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  1. davholla

    davholla

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    David
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    Although I can get reasonable photos with my Canon
    [​IMG]Bumblebee IMG_5192 by davholla2002, on Flickr

    I am really thinking of changing to a Panasonic because of work like this bloke's
    what do people think?
    https://www.flickr.com/photos/achimowl/

    I don't really want to be they seem to be so much better than people (not just me are getting on Canon)
     
  2. lightshipman

    lightshipman

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    Was this taken with a tripod?
     
  3. troutfisher

    troutfisher

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  4. davholla

    davholla

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    Mine no, the link no idea.
     
  5. alfbranch

    alfbranch

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    David
    I use Olympus so I have nothing against m4/3.
    I would think carefully about this is as Achim uses an Olympus 60mm lens which is noit the easiest thing to get on with IMO. I use a 4/3 Sigma 105 f2.8 with an adapter and I am happier with that than the oly 60mm. The other dedicated m4/3 lense at 30mm and 45mm are too short IMO.

    I use MF for macro and find I am happy with the Sigma. The oly focus by wire on the 60mm is very frustrating as it is so slooooow! in MF. If you use back button focus and move the camera you may get on with it. The Olynpus STF-8 twin flash looks nice though.
     
    davholla likes this.
  6. davholla

    davholla

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    Although I like his work alot all this is from 7 years ago. I wonder if the new technology is a game changer.
     
  7. alfbranch

    alfbranch

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    They big difference with these is lighting and processing IMO.
     
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  8. davholla

    davholla

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    Thanks for that, the problem when you look at photos taken by a camera/lens combo you have never used, you don't know how difficult it is if that makes sense.
    As you already have an Olympus have you ever thought of getting a panasonic to get post focus stacking? Or would that not work with your sigma lens?
     
  9. troutfisher

    troutfisher

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    Why don't you ask him
     
  10. davholla

    davholla

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    I am sorry what do you mean? You think that all cameras/lens can get good photos? I guess that is true but if it is easier to get a stack surely you get better details?
    Then again what do I know, I almost didn't post this and it went to explored
    [​IMG]Fly IMG_0984 by davholla2002, on Flickr
     
    SsSsSsSsSnake likes this.
  11. alfbranch

    alfbranch

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    For me that looks like you missed the focus and the light is little harsh.

    Wait for Nick @GardenersHelper to come along and he may go into great detail for or if you are brave enough look here

    https://www.talkphotography.co.uk/t...-dslr-primes-a-journey-of-exploration.531050/

    Show us you macro rig.
     
  12. alfbranch

    alfbranch

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    He is stacking shots helicon and maybe they are post focus which is a Panasonic thing.
     
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  13. davholla

    davholla

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    He did put that he was using post focus stacking in the comments.
     
  14. GardenersHelper

    GardenersHelper

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    Brian Valentine (LordV) is one of my macro heroes. He has produced many beautiful, stunning images, and must have inspired goodness knows how many people to take up/improve their macro photography.

    Brian uses Canon kit, APS-C and full frame, and excellent lenses including the MPE-65.

    Brian does stacking, using Zerene Stacker I think, and I suspect they are mainly stacks of fairly small numbers of images. I suspect that none of his cameras provide automated capture of a set of images to be used for focus stacking.

    Achim Kluck, who David linked to, uses a GH5, the top of the range Panasonic micro four thirds camera, and also a GX80, a less expensive micro four thirds camera. Both can use Panasonic's "Post focus" facility. This produces a 4K video (around 3300 x 2500 pixels on my FZ330). During a post-focus capture the focus is racked from the nearest to the furthest thing that the camera can focus on. JPEG stills can be extracted from the 4K video and used in a stacking application. There may be 100 or more stills in a 4K post-focus video. Achim Kluck uses Helicon Focus for stacking.

    I have used post-focus and Helicon Focus and this combination considerably simplifies the production of stacked images.

    The capture is straightforward - keep the camera fairly still (I have done it hand-held) while the video is captured over the course of up to several seconds. Then point Helicon focus at the video and Helicon Focus will extract the stills (and does this quite fast). You then choose which of the stills to use; there are some at the start and end of the sequence that must be discarded, and others may be discarded depending on what you want to be in and out of focus in the stacked image.

