Help Using Long Lens

GaryLaird

GaryLaird

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Gary Laird
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Hi guys, need some help/suggestions in using a telephoto lens. I have a 100-300mmm f4.0~5.6 on a micro four third camera so 200-600mm full frame equivalent. I understand that using these long lenses is a skill in itself..... which I clearly don't have yet. I have only used the lens in anger twice and yesterday tried taking pictures of some birds using a bird feeder. I was excited when along came Mr squirrel to get in on the action and I thought I had some great shots until I uploaded to my computer.......oh dear!!!! I used shutter speed priority set at 1/800sec and an ISO of 800 to give reasonable apertures. Shooting in burst mode I think I have some serious problems with lens movement causes blurred/out of focus crappy images. I know the lens is not 'great' at maximum focal length and has had mixed reviews and I would upgrade to something better if I can master this one! I know the lens can produce reasonable results (at least for me) as it worked OK when I visited a seal sanctuary a while ago. With regards to shutter speed when using longs lenses I have seen some incredible images that claim to be shot hand held at below 1/100 of a sec at a 600mm focal length......is this really possible? The pictures I shot at the seal sanctuary had the lens braced against hand rails while those from yesterday were truly handheld with only me leaning against a wall. I also think that at an ISO of 800 there is a lot of grain! I know m4/3 cameras are not renowned for their high ISO performance I would not have considered though 800 should cause this. Maybe this 'grain or noise' is also my unsteadying shooting.

Anyway here is the evidence bellow....the pictures of the birds/squirrel from yesterday is a straight jpg output from the camera raw file.......any comments tips gratefully received :)

264mm f13.0 1/800 ISO800
20170917-P1150579.jpg by Gary Laird, on Flickr

300mm f7.1 1/800 ISO800
20170917-P1150453.jpg by Gary Laird, on Flickr

300mm f10.0 1/800 ISO800
20170917-P1150533.jpg by Gary Laird, on Flickr

264mm f9.0 1/800 ISO800
20170917-P1150563.jpg by Gary Laird, on Flickr


And now some of the better ones from the first outing at the seal sanctuary:

264mm f5.6 1/160 ISO160
20170725-P1110389.jpg by Gary Laird, on Flickr

300mm f5.6 1/500 ISO800
20170725-P1110633.jpg by Gary Laird, on Flickr

300mm f5.6 1/250 ISO400
20170725-P1110500.jpg by Gary Laird, on Flickr

300mm f5.6 1/500 ISO800
20170725-P1110629.jpg by Gary Laird, on Flickr
 
Would also add that now I see the images output as JPG's some of them don't look as bad as when I zoom in in Lightroom.
 
Just an observation in passing. On the photos of whiskers, it would appear that you don't get enough depth of field with the lens wide open. On the last 3 photos only one side of the whiskers seems to be in focus. I don't see what troubles you with the other photographs so I am keeping quiet [they might be a bit soft given other stuff we see here and you may see more imperfections when you zoom in].
 
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They don't look bad to me, but, for what it is worth, I use an ISO of 1,600 most of the time and a shutter speed of about 1/1,500 to 1/2,500.

If I am shooting below 1/1,000 I use image stabilisation - at high shutter speeds, IS can soften the image. Using IS, it should be possible to get acceptable results at 1/100 on a 600 mm lens (if you did not drink too much the night before) but IS only compensates for camera movement, not subject movement, so I use a faster shutter speed to freeze subject motion.
 
TLR-330 said:
Just an observation in passing. On the photos of whiskers, it would appear that you don't get enough depth of field with the lens wide open. On the last 3 photos only one side of the whiskers seems to be in focus. I don't see what troubles you with the other photographs so I am keeping quiet [they might be a bit soft given other stuff we see here and you may see more imperfections when you zoom in].
Click to expand...

Now that's attention to detail :) To be honest and with my eyesight I am not sure I see that. I am only using my crappy laptop screen however so you may well be correct. It probably is a function of the lens as it does not inspire confidence in use to be honest....a bit plastic and zoom certainly not smooth....nothing like the other Panasonic lenses that I own. :(
 
john.margetts said:
They don't look bad to me, but, for what it is worth, I use an ISO of 1,600 most of the time and a shutter speed of about 1/1,500 to 1/2,500.

If I am shooting below 1/1,000 I use image stabilisation - at high shutter speeds, IS can soften the image. Using IS, it should be possible to get acceptable results at 1/100 on a 600 mm lens (if you did not drink too much the night before) but IS only compensates for camera movement, not subject movement, so I use a faster shutter speed to freeze subject motion.
Click to expand...

Right so very much higher shutter speeds. I should have mentioned that lens IS was turned on. I will maybe try and post some crops latter which may highlight the issue better.
 
