Critique A Little Feedback and some questions

What would be the best coloured background to go for would you suggest?

Ive just been messaged from a parent at work wanting a few of their little girl and mum and dad so really want to work on the lighting in time for it.
So when the time came I would use two lights, one on the background but not affecting the subject and then one on the subject too? is that where the two studio flashes would come in?
 
I've just been up to a family friends, well it's my mums friends but I do some baby sitting helping them out etc and the husband is hugely Into photography.

He has given me the Canon 35-105mm lens need to do some re search not sure how good itll be for photography but he's also given me a Canon 550ex speedlite and now I feel a little lost because ive just gotten used to the flash heads so not quite sure which option to go for/what to do now! lol
 
caitlinjade95 said:
I've just been up to a family friends, well it's my mums friends but I do some baby sitting helping them out etc and the husband is hugely Into photography.

He has given me the Canon 35-105mm lens need to do some re search not sure how good itll be for photography but he's also given me a Canon 550ex speedlite and now I feel a little lost because ive just gotten used to the flash heads so not quite sure which option to go for/what to do now! lol
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That flashgun will come in handy for all kinds of things, it's not an either / or, it's an either / or / and!

If you go for a grey background that gives most options.

I can't remember what other lenses you have, but IIRC that's one of Canons old kit lenses that doesn't have a stellar reputation

A 2nd flash could be used as a fill light, as a background light, a hair light, a rim light or other accent light. A 3rd, likewise.

So it's possible to have any number of lights doing multiples of those duties and more.
 
I know Phil already touched on this, but seriously, you have to stop trying to make white backgrounds when you don't have the lighting to do it. It will never look right. Embrace the grey I say... you can achieve some lovely shades of grey by moving your subject further away from your white background. Don't try to do your white background until you have the kit and the understanding to do it. But can I also make a suggestion? Why not try just maybe shoot 'lifestyle' and utilize your natural surroundings? It does mean you'll have to look a little more closely at your backgrounds, for distractions, but by choosing carefully and shooting to throw it out of focus, you can really product some lovely and natural images.

Just an fyi, I often shoot on a grey backgound but also use colours. I'll use a few different lighting setups, but the one I'm liking at the moment includes one large octa on my subject (with grids, to keep more control over the direction of my light) and one on the background... here's a pullback and a finished shot so you understand what I mean... and one way of using a two light setup (one for the subject, one for the background). I normally use 2.75m rolls, this is a 1.35m colorama roll and great for smaller setups and smaller persons who don't move around too much and tend to stay put. :)

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The interesting point to note for most newbies in Beth's pullback above is how much space is required even for the smallest setup with a lit background.
 
Phil V said:
That flashgun will come in handy for all kinds of things, it's not an either / or, it's an either / or / and!

If you go for a grey background that gives most options.

I can't remember what other lenses you have, but IIRC that's one of Canons old kit lenses that doesn't have a stellar reputation

A 2nd flash could be used as a fill light, as a background light, a hair light, a rim light or other accent light. A 3rd, likewise.

So it's possible to have any number of lights doing multiples of those duties and more.
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Yes I can keep it until I need it cant I and then eventually move up to two lights and more. I have a friend at work with a little girl and boy who has said I can take as much time as I like and need to practice with my set up of lights etc. She has older children so I think this will help me quite alot!
 
sunnyside_up said:
I know Phil already touched on this, but seriously, you have to stop trying to make white backgrounds when you don't have the lighting to do it. It will never look right. Embrace the grey I say... you can achieve some lovely shades of grey by moving your subject further away from your white background. Don't try to do your white background until you have the kit and the understanding to do it. But can I also make a suggestion? Why not try just maybe shoot 'lifestyle' and utilize your natural surroundings? It does mean you'll have to look a little more closely at your backgrounds, for distractions, but by choosing carefully and shooting to throw it out of focus, you can really product some lovely and natural images.