    The process of doing the stacking can be very time-consuming. Helicon Focus is quite fast at doing the processing, but there tend to be issues, including halos (I noticed a few, very few though, in Achim Kluck's images) and issues where the subject or part of the subject or part of the scenery moved while the post focus video was being captured. Solving these issues can be extremely time-consuming (up to hours on a single image, occasionally). There is one issue, which is visible in some of Achim Kluck's images, which I don't know of any solution to - that is the sudden transition from in-focus to out-of-focus areas, which can make images look rather unnatural to my eye. In fact, although I was deeply impressed with Achim Kluck's stacked images, I did feel that some of them had a slightly unnatural look to them, mainly not associated with sharp in/out-of-focus transitions. I couldn't pin down exactly what was troubling my eyes.

    You can't use flash for post-focus captures. As an alternative to using natural light, which may not be bright enough, I have used a diffused LCD light.

    The GH5 will do 6K post-focus capture. (More pixels than 4K, but I don't know how many more. Definitely not 6000 pixels across. )

    Recent Panasonic cameras will do focus bracketing. This captures a number of images that you specify and racks the focus an amount you specify between shots. This produces a set of full size images which can then be used for stacking. The images can be JPEG or raw, although I found raw impractical for large stacks because once the buffer fills the capture slows to a glacial rate.

    Achim Kluck has used focus bracketing, but I only noticed one of the images where this was the case. Given so much use of post-focus and so little of focus bracketing I imagine Achim Kluck has come to the conclusion that post focus is the better option. He has used both 4K and 6K post-focus captures.

    Achim Kluck is using two high class lenses, the Olympus 60mm macro and the Panasonic 100-400. (Incidentally, like other autofocus macro lenses I have used the Olympus 60mm macro increasingly hunts for focus as the magnification increases. While this is relevant in post-focus while the camera seeks the nearest thing it can focus on, the subsequent sweep to the back can go as fast as the images can be captured as the focus is moving in predefined steps. The tendency to hunt is not relevant at all for focus bracketing as the photographer defines the nearest thing to be focused on by virtue of where the camera is positioned, and then the sweep is made using predefined steps.)

    I have written about my experiments with post-focus, focus bracketing and stacking with Helicon Focus in this post in my journey thread, which has links to other posts and threads here and at dpreview where I have written more about it.

    I have not used focus stacking since doing the experiments described in the linked posts. Having seen Achim Kluck's work I am very inclined to do some more.
     
  15. davholla

    davholla

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    You are almost correct some would with magic lantern but magic lantern is not user friendly and does not work with MPE-65 and needs a very very co-operative insect. For plants it is ok though (with house plants you need ideally a big and tidy house otherwise you need to be very careful where you put your plants - sadly neither are true for me).

    [​IMG]Africanviolet by davholla2002, on Flickr
    That is a killer for me, it does not seem to be such a good idea. I go to South America most years and do lots of night shots (I do it very rarely in the UK as the days are so much longer in the summer and I don't think there are so many insects here you can only see at night).
     
  16. davholla

    davholla

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    [QUOTE="GardenersHelper, post: 7882198, member: 29498"

    Recent Panasonic cameras will do focus bracketing. This captures a number of images that you specify and racks the focus an amount you specify between shots. This produces a set of full size images which can then be used for stacking. The images can be JPEG or raw, although I found raw impractical for large stacks because once the buffer fills the capture slows to a glacial rate..[/QUOTE]
    Interesting I have wonder if I should use JPEG when trying to do a stack because of the problems with buffer with my camera, the problem is that you have to remember to change back.
     
  17. GardenersHelper

    GardenersHelper

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    Ah, of course. I forgot Magic Lantern. (Not something I have ever used, even experimentally.)

    More later on the subject of co-operative (or not) subjects. This morning I went out to do (or to try to do) some post-focus captures.

    Yes, plants are easier to capture. However, I found that their complicated structures can lead to halo issues that are difficult to resolve.


