Brands Hatch GT cup

Russdaz1

Russdaz1

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Darren Russell
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Went to a massively busy Brands Hatch Saturday... ok massively quiet couldn't have been many more then 200 cars if that, there parked up through out the whole track, (includes marshals parking) never seen it the place so empty especially as it was the GP track... I do wonder how many people are put of by the fact the whole track is now fenced. (except inside of druids) If it was BTCC weekend I would say because its not race day, but Saturday is race day for the GT cup with 2 races. Most people seemed to connected to teams in one way or another, and very few people with cameras, in fact I started counting and only made around 10 cameras. Are all tracks like this now?

_G0I6523 by Darren Russell, on Flickr

_G0I7079 by Darren Russell, on Flickr

_G0I7522 by Darren Russell, on Flickr

_G0I7894 by Darren Russell, on Flickr

Nothing quite as sharp as last weekends horse show jumping but there is fences between me and every car on every shot. All hand held.
 
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Thanks.

No couldn’t make it today. I didnt have the budget to go back. I did feel a bit outta place as I didn’t see another 1dx mk2 out there, not even the media photographers.
 
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Worth a trip out if you can, some interesting cars out there.
 
Thanks, put a few more here. https://flic.kr/s/aHsmGCDano

Will add some more tomorrow.

Motorsport seems to be a dying out, very few people at the track, smaller grids, and fewer people talking about it. Bigger TV audience for the BTCC this though, not sure what all this means. Except the fact the I remember this section being much busier then it seems to be these days. Also a noticeable drop in media photography those that attended Brands hatch most only did the GT cup. Seen some of the stuff being used by the teams, and making me look at mine in a different way. Whats happened in the time I was away? where's everyone gone?
 
Russdaz1 said:
Motorsport seems to be a dying out, very few people at the track, smaller grids, and fewer people talking about it. Bigger TV audience for the BTCC this though, not sure what all this means. Except the fact the I remember this section being much busier then it seems to be these days. Also a noticeable drop in media photography those that attended Brands hatch most only did the GT cup. Seen some of the stuff being used by the teams, and making me look at mine in a different way. Whats happened in the time I was away? where's everyone gone?
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Have to say i disagree a little with the above, i don't believe GT Cup has ever had a huge following hence not many people at Brands Hatch. I've been to MotoGP and WEC at Silverstone in the last couple of weeks and seen loads of people with cameras, some proper nice camera gear on show as well with some big telephoto primes. In fact i would say that a large proportion of people at MotoGP on the Friday were there with a camera. Admittedly MotoGP & WEC are both big events but still plenty of people about at BSB, BTCC etc throughout the year.

3 & 4 the picks for me btw (y)
 
benh14 said:
Have to say i disagree a little with the above, i don't believe GT Cup has ever had a huge following hence not many people at Brands Hatch. I've been to MotoGP and WEC at Silverstone in the last couple of weeks and seen loads of people with cameras, some proper nice camera gear on show as well with some big telephoto primes. In fact i would say that a large proportion of people at MotoGP on the Friday were there with a camera. Admittedly MotoGP & WEC are both big events but still plenty of people about at BSB, BTCC etc throughout the year.

3 & 4 the picks for me btw (y)
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Thanks :)

A couple of seasons ago I went to every event at Brands Hatch, this was the first time I have seen the place so empty. First time I have every seen them not open the external car parks the year I saw every event club bike racing had bigger crowds then this years DTM's. I was also amazed how quiet it was at Thruxton for the BTCC, I camped there a few years back when I followed it around too a few tracks, the camp site was twice the size of this years, and there was more cars involved in the support racing.

As for the Moto gp, and f1 etc, you could normal say there'd be 15 posts about it, or you'd be fighting the other series to even keep your post of the front page of this forum. Same on another one too, its dried up so to speak, I have a few posts on the front page from weeks ago..

I also looked at the media and wished for the gear.. now maybe some of this is the fact I have the gear the others want, leaves me disappointed with what the teams and press are putting out. I am disappointed with the stuff from brands as pixel peeking I can see my work isn't as sharp as it could be compared to other things I shoot. Same as Flickr tbh, it isn't as busy as it used to be, and I go as far as saying nor is instagram.