Just an fyi, I often shoot on a grey backgound but also use colours. I'll use a few different lighting setups, but the one I'm liking at the moment includes one large octa on my subject (with grids, to keep more control over the direction of my light) and one on the background... here's a pullback and a finished shot so you understand what I mean... and one way of using a two light setup (one for the subject, one for the background). I normally use 2.75m rolls, this is a 1.35m colorama roll and great for smaller setups and smaller persons who don't move around too much and tend to stay put. :)

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Thanks beth for showing me the pull back. I love the look of the pink and the glass top my biggest problem I'm having with backdrops like that is my floor is carpet :( I have quite a few different back drops but I'm kind of forced to go for one where the child sits on a beanbag but I really want something like this but then of course, it sinks! I also wasn't sure what amount of paper to go for so the fact youve mentioned I find very helpful!! I really like grey, especially for newborns so I need to have a look at getting grey or some kind of other colour as soon as I suss out my dilemma with the floor lol!
 
sunnyside_up said:
I know Phil already touched on this, but seriously, you have to stop trying to make white backgrounds when you don't have the lighting to do it. It will never look right. Embrace the grey I say... you can achieve some lovely shades of grey by moving your subject further away from your white background. Don't try to do your white background until you have the kit and the understanding to do it. But can I also make a suggestion? Why not try just maybe shoot 'lifestyle' and utilize your natural surroundings? It does mean you'll have to look a little more closely at your backgrounds, for distractions, but by choosing carefully and shooting to throw it out of focus, you can really product some lovely and natural images.

Just an fyi, I often shoot on a grey backgound but also use colours. I'll use a few different lighting setups, but the one I'm liking at the moment includes one large octa on my subject (with grids, to keep more control over the direction of my light) and one on the background... here's a pullback and a finished shot so you understand what I mean... and one way of using a two light setup (one for the subject, one for the background). I normally use 2.75m rolls, this is a 1.35m colorama roll and great for smaller setups and smaller persons who don't move around too much and tend to stay put. :)

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I was meant to ask you this the other day actually. What colour is your grey background... I mean, light, dark... erm, darker? :confused:
 
caitlinjade95 said:
Thanks beth for showing me the pull back. I love the look of the pink and the glass top my biggest problem I'm having with backdrops like that is my floor is carpet :( I have quite a few different back drops but I'm kind of forced to go for one where the child sits on a beanbag but I really want something like this but then of course, it sinks! I also wasn't sure what amount of paper to go for so the fact youve mentioned I find very helpful!! I really like grey, especially for newborns so I need to have a look at getting grey or some kind of other colour as soon as I suss out my dilemma with the floor lol!
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Get a sheet of hardboard, plywood or some laminate flooring boards and lay it under the paper to avoid the sunk feet look.
 
If you go to wickes/homebase/b&q and can fit it in car and house a sheet of hardboard is the cheapest best option but, this type of thing http://www.diy.com/departments/hardboard-l2440mm-w1220mm-th3mm/27586_BQ.prd you can get a smaller sheet depending how wide your background is.

If you can't fit it a pack of laminate boards, there not as good as a single sheet but the pack a lot smaller and can double as a flooring for shoots if you want that look.
 
sunnyside_up said:
In colorama it's charcoal 49 - one in the same. ;)
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Just ordered one. Along with black and white. I really hope my calculations on space in the apartment were correct :eek:

Now I just need to find a strip light and an octa... Any recommendations on those wise one? :)
 
UaeExile said:
Just ordered one. Along with black and white. I really hope my calculations on space in the apartment were correct :eek:

Now I just need to find a strip light and an octa... Any recommendations on those wise one? :)
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I'll PM you as don't want to clog up Caitlin's thread. she's got enough to read... :)
 
CraigDHD said:
If you go to wickes/homebase/b&q and can fit it in car and house a sheet of hardboard is the cheapest best option but, this type of thing http://www.diy.com/departments/hardboard-l2440mm-w1220mm-th3mm/27586_BQ.prd you can get a smaller sheet depending how wide your background is.

If you can't fit it a pack of laminate boards, there not as good as a single sheet but the pack a lot smaller and can double as a flooring for shoots if you want that look.
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Thanks I wish homebase and B&Q delivered closest one is an hour away and I don't drive, I'll figure it out but what you sent me on the link would be perfect
 
caitlinjade95 said:
Thanks I wish homebase and B&Q delivered closest one is an hour away and I don't drive, I'll figure it out but what you sent me on the link would be perfect
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Wickes deliver, but delivery would be more expensive than the board.
 
just added to basket to calculate prices. I didn't mind spending a little extra on delivery but perhaps not £35 lol!!

Persuaded my dad into a trip to b and q on payday he can work out the size i'll need and do all the heavy lifting lol so I'll grab one at the end of the month!!

