Motorist faces jail for assaulting cyclist

Whilst an insurance premium may be cheap for cyclists if it was that good an idea do you not think it would have been implemented a long time ago.

You can try and force registration, insurance and a form of MOT but there will always be those that flout it just like in the motoring world and its the ones that would flout it that are probably more likely to cause harm.
 
Now we have electric bicycles when does it cease to be a bike?
Ive just returned from Austin Texas where they have public rent electric scooters. They are everywhere, on roads and pavements. These things will do 18 mph with a 15 stone rider on board. The fun will start if/when we get those here.
 
Cockney said:
Now we have electric bicycles when does it cease to be a bike?
Ive just returned from Austin Texas where they have public rent electric scooters. They are everywhere, on roads and pavements. These things will do 18 mph with a 15 stone rider on board. The fun will start if/when we get those here.
Click to expand...

Easy tiger don't get the car drivers squeezing their pitchforks even tighter! :police:
 
dod said:
I know what insurance is for. Why don't you insure against being hit by a 10 year old on a bike without insurance?
Click to expand...
I am insured against it, everyone with vehicle insurance is insured against it. But premiums would be cheaper without it. But again a 10yr old will be covered by house insurance if there is any. So your point is going nowhere.
 
Cockney said:
Now we have electric bicycles when does it cease to be a bike?
Ive just returned from Austin Texas where they have public rent electric scooters. They are everywhere, on roads and pavements. These things will do 18 mph with a 15 stone rider on board. The fun will start if/when we get those here.
Click to expand...

P.S they are already here in Edinburgh in small quantities and being used on the pavements - might start a new thread about that so as to give us cyclists a break!
 
stupar said:
Whilst an insurance premium may be cheap for cyclists if it was that good an idea do you not think it would have been implemented a long time ago.

You can try and force registration, insurance and a form of MOT but there will always be those that flout it just like in the motoring world and its the ones that would flout it that are probably more likely to cause harm.
Click to expand...
The number of motorists flouting it is small though, as it would be for cyclists, so not really a worthwhile point.
 
Cockney said:
Now we have electric bicycles when does it cease to be a bike?
Ive just returned from Austin Texas where they have public rent electric scooters. They are everywhere, on roads and pavements. These things will do 18 mph with a 15 stone rider on board. The fun will start if/when we get those here.
Click to expand...
Electric scooters aren't a legal means of transport in the UK. They can't be used on roads or pavements at present.
 
stupar said:
P.S they are already here in Edinburgh in small quantities and being used on the pavements - might start a new thread about that so as to give us cyclists a break!
Click to expand...
Wow i didn't know that. First time I saw them in Austin and they are everywhere. 4 or 5 on every street corner.
 
nilagin said:
Electric scooters aren't a legal means of transport in the UK. They can't be used on roads or pavements at present.
Click to expand...
Neither are uninsured drivers, untaxed or no MOT cars but you still see them on the road so I don't see your point
 
Cockney said:
Wow i didn't know that. First time I saw them in Austin and they are everywhere. 4 or 5 on every street corner.
Click to expand...

You can pick them up for a few hundred quid new. It's almost too cheap and too easy and only a matter of time before they really catch on (and cause issues into the bargain)
 
stupar said:
Neither are uninsured drivers, untaxed or no MOT cars but you still see them on the road so I don't see your point
Click to expand...

These aren't privately owned. You hire them with your uber app. $1.50 start and 15 cents a minute. A bit like boris bikes.
 
nilagin said:
Just ask the parents if they have a form of ID from which to copy their details. Not everyone is dishonest.
Click to expand...
These ones were. And besides, house insurance is handy in that it often covers things outside of the house. But I would be very surprised if it covered offspring lobbing stones. :LOL:

nilagin said:
If I cycled to work, I would have to get up at around 4:30 am instead of 5:00 am. On late shift I would get home around 11:45pm instead of 11:00 pm. Also I wouldn't be going to the gym after an early shift or on the way to work on a late shift ad weight training I a much better fat burner than cycling as it continues to burn fat at a faster rate and for a longer period whilst resting and even sleeping.
Cyclists can do a he'll of a lot more damage to a car than just clipping a mirror.
Click to expand...
Me me me. We are talking about the population as a whole and general trends, not your specific situation.

FWIW, I both cycle and drive so I have no particular axe to grind with any group.
Personally I find cycling on the road boring and monotonous as a hobby/sport, I would much rather spend my time off road for fun, however I do commute (partly) by bike simply because it is the quickest and cheapest option in my case.
I also drive, mainly at the weekends just like any other person and I enjoy driving past simply being a method of getting from A to B. I have a relatively fun car, not quite up to your RS level, but I struggle to get much more than half the manufacturers claimed mpg because the loud pedal is rather addictive.

