Ospreys from the new hide

well done on your news spread, the first photo is fantastic imo
 
Just superb.
 
Stupendous shots :)
 
Thanks All,
I have hundreds more, but so pleased Gary;s image has made the papers and over 100,000 views on his web page in the first couple of days, double figure dives this morning in good light so lots more images to come.
I do think the new hide is the best in the business and with more Osprey dives than anywhere else, but i am already planning a few little changes to it, i don't want guys getting the same old image and i know i can make it even better for next year,
Sometimes it better to do the Ospreys two at a time, saves waiting around, who wants to sit in a Osprey hide all morning for nothing, o that's somewhere else. lol
Thanks Gordon.
 

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they are reasonable images, but your processing could be a lot better

the first image is good but technically the rest are weak
 
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Thanks Bill.
I only post images here for fun and hopefully I will post at some point better than reasonable images for you, in the meantime I will have a look at your flickr page to see what I should be aiming for in the perfect image.
Thanks Gordon.
 
Thanks Bill.
I only post images here for fun and hopefully I will post at some point better than reasonable images for you, in the meantime I will have a look at your flickr page to see what I should be aiming for in the perfect image.
Thanks Gordon.

I am not suggesting that I take perfect images

what I am saying is when you have an opportunity like that at least look at your technical settings, composition and processing .. after all you have taken "hundreds" of images

it is a sacrilege not to the best that you can, as I said the images on this page have not been processed well, technically the settings leave some to be desired and composition-wise they are nothing special.

look at what other wildlife photographers would have made of an opportunity like that

all the "like", "marvellous images" do nothing to improve the quality ...... just look at your Grey Heron shot and compare it with others on here

This is a Critique forum .. if your images are "for fun" post them in the "for fun" section
 
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Perfectly understood Bill, but you should read over my first post again, Gary's image has reached thousands of wildlife photographers and only you have said the image is reasonable, everybody else thinks its brilliant.
I do understand what you are saying but you really need to read what I write, give you a clue it says Gary's image.
Cheers Gordon.
 
Perfectly understood Bill, but you should read over my first post again, Gary's image has reached thousands of wildlife photographers and only you have said the image is reasonable, everybody else thinks its brilliant.
I do understand what you are saying but you really need to read what I write, give you a clue it says Gary's image.
Cheers Gordon.

One of the increasing features of this "critique" bird forum is that useful critique is now seldom given........... it has certainly been "dumbed" down by the influence of a few ................. and in some cases all that can be mustered is a "like"

Critique should be appropriate to the image and the level of the individual who has taken the image. In that way the image can be discussed, hopefully appreciated and all can learn from the posting

"blowing smoke" up some-one arse seems to be an occupation of a few and it does no good.

when I make a comment it has nothing to do with me, (although you can spend as long as you want looking at my images and I always appreciate comments and critique), or my ability ....... it has to do with what I see in front of me

I just disagree with most of the comments above, OK it's an Osprey ........ but if you want to look a "better" or really good Osprey shots there are plenty of the web

I do not in any way object to these shots being posted, indeed I thank you for doing so, what I would like to see are some constructive comments, especially as the subject matter is so interesting

If you take up some of the things that have been said and carry on as is, fun shots or not, you will never improve

(I take what you say about some of the images not being yours - it is the general tenor of the comments that I do not understand)

A few on here do take what they do seriously and wish to improve with every shot
 
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Thanks Bill,
But you must remember most critique is only an opinion, with due respect i cannot value your opinion, the reason being it is in conflict with 1,000 other wildlife photographers, but possibly you are that good.
To state it is a reasonable image, not sure what kind of quality critique but that;s cool with me,
Is it ok if i ask some professional wildlife photographers to have a look at your images on flickr and give critique so i can improve.
Thanks Gordon.
 
Thanks Bill,
But you must remember most critique is only an opinion, with due respect i cannot value your opinion, the reason being it is in conflict with 1,000 other wildlife photographers, but possibly you are that good.
To state it is a reasonable image, not sure what kind of quality critique but that;s cool with me,
Is it ok if i ask some professional wildlife photographers to have a look at your images on flickr and give critique so i can improve.
Thanks Gordon.