But leaving the camera aside, except BSB, MotoGP, F1 the crowds just haven't been like they where, can't be down the fences at Brands hatch as most of the Indy circuit has had for before I got involved. But me and a friend noticed it was getting quieter a few years back before my break away. I know a few media photographers limited there motorsport as it stopped paying them to be there.
 
Well I was there with my 1DX II.

For what was really a car club racing event, crowd was what I expected. None of the series racing would be considered feeder series where the next Louis Hamilton will be coming from... This was amateur racing - high end amateur racing in some case with expensive kit - but not a career path for up and coming racers.

Its not unusual to find more expensive glass with the spectator side photographers behind the fence rather than the gear the media photographers use. For some its a hobby and they can spend what they want on it, the others its a job and they spend what they need to get the shots they need.

GT Cup had their photographers there, I was there working for a couple of championships, plus I saw other photographer shooting for their respective customers.

GT Cup also race on Sundays - same format - free practice, qualifying, 25m sprint race, 50m endurance race.

WEC at Silverstone would have drawn some photographers away.
 
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andrewc said:
Well I was there with my 1DX II.

For what was really a car club racing event, crowd was what I expected. None of the series racing would be considered feeder series where the next Louis Hamilton will be coming from... This was amateur racing - high end amateur racing in some case with expensive kit - but not a career path for up and coming racers.

Its not unusual to find more expensive glass with the spectator side photographers behind the fence rather than the gear the media photographers use. For some its a hobby and they can spend what they want on it, the others its a job and they spend what they need to get the shots they need.

GT Cup had their photographers there, I was there working for a couple of championships, plus I saw other photographer shooting for their respective customers.

GT Cup also race on Sundays - same format - free practice, qualifying, 25m sprint race, 50m endurance race.

WEC at Silverstone would have drawn some photographers away.
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You didn’t have a camouflage lens at the last final corner for race 2 on Saturday? Us 1dx users seem rare lol i remember the 1d series being common at race tracks.

I do know what about the hobby side of things, but I do think some of the lenses some people take as spectators are posers more then anything. 500mm Nikon with a d500 man for example this weekend taking photos of helmets (I was stood next him seeing what he was taking) saw a 600mm canon on 7d body at DTM at druids. God knows what he was doing.
For me if I had the money I’d have gone to wec Saturday and gt cup sun. But as a hobby something gives, so funds said gt cup Saturday, watch f1 Sunday. But I really should start making my hobby (photography) starting paying a little back, so I can enjoy doing it more. Not sure how to make it start contributing though. But I like most sport photography, with a slight preference to motorsport as I was a motorsports fan before photography come along.

DONT get me wrong. There’s some good stuff out there, but some of what I seen the teams use is s***, even in a BTCC programme I looked at some stuff and felt it was crap. But that might also be down to some people losing motivation as it becomes just a job and doesn’t interest them anymore, rather then equipment. I have seen media photos with visible fences in them, under exposed etc. I know people that get very good stuff from a 7d with 100-400 compared to 1dx mk2 with 400mm do f4 but bless them when they say it’s because they have the same auto focus, they don’t it just have the dots lol. The actual auto focus sensors are different.

Take the GT cup out of it then, I’d still most events feel down on what they where 5yrs ago BTCC gets bigger tv but is it people saying f*** going paying £x and getting wet when I can see more on tv.

And I do standby what I say about the forum being quieter when f1 WEC MotoGP WSB BSB DTM BTCC weekends you post come back and you would be page 2 when you come back. Plus to note not as many people give feed back either. Part of the fun for me is the feed back what works what doesn’t. I was a member by different name years ago. Just couldn’t reactivate my old account lost email and password.

But I have had very little feed back in the bird section, sports or motorsport section of this forum. So I am either so good no talks, or so s*** no one talks or no one talks anymore.

Going with the no one talks anymore as there’s lots of 400 views but no likes or comments threads :)
 
No - it wasn't me.

