Nikon Z6 and Z7 mirrorless

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Trevor
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There’s a 20mm f1.8 and 24mm f1.8 on the way but I’m not sure they’ll be small and light
My thoughts exactly. Out today with the 50. Not heavy but not exactly small either.
Would like something compact. Don’t think we’re getting that at f1.8. I guess one day maybe at F2.8. Probably years away. I won’t live long enough.
 
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My thoughts exactly. Out today with the 50. Not heavy but not exactly small either.
Would like something compact. Don’t think we’re getting that at f1.8. I guess one day maybe at F2.8. Probably years away. I won’t live long enough.
What makes me 'laugh' is that the whole ethos of mirrorless being smaller and lighter has gone out of the window.

D750 plus 50mm f1.8G 1026g
Z6/7 plus 50mm f1.8 S 1090g

Screen Shot 2019-05-15 at 19.34.12
by TDG-77, on Flickr


Prime lenses seem to be getting bigger and bigger, with Sigma primes being monsters. I think we have to stop thinking of mirrorless as small and light now and are just and evolution of DSLRs, the only way you can get genuinely/significantly smaller and lighter is by changing format.

.
 
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Just on small and light lenses.

Didn't Sigma recently say they're looking at smaller lenses for mirrorless cameras? These smaller lenses may not be announced tomorrow and if/when they do come they probably wont have the across the frame performance from wide open that the newer large lenses have but they'll probably be good enough for many of us who'll willingly bypass excellent performance in a big and heavy lens for acceptable to good performance in a compact and light lens.
 
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It strikes me, with absolutely no evidence, that Nikon are pricing and manufacturing their Z lenses with the pro market in mind; those who need top resolution at any cost. Remember, these lenses have to perform on the Z7 sensor, not just the Z6. And maybe, who knows, the next Z camera will be of even higher resolution (goodness knows why) and it will already have lenses to make the most of it. Which doesn’t help us paupers (speaking for myself). But if the Sigmas and Tamrons can perhaps make “second tier” lenses ...
 
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Just on small and light lenses.

Didn't Sigma recently say they're looking at smaller lenses for mirrorless cameras? These smaller lenses may not be announced tomorrow and if/when they do come they probably wont have the across the frame performance from wide open that the newer large lenses have but they'll probably be good enough for many of us who'll willingly bypass excellent performance in a big and heavy lens for acceptable to good performance in a compact and light lens.
Interesting, that’s be good, although that probably just means f1.8 lenses rather than f1.4 ;)
It strikes me, with absolutely no evidence, that Nikon are pricing and manufacturing their Z lenses with the pro market in mind; those who need top resolution at any cost. Remember, these lenses have to perform on the Z7 sensor, not just the Z6. And maybe, who knows, the next Z camera will be of even higher resolution (goodness knows why) and it will already have lenses to make the most of it. Which doesn’t help us paupers (speaking for myself). But if the Sigmas and Tamrons can perhaps make “second tier” lenses ...
I think they’ve all done this tbh, ie starting with premium lenses. I’m pretty sure I read somewhere that Nikon will be doing a line of more affordable lenses as well as the S line, but when who knows. Also I’ve read they’ll be doing DX mirrorless too.
 
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Interesting, that’s be good, although that probably just means f1.8 lenses rather than f1.4 ;)
Or even f2 or even f2.8...

I've been down the route of f1.4, f1.2 and even f0.95 but in reality most of the time I don't want to take pictures with next to nothing in the DoF. YMMV and all that. Each of us could maybe have a serious think and decide if f1.4 is really a necessity or more a case of GAS and if it is then maybe f1.8 or even Gosh forbid f2 might in reality be enough :D especially if it comes in a compact and light package.

I just can't see me ever buying one of these modern very good but big and heavy and attention grabbing f1.4's. I could afford them and indeed I could afford a full set so it's not really honestly and truly a money issue but more that I much prefer smaller, lighter and more unobtrusive kit. YMMV etc...
 
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Or even f2 or even f2.8...

I've been down the route of f1.4, f1.2 and even f0.95 but in reality most of the time I don't want to take pictures with next to nothing in the DoF. YMMV and all that. Each of us could maybe have a serious think and decide if f1.4 is really a necessity or more a case of GAS and if it is then maybe f1.8 or even Gosh forbid f2 might in reality be enough :D especially if it comes in a compact and light package.

I just can't see me ever buying one of these modern very good but big and heavy and attention grabbing f1.4's. I could afford them and indeed I could afford a full set so it's not really honestly and truly a money issue but more that I much prefer smaller, lighter and more unobtrusive kit. YMMV etc...
The reason I said that was that all the latest Sigma primes that I'm aware of (other than macro) are f1.4, they haven't been interested in 'slow' lenses so think that smaller lighter would mean f1.8. Of course this is purely speculation on my behalf ;)

I'm a fan of fast lenses, but not for the wafer thin DOF per se. I like the extreme subject isolation that gives (to my eyes) a hint of a diorama or Brenizer look. Of course, this is not just down to the lens aperture but the characteristics of the lens itself. This is why I like some of the legacy Leica and Zeiss lenses.
 