The biggest/most consistent issue I'm seeing is a lack of DOF and point of focus. FL has a huge affect on DOF (2x FL = 1/4 DOF), much more than aperture does... 100/4 has 2x as much DOF as 200/8 from the same distance.
 
with the birds the background is not doing you any favours. Place the feeder so that there is a mono colour,out of focus background and ensure that it is in good light so that you can have the light behind you. Get a tripod so that you only have to worry about subject movement - many birds and mammals can be taken at 1/50 to 1/100. Set your ISO no higher than 800 and your aperture to around F8 then the speed will be whatever the light allows. Take bursts of 3 and ideally use an off camera release but wait until the subject is still aiming to have the autofocus on the subjects eye and get as close to the subject as possible without frightening it.

Once you have mastered these basics then its time to start waving the camera around!!

Regen
 
sk66 said:
The biggest/most consistent issue I'm seeing is a lack of DOF and point of focus. FL has a huge affect on DOF (2x FL = 1/4 DOF), much more than aperture does... 100/4 has 2x as much DOF as 200/8 from the same distance.
Click to expand...

Thanks sk66. Yes a long focal length reduces DOF considerably. So shooting at an equivalent full frame equivalent of 600mm will have very small depth of field. For the birds/squirrel I was focussing on the bird feeder as something that was tangible to aim at.....assuming that if I hit the feeder anything around that would also be in focus......maybe in error. I was using the spot (center) focus. Its a good point and I wonder what others would focus on given that the birds are a very small part of the frame?
 
regen said:
with the birds the background is not doing you any favours. Place the feeder so that there is a mono colour,out of focus background and ensure that it is in good light so that you can have the light behind you. Get a tripod so that you only have to worry about subject movement - many birds and mammals can be taken at 1/50 to 1/100. Set your ISO no higher than 800 and your aperture to around F8 then the speed will be whatever the light allows. Take bursts of 3 and ideally use an off camera release but wait until the subject is still aiming to have the autofocus on the subjects eye and get as close to the subject as possible without frightening it.

Once you have mastered these basics then its time to start waving the camera around!!

Regen
Click to expand...

Hi Regen,
The bird feeder was in the car park of a café we visited so location was not under my control......although a bird feeder in our garden is now on the cards....and positioned with no trees in the back ground ;)
I do have a tripod but this was just grab shots in a carpark.....but indeed had I taken the time I could have set that up :(. I really just wondered about hand holding long lenses and if this is common place and indeed if there were any recommended settings/tips for doing so.
 
as the dof is so shallow at long fl I'd suggest aiming at the main subject's eye/face
 
In the crop of the Squirrel the feeder and nuts looks sharp, as others have suggested it may be the depth of field is not enough to get the squirrel as sharp as you would like.
 
How to focus for things like this is somewhat camera specific. I tend to use the center focus point and dynamic tracking of some sort with my Nikons... If the frame is loose enough I place the center focus point on the face/eye and just crop for composition. If it is tight enough I acquire focus with the center point on the face/eye and rely on tracking to maintain that focus as I recompose.
 
I really just wondered about hand holding long lenses and if this is common place and indeed if there were any recommended settings/tips for doing so.

Hi Gary,

Lots of people do hand hold big lenses - some sound as though they are trying too machine gun the subject and probably work on the principle that if you take enough you may get lucky now and again. But it probably takes longer to go thro the files and remove the rejects than it did for the whole photo session. The faster the speed and the shorter the lens then your chances are increased particularly in very good light. Most people rely on some form of support be it a bean bag,wall or branch and the better their stalking skills then the better the chance of a great picture.

Most of the great shots you see will have had a considerable amount of planning prior to execution.

Good luck

Regen
 
Thanks for the response guys. Clear issue identified with point of focus......something I need to pay greater attention to given the very small DOF. Maybe a bit of shake as well and will look at higher shutter speeds as a good starting point. As mentioned the pictures here in JPG form look much better than when zoomed in Lightroom which I guess is a brutal test for focus/sharpness. Hopefully get some more practice in today at the owl sanctuary....if I can persuade the wife she wants to go there :p
 
yep.....lunch worked ;)

and here are some of the results. Concentrated on where I was focussing and bracing the camera & lens against anything available. These are all static images so obviously easy targets but happy enough with the results.
Tried a few of the owls in flight.....oh boy that's going to be a very steep learning curve!!

20170919-20170919-P1160091-2.jpg by Gary Laird, on Flickr

20170919-P1150816.jpg by Gary Laird, on Flickr

20170919-P1160002.jpg by Gary Laird, on Flickr

20170919-P1160041.jpg by Gary Laird, on Flickr

20170919-P1160099.jpg by Gary Laird, on Flickr
 
Pretty eyes and from the look of things your models had a shampoo, conditioner and blow dry :banana:
 
Your results seem mostly fine to me. Any issues are really with focussing and not with the lens quality per se. There is one where the focus is clearly locked onto foliage rather than the squirrel, and one where the focus has caught the feeder, not the bird. A greater DOF would help a bit, but really, getting the focus to lock on the subject is the key. It can be hard with moving subjects. The "smarts" in the cameras are getting better but they're not perfect. Practice, and play around with the settings, trying both continuous and single focus tracking. Set-up a focus lock button to your liking and practice with that, too. Many longer lenses have focus lock buttons on the lens body itself and your camera will have user-configurable buttons on the back that you can press with your thumb.
 
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