Everyone should be free to travel which ever way they see fit without some moron claiming to have superiority over them.
 
nilagin said:
I am insured against it, everyone with vehicle insurance is insured against it. But premiums would be cheaper without it. But again a 10yr old will be covered by house insurance if there is any. So your point is going nowhere.
Click to expand...
Fair enough, we are insured against it generally (although that wasn't the point I was making and you know it) and will incur financial loss if we can't get someone to accept liability.

I wouldn't have thought a child scraping someone's car on a bike would be covered by household insurance, maybe an expert can confirm one way or the other? If not we're back to insuring everyone against every eventuality which I just can't see happening.
 
Cockney said:
Now we have electric bicycles when does it cease to be a bike?
Ive just returned from Austin Texas where they have public rent electric scooters. They are everywhere, on roads and pavements. These things will do 18 mph with a 15 stone rider on board. The fun will start if/when we get those here.
Click to expand...
There's a technical definition somewhere, to do with speed and/or power I think where if it exceeds certain limits it's classed as a motor cycle presumably.

edit: I assume this is accurate and correct

https://www.cyclingweekly.com/news/product-news/electric-bikes-uk-law-234973
 
Last edited:
stupar said:
Neither are uninsured drivers, untaxed or no MOT cars but you still see them on the road so I don't see your point
Click to expand...
Do you have your own personal ANPR camera? I fail to see spot them without one and instantly recognise them as breaking the law and not meant to be there.
 
nilagin said:
Do you have your own personal ANPR camera? I fail to see spot them without one and instantly recognise them as breaking the law and not meant to be there.
Click to expand...

Don't be a pedant and play on my words when you know exactly what I mean.
The police and road networks do, and as part of there job is to catch them, it by default becomes a statistic available to the media and general public
 
Last edited by a moderator:
dod said:
Fair enough, we are insured against it generally (although that wasn't the point I was making and you know it) and will incur financial loss if we can't get someone to accept liability.

I wouldn't have thought a child scraping someone's car on a bike would be covered by household insurance, maybe an expert can confirm one way or the other? If not we're back to insuring everyone against every eventuality which I just can't see happening.
Click to expand...

As with most insurance today compared to how it used to be where a lot of things were standard cover, it appears it may now be an added extra that you would have to specify and pay extra for. But from what I can make out from a quick Google search, the cost of cover is very small.
 
bass_junkie83 said:
Me me me. We are talking about the population as a whole and general trends, not your specific situation.
Click to expand...
If we are talking about the population as a whole, whilst obesity is on the increase, it is far from the norm. Also on the increase is the distance people find themselves having to commute to work due to cost of housing whether buying or renting and as a result thete is less likelihood of them being able or wanting to cycle to work.
 
stupar said:
Don't be a pedant and play on my words when you know exactly what I mean.
The police and road networks do, and as part of there job is to catch them, it by default becomes a statistic available to the media and general public
Click to expand...
So what was the point of your comment then. Even though there is a very small minority of motorists who don't drive legally, the mode of transport is still legal. Electric scooters aren't legal so can't be taxed, registered, MOT'd etc. So a pointless comparison.
 
stupar said:
What about a stray animal (e.g. Sheep or deer) that you hit because they run out onto the road (more a rural scenario but still valid all the same).
Click to expand...

In the case of the sheep, you could try and claim from the farmer, same as dogs, if stray the owner is responsible

A few years back I was just at the end of the London to Brighton Bike ride, heading down to the seafront finish
line I caught a car's side mirror and smashed it :oops: :$
Stopped to apologise and offer to pay, guy just shook my hand and congratulated me on doing the ride
 
nilagin said:
Even though there is a very small minority of motorists who don't drive legally,
Click to expand...
Iteresting point on that: various police officers have been shown on TV stating that up to 1 million drivers are uninsured. However the prosecution records show that the highest prosecution year was 2017 with 118,698 convictions while the following year (2018) only 79,713 insuranceless drivers were caught. Either the police aren't making sufficient use of the ANPR network or a wildly excessive estimate has become received wisdom among front line officers. :thinking:
 
nilagin said:
So what was the point of your comment then. Even though there is a very small minority of motorists who don't drive legally, the mode of transport is still legal. Electric scooters aren't legal so can't be taxed, registered, MOT'd etc. So a pointless comparison.
Click to expand...
The mode of transport is not legal if it is not being used in accordance with the law and you know it!

Wouldn't that be great in court - no insurance, tax or MOT but as your vehicle is a legal form of transport we will let you off........ give over.
 