It would be wonderful if you could ask some professional wildlife photographers to critique my images on flickr ...... but most are bird images (and Dragonflies) and not really wildlife

but it is not about my images it is about yours

I do not think that you will improve by looking at my images ........ you need to look at yours if you want to improve

I would love to see the critique of your shots from "1,000 professional wildlife photographers" - I did not realise that there were that many - but please link me to their comments, all 1,000 of them

but my comments related to the images that you posted on this thread - was the Heron image yours?
 
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Hi Bill,
I mean't a 1,000 wildlife photographers, not 1,000 professional photographers, its late for me to be up, no the heron was not mine, its was just mean't to show strange behavior and only for fun, i know what was all wrong with the image.
I do not think that you will improve by looking at my images ........ you need to look at yours if you want to improve. but surely i would need to look at your images to improve/
i have a former Scottish wildlife photographer of the year in next weekend and will ask him to have a look at your images so i can get some feedback,, after all i want to find your critique is correct and the only way i can judge it is by asking some one i know to be highly regarded for the images he takes and sells from around the world.
Lets see what he says and i will post his findings, then we can all form an opinion on the quality of the critique in this section, now i'm sure you will agree that would be useful.
Cheers Gordon.
 
Hi Bill,
I mean't a 1,000 wildlife photographers, not 1,000 professional photographers, its late for me to be up, no the heron was not mine, its was just mean't to show strange behavior and only for fun, i know what was all wrong with the image.
I do not think that you will improve by looking at my images ........ you need to look at yours if you want to improve. but surely i would need to look at your images to improve/
i have a former Scottish wildlife photographer of the year in next weekend and will ask him to have a look at your images so i can get some feedback,, after all i want to find your critique is correct and the only way i can judge it is by asking some one i know to be highly regarded for the images he takes and sells from around the world.
Lets see what he says and i will post his findings, then we can all form an opinion on the quality of the critique in this section, now i'm sure you will agree that would be useful.
Cheers Gordon.

post your images on here for "amateur" Critique ..... maybe we can all learn something .... I hope

what was the thread all about then? - Bird Forum - Critique Section
 
Would love to see more images, don't get to see many Ospreys around here :)
 
Its not often Bill that i will come on and post about some of your comments on here so here goes.
,Gordon did state that the images were not his ,and i for one would not comment on images just posted to showcase Gordons (Osprey hide work)
i looked at made my own opinion on the images
post your images on here for "amateur" Critique ..... maybe we can all learn something .... I hope

what was the thread all about then? - Bird Forum - Critique Section
Show some respect Bill
Its obvious Gordon only posted to showcase his current work with the Ospreys
just need to read the post
Also just have a quick look at some of Gordons images , maybe you will then be a bit more respectfull of the man
 
Hi Bill,
I have already said i will post them in a different section, but i guess you are again not reading what i write, den i do want to value Bill's Critique so will ask everybody this week including the wildlife photographer of the year to give me feedback on Bill's images.
Den i post on fly fishing forums so i am well used to the banter, i never let things get to me.... but i never let things go, so this is fun for me and we all want to improve at least all the photographers i have ever met do, Bill is more than happy for me to show his flickr images to all the wildlife phographers to understand his Critique, that i will do starting tomorrow,, I can't imagine there will be any Critique of Bill's images, but if there is any small detail i will happily post it, after all we want to improve and a huge part of that is getting brilliant Critique, i will not post my findings here, but will start a new thread in this section.
I thought i was wrong section... but this IS the fun section.
Cheers Gordon.
 
Hi Bill,
I have already said i will post them in a different section, but i guess you are again not reading what i write, den i do want to value Bill's Critique so will ask everybody this week including the wildlife photographer of the year to give me feedback on Bill's images.
Den i post on fly fishing forums so i am well used to the banter, i never let things get to me.... but i never let things go, so this is fun for me and we all want to improve at least all the photographers i have ever met do, Bill is more than happy for me to show his flickr images to all the wildlife phographers to understand his Critique, that i will do starting tomorrow,, I can't imagine there will be any Critique of Bill's images, but if there is any small detail i will happily post it, after all we want to improve and a huge part of that is getting brilliant Critique, i will not post my findings here, but will start a new thread in this section.
I thought i was wrong section... but this IS the fun section.
Cheers Gordon.

