One deadly weekend in America. BBC prog

Chipper

Chipper

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i have had this in the planner for a while and am watching it today. A staggering statistic from this programme is that 86 people every day die from gunshot wounds. It is so sad to see the devastation caused by this to those that remain: arguments going out of control, gang violence, suicide so far. Ah dear.
 
the carnage is just nuts, many people say guns are just tools in america and until someone actually stands up and takes on board its not a tool, its a machine made by men to kill other men.
the yanks are a doomed race.
 
Americans are not a race.
 
As the saying goes "guns don't kill people, people do"

Cause needs treating, not the symptoms and far more basic problems need sorting than gun control
 
It's ok to say treat the cause, but until you've done that then some sensible gun control is sensible. If anything else was killing that number of people daily you'd treat it as a major public health issue, and attempt to address it & when push comes to shove nobody needs military grade weapons at home
 
Chipper said:
A staggering statistic from this programme is that 86 people every day die from gunshot wounds
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boyfalldown said:
. If anything else was killing that number of people daily you'd treat it as a major public health issue
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In 2014, ( couldn't find any thing more up to date) 32,675 people were killed in 29,989 crashes, an average of 96 per day.
But perhaps that's acceptable because of the financial interests
 
Cobra said:
In 2014, ( couldn't find any thing more up to date) 32,675 people were killed in 29,989 crashes, an average of 96 per day.
But perhaps that's acceptable because of the financial interests
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Just because one thing is an issue doesn't meant it excludes all others. Nor does it mean you shouldn't attempt to do anything about it. The list of public health concerns could go on and on.Unlike gun control though, sensible measure are taken to reduce those deaths (thats not the same as eliminate them).For example there are licences, tests, speed limits, drivers ed etc aimed at making the roads safer. In the US there isn't really an equivalent sensible measure for guns.

A scarier statistic, but one equally meaningless -according to the LA times less then 7,000 US service personal have been killed in the war on terror, by enemy action, since 2001. That would mean that more civilians died of gunshot wounds in the first three months of this year, then soldiers have been killed fighting for their country over the last 16 years. Another meaningless way of looking is at that rate of firearms deaths it takes 21 years for as many Americans to die from gunshot domestically as US soldiers who've died on the battlefields of every war that country has ever fought in.
 
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Mr Bump said:
the carnage is just nuts, many people say guns are just tools in america and until someone actually stands up and takes on board its not a tool, its a machine made by men to kill other men.
the yanks are a doomed race.
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In terms of gun crime there are a number of countries with worse rates, I think from memory South Africa and Brazil, yet we seem obsessed by the US?
 
boyfalldown said:
Just because one thing is an issue doesn't meant it excludes all others.
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I was just responding to
boyfalldown said:
f anything else was killing that number of people daily
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and not passing judgement on there very lax gun "licensing" laws .. well "Cooling off period" anyway ;)
TBH, I don't know why we worry about such things, that we can't change or influence, we we have our own problems, that need sorting.
Its about time the UK realised that its not the Empire it once was, we do not own nor control half the world any more.
As they say in America, gun control is being able to hit your target.
 
Cobra said:
I was just responding to

and not passing judgement on there very lax gun "licensing" laws .. well "Cooling off period" anyway ;)
TBH, I don't know why we worry about such things, that we can't change or influence, we we have our own problems, that need sorting.
Its about time the UK realised that its not the Empire it once was, we do not own nor control half the world any more.
As they say in America, gun control is being able to hit your target.
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I agree not passing judgement, we'll have stuff all influence anyway. But more 'observing'
 
cambsno said:
In terms of gun crime there are a number of countries with worse rates, I think from memory South Africa and Brazil, yet we seem obsessed by the US?
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There are about 50 murders/day in South Africa. That's the official statistic, and the true figure might well be higher. I don't have a breakdown of the causes of death, but these are not all gun related.

The total population is around 55 - 60 million, so the murder rate per 100,000 people is significantly higher than the US.
 
cambsno said:
In terms of gun crime there are a number of countries with worse rates, I think from memory South Africa and Brazil, yet we seem obsessed by the US?
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Yeah because South Africa and Brazil are really safe countries with great human rights records?

the US on the other hand declare itself to be the best and the greatest country on earth with god on its side?
 
Mr Bump said:
Yeah because South Africa and Brazil are really safe countries with great human rights records?

the US on the other hand declare itself to be the best and the greatest country on earth with god on its side?
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US are not exactly great in the human rights department either, in fact up there with the worst I reckon.
 
it always makee me laugh when the discussion of gun deaths and violence comes up and people try and analyse it you cant.

the yanks love there guns
they are racist homophobes
thay hate each other

im just glad they have borders to keep all their f***ed up s*** in.
 