Last edited by a moderator:
AndrewFlannigan said:
Iteresting point on that: various police officers have been shown on TV stating that up to 1 million drivers are uninsured. However the prosecution records show that the highest prosecution year was 2017 with 118,698 convictions while the following year (2018) only 79,713 insuranceless drivers were caught. Either the police aren't making sufficient use of the ANPR network or a wildly excessive estimate has become received wisdom among front line officers. :thinking:
Click to expand...

Probably just don't have the manpower to deal with it all so only deal with those they pull over for something else?
 
KitsuneAndy said:
Probably just don't have the manpower to deal with it all so only deal with those they pull over for something else?
Click to expand...

I would agree. Police resource is stretched as it is so there will be plenty that slip under the radar.
 
stupar said:
The mode of transport is not legal if it is not because used in accordance with the law and you know it.

Wouldn't that be great in court - no insurance, tax or MOT but as your vehicle is a legal form of transport we will let you off........ give over.
Click to expand...
Now whose being pedantic or are you that really that dense. A car is a recognised legal means of transport, it can be taxed, insured and in most cases MOT'd for use on the road. An electric scooter at present as they can only be used on private land in the UK.
 
nilagin said:
Now whose being pedantic or are you that really that dense. A car is a recognised legal means of transport, it can be taxed, insured and in most cases MOT'd for use on the road. An electric scooter at present as they can only be used on private land in the UK.
Click to expand...

No need to start getting personal
 
Red light, jump red light and instant karma.......that's right because unbeknown to some, car drivers are equally not perfect!

I guess it was the cyclists fault in this case though.

 
Last edited by a moderator:
Ok, so there is a clear resolution here. Each person takes turns posting youtube videos of highways transgressions, alternating between car and bicycle. The first person to run out of videos is the loser and that particular mode of transport is banned from the roads forever. The victor is crowned king of the road and gets a certificate and everything!

Seems to be the sensible conclusion to this discussion........
 
bass_junkie83 said:
Ok, so there is a clear resolution here. Each person takes turns posting youtube videos of highways transgressions, alternating between car and bicycle. The first person to run out of videos is the loser and that particular mode of transport is banned from the roads forever. The victor is crowned king of the road and gets a certificate and everything!

Seems to be the sensible conclusion to this discussion........
Click to expand...

ha ha i like it! I will apologise for mine as I only did it to serve a point.
That point being that some drivers are not worthy of being on the road let alone cyclists and, despite this original thread being about the wrongdoing of a motorist, somehow the cyclist in general is still vilified.
 
Last edited by a moderator:
It's just a pity that most people who break the rules and behave dangerously don't receive such instant feedback as either the cyclist or the driver above.
 
bass_junkie83 said:
Ok, so there is a clear resolution here. Each person takes turns posting youtube videos of highways transgressions, alternating between car and bicycle. The first person to run out of videos is the loser and that particular mode of transport is banned from the roads forever. The victor is crowned king of the road and gets a certificate and everything!

Seems to be the sensible conclusion to this discussion........
Click to expand...
Not just car and bicycle, we have to include pedestrians too.
View: https://youtu.be/25AMmV2uzkg

:)
 
KitsuneAndy said:
The amount of drivers who think it's legal to break the speed limit when overtaking is ridiculous as well.
Click to expand...

Don't get me started on Norwich! ;P

BTW, love your work Andy, super stuff.

Anyway, back on topic. Im pretty much of the opinion that all road user break the rule in equal measure. And the few articles I've read on the subject more or less confirm this. That said, the difference between law-breaking cyclists and law-breaking motorists are like night and day, not because one is somehow more virtuous than the other, its simply a matter of physics.
For example, since this thread started and many have been moaning about cyclists, motorists have killed 30 people, this time tomorrow it will be 35.
 
Mattyd said:
https://www.autoexpress.co.uk/car-n...than-half-of-drivers-break-30mph-speed-limits
Click to expand...
It doesn't say how such data is derived. To come up with concrete statistics how are they deciding which cars are speeding or not? Speed cameras maybe They don't cover every foot of motorway how have they determined how many cars weren't speeding as far as I am aware, speed cameras don't register a passing car that isn't speeding.
We have a couple of speed cameras on the entry road at work. If I set my cruise control to 30mph on the way into work the sign displays a smiley face and tells me I am doing 29mph. Repeat the same when leaving work and it will tell me I am doing 30mph but sometimes I get a frowning face as it has registered 31mph.
Similar speed sensors but with a sign saying slow down can be found on 30mph roads and always give a message if over 30mph yet car speedometers have a 10% tolerance, so technically people could not be speeding.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top