I'm looking at the colourama seamless papers and maybe an incredibly stupid question but does it rip easily? is it as thin as like printer paper?
 
caitlinjade95 said:
I'm looking at the colourama seamless papers and maybe an incredibly stupid question but does it rip easily? is it as thin as like printer paper?
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Nope. It's background paper not printer paper. Can't remember the actual gsm on it but lets just say I've had tap dancers tap on it.
 
thats good then I thought it would be daft to ask but better to ask and know then not to lol!!

Im trying to settle on a colour I can get one for now that will do for both genders but I just feel like greys a really dark colour, gloomy etc.

Would a do able option be to get a background paper http://www.photography-backgrounds..../Ella-Bella-printed/P2501-Classic-Damask.html this one for example with a floor http://www.photography-backgrounds....la-Bella-printed/P2507-White-Washed-Wood.html like this one and then use a skirting board to break up the connecting bits?
 
Umbrella arrived and the adaptor for the flash so Im going to have a go with it at the weekend. Need to get myself another light stand so I dont have to switch and change all the time lol!
 
caitlinjade95 said:
Umbrella arrived and the adaptor for the flash so Im going to have a go with it at the weekend. Need to get myself another light stand so I dont have to switch and change all the time lol!
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You know there's a brolly hole in the bracket on the studio heads. ;)
 
grrrrrrr lol!! Never mind lol was only a couple of quid I'll keep it as a replacement if I need to lol

I have a friend at work who's going to be a 'model' for a couple of hours with me so I can just use the time to try the lights out without my mum moaning at me for taking photos of her lol.
 
A lot of this thread is about equipment but the real problem I think is Caitlin's inability to see! You must learn to see the light. Look at portraits others have done. Look at how lighting affects things around you. Only when you know what it is possible to achieve can you begin to work out how to achieve it. If you can't see then you're not a photographer. Light is everything.

Please don't tell us you're charging people for these shoots you do!
 
snap-happy said:
A lot of this thread is about equipment but the real problem I think is Caitlin's inability to see! You must learn to see the light. Look at portraits others have done. Look at how lighting affects things around you. Only when you know what it is possible to achieve can you begin to work out how to achieve it. If you can't see then you're not a photographer. Light is everything.

Please don't tell us you're charging people for these shoots you do!
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To be fair to Caitlin she's came a long way in terms of understanding and attitude and she's using friends kids to practice on. Despite taking a few beatings she's still posting images for critique and coming back for more.... a good quality to have as an aspiring pro tog :)
 
snap-happy said:
A lot of this thread is about equipment but the real problem I think is Caitlin's inability to see! You must learn to see the light. Look at portraits others have done. Look at how lighting affects things around you. Only when you know what it is possible to achieve can you begin to work out how to achieve it. If you can't see then you're not a photographer. Light is everything.
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You are right, and Caitlin IS working on this aspect, it's clear to those of us that have been following her progress, in this, and a number of other threads, that she's progressing, and working at it - and as Adam said above, shes come a long way already... I'm also sure that she's also aware that it's a long journey, and that we're ALL on that same journey - just a few of us are a little further down the road - it's just that some of us further down the road are sending her suggested routes to progress upon, and others seem more intent on putting up roadblocks. Don't be one of those people.

snap-happy said:
Please don't tell us you're charging people for these shoots you do!
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(puts on Moderators hat for a moment)

Like I said, don't be one of those people. This is a completely un-necessary comment - it's not as if this thread is in the Business Section, now is it ? if that's the best you can offer in this thread, well - frankly, don't come back.
 
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Isn't practice, experimenting and asking questions, from the people in the know, the way we learn?
She knows what she wants, but isn't sure at the best way of achieving it.
I'm not into portraits, but have founded out how hard and what you need to get the lighting right, just from reading this tread.
She obviously has a passion for this sort of photography, which is shown by her persistence in trying to get it right and listening to what has been said here. So for me, fair play to her and keep at it.
 
Got to agree with the other comments above. You don't become a pro on day one, theres a route to follow from fist picking a camera up and you must remember that we all learn at different paces. I haven't a clue with this type of photography and the thread has been a big learning curve for me. I respect Caitlin for what she's trying to achieve along with the members who are giving her the advice.
 
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Thankyou everyone, internet has been down so not had a chance to check the thread grrr!
I have had a massive change in attitude from when I first began and assuming it would be an easy ride to now where I realize you never stop learning with photography! My passion is still there for it and I love doing it and I love the learning of it. I guess you can call me a tough cookie and I'm certainly someone who learns through making mistakes and I'm sure alot of other people also feel the same way. I think previously people were getting rather mift with me because they couldn't see what effort I had been taking to improve and it seemed as though I was ignoring the great advice I was being given. I think since actually talking about the things I don't understand and have asked questions about those things it's helped me to grow a lot more in that time than it has since I started learning!