I am very happy to receive (free) Critique about my flickr images from your professionals ..... certain were included for specific purposes, take that into account ........ but critiquing my images will not help with what I have said about the images on this thread which you have now removed

what is important would be to ask for comments on the images that you posted on this thread, (now removed) and to ask if my comments were valid ....... that is what the discussion is about - the images that you posted on this thread and my comments there on - I cannot see what the images that I post on flickr have to do with this thread

My comments on the posted images were simply

"they are reasonable images, but your processing could be a lot better
the first image is good but technically the rest are weak"


why did you remove the images? - please repost them so that others can make there minds up on whether my comments have any merit

or are you suggesting that only "professional photographers" or photographers who produce better results than the images posted, are the only ones qualified to critique the images - so in order for my critique to be valid my images have to be better than the ones posted ......... a strange logic

re post the images so we know what we are talking about
 
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Hi Bill,
You say they are in the wrong section so i remove them and now you want me to put them back in the same section, ok here's the thing, i am sure your images must be technically fantastic, with more than 10,000 post and i. sure thousands in the critique on birds, one of the images i posted has had more than 100.000 views on flickr and facebook with great comments and a lot from other wildlife photographers, now you are the first to call it a reasonable image, which intrigues me, i can only assume that your image quality must be outstanding and something i now have a really interest in, but because i see nothing special in the images you produce and because this is a new area for me i am happy to learn, and who better to learn from than a guy with more than 10,000 posts on one forum,
i maybe wrong but surely looking at your images will help everybody and i can't understand why it would not, like i said from the start the images i posted where not mine and again for a little bit of fun, but in the wrong section.
I now have a keen interest to learn from the master at processing and because i know the images are only reasonable and all could do with better processing i will not post them again, i have picked four of your flickr images to share to get some other feedback, not from professional photographers at the moment, but people who do a lot of wildlife photography,
Hopefully this will help others to join the website to study your work, it will be a great way of getting more traffic to the Talk Photography website.
Cheers Gordon.
 
Hi Bill,
You say they are in the wrong section so i remove them and now you want me to put them back in the same section, ok here's the thing, i am sure your images must be technically fantastic, with more than 10,000 post and i. sure thousands in the critique on birds, one of the images i posted has had more than 100.000 views on flickr and facebook with great comments and a lot from other wildlife photographers, now you are the first to call it a reasonable image, which intrigues me, i can only assume that your image quality must be outstanding and something i now have a really interest in, but because i see nothing special in the images you produce and because this is a new area for me i am happy to learn, and who better to learn from than a guy with more than 10,000 posts on one forum,
i maybe wrong but surely looking at your images will help everybody and i can't understand why it would not, like i said from the start the images i posted where not mine and again for a little bit of fun, but in the wrong section.
I now have a keen interest to learn from the master at processing and because i know the images are only reasonable and all could do with better processing i will not post them again, i have picked four of your flickr images to share to get some other feedback, not from professional photographers at the moment, but people who do a lot of wildlife photography,
Hopefully this will help others to join the website to study your work, it will be a great way of getting more traffic to the Talk Photography website.
Cheers Gordon.

I have posted hundreds of images on here - you do not need to pick any - my images are looked at regularly - as you say I have 10,000+ postings .... critique is given to me and I take in on board: in fact 90% of what I have learned regarding bird photography has come from posting images on here and listening and applying what has been said

the basis on this drawn out discussion is that you should attempt to verify what I said with whoever you want to ask ....... it is not about my images it is about my comments - don't you understand that?

It is not even about your multitude of images - none of which I have seen

I said with reference to the 4 images you posted on this thread

"they are reasonable images, but your processing could be a lot better
the first image is good but technically the rest are weak"


I am not bothered whose images they are, my comments are my opinion

it is totally irrelevant whether my images are good bad or indifferent, (I have posted a few more on flickr this morning because, as an aside, it would be useful to know what your experts think as it would help me, since you have offered this ..... I am not adverse at all to Critique), my bird shots are mainly "close ups" that's what I enjoy taking

I have never said that I am a master of processing - I said "your processing could be a lot better" ...... you do not have to be a master to identify when processing is weak

I have never said that my images are technically fantastic - I said "the first image is good but technically the rest are weak" .. you do not have to be even an expert to recognise an image that is not in focus

I cannot explain it any clearer

There are 250 bird images on my flickr page - pick them all if you want . they are out there for all to see
 