I was there for single seaters, although I'm friends with someone in both GT Cup and Sports 2000, so a couple of frames for them.

Some grids are pretty healthy. Some less so, but they're often cyclical and will recover.
 
Hey mate, pictures look ok to me... bit oddly composed on a few where the subject needs a bit more room and could do with some minor work in post to make the colours stand out more. Decent enough set of record shots but in terms of critique they aren’t really stand out - that’s not meant to sound combative (which is why a lot of people tend not to comment unless they have something nice to say) just an honest opinion.

What confuses me more is the amount of gear talk [emoji16] it really doesn’t matter what other people use, it’s about how well you use what you have. One of the very best photographers I know working media in the UK doesn’t use the top line body... a D5 and a 1DXii does not necessarily a good photographer make. From my side it looks very odd to me that you keep talking about having a £5k camera but being able to afford a £50 weekend to the WEC is a stretch? [emoji23] but different strokes for different folks I guess.

I’ve seen loads of utter tosh being posted by pros and spectators with flagship gear, they clearly earn enough to warrant such an expense which is great for them but “all the gear, no idea” often springs to mind. That said I’ve seen outstanding stuff from prosumer equipment both sides of the fence too... you also need to remember that media photographers have a brief that doesn’t necessarily marry up with what photographers appreciate creatively... I.e no blurry sponsors and images with space for editorial content etc. Plus with all the spectators giving stuff away for free there’s a lot of teams and media outlets with limited budgets opting for free exposure over paid photography. MSV has also made the accreditation process much stricter to ensure there are fewer photographers getting trackside at their circuits as it was getting a bit silly with the number of people just on a jolly getting in the way. Ahhh

On the last point about the popularity of motorsport... yeah it is dying, unless you’re at a big event like the F1 or MotoGP, maybe the bumper cars too there’s very little interest from crowds... even the WEC which is an absolute bargain in ticket price alone is only attended by a handful of people and has been for the last 10-12 years.
 
Graphix501 said:
Hey mate, pictures look ok to me... bit oddly composed on a few where the subject needs a bit more room and could do with some minor work in post to make the colours stand out more. Decent enough set of record shots but in terms of critique they aren’t really stand out - that’s not meant to sound combative (which is why a lot of people tend not to comment unless they have something nice to say) just an honest opinion.

What confuses me more is the amount of gear talk [emoji16] it really doesn’t matter what other people use, it’s about how well you use what you have. One of the very best photographers I know working media in the UK doesn’t use the top line body... a D5 and a 1DXii does not necessarily a good photographer make. From my side it looks very odd to me that you keep talking about having a £5k camera but being able to afford a £50 weekend to the WEC is a stretch? [emoji23] but different strokes for different folks I guess.

I’ve seen loads of utter tosh being posted by pros and spectators with flagship gear, they clearly earn enough to warrant such an expense which is great for them but “all the gear, no idea” often springs to mind. That said I’ve seen outstanding stuff from prosumer equipment both sides of the fence too... you also need to remember that media photographers have a brief that doesn’t necessarily marry up with what photographers appreciate creatively... I.e no blurry sponsors and images with space for editorial content etc. Plus with all the spectators giving stuff away for free there’s a lot of teams and media outlets with limited budgets opting for free exposure over paid photography. MSV has also made the accreditation process much stricter to ensure there are fewer photographers getting trackside at their circuits as it was getting a bit silly with the number of people just on a jolly getting in the way. Ahhh

On the last point about the popularity of motorsport... yeah it is dying, unless you’re at a big event like the F1 or MotoGP, maybe the bumper cars too there’s very little interest from crowds... even the WEC which is an absolute bargain in ticket price alone is only attended by a handful of people and has been for the last 10-12 years.
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Hi thanks, post processing is something I need to learn more of tbh, and now seeing other people’s work I can see why the 400mm F4 DO has a reputation of not being as punchy as some other primes. Has wonderful detail but not as contrasty as some, easy fix as I have learned last night.
Most don’t have room to breathe being on a 400mm needed a 300mm really for most of them, as this bunch are uncroped. It I haven’t anything other the 24-70 F4 atm. (Long story) but for most things I get by. Thanks for the comments, yes I know there’s nothing standout different or special about this bunch :) but I was practicing being consistent more then anything else.

