Has anyone passed their driving test recently?

[Garry Edwards]

My own history - I started driving a moped at 16, a motorbike at 17, a car at 18 and an HGV at 21. I haven't taken a test for well over 50 years and so have no idea what's involved.

My youngest daughter has failed 2 car tests, we've got her an old Honda Jazz to practice in, with her mother, brother and myself sitting next to her whilst she practices. She is also taking lessons, with a new instructor.

Some of the things that she has been taught to do just seem so wrong to me, so any advice from anyone with recent experience would help . . .

Handbrake - only use it when parking. Hold the car steady with the footbrake in stationary traffic.

Hillstarts, using the handbrake - not taught. Apparently there were no hills in her previous test area.

Always be ready to move off, which in traffic queues means keeping it in gear with the foot on the brake until she is ready to move.

Stationary spacing - always be far enough behind the car in front to be able to see part of the rear tyres.

Speed, basically as fast as the speed limit allows, except near schools or when cars are parked both sides and space is tight.

Mirror use - clear movement of the head is unnecessary, as long as there is SOME head movement.

Joining a major road - no other road user must ever be inconvenienced, which means that she mustn't move forward if there is another vehicle basically in sight.

So, is she correct, as far as the test is concerned?

 

[J Veitch]

I've not sat a test for a long time, but these are generalizations based on the Highway code:

For example: "Stationary spacing" - "leave enough space to be able to manoeuvre if the vehicle in front breaks down or an emergency vehicle needs to get past", combined with "reduce the distance between you and the vehicle ahead to maintain traffic flow" (both from rule 151). For my wife, she would never see the wheels, but still be able to maneuver, but as I am much taller, I could probably see the wheels and still not be able to get out... however a good general rule of thumb to easily apply the rule is "always be far enough behind the car in front to be able to see part of the rear tyres."

Most of what she says sounds fairly plausible to me. Although, for example joining a road, you do need to make sure you don't cause other users to slow down, but watch for undue hesitation.

https://www.gov.uk/guidance/the-highway-code

 

[mikew]

Always be ready to move off, which in traffic queues means keeping it in gear with the foot on the brake until she is ready to move.

That may have to change as they are talking about having to switch the engine off in queues

 

[Tringa]

My own history - I started driving a moped at 16, a motorbike at 17, a car at 18 and an HGV at 21. I haven't taken a test for well over 50 years and so have no idea what's involved.

My youngest daughter has failed 2 car tests, we've got her an old Honda Jazz to practice in, with her mother, brother and myself sitting next to her whilst she practices. She is also taking lessons, with a new instructor.

Some of the things that she has been taught to do just seem so wrong to me, so any advice from anyone with recent experience would help . . .

Handbrake - only use it when parking. Hold the car steady with the footbrake in stationary traffic.

Hillstarts, using the handbrake - not taught. Apparently there were no hills in her previous test area.

Always be ready to move off, which in traffic queues means keeping it in gear with the foot on the brake until she is ready to move.

Stationary spacing - always be far enough behind the car in front to be able to see part of the rear tyres.

Speed, basically as fast as the speed limit allows, except near schools or when cars are parked both sides and space is tight.

Mirror use - clear movement of the head is unnecessary, as long as there is SOME head movement.

Joining a major road - no other road user must ever be inconvenienced, which means that she mustn't move forward if there is another vehicle basically in sight.

So, is she correct, as far as the test is concerned?

Can't help with recent experience because I took my test years ago too.

The first one seems wrong to me. If it is clear that the stationary traffic isn't going to move soon then I think applying the handbrake is the correct, and safer thing to do.
Similarly, with the third one, in certain circumstances.

The stationary spacing was new to me until I did a speed awareness course. They made the point that if you are close to the car in front you could be shunted into it by someone failing to stop behind you, so giving more room (they suggested being able to see all of the rear wheels of the car in front) was a good idea.

The speed one sounds crazy to me, it makes it sound more like a target than a limit. There are lots of reasons, in addition to being near schools and where cars are parked both sides, where driving at the limit is not a good idea.


Dave

 

[rick448]

Handbrake - only use it when parking. Hold the car steady with the footbrake in stationary traffic.

Depends, if you are looking like being stationary for a period of time, then we taught to use the handbrake. The reason for not using the handbrake whenever stopping is to prevent taking ages to get moving again. Most people would apply the handbrake and select neutral, then when setting off at a set of lights for example, would take so long to move it would only allow a couple of vehicles through. I think this has been reviewed over the years diue to traffic volumes and congestion.