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What makes me 'laugh' is that the whole ethos of mirrorless being smaller and lighter has gone out of the window.

D750 plus 50mm f1.8G 1026g
Z6/7 plus 50mm f1.8 S 1090g

Screen Shot 2019-05-15 at 19.34.12
by TDG-77, on Flickr


Prime lenses seem to be getting bigger and bigger, with Sigma primes being monsters. I think we have to stop thinking of mirrorless as small and light now and are just and evolution of DSLRs, the only way you can get genuinely/significantly smaller and lighter is by changing format.

.
If the old screw driven lenses could be used on the zeds then there would be a smalller lighter autofocus option. Alas the days of small f2.8 or f2 lenses are behind us, I fear. Big f1.8s are the new f2.8s.
 
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Nikon have confirmed exactly what the new firmware will bring, and there’s nothing that we didn’t already know. Seems a decent ‘upgrade’ though.

1. Eye AF
2. AE changes during continuous high extended shooting
3. Improved low light AF (I’ve seen it said -6ev for the Z6 and -4ev for the Z7 but Nikon haven’t confirmed yet AFAIK)
4. CFexpress compatibility.
Ok so since posting this it now appears that 'only' eye-AF, AE changes during continuous extended, and improved low light AF will be included in the firmware update tomorrow, CFexpress compatibility and support for RAW video output (which I forgot to mention) are now showing as "release date to be announced".
 
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What makes me 'laugh' is that the whole ethos of mirrorless being smaller and lighter has gone out of the window.
You're being unrealistic with your expectations for native lenses within a few months of them launching a new system, one of the advantages of mirrorless isn't that it's small but rather that it can do both and given time you'll eventually be able to choose between a small or large setup, which is nice.

I think they probably made the right choice going for a better 50mm, eventually they should make a Z mount version of the G but anyone who wanted a budget option can just adapt the G...
 
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Pleased to see this in the update - hopefully will default to EFCS when it can :

Item d5 in the CUSTOM SETTING MENU, formerly Electronic front-curtain shutter, has been renamed Shutter type and offers a choice of Auto, Mechanical shutter, and Electronic front-curtain shutter. If Auto is selected, the camera will automatically choose a shutter type according to shutter speed.
 
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Pleased to see this in the update - hopefully will default to EFCS when it can :

Item d5 in the CUSTOM SETTING MENU, formerly Electronic front-curtain shutter, has been renamed Shutter type and offers a choice of Auto, Mechanical shutter, and Electronic front-curtain shutter. If Auto is selected, the camera will automatically choose a shutter type according to shutter speed.
I have yet to update but from what I've read it switches to mechanical shutter at speeds of 1/320s and faster.
 
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Alan
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I have yet to update but from what I've read it switches to mechanical shutter at speeds of 1/320s and faster.
Sounds like they're trying to avoid shutter shock?

For anyone new to electronic shutters... they can cause rolling shutter effects and banding under some flickering artificial lighting. I've never been bothered about rolling shutter but I have seen banding with my Panasonic cameras and it can be shot ruining. Anyone shooting under flickering artificial lighting sound perhaps consider the possibility of banding if thinking about using an electronic shutter.
 
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You're being unrealistic with your expectations for native lenses within a few months of them launching a new system, one of the advantages of mirrorless isn't that it's small but rather that it can do both and given time you'll eventually be able to choose between a small or large setup, which is nice.

I think they probably made the right choice going for a better 50mm, eventually they should make a Z mount version of the G but anyone who wanted a budget option can just adapt the G...
My quote was a bit tongue in cheek tbh as I've said before that you can't change physics and FF lenses are FF lenses. One of the advantages of mirrorless that people used to state was the weight advantage, but this is only significant with m4/3 and some Fuji setups. But then FF mirrorless came along and your weight advantage disappeared to large extent. Yes the bodies are slightly lighter, but the lenses aren't and as a result I don't believe mirrorless has a big advantage in terms of weight.

This is absolutely fine of course, and I haven't bought into the Z system to save weight per se (although of course swapping from the D850 to the Z7 is more of a significant weight saving than swapping from something like the D750) but I've bought into it for the form factor and tech such as EVF, auto switching to live view, silent shooting, peaking and all the other advantages of mirrorless. I just prefer using mirrorless over DSLR. If I want to 'travel' light then I still have my M4/3 system (y)
 
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Sounds like they're trying to avoid shutter shock?