As for gear.
I am blessed to have a new 1dx, had a 1dmk2 and 1dmk2n that come to a messy ends (both second hand when I brought years ago) insurance covered one with out question the second is an on going claim. Firm believer in the 1series even second hand compared to prosumer, as good as they are now. My 400mm F4 DO is a well used secondhand lens.
But as you say about spectators giving things away takes the money out of media that’s the real point I suppose I was getting at, and I wonder how many teams by decent cameras and do there own. There used to be so much topend stuff floating around the forum was full of people posting top end images and everyone seemed to be chasing/claiming/giving away images. Just wondering if it’s the sport is quieter or the crowds are quieter as there isn’t as many chasing being media and taking there photography hobby else where. Because the crowds are deffo less then 10yrs ago.

I am blessed to have some nice gear but consider myself still learning, and finding myself in a position where I am finding potential work offers from other photography options where my current skills/work would sell. From that I have seen the list of what ‘clients’ would want look for so I get that. One reason I never chased the media dream, although I wouldn’t turn it down now if offered the chance. I can’t afford to get to as many events as I would like to, why my wildlife stuff has taken over really.

But I do agree you don’t need £20k of gear to get the shots, especially with prosumer cameras taking sells of the top line cameras, but it’s just an observable difference after 2-3yrs away from a track crowds are down photography gear is also down.

(Something to note the DTM had a large number of what I’d non English speakers)
 
The media aspect is also in decline. Autosport is loosing subscribers hand over fist, the magazine has been cheapened considerably and previously where they sent a photographer and a journalist to every club meeting, they now don't bother covering every meeting, and are much more selective over what they feature. Motorsport News now covers a bit more but its not carried by most newsagents. Newpapers are declining as well and have slashed picture budgets. I don't know how much the journalist gets paid, but they just need a notebook and pen - and then a phone or laptop to send in their copy. Photogs carry about significantly more expensive gear... Motorsport websites are run on a shoestring budget.

People don't appreciate that a day at a motorsport circuit is actually quite good value. A full days entertainment can be had for £ 15 for an adult with children discounted or free, and you get much more access on a club day than you would at a higher end meeting, compared to cost of going to a football match.
 
A shame really, seeing the crowds attendances that I have made makes me fearful. Smaller crowds less exposure, less exposure less sponsorships etc.

I love the sights and sounds of motorsport, and yes club racing is very cheap day out. F1 is very expensive these days, but I think everything else is reasonable.
 
As DTM is primarily a German series, with 3/4 of their calendar taking place within Germany, with away weekends to Brands Hatch, Assen and Zolder, then I'd expect a significant influx in media from those countries. Most of the DTM teams are German, with two from Belgium and one from Switzerland. Drivers are from all over, with a handful of Brits.

DTM, whilst the headline event, would probably get less coverage in the UK than some of the support series.
 
Sponsorship is a funny thing to arrange. Its often not about exposing a sticker moving at 120mph+ to a bunch of spectators. Its more about a symbiotic relationship - taking your car to one of your sponsors events - a nice photo that the sponsor can use or display in their newsletters, and occassionally giving some free tickets to a supplier.
 
There wasn’t a massive media contingent at the DTM’s tbh the GT cup properly had as many trackside photographers. But there where videographers there and some big name reporters.

An interesting insight, it’s not just this site that’s gone quiet on the motorsport photography front, it’s others too.

But it’s not just motorsport squeezing photography it’s football too, I know a club offered a place as official photographer, but all that was on offer was a season ticket. Fine for a amateur fan.
 
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Was there on Sunday for the GT race until the end of it, yes have to agree it is pretty quiet and I managed to get to a few spots to do some shots on the same race. Didn't get to see many photographers, only one close to the end of GT race with media vest on (he's with 1Dx and 500mm IS) ...

