of personal project work will hardly ever do more than is expected and/or paid for.

EDIT: To answer your question above. Quick is clone only. Full rework is liquify, frequency separation, dodge and burn. For ladies may hand draw additional make up on.
 
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Marcus Geezer said:
If I'm taking standard portraits then may remove the odd blemish but the intent will never be to do a full rework. Actors headshots then deffo yes, it is pretty much expected but the art is to make it look like you haven't. Some stuff I may see one shot out of a set I really like and work on it to make it as good as I feel it can be. Time is the fire in which we burn and outside of personal project work will hardly ever do more than is expected and/or paid for.

EDIT: To answer your question above. Quick is clone only. Full rework is liquify, frequency separation, dodge and burn. For ladies may hand draw additional make up on.
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Thanks Marcus. Great to hear your way of doing it.

Exactly the same way I do my retouching (liquify, freq sep, d&b), all by hand, but I had this included in the price of the shoot. I just finished photos for a client and it took me way too long for my liking (skin condition). From now on I will offer full retouching as an extra and just have basic editing / retouching included in the price.

Interesting that you don't use any filter based PS plugins. After pulling my hair out I started to look around.
 
=ReBeL= said:
Thanks Marcus. Great to hear your way of doing it.

Exactly the same way I do my retouching (liquify, freq sep, d&b), all by hand, but I had this included in the price of the shoot. I just finished photos for a client and it took me way too long for my liking (skin condition). From now on I will offer full retouching as an extra and just have basic editing / retouching included in the price.

Interesting that you don't use any filter based PS plugins. After pulling my hair out I started to look around.
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I find the best results are by hand rather than any fancy filters, but as you do, I try and cost them in to the job. Had one guy turn up with the biggest cold sore on his lip, although editing that horrible thing out was within the job limits, was not the nicest thing to have large on my dell ultrasharp screen! Sometimes it is just a graft when doing multiple retouching portraits, but as long as the dosh covers it, get Netflix on your other monitor or on your tablet, throw something hilarious on like Revenge of The Nerds 2 and just go for it.
 
Marcus Geezer said:
I find the best results are by hand rather than any fancy filters, but as you do, I try and cost them in to the job. Had one guy turn up with the biggest cold sore on his lip, although editing that horrible thing out was within the job limits, was not the nicest thing to have large on my dell ultrasharp screen! Sometimes it is just a graft when doing multiple retouching portraits, but as long as the dosh covers it, get Netflix on your other monitor or on your tablet, throw something hilarious on like Revenge of The Nerds 2 and just go for it.
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Agreed. Definitely best results are when retouching by hand, however it takes time. I will have a look around and get some trials from the best ones out there. Last time I tried them (few years ago, mind you) I wasn't really happy with the results. Maybe things changed.

I usually do retouching listening to music on my headphones, but will to try stick something on the other monitor to watch.

Going back to lighting, I need to invest in beauty dish. I see you use it sometimes. What do you prefer (for corporate and actors) beauty dish or octabox?
 
Whippet said:
I like Hurley a lot, he's had quite a bit of internet presence recently. Not sure if his style would be appropriate for a corporate bio headshots though, think his look is more geared towards actors? He does give some excellent advice for posing non-model clients in his videos.
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Hurley tries to shoot corp headshots just like he tries to shoot actors. He wouldn't last 5 minutes with actors I know who I have shown his work. His attitude with clients is dreadful, some of the things I have heard him say on videos would be laughable if they weren't true. 20 grands worth of Hassy and 10 grands with of Keenos to shoot Ebay product style.

If you're an actor in the UK and you get Hurley style expressions they are going to be derided by Casting Directors and agents. Why? Because they show absolutely no character in the shot. And if you spend 5 mins listening to Casting Directors on Youtube talk about headshots one thing you will hear over and over again is that they need to be able to "meet the actor" when they look at the headshot.
 