For anyone new to electronic shutters... they can cause rolling shutter effects and banding under some flickering artificial lighting. I've never been bothered about rolling shutter but I have seen banding with my Panasonic cameras and it can be shot ruining. Anyone shooting under flickering artificial lighting sound perhaps consider the possibility of banding if thinking about using an electronic shutter.
I'm yet to see any rolling shutter using EFCS but have using full electronic shutter.
View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WODxhodB3-o


not the best doesn't show any images, but gives you an idea of it working
Another comparison video
View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=opJeiICdfhU
 
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View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WODxhodB3-o


not the best doesn't show any images, but gives you an idea of it working
Seems the Sony is still slightly better, being able to pick up the eye when the subject is smaller in the frame. I did feel at one point there was some Sony bias though as when he was moving in and out from the side of the frame he 'jumped' into the frame with the Nikon but didn't enter the frame so fast with the Sony. However, overall the Sony looked better to me, but the Nikon looked perfectly useable to me.
 
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Firmware all done and the new face AF seems pretty impressive for a first generation mirrorless camera from Nikon. Now if they would just change the horizontal horizon to the series of dashes (rather than the big "compass") and have it available on screen at the same time as the histogram (as most other mirrorless cameras can), then the Z6 for me would be just about perfect.
 
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Firmware all done and the new face AF seems pretty impressive for a first generation mirrorless camera from Nikon. Now if they would just change the horizontal horizon to the series of dashes (rather than the big "compass") and have it available on screen at the same time as the histogram (as most other mirrorless cameras can), then the Z6 for me would be just about perfect.
I presume it didn't wipe your existing settings?
 
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Firmware all done and the new face AF seems pretty impressive for a first generation mirrorless camera from Nikon. Now if they would just change the horizontal horizon to the series of dashes (rather than the big "compass") and have it available on screen at the same time as the histogram (as most other mirrorless cameras can), then the Z6 for me would be just about perfect.
I did mention this to the Nikon representative that I was in discussion with via email and he said that he would pass it onto the developers, but I'll not hold my breath ;) I wish they'd allow customisation of the display as well like Olympus, so that you can choose which features you want displayed. For example, I don't like that when you choose to view the histogram you lose some of the other setting info. I'd like all the info, plus histogram plus rudimental virtual horizon
 
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David
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Yep, it can be had for 350€ plus shipping across Europe. This is very tempting to switch over from the 50/1.8 G.
Yes, I'm astonished that the 50mm is now virtually half the price it was at the beginning of the year. Indeed I might have even had second thoughts about getting an MF 50mm f1.2 at only around £20 pounds less if I'd known (although the 1.2 has its own very special characteristics) Why couldn't they also do the €200 reduction on the 35mm?
 
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Just pressed go on Z7 and 24-70 f4 to replace my D810 - I'm going totally mirrorless baby!
Thanks for whoever said it's poss to get discount from Panamoz - they took off an extra £20 (it all counts!) - thought about e-infinity but I think that it's worth the extra for a longer warranty for a camera whereas I'd take more of a risk with just the lens.
 
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Just pressed go on Z7 and 24-70 f4 to replace my D810 - I'm going totally mirrorless baby!
Thanks for whoever said it's poss to get discount from Panamoz - they took off an extra £20 (it all counts!) - thought about e-infinity but I think that it's worth the extra for a longer warranty for a camera whereas I'd take more of a risk with just the lens.
You're welcome ;) Did you get the FTZ too?
Since UK prices have dropped, is Panamoz likely to follow suit? Interested in trying out the Z6 with adapter/24-70 lens kit.
I wondered about that as I only bought mine a couple of weeks ago and would have been gutted if it suddenly went for £300 less, however they haven't dropped their prices yet. I think (although don't take this as gospel) grey importers follow US prices more than UK ones and they had their discounts applied a while ago I believe. The prices will of course continue to fall over time.
 
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I'm yet to see any rolling shutter using EFCS but have using full electronic shutter.
I don't think EFCS is a problem or at least I know it can cause some issues (maybe with flash?) but I've never seen a single issue since I got my A7 and I'd expect Nikon to be the same, zero issues :D An electronic shutter is another matter and issues are easy to find and reproduce.
 
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I did mention this to the Nikon representative that I was in discussion with via email and he said that he would pass it onto the developers, but I'll not hold my breath ;) I wish they'd allow customisation of the display as well like Olympus, so that you can choose which features you want displayed. For example, I don't like that when you choose to view the histogram you lose some of the other setting info. I'd like all the info, plus histogram plus rudimental virtual horizon
Agree, say what you want about Olympus and Micro Four thirds, but they really do give the user the ability to really customise their camera to how they want it (not the manufacture)
 

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Just a query about eye AF (particularly on the Zs but also just in general) - does it work on animals too, or just humans? Apologies if this is a completely idiotic query :ROFLMAO:
 
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Quite a few people on FB are stating that it works on dog eyes, but not cats :)

Haven't tried it myself though.
 
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Just a query about eye AF (particularly on the Zs but also just in general) - does it work on animals too, or just humans? Apologies if this is a completely idiotic query :ROFLMAO:
Nikon haven't specified animal AF, whether it does or not I don't know. Maybe I'll risk updating mine later and try it on our dog. Sony have recently released animal eye AF for some of their mirrorless cameras though.
Already have one with the Z6. Thought about getting another in a kit and selling it but it wasn't quite worth it.
Are you keeping both bodies then or selling the Z6?
 
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