But that green Merc GT was too quick even for 911, Huracan and GTR
 
Russdaz1 said:
An interesting insight, it’s not just this site that’s gone quiet on the motorsport photography front, it’s others too.
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And yet there is a vast amount of motorsport photography on Instagram. Forums are nowhere near as popular as they once were following the rise of social media. Re Brands Hatch being quiet, I wouldn't expect many people to attend a GT Cup event. Outside of hardcore motorsport fans, nobody knows that championship exists. It gets no TV coverage and very little other media coverage, so it wouldn't attract a crowd. Outside of big events such as BTCC, BSB, FIA WEC etc then whether there is a crowd there or not really does not matter. I'm sure Oulton Park will be bursting at the seams for BSB this weekend.
 
Yes, a lot of forums are struggling due to social media. I run a small car forum and that has got a lot less traffic now. Social media wins on convenience but is often poor at finding information posted previously, which is where forums are still so much better for that purpose.

The series at Brands this weekend was GT Cup, F3 Cup, Monoposto, Sports 2000s, Trackday Trophy, Toyo Tires Racing Saloons, Production BMW and Caterhams. That may interest those with a season pass for Brands Hatch who look forward to the comparatively rare meetings held on the GP loop (althuogh I saw a handful of spectators venture out the back) or friends / family of those competing, but its unlikely to tempt in the armchair fan when there is the Belgian GP on television, the World Endurance Championship at Silverstone, with BSB at Oulton Park this weekend, Goodwood Revival the weekend after that et cetera. GT Cup pay to have their races filmed and that footage is then edited into a small programme via Youtube, but is not streamed live.

Some drivers use GT Cup as a progression into British GT, but these are generally the Am part of the Pro-Am pairing, or British GT drivers may use GT Cup for track time or to test a new car in race conditions somewhat out of the spotlight or new drivers. You also see Pro drivers racing, coupling up with a well funded Am - but they are also acting as driver coach for the man at the same time.

My main interest in the meeting ended shortly before lunch on Sunday, so packed up and made the trek home, but I had been there since Friday evening.
 
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robinsslee said:
Was there on Sunday for the GT race until the end of it, yes have to agree it is pretty quiet and I managed to get to a few spots to do some shots on the same race. Didn't get to see many photographers, only one close to the end of GT race with media vest on (he's with 1Dx and 500mm IS) ...

But that green Merc GT was too quick even for 911, Huracan and GTR
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Oh that Green Merc was quick and sounded mint too, but not much in it between it and the red Lambo to the point the Lambo tapped it into a spin on Saturdays long race I could loads more up of all the cars but sure it would boring same thing just a different car.
 
RichardC27 said:
And yet there is a vast amount of motorsport photography on Instagram. Forums are nowhere near as popular as they once were following the rise of social media. Re Brands Hatch being quiet, I wouldn't expect many people to attend a GT Cup event. Outside of hardcore motorsport fans, nobody knows that championship exists. It gets no TV coverage and very little other media coverage, so it wouldn't attract a crowd. Outside of big events such as BTCC, BSB, FIA WEC etc then whether there is a crowd there or not really does not matter. I'm sure Oulton Park will be bursting at the seams for BSB this weekend.
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Sure the BSB will be packed normally is. But the BTCC was actually dead at Thruxton at least for Saturday. But there was forcast of serve weather that weekend. But the other forum I go to is mainly US based and again I seen a drop off in motorsport posts there too.

New to instagram so just finding my way on there.
 
andrewc said:
Yes, a lot of forums are struggling due to social media. I run a small car forum and that has got a lot less traffic now. Social media wins on convenience but is often poor at finding information posted previously, which is where forums are still so much better for that purpose.

The series at Brands this weekend was GT Cup, F3 Cup, Monoposto, Sports 2000s, Trackday Trophy, Toyo Tires Racing Saloons, Production BMW and Caterhams. That may interest those with a season pass for Brands Hatch who look forward to the comparatively rare meetings held on the GP loop (althuogh I saw a handful of spectators venture out the back) or friends / family of those competing, but its unlikely to tempt in the armchair fan when there is the Belgian GP on television, the World Endurance Championship at Silverstone, with BSB at Oulton Park this weekend, Goodwood Revival the weekend after that et cetera. GT Cup pay to have their races filmed and that footage is then edited into a small programme via Youtube, but is not streamed live.