Hillstarts, using the handbrake - not taught. Apparently there were no hills in her previous test area.

That is poor, the instructor should teach the use of a handbrake regardless of the test route, they should be teaching the student to drive, not just pass a test...

Always be ready to move off, which in traffic queues means keeping it in gear with the foot on the brake until she is ready to move.

As per the first point.

Stationary spacing - always be far enough behind the car in front to be able to see part of the rear tyres.

You should be able to see "tyres on tarmac" this allows you to move if the vehicle ahead breaks down, stalls etc, pus you can take avoiding action in the case of something out of control behind you, also it may prevent you hitting the vehicle in front if hunted, and preventing a double impact.

Speed, basically as fast as the speed limit allows, except near schools or when cars are parked both sides and space is tight.

Drive to the speed limit where safe to do so, you can fail your test for driving unnecessarily slow, but it is NOT a target.

Mirror use - clear movement of the head is unnecessary, as long as there is SOME head movement.

I'd make sure the examiner can see the movement, but it is more important to act on what you see rather than make extreme h
ead movements for effect.

Joining a major road - no other road user must ever be inconvenienced, which means that she mustn't move forward if there is another vehicle basically in sight.

Not true, you should not cause another road user to change speed or direction, though discretion will be given depending on traffic, the thing they hate is pulling out after waiting a while if a better opportunity existed and was not taken.

 

[viv1969]

Married to a driving instructor.
His advice, not mine....

Handbrake - only use it when parking. Hold the car steady with the footbrake in stationary traffic.
Sadly a judgement call. In a queue which moves slowly, yes. In stationary traffic, handbrake. At red lights, always handbrake. Not foot brake, not gear balance.

Hillstarts, using the handbrake - not taught. Apparently there were no hills in her previous test area.
Should be taught. Poor instructor practice.

Always be ready to move off, which in traffic queues means keeping it in gear with the foot on the brake until she is ready to move.
No. If stationary, hand brake and neutral.

Stationary spacing - always be far enough behind the car in front to be able to see part of the rear tyres.
Rear tyre on tarmac.

Speed, basically as fast as the speed limit allows, except near schools or when cars are parked both sides and space is tight.
Correct-ish. Drive to the speed limit whenever safe to do so. Even close to a school.

Mirror use - clear movement of the head is unnecessary, as long as there is SOME head movement.
Correct...for test purposes. Slight head movement tells the examiner you're looking.
In practice (post test) side-of-your-eye is the norm.

Joining a major road - no other road user must ever be inconvenienced, which means that she mustn't move forward if there is another vehicle basically in sight.
Rubbish. It depends on the road, and whether the junction is Stop or Give Way.
Basically dependent on length of vision. (This one actually p***ed him right off.)

So, is she correct, as far as the test is concerned?

Has to be said, husband has a cracking pass rate.

 

[nilagin]

The stationary spacing was new to me until I did a speed awareness course. They made the point that if you are close to the car in front you could be shunted into it by someone failing to stop behind you, so giving more room (they suggested being able to see all of the rear wheels of the car in front) was a good idea.

I learnt to drive in 1980 and that is what they taught back then. Certainly not a new thing.

 

[the black fox]

Probably why the roads now seem more like Ben hurs chariot race than a way to get from a to b .

 

[onomatopoeia]

I passed my test at 17, which would be 33 years ago, and I was the last student the instructor had as he was 65 by the time my test date came round (six month waiting list at the local test centre at the time) and not officially a driving instructor any more at that point.

Handbrake - only use it when parking. Hold the car steady with the footbrake in stationary traffic.
Not what I was taught, which included using it at traffic lights and junctions.

Hillstarts, using the handbrake - not taught. Apparently there were no hills in her previous test area.
I was taught hill starts using the handbrake, and tested on it.

Always be ready to move off, which in traffic queues means keeping it in gear with the foot on the brake until she is ready to move.
Yes be ready to move off but there was no penalty that I recall for taking one second to put it in gear and release the handbrake.

Stationary spacing - always be far enough behind the car in front to be able to see part of the rear tyres.
Not taught as seeing the rear tyres, but leaving a sensible gap to move around a broken down or otherwise not moving car was taught.

Speed, basically as fast as the speed limit allows, except near schools or when cars are parked both sides and space is tight.
Yes, definitely. Hesitancy and dawdling were penalized. You were expected to make progress to the legal limit where it was possible and safe to do so. So it was a target in conditions where attaining it was safe.

Mirror use - clear movement of the head is unnecessary, as long as there is SOME head movement.
Again this, but only for the test so the examiner could see you are checking the mirrors. That was the one piece of "teaching for the test" my instructor did.