    :(


    Probably not, although I have been surprised a few times as to how much I found going on in our garden after dark. It can be very good for active snails and slugs for example. Woodlice too, and lots of earwigs too a couple of times, although unlike snails and slugs, woodlice and earwigs seem to not like light and tend to scurry off pretty quickly.
     
  18. GardenersHelper

    GardenersHelper

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    Yes, that is all too easy to get caught out with. Do you have a Custom setup that you could use for stacking?
     
  19. alfbranch

    alfbranch

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    Interesting I have wonder if I should use JPEG when trying to do a stack because of the problems with buffer with my camera, the problem is that you have to remember to change back.[/QUOTE]

    The Olympus E-M1 will do focus bracketing and focus stacking in camera

    If you look at this like any other photography say for instance prtraiture the quality of the light is key to a good shot. When you take a portrait you want good light as harsh sunlight is not flattering.

    Here is an example with a fly https://www.talkphotography.co.uk/t...-to-get-into-macro.551944/page-2#post-7061593

    We alaso need plenty of light like the sports photographers as we need fatser shutter speeds if you work handheld. Many people shoot only in the morning when there subjects do not move much and suse a tripod. there are many ways of doing this.
    Do you only use the Canon MPE-65 as for larger subjects a 105 f2.8 may be easier.
    A look through the macro rig thread throws up this set up https://www.talkphotography.co.uk/threads/show-us-your-macro-rig.132158/page-14#post-7418101
    Which Alby has given up on and gone back to Canon I think.

    A change of system may help you but are you gettiung the best out of what you have?
    Just because someone else produces great results with a particular set up does not mean you will. What is your workflow?

    Have you shown us your macro rig?
     
  20. davholla

    davholla

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    I have 2 cameras both Canon 550D and 7DMK2. The 550D I use with my 60mm and 7DMK2 with the MPE65, recently I have been mainly using the 60mm lens because of the number of large insects, but in the winter I would use more 65mm. The reason for doing it this way is mainly because my ring flash doesn't work with the 550D.

    This is the last photo I took and processed with the 65mm
    [​IMG]Micromoth EF7A5265 by davholla2002, on Flickr

    However since that I have put a polystyrene diffuser on the ring flash (in the past I used kitchen paper but it never last).
    Sadly the 550D doesn't have a custom mode but the 7DMKII does.

    For the 550D/60mm I have experimented with various diffusers, polystyrene plate, pringles tube etc but I couldn't see any real differences over the pop up flash. Due to the short working distance a pop up flash is better than an external flash (unless it is off camera but I couldn't find a good support to do that). I might try again with a speedlite.
     
  21. davholla

    davholla

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    The Olympus E-M1 will do focus bracketing and focus stacking in camera

    If you look at this like any other photography say for instance prtraiture the quality of the light is key to a good shot. When you take a portrait you want good light as harsh sunlight is not flattering.

    Here is an example with a fly https://www.talkphotography.co.uk/t...-to-get-into-macro.551944/page-2#post-7061593

    We alaso need plenty of light like the sports photographers as we need fatser shutter speeds if you work handheld. Many people shoot only in the morning when there subjects do not move much and suse a tripod. there are many ways of doing this.
    Do you only use the Canon MPE-65 as for larger subjects a 105 f2.8 may be easier.
    A look through the macro rig thread throws up this set up https://www.talkphotography.co.uk/threads/show-us-your-macro-rig.132158/page-14#post-7418101
    Which Alby has given up on and gone back to Canon I think.

    A change of system may help you but are you gettiung the best out of what you have?
    Just because someone else produces great results with a particular set up does not mean you will. What is your workflow?

    Have you shown us your macro rig?[/QUOTE]
    Good points, my workflow is to just put the photos on my PC, those I like but can't stack I use darktable, otherwise zerene stacker and darktable. I can't do changes on small scale due to problems with manipulating the mouse, maybe changing my PC setup would help but I have never really to do drawing things like on the PC even using a tablet pen.
    I will have to post my rig soon although as you can see from the above it is nothing special, sadly I can't make things.
     
  22. davholla

    davholla

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    I would love to shoot early in the morning but because of my family that is not possible.
     

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