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Thanks Bill,
Will get back to you soon, but as as a long time critic your images must be processed the best with your experience, i like them all even if the subject is not my cup of tea, one of the guys thought there was to much processing on the birds with yellow eyes like the Heron, i don't see it, but he thought it didn't look natural.
Will ask others in the morning, but i need to head out to the Red Grouse
I have never said that my images are technically fantastic - I said "the first image is good but technically the rest are weak". but that.s not what you said, your first comment was that the first image was reasonable not good,...... you just added that.
Anyway i do understand what you are saying but i wish you would make your mind up, its reasonable ... and then its good.
Got to fly oot the door,
Cheers Gordon.
 
Aww, the original 'reasonable' or 'good' shots, whatever they are, have gone, so now I can't form an opinion!
 
To be fair, Gordon did say that they were not his. Also, Bill was right in the processing could've been better in all images, which is where we are all learning!

I follow Gary Jones, and his image of the diving Osprey was a fantastic image and fully deserved the credit he received.

Wanted to get up to Gordon's hide back in June but just couldn't come to a compromise with my dad!

Hope to get there for next year's Ospreys (y)
 
Thanks Bill,
Will get back to you soon, but as as a long time critic your images must be processed the best with your experience, i like them all even if the subject is not my cup of tea, one of the guys thought there was to much processing on the birds with yellow eyes like the Heron, i don't see it, but he thought it didn't look natural.
Will ask others in the morning, but i need to head out to the Red Grouse
I have never said that my images are technically fantastic - I said "the first image is good but technically the rest are weak". but that.s not what you said, your first comment was that the first image was reasonable not good,...... you just added that.
Anyway i do understand what you are saying but i wish you would make your mind up, its reasonable ... and then its good.
Got to fly oot the door,
Cheers Gordon.

If this is the one that you are commenting upon

Heron with "yellow eyes" - too much processing .. your friend could be correct - [just looked on the net - eye colour Grey Heron looks OK/reasonable compared with some posted - breeding season]

The image was taken in mid summer in S Africa ... not in the UK or Europe

Heron_2_Jul_16.jpg


another taken in S Africa a few years ago - different colours . to compare

Heron_2015.jpg
 
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To be fair, Gordon did say that they were not his. Also, Bill was right in the processing could've been better in all images, which is where we are all learning!

I follow Gary Jones, and his image of the diving Osprey was a fantastic image and fully deserved the credit he received.

Wanted to get up to Gordon's hide back in June but just couldn't come to a compromise with my dad!

Hope to get there for next year's Ospreys (y)

Wez, my comments were related to the images posted on this thread

they were posted for comment and critique - that's what I gave

look at #15

Gordon has turned it into a thread about my images ......... I am quite happy about that as comments only help

my comments were normal about the images posted .. but they have gone, the images that is
 
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Bill, I have the upmost respect for you, but if you tell Gordon you're happy to receive critique from pro wildlife togs and he gives it, it doesn't make sense to start arguing back as to why they are wrong...just say thanks and move on, or we'll be here all year arguing back and forth as to who is right and who is wrong ;)
 
Bill, I have the upmost respect for you, but if you tell Gordon you're happy to receive critique from pro wildlife togs and he gives it, it doesn't make sense to start arguing back as to why they are wrong...just say thanks and move on, or we'll be here all year arguing back and forth as to who is right and who is wrong ;)

how have I argued back

I have said he could be correct and posted an image to illustrate it

I said

"
If this is the one that you are commenting upon

Heron with "yellow eyes" - too much processing .. your friend could be correct

The image was taken in mid summer in S Africa ... not in the UK or Europe"
 
Did you edit the comment? If not I obviously missed the "your friend could be correct" part and I apologise.
 
Did you edit the comment? If not I obviously missed the "your friend could be correct" part and I apologise.

I just edited it to include another shot to illustrate that the eyes may be too yellow, or different bird different colours

I tend to post a quick answer, look at it on screen and then add stuff

the original shot was slightly over exposed because of the strong light, I will have to look it detail what adjustments I made

but we are now discussing my images not the ones I commented upon .. which I am sure that you are dying to see!!
 
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Thanks guys and Gordon


I thought that I was being a little constructive seeing the subject matter and the opportunities presented

maybe it is best to just 'drop it" now - I will on my part
 
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