Joining a major road - no other road user must ever be inconvenienced, which means that she mustn't move forward if there is another vehicle basically in sight.
You definitely should not inconvenience another road user when joining a major road, but that does not mean waiting until there is nothing visible. It may mean having to press the accelerator pedal to reach the speed of the traffic you are joining quickly and not cause the traffic behind to have to slow down. Hesitancy will be penalized, a colleague who recently passed her test at the fifth attempt kept failing for hesitancy at junctions and waiting for too big a gap to pull out.

 

[sirch]

Both my kids have passed first time within the last two years. I was a bit suprised by some of the things they were taught, particularly on not hesitating - i.e. they were taught to be quite assertive and not hesitate - but for me that's the point of paying an instructor, they know the local test centre and what is expected. My hunch (from the experiences of my kids friends) is that the examiner can make the test more challenging if they feel you are not ready to pass, so I think confidence and competance from the outset in the test session could make a difference.

 

[Garry Edwards]

Many thanks to everyone who has replied, very helpful.

 

[AndrewFlannigan]

I passed my test at 17, which would be 33 years ago,

I took my test about 20 years before you and my experience was very similar to yours with one exception...

Yes be ready to move off but there was no penalty that I recall for taking one second to put it in gear and release the handbrake.

I was taught to apply the handbrake, put the car in 1st gear and take the handbrake in hand ready to move off. I don't know if this was just a matter of style or the standard approach at the time.

Incidentally, I learned to drive on an A40 Farina (not this one which I photographed a few years ago). It had the accelleration of a slug!

 

[LCPete]

I took my test about 20 years before you and my experience was very similar to yours with one exception...
I was taught to apply the handbrake, put the car in 1st gear and take the handbrake in hand ready to move off. I don't know if this was just a matter of style or the standard approach at the time.

Incidentally, I learned to drive on an A40 Farina (not this one which I photographed a few years ago). It had the accelleration of a slug!

View attachment 251794

Me too I was taught to use the handbrake when stopped

 

[Box Brownie]

I took my test about 20 years before you and my experience was very similar to yours with one exception...
I was taught to apply the handbrake, put the car in 1st gear and take the handbrake in hand ready to move off. I don't know if this was just a matter of style or the standard approach at the time.

Incidentally, I learned to drive on an A40 Farina (not this one which I photographed a few years ago). It had the accelleration of a slug!

View attachment 251794

Me too I was taught to use the handbrake when stopped

Yes, I passed 1st time 2 months after my 17th birthday and 13 lessons.......plus I had the examiners examiner sitting the back of the car! That in 1971

I was taught that it was poor car control to sit in traffic with foot brake applied as the moment you need to move off, if driving a manual, you need to be sure that you will not roll either forwards or backwards. In other words treat every situation as a hill!

Plus, I was taught how to be observant ~ in traffic watch (as appropriate) 3 to 4 cars ahead so that as they move you can select first gear in readiness to move off. Similar applies traffic lights i.e. observe the other traffic in readiness to select first gear in good time to move forward once the lights change!

Reading above that they teach sitting in traffic with foot brake applied for reason of potential being rear ended appears to not recognise that if that happens there is a real possibility that your foot might not stay on the pedal at sufficient pressure to be as effective compared to the handbrake! That new advice/method also explains one of my repeated WAMT's i.e. high intensity brake lights affecting night vision in the winter as you wait for traffic to move.

 

[Tori_T]

Mirror use - clear movement of the head is unnecessary, as long as there is SOME head movement.
Again this, but only for the test so the examiner could see you are checking the mirrors. That was the one piece of "teaching for the test" my instructor did.

My examiner gave me a technical fail on that, but passed me anyway as I was clearly reacting to the the things I supposedly wasn't looking at.

That new advice/method also explains one of my repeated WAMT's i.e. high intensity brake lights affecting night vision in the winter as you wait for traffic to move.

That was the reason my instructor gave me for not doing it.

 

[nilagin]

Yes, I passed 1st time 2 months after my 17th birthday and 13 lessons.......plus I had the examiners examiner sitting the back of the car! That in 1971

I was taught that it was poor car control to sit in traffic with foot brake applied as the moment you need to move off, if driving a manual, you need to be sure that you will not roll either forwards or backwards. In other words treat every situation as a hill!

Plus, I was taught how to be observant ~ in traffic watch (as appropriate) 3 to 4 cars ahead so that as they move you can select first gear in readiness to move off. Similar applies traffic lights i.e. observe the other traffic in readiness to select first gear in good time to move forward once the lights change!