All down to perspective. Like has been stated, 10s or thousands people die each year on the roads. Let's ban cars, because cars kill people not the people driving those cars.
Even with all the systems in place to reduce the risk, people still die.

I think people forget why the Americans have easy access to fire arms. It all goes back to independence and the setting up of maltia.
 
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Dave70D said:
Agree, the US,Russia and China are the worst imo.
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Really... So North Korea, Zimbabwe, Egypt, Kenya, Israel, Gambia, Pakistan, Saudi and Syria are better than the US? Not according to Amnesty who have most of those plus Russia and China as the top 10 worst offenders.
 
cambsno said:
Really... So North Korea, Zimbabwe, Egypt, Kenya, Israel, Gambia, Pakistan, Saudi and Syria are better than the US? Not according to Amnesty who have most of those plus Russia and China as the top 10 worst offenders.
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If you dig deeper, every country Has committed bad or evils over the years, even the UK, but some people forget.
 
I know that I quoted a statistic which I found shocking but that wasn't what struck me about the programme which looked at fatal shootings over one weekend in America - it was the misery that it left behind. Generalisations about Americans are not valid in my view. More for example voted against their gun loving President than voted for him.
 
Let's say ban all guns in America because they kill people.... isn't guns banned in UK a long time ago? What do muslims use now to kill cause chaos/suffering people in the streets of Londonistan? Vehicles, machetes, acid?

I am a British citizen living in America at the moment, I see that gun owners are the most law abiding and friendliest people in here TBH.

The gun violence you hear about, mostly happen in California and Chicago, these s***holes are the Democrat infested places where they are strict on guns, even buying ammunition, they require a valid I.D. and yet, the criminals still acquire guns.

But you never hear about the guy who used a gun to protect himself, and most recently, a good guy with a gun who saved a police officer by shooting at the criminal in Arizona.

Speaking of California, Robbie Williams (correction: Robin Williams) didn't own a gun, but he still killed himself with a rope... wanna ban ropes now?

There is also a correlation between suicide and taking anti depressants, but that is another topic for another day.

These are some of my toys:
30742354791_1fd28b06ec_z.jpg


30209364564_4fa5b4de39_z.jpg


31568597363_b03fc64495_z.jpg


35070421131_272f6804b6_z.jpg
 
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strobemonkey said:
Let's say ban all guns in America because they kill people.... isn't guns banned in UK a long time ago? What do muslims use now to kill cause chaos/suffering people in the streets of Londonistan? Vehicles, machetes, acid?

I am a British citizen living in America at the moment, I see that gun owners are the most law abiding and friendliest people in here TBH.

The gun violence you hear about, mostly happen in California and Chicago, these s***holes are the Democrat infested places where they are strict on guns, even buying ammunition, they require a valid I.D. and yet, the criminals still acquire guns.

But you never hear about the guy who used a gun to protect himself, and most recently, a good guy with a gun who saved a police officer by shooting at the criminal in Arizona.

Speaking of California, Robbie Williams didn't own a gun, but he still killed himself with a rope... wanna ban ropes now?

There is also a correlation between suicide and taking anti depressants, but that is another topic for another day.
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Welcome to my ignore list :)
 
Keith W said:
I do not see any facts in your post

Also Robbie Williams is very much still alive ;)
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Facts that I experience myself... ans sorry, I meant Robin Williams... lmao
 
Things is it's fine to be killed by another American, it's those damn ISIS terrorists that you need to spend billions on protecting yourselves against, banning them from entering the country, inconveniencing everyone at airports for. Because, after all, more people are killed by toddlers than are killed by terrorists
 
Go and strobe your monkey for a bit and release some of that pent up racist, angry frustration that you have
 
strobemonkey said:
Let's say ban all guns in America because they kill people.... isn't guns banned in UK a long time ago? What do muslims use now to kill cause chaos/suffering people in the streets of Londonistan? Vehicles, machetes, acid?

I am a British citizen living in America at the moment, I see that gun owners are the most law abiding and friendliest people in here TBH.

The gun violence you hear about, mostly happen in California and Chicago, these s***holes are the Democrat infested places where they are strict on guns, even buying ammunition, they require a valid I.D. and yet, the criminals still acquire guns.

But you never hear about the guy who used a gun to protect himself, and most recently, a good guy with a gun who saved a police officer by shooting at the criminal in Arizona.

Speaking of California, Robbie Williams (correction: Robin Williams) didn't own a gun, but he still killed himself with a rope... wanna ban ropes now?

There is also a correlation between suicide and taking anti depressants, but that is another topic for another day.

