5 people trapped in over tram in croydon

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hope theres no deaths
 
hope theres no deaths

Being reported that there are.

Tram has overturned. Never heard of that happening to a tramcar.
 
by this image alone it may be that it took the radius to quickly. Either that or debris on the rails that derailed and tipped it or a points failure???

1575.jpg
 
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by this image alone it may be that it took the radius to quickly. Either that or debris on the rails that derailed and tipped it or a points failure???

1575.jpg

Not the scenario I had in mind when I thought of tramcars. Guess my mind was locked into the days when trams were only to be found in congested cities.

That is a very tight curve and I expect the permitted speed would be fairly low. Nevertheless, there may be other factors.
 
Not the scenario I had in mind when I thought of tramcars. Guess my mind was locked into the days when trams were only to be found in congested cities.

That is a very tight curve and I expect the permitted speed would be fairly low. Nevertheless, there may be other factors.

Agreed.
According go the latest updates the driver has been arrested.
 
A sad day.

That looks a rather sharp bend. I think arresting the drive is a standard procedure?
 
A sad day.

That looks a rather sharp bend. I think arresting the drive is a standard procedure?

The police would need to have a reasonable belief, based on facts and circumstances, that an offence had been committed.
Looking at the pics again there is a possibility that derailment started at the junction in which case there may not have been excessive speed and other causes are possible. It is all if's, buts, perhaps and maybes until the facts are established and made public. The HSE will carry out a public inquiry and I expect the Coroner will investigate the deaths.
 
i always thought they were speed limited ? obv i was wrong
 
Sad times, looks like it took the bend too fast.
 
Trams aren't speed limited. Maybe they will be now.

Where I lived in Spain they had a dead-man's switch to ensure the tram would come to a halt if the driver was incapacitated. Maybe they are not legislated here.
 
Trams aren't speed limited. Maybe they will be now.
I'm amazed they aren't. A steep radius curve that can kill and seriously injure people if the tram goes over 12mph? And there's no speed regulation device fitted ? The driver is apparently getting charged with manslaughter but I can foresee the tram company getting sued over this too.
 
12 mph is being widely reported as the limit for the curve. That is a very strange figure. Speed restrictions on railways are always in multiple of 5mph. (trackside signs to that effect are provided) and speedometers are calibrated in multiples of 5 or 10 mph.

Even if 12 mph was the maximum permitted for that curve there would be a significant safety margin to ensure that trains would only derail if the permitted speed was exceeded by quite a large margin.
 
This is very sad indeed!

It's quite vague in regards to the details, but it seems the tram sped through the tunnel just before the 2 bends, made the first one and then derailed and flipped on it's side. It skidded for 8-10 seconds before coming to a stop. Nowhere does it state how far it skidded once it toppled over, but it seems that most fatalities occurred due to passengers falling into the exposed window openings and getting trapped between the tracks and moving tram..
 
Where I lived in Spain they had a dead-man's switch to ensure the tram would come to a halt if the driver was incapacitated.
The guy this morning from the tram association ( or what ever it is called) said that they are driven "line of sight" in exactly the same way a bus is.
No fail safe ...
Seems crazy I know.
 
Surprised at so many deaths, looks like its in one piece, just toppled over

Still very sad whatever, but buses have gone over with no loss of life, just wondering what happened exactly
 
Surprised at so many deaths, looks like its in one piece, just toppled over

Still very sad whatever, but buses have gone over with no loss of life, just wondering what happened exactly

I had the same thoughts - even a speeding tram isn't going that fast and it didn't hit anything to cause massive deceleration.
Apparently (see post a couple above this one) as it tipped, it slid, and people fell through the window openings and were crushed between the tram and the rails/ground as the tram slid. Horrific.
 
I had the same thoughts - even a speeding tram isn't going that fast and it didn't hit anything to cause massive deceleration.
Apparently (see post a couple above this one) as it tipped, it slid, and people fell through the window openings and were crushed between the tram and the rails/ground as the tram slid. Horrific.

That does sound awful, seat/lap belts would have saved lives in this instance, impractical I know, but kids school buses have to have them
 
The trams in Croydon are rammed so full all the time, mostly standing passengers - seat belts would sadly not have prevented deaths. Such a sad accident.
 
Police investigating whether the driver fell asleep resulting in taking the 12mph bend too fast.

I heard that Neil - I do think the police should shut up and not comment until much later when the facts have been fully established ........ but maybe that's the press again stating something that has not been said


from the BBC

"A BTP investigator said "a number of factors", including whether the driver had fallen asleep or blacked out, were being examined as possible causes."
 
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That does sound awful, seat/lap belts would have saved lives in this instance, impractical I know, but kids school buses have to have them

Can't see it working on public transport. Most of the time (certainly rush hours) many people will be standing.
 
Where I lived in Spain they had a dead-man's switch to ensure the tram would come to a halt if the driver was incapacitated. Maybe they are not legislated here.

Apparently the tram had one also. (a button)
 
Not trying to be insensative during such a horrific time but that tram did not roll 3 times, Me thinks that survivor is either over exaggerating the situation or is confused about what unfolded during his ordeal.
 
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Not trying to be insensative during such a horrific time but that tram did not roll 3 times, Me thinks that survivor is either over exaggerating the situation or is confused about what unfolded during his ordeal.

l agree, you can see that from the condition of the tram in the pictures.
Must have been very confusing though
 
I can never understand why trains cannot be self driving ? if they have the technology to do it on roads, railways are a piece of cake .
 
I can never understand why trains cannot be self driving ? if they have the technology to do it on roads, railways are a piece of cake .

Trains are on the DLR but the unions are against it because they claim it would be unsafe.
 
I use this line on my commute and always stand against the door that would have taken the most impact - worked at home on Wednesday . . . Shocking/chilling news that doesn't get any better as they reveal the names and details of the victims.

May they rest in peace.
 
Victoria Line was designed to be driverless, don't think it ever has been operated like that though
 
Unsafe for the Union's membership numbers...

Isn't that their job, to protect their members interests,ie their jobs , if that tram had rolled 3 times it'd be a lot further from the curve than that, anything could have happened, fallen asleep, blackout, epileptic fit

I was reading recently about Gary Hart, the driver of the combination that derailed the train at selby killing 10, so far his insurance has paid out 22m, he went to prison because he'd been up all night then set off with hardly any sleep.

doesn't bear thinking about having to live with killing someone due to incompetence
 
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