Reading above that they teach sitting in traffic with foot brake applied for reason of potential being rear ended appears to not recognise that if that happens there is a real possibility that your foot might not stay on the pedal at sufficient pressure to be as effective compared to the handbrake! That new advice/method also explains one of my repeated WAMT's i.e. high intensity brake lights affecting night vision in the winter as you wait for traffic to move.

Although brighter than standard rear lights, they are still a red light and a point in the light spectrum where they shouldn't dazzle. If they do, it is your eyesight not the brake light at fault. Also if you were watching the cars 3-4 cars ahead as you say, you wouldn't be staring at the brake lights of the vehicle in front.

 

[Box Brownie]

Although brighter than standard rear lights, they are still a red light and a point in the light spectrum where they shouldn't dazzle. If they do, it is your eyesight not the brake light at fault. Also if you were watching the cars 3-4 cars ahead as you say, you wouldn't be staring at the brake lights of the vehicle in front.

Perhaps I was missing in depth explanation:-

At night on dry conditions the high level high intensity brake lights have a marked effect on night vision.....I don't know about others but I have been stuck in traffic that has been stationary for more than a few moments and what I see is every car ahead of me with their brake lights showing. I have learned not to fix my gaze on any single light but to be aware of change, especially needed when the whole field of view is punctuated with brighter level lights

The glare/dazzle I refer to was in rainy conditions...that combined with the intensity is not a good thing to be considered usefull or accepted norm in stationary traffic.

As for the red light being in a part of the spectrum that should not dazzle et al. Well, some manfacturers perhaps are taking short cuts...... some when looked at almost straight on have a visible whiter centre. Maybe they are using white LEDs and relying on red coloured plastic for the "colour"???

 

[nilagin]

As for the red light being in a part of the spectrum that should not dazzle et al. Well, some manfacturers perhaps are taking short cuts...... some when looked at almost straight on have a visible whiter centre. Maybe they are using white LEDs and relying on red coloured plastic for the "colour"???

The intensity of the lights through the lens should be the same regardless of whether an LED or traditional bulb. LED bulbs are only used because they light up quicker and last longer than conventional bulbs. If you can see white light, I would say that is more likely the owner having fitted LED's but not the relevant lens if one is available.

 

[Tori_T]

The intensity of the lights through the lens should be the same regardless of whether an LED or traditional bulb.

Should be, yes, but looking at the specs, a standard incandescent brake bulb is around 15-20W. It's not hard to find aftermarket red LEDs putting out 50+W. I have one in my fog light, and it's great for that, but having to squint past them at the traffic lights isn't fun.

 

[Nod]

21/5W is (or was!) the standard twin filament tail light bulb when incandescent bulbs were the norm; 5W being the tail light and the 21W being the brake. The multi LED clusters now more common seem much brighter and are a real PITA when people sit with their foot on the brake - rather inconsiderately IMO. Can't always blame the drivers - some manufacturers' stop/start systems work when the vehicle's held on the footbrake rather than hand brake being applied.

On a (relatively compared to my tests) recent BikeSafe course, we were advised to always wait at traffic lights etc. in neutral rather than in gear with the clutch pulled in - cables can snap and launch you across the junction/crossing - same can happen with car cables.

 

[Marc]

Not completely relevant to the OP but I recently had to change to driving with hand controls. As part of the process, I had to undergo an assessment followed by some tuition followed by another assessment. I watched a number of Youtube videos in the lead up and the channel I found most useful was

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC_QdDflGx1D8Jh9mvQ7D8uQ

I think even experienced drivers could find his videos quite informative.

 

[Micehorns]

Passed my test two years ago, so nearly recent?

Handbrake - If you've just missed the lights and you'll be waiting for awhile I was always told to apply the handbrake (even done this in the test a few times)

Hillstarts - Didn't use the handbrake, as the car had hill assist.

Always ready to move - This is what I done as well. Always be in first gear and near the biting point by the time the car infront has moved.

Stationary position - was taught this with the phrase "Tarmac and tyres" - You must always see the tyres of the car ahead and some tarmac should be seen.

Speed - Was taught to keep up with traffic to the limit, actually my only minor in my test was doing 18mph in a 20 zone.

Mirror use - Same as your situation, don't make it a dramatic swing of the head, just glance at them (and make sure the instructor can see you're looking)

Junction - The phrase my instructor said was "Don't make others adjust their speed, lane or road position", so if you pull out of a junction and someone has to slow down then it's viewed as a fail. But being hesitant at a junction is a fault as well.