These are some of my toys:
30742354791_1fd28b06ec_z.jpg


30209364564_4fa5b4de39_z.jpg


31568597363_b03fc64495_z.jpg


35070421131_272f6804b6_z.jpg
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Well, if (as you say) guns were banned in the UK a long time ago, my own arrest is long overdue:)
 
Keith W said:
Go and strobe your monkey for a bit and release some of that pent up racist, angry frustration that you have
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1. Racist = I am not white nor black
2. I am not angry
3. Am I frustrated ? - maybe yes, because we need more Nigel Farage, Tommy Robinson, Paul Joseph Watson, Tara McCarthy and other patriotic Brits to wake people up...
 
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Garry Edwards said:
Well, if (as you say) guns were banned in the UK a long time ago, my own arrest is long overdue:)
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I don't mean all guns. And I know some people can acquire 22LR, 22MAg, 17HMR and shot guns... Eley 22LR is a great ammo brand made in England... heck I remember trying to buy an Air rifle back then in Uk just to kill grey squirrels in my backyard, but there are so many restrictive recquirements that I gave up. Eventhough I knew there was another easier way for acquiring one, I did not do it as I did not want to break the law. If I were a criminal, would I care?

I was also there when that guy went on a rampage shooting people with a shotgun...
 
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strobemonkey said:
I don't mean all guns. And I know some people can acquire 22LR, 22MAg, 17HMR and shot guns... Eley 22LR is a great brand made in England... heck I remember trying to buy an Air rifle back then in Uk just to kill grey squirrels in my backyard, but there are so many restrictive recquirements that I gave up. Eventhough I knew there was another easier way for acquiring one, I did not do it as I did not want to break the law. If I were a criminal, would I care?

I was also there when that guy went on a rampage shooting people with a shotgun...
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There are NO restrictions (other than those on persons prohibited by virtue of having been sentenced to a term of imprisonment) for adults who want to buy "normal" powered airguns.
And about a million people own shotguns, rifles with a wide range of calibres, and some of us own pistols too, although these are far more tightly regulated than either shotguns or rifles.

Just a clarification of your comment I suppose, but the reality is that about 1 person in every 66 owns some kind of firearm, which I suppose means that (on average) one home in 16 has one or more legally owned firearms.

It's just that here, unlike the USA, it's extremely rare for firearms owners to use them irresponsibly.
 
Garry Edwards said:
There are NO restrictions (other than those on persons prohibited by virtue of having been sentenced to a term of imprisonment) for adults who want to buy "normal" powered airguns.
And about a million people own shotguns, rifles with a wide range of calibres, and some of us own pistols too, although these are far more tightly regulated than either shotguns or rifles.

Just a clarification of your comment I suppose, but the reality is that about 1 person in every 66 owns some kind of firearm, which I suppose means that (on average) one home in 16 has one or more legally owned firearms.

It's just that here, unlike the USA, it's extremely rare for firearms owners to use them irresponsibly.
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Thanks for the info, but it's hard to believe your data though I am NOT arguing you are wrong.

Anyway, I believe "Responsibility" is the key word here when owning guns.
 
OK, it seems that my data is wrong, the official figure is 736,097 individuals and on average each individual owns several guns. Full official info, which is a couple of years out of date, is here https://www.gov.uk/government/publi...nd-and-wales-financial-year-ending-march-2015.

The big difference between here and most states in the USA is that except when the police badly screw up (Ryan, Hamilton, Bird) the people who have guns have been positively vetted, are of good character and are required to have suitable, safe storage.

BTW, as far as I'm concerned at least, you're more than welcome to our "Patriotic brits":)
 
Garry Edwards said:
OK, it seems that my data is wrong, the official figure is 736,097 individuals and on average each individual owns several guns. Full official info, which is a couple of years out of date, is here https://www.gov.uk/government/publi...nd-and-wales-financial-year-ending-march-2015.

The big difference between here and most states in the USA is that except when the police badly screw up (Ryan, Hamilton, Bird) the people who have guns have been positively vetted, are of good character and are required to have suitable, safe storage.

BTW, as far as I'm concerned at least, you're more than welcome to our "Patriotic brits":)
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I never said you are wrong, I said it's hard to believe... :)

Thank you for the warm welcome ;)
 
Garry Edwards said:
There are NO restrictions (other than those on persons prohibited by virtue of having been sentenced to a term of imprisonment) for adults who want to buy "normal" powered airguns.
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AFAIK, you must have an Air Weapon Certificate to own an airgun in Scotland. You need to show 'good reason' - amongst other things - and the fee is £72.
 
Garry Edwards said:
Just a clarification of your comment I suppose, but the reality is that about 1 person in every 66 owns some kind of firearm, which I suppose means that (on average) one home in 16 has one or more legally owned firearms.
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Its also worth pointing out that does vary widely by police force (and area). For example there are considerably less people holding a gun in the Met's area (I think its about 1 in 500) against parts of Wales where its nearer 1 in 50.
 
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