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JennyGW said:
Hurley tries to shoot corp headshots just like he tries to shoot actors. He wouldn't last 5 minutes with actors I know who I have shown his work. His attitude with clients is dreadful, some of the things I have heard him say on videos would be laughable if they weren't true. 20 grands worth of Hassy and 10 grands with of Keenos to shoot Ebay product style.

If you're an actor in the UK and you get Hurley style expressions they are going to be derided by Casting Directors and agents. Why? Because they show absolutely no character in the shot. And if you spend 5 mins listening to Casting Directors on Youtube talk about headshots one thing you will hear over and over again is that they need to be able to "meet the actor" when they look at the headshot.
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I think it's fair to say that you operate in different markets.
 
JennyGW said:
Even if all of their existing images are in another style?
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Eh? I was asked what my go to light modifier was and its the octa. What relevance does your question have to that?
 
JennyGW said:
Hurley tries to shoot corp headshots just like he tries to shoot actors. He wouldn't last 5 minutes with actors I know who I have shown his work. His attitude with clients is dreadful, some of the things I have heard him say on videos would be laughable if they weren't true. 20 grands worth of Hassy and 10 grands with of Keenos to shoot Ebay product style.

If you're an actor in the UK and you get Hurley style expressions they are going to be derided by Casting Directors and agents. Why? Because they show absolutely no character in the shot. And if you spend 5 mins listening to Casting Directors on Youtube talk about headshots one thing you will hear over and over again is that they need to be able to "meet the actor" when they look at the headshot.
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You seem pretty angry about his success.
 
Sir SR said:
I think it's fair to say that you operate in different markets.
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I suggest you spend a little time on Youtube listening to American Casting Directors talk about what they want from a headshot to understand the market. I've just done USA style headshots for an actor out in LA. He and his American agent love the shots because they have character.
 
Marcus Geezer said:
Eh? I was asked what my go to light modifier was and its the octa. What relevance does your question have to that?
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All of this businesses existing team shots were done with an octa? You know that? What your go-to modifier is really has no relevance if it's not the style the business requires.
 
JennyGW said:
I suggest you spend a little time on Youtube listening to American Casting Directors talk about what they want from a headshot to understand the market. I've just done USA style headshots for an actor out in LA. He and his American agent love the shots because they have character.
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All I'm saying is that he is very successful in his market. I suspect he goes to the horses mouth rather than YouTube.

People may not like his style/shots but he is very successful.

You have success in your market. Hopefully you'll be able to break America after getting your foot in the door and become the go to person for headshots? The agent might ask some of his/her other clients to have the same done? Small Acorns and all that.
 
Sir SR said:
All I'm saying is that he is very successful in his market. I suspect he goes to the horses mouth rather than YouTube.
People may not like his style/shots but he is very successful.
You have success in your market. Hopefully you'll be able to break America after getting your foot in the door and become the go to person for headshots? The agent might ask some of his/her other clients to have the same done? Small Acorns and all that.
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With respect, The "horses mouth" is the Casting Director. They are on Youtube.

It would be nice to get some sunshine now and then, that's for sure :) (I have stuff going on ... very early days.)
 
JennyGW said:
With respect, The "horses mouth" is the Casting Director. They are on Youtube.

It would be nice to get some sunshine now and then, that's for sure :) (I have stuff going on ... very early days.)
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I meant in person as opposed to you tube.

But I'm no expert in this field!
 
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JennyGW said:
All of this businesses existing team shots were done with an octa? You know that? What your go-to modifier is really has no relevance if it's not the style the business requires.
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Pretty basic stuff to be honest Jen. Client shows you a set of existing pictures, asks you to add a few headshots to the set due to new starters, etc. Reverse engineer the lighting, pose, focal length, blah blah blah, however normally do a far far better job and end up winning the contract to re-shoot all and hopefully other work. Yay!