I would be much worse off without this forum getting myself rather confused and frustrated over more than just lighting lol! So I want to thank everyone again that has taken the time even if its just a couple of minutes of posting a comment or even giving me critique and I certainly want to think everyone for the advice they have given despite me being a pest at times lol!

So no, I don't call myself a photographer not by any means, I'm well aware Im a long way off that status! And as to the person who posted that comment you could clearly see a few messages ahead that I stated I have been able to practice on my niece alot of the times when she will sit still lol and considering I work in a nursery I have alot of people that are more than happy for me to practice my photography and lighting etc with their children. One advantage to working in a nursery I guess lol!
 
I just wanted to post a quick question I've been looking at the seamless papers and found one I want to use with a floor I already have. I'm going to B&Q Friday to get some plywood/something hard enough for them to stand on ha!

So i just need one as a backdrop and not for on the floor would 1.22 x 3.65 be big enough? what sizes does everyone tend to use for just the backdrop without the floor covered too?
 
yes it does but just as a backdrop. It's one a roll the total size being what I said above but it's just supposed to be one that goes down the back
 
The width is suitable for the space you have and how many people it needs to accommodate, the length is about its disposability, you might at some point use it as floor as well, and when it gets damaged, you tear that bit off and unroll a bit more.

Like the light stands and brollies though; what you're buying is your first, there'll be others, you'll end up with a selection.
 
Morbid said:
Don't these come on a roll of a given width, or am I missing something?
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yep - you're missing the details of the items she linked to in post #102 above (this and this), which are basically a big single sheet of patterned backdrop - a bit like a chunk of 4 foot wide wallpaper thats only 12 feet long.

Caitlin - using one of those backdrops could be fine - though the pattern on that one pretty much means it HAS to be used in "portrait" rather than "landscape" orientation, and for me it's a bit too strongly patterned to be used as a full wall and floor drop, so it's usefulness is somewhat limited. Use as a "back wall" only also means you could have problems disguising the transition to the "floor" - either laminate flooring planks (say) or the other backdrop paper you linked to. I'd probably just grab a length of Pre Painted MDF skirting board from a DIY shed and use that to hide the gap - if you buy the right kind, it actually has 2 different profiles, one on each side - one that looks neat and modern, the other looking more old-style...

ETA: Definitely agree with @Phil V - these kind of backdrops and props just tend to multiply over the time you're involved with this stuff - I've got at least half a dozen "flats" with various kinds of wall-treatments on them in storage behind a cupboard in my makeshift studio (i.e. the spare bedroom)

The other alternative is to actually just buy a paper roll of a neutral-ish colour, which will allow you to just pull out what you want, provide a back wall AND a floor surface (albeit needing something hard under the paper or it'll get completely knackered in the first couple of minutes if its just on carpet!). I'll leave it to the people-shooting experts to suggest an appropriate colour, size and supplier of these, as I'm very out of touch with recent usage of these things (it must be 15 years or more since I set up this kind of thing to shoot people... I concentrate on still-life stuff now - no talking back, misbehaving, or getting bored while I spend hours messing with my lighting... I still build my own sets, props and backdrops for them though - even to the extent of making a Faux-Wall out of a sheet of plasterboard and learning how to give it a 17th/18th century plaster effect!)...
 
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Thankyou both I have a flooring that I can use to get going for now, havn't been able to do it due to having carpet but I now know that i need some MDF/Plywood so I'm off to B and Q tomorrow and my plan was to use a skirting board to divide both of the joinings. I do really want to get a full roll to use as a back and floor but really struggling for what colour choice I want to go with! I want something for boy girl but the grey just seems too harsh. Maybe I'm just not a fan of grey lol!

I do eventually want lots and I imagine over the times it'll just naturally happen getting more to create different sets. My thought process was to get something neutral and something that can be used for everything until I get some more but lighting is more of a priority at the moment so one will do me for now!

for the full length one the only one I have found that I like the most is this one http://www.photography-backgrounds....nd-Papers/1.35-x-11-metres/101233-Oyster.html but im still not certain lol!
 
Honestly Catlin all this money you are spending on little bits of kit, backdrops, flooring acould have easily booked you on a one to one by now. That would have been a far better investment.

PS sorry if the above has already been said in this thread.
 
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