Some drivers use GT Cup as a progression into British GT, but these are generally the Am part of the Pro-Am pairing, or British GT drivers may use GT Cup for track time or to test a new car in race conditions somewhat out of the spotlight or new drivers. You also see Pro drivers racing, coupling up with a well funded Am - but they are also acting as driver coach for the man at the same time.

My main interest in the meeting ended shortly before lunch on Sunday, so packed up and made the trek home, but I had been there since Friday evening.
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I wasn’t aware of that, thanks.

But I suppose the gp track for the photographers isn’t the same attraction it used to be. Before all the fences around there it would be busy with Spector-photographers but your to close to action as a spectator-photographer to get anything but fence photos, as you can’t focus it out like I have on the those posted up, but still a wonderfully fast section to appreciate the cars fully. Wish it had more use.

I went out there to feel the speed of the gp loop with no intention of getting any shots.
 
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Good pics. My only comment would be give them more space. These shots look best (imo) when the car/subject is going into the frame. Yours tend toward leaving the frame.
 
Due to moaning neighbours who moved next door to an established race track, Brands Hatch is only allowed to run a handful of noisy events on the GP loop.

Blancpain GT
Masters Historic Festival
British GT
DTM
MSVR Club event I
MSVR Club event II
BTCC

BSB 1
BSB 2
BMCRC Club I

They can run quiet events as well - so some trackdays for both cars and bikes and cycling events, but they have strict evening curfews as well. So for many club racing series, getting a race on the GP loop is quite an honour...
 
Boss said:
Good pics. My only comment would be give them more space. These shots look best (imo) when the car/subject is going into the frame. Yours tend toward leaving the frame.
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Thanks
Not so easy to leave more room in some cases, due to the restrictions of using a 400mm prime, but I was trying both. framed by camera no cropping here.

_G0I6589 by Darren Russell, on Flickr

_G0I7535 by Darren Russell, on Flickr

_G0I6583 by Darren Russell, on Flickr


Increased the contrast a bit more in post enough or do they still need a bit more?
 
Contrast looks good to me. Too much and bright, strong colours can get a bit cartoonish in my view.
 
Boss said:
Contrast looks good to me. Too much and bright, strong colours can get a bit cartoonish in my view.
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Thank you, I hear what your saying and having seen some now from other photographers after finding having the Facebook page of the green merc pop up and seeing the images they have used and the media photographers images I quite pleased with the last bunch. Just got to remember they need a slight lift compared to my 24-70L but most 400mm F4 DO reviews say the lens lacks as much contrast as some other lenses which I think on hindsight seeing things is true.

The green on the merc is a reflective finish so really stands out.
 
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The Merc with my standard preset looks pretty similar. Its a green metallic wrap and really stands out - a really vibrant green. Colours on the Lotus are a little incorrect - its in gulf colours which are traditionally paler.
 
andrewc said:
The Merc with my standard preset looks pretty similar. Its a green metallic wrap and really stands out - a really vibrant green. Colours on the Lotus are a little incorrect - its in gulf colours which are traditionally paler.
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Thanks, I appreciate that. Still getting used to body and lens and laptop screen, but I have two iPhone screens open and they doth display differently to my calibration of my laptop. So 3 screens and the lotus looks different on all three, ones warmer, ones cooler lol but they print as they look on my laptop and that’s paler then my iPhone. But..
I think looks darker because of the bright light in the background but the car itself is in the shade. My exposure was set up for the shady condition.

Full sun.
https://flic.kr/p/2ha4poc
View: https://www.flickr.com/photos/russdaz1/48672913291/in/album-72157710638365476/


Same processing used.

Or a plain white BMW.
https://flic.kr/p/2ha2F7N
View: https://www.flickr.com/photos/russdaz1/48672575998/in/album-72157710638365476/
 
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