Do you know what, this thread was really positive with everyone throwing in help and suggestions with no-one really stating anything that was troll-ish or aggressive and then you step in. You seem to know better than a man who is considered one of the worlds successful head shot and portrait photographers (probably because casting agencies want his pictures to represent their clients as they work for all parties), you started telling everyone that white background is a fad (one of my friends is a semi-retired lifelong photographer who has been shooting in the music industry since Tom Jones was young and has been shooting white background since ever as per provided briefs all around the world - London, LA, New York, Japan, etc. His friends and clients include Backstreet Boys, Culture Club to name a few, flipping long fad if you ask me), then start off on a tangent about lighting modifiers, existing shots, etc.

Blimey. Is everything alright Jenny? You are of course welcome to your opinions about things but to start poking a few of the guys on here who are being helpful to the OP in a generally quite positive thread, well not sure what to say to you really. Would also love to see some of your work as well, although everyone can post and offer their opinion regardless of level sometimes it can add a level of credence to commentary if you know someone is walking the walk as well as talking the talk. Peace and love and harmony and all that stuff.

EDIT: Don't worry, through the power of google I found your work on flickr and facebook and your website:)
 
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White backgrounds have always been in fashion, and always will be. I first noticed it in Bailey's book Goodbye baby and Amen from the sixties, but it wasn't exactly new even then. In recent years, it's been heavily pushed by the Venture style that is quite distinctive and can get a bit tiresome. I think some of the reaction against it amongst photographers is maybe directed more towards Venture than the technique as such.

The key to Hurley's success is really him and his personality (as it often is). He's a charismatic guy who lives in a world of BS and banter, and he's extremely good at both. His headshot photography is excellent of its type, for its market, but technically it's not at all difficult - he just talks it up very effectively.
 
Marcus Geezer said:
Pretty basic stuff to be honest Jen. Client shows you a set of existing pictures, asks you to add a few headshots to the set due to new starters, etc. Reverse engineer the lighting, pose, focal length, blah blah blah, however normally do a far far better job and end up winning the contract to re-shoot all and hopefully other work. Yay!

Do you know what, this thread was really positive with everyone throwing in help and suggestions with no-one really stating anything that was troll-ish or aggressive and then you step in. You seem to know better than a man who is considered one of the worlds successful head shot and portrait photographers (probably because casting agencies want his pictures to represent their clients as they work for all parties), you started telling everyone that white background is a fad (one of my friends is a semi-retired lifelong photographer who has been shooting in the music industry since Tom Jones was young and has been shooting white background since ever as per provided briefs all around the world - London, LA, New York, Japan, etc. His friends and clients include Backstreet Boys, Culture Club to name a few, flipping long fad if you ask me), then start off on a tangent about lighting modifiers, existing shots, etc.

Blimey. Is everything alright Jenny? You are of course welcome to your opinions about things but to start poking a few of the guys on here who are being helpful to the OP in a generally quite positive thread, well not sure what to say to you really. Would also love to see some of your work as well, although everyone can post and offer their opinion regardless of level sometimes it can add a level of credence to commentary if you know someone is walking the walk as well as talking the talk. Peace and love and harmony and all that stuff.

EDIT: Don't worry, through the power of google I found your work on flickr and facebook and your website:)
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Pretty much agree with all of this.

Even references to Hurley on her FB page. Very odd :confused:
 
I like Hurleys work, I think he has some stunning headshots on his site, I'm actually quite gobsmacked anyone could call his work awful
 
Jenny, you would contribute to the thread in a better way, if instead of criticising everybody and everything, you would explain how you do it and why your way of doing things is better than everybody else's (including the most famous photographer in this area). I'm sure we all here would be interested in learning a few new things.
 
TG. said:
I like Hurleys work, I think he has some stunning headshots on his site, I'm actually quite gobsmacked anyone could call his work awful
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I'm gobsmacked that anyone would be gobsmacked by anything Jenny says. It's the pattern.
 
Phil V said:
I'm gobsmacked that anyone would be gobsmacked by anything Jenny says. It's the pattern.
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Lol, ok Phil point taken, in my defence though I don't recall reading anything she has said before, ( I must start to get here more often again) I think I may now though, as I found this alarming but amusing at the same time, if you get my drift :D
 
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