Why is it so hard to get a tradesman

chris954

chris954

Messages
809
Name
pretty obvious really.
Edit My Images
Yes
Since Christmas I have had five tradesmen from well reviewed local companies come to give me quotes for a new bay window, back door with skylight and front door with side windows, the bay also needs the roof re felting. Of these five, only one has sent me a quote and that didn’t include the bay roof, probably the most important job as it sometimes leaks. Whats wrong with people. Dont they want a 4-5k job. This is possibly how the cowboys make a living, people getting disilusioned.
 
Absolutely the same. Looking at somewhere upwards of £10K for home improvements and so hard to get anyone interested. Gave up in the end.
 
We’ve been having similar issues.

We approached a local kitchen company to do everything for us. They did an initial plan, we requested some changes and we never heard from them again.

So, I’m doing it myself. Spent £20k so far. Obviously they didn’t need the money.

Think I’ll send them photos via their Facebook page when I’m finished
 
We had a plumber in before Christmas, to change two taps in the downstairs loo, he put the new taps on, said he would be back the next day to connect the up............not seen him since:rolleyes:
 
Had a roofer recently and he won't give quotes for flat roofs for any sort of remedial work. Apparently they're usually bodged for as long as possible so when the job's done properly, it's expensive and an attractive quote (rather than an estimate) is likely to end up costing the contractor money.
 
To much high end easy long term work at the moment for good people.
So much new stuff going up, extensions, house renovations.
 
Quicker to learn the trade yourself than keep on chasing tradesmen. Fed up with trying to get a builder for love nor money.
 
There's a few people in North Oxon that I can recommend for kitchen fitting, electrical work and plumbing. :)
 
Couple of reasons:

1 - Often these people are very good at what they do but not so good at business and customer service
2 - There is not enough of them as we think that going to university to read History of Art is more useful than a trade
 
Since we chased all the European trades men back home, there has been a shortage of skilled tradesmen. It will be worse still after brexit.
It is not that there are no skilled workmen around, it is that there are nowhere near enough.
However there are far too many scammers.

Remedial work in particular, needs very high skill levels and experience, and takes far longer to do than new work.
It is usually better to strip right back and start afresh on things like bay roofs, and flat roofs.
 
And when you find one of these folk who does a good job - hang on to him. My roof man checks my roof every year and now knows that when I say I've a problem - I really have and he fits me in ASAP [ leaking sun lounge roof in the last big storm - told him and it was fixed on the first dry day - a gap between flashing and wall had developed :( ]
 
cambsno said:
1 - Often these people are very good at what they do but not so good at business and customer service
Click to expand...


We had a heating engineer round a few years ago and he started the repair but just needed to get hold of a part. We never heard from him again and ended up getting someone else in to finish the job. The 2nd guy new the 1st and, apparently, he made a habit of doing this. End of the day, it actually saved us money!
 
I had the same bloke do my extension and bay roof, at different times.
Strips right back to the timber, not overly expensive either.
Got something like a three month waiting list as a rule, pays well if you get a good name
 
I'm a bit dubious about the trade checker websites.
My girlfriend found some glowing reviews on a painter and decorator so she asked them for a quote.
She had a few quotes but decided to go with the guy with most positive reviews.
When they came to doing the job they stopped for a tea break every hour.
After it was completed she noticed that some of the wallpaper had not been cut staight (honestly a 5 year old could have done better) so she held back £400 until they rectified it.
She also believes that they also stole a bracelet although she has no proof as such.
They never returned so the review she left for them wasn't glowing.
 
Last edited:
Brexit hasn't helped a lot of Euro trades have gone home.
 
Luckily I have a great local builder, so I always ask who he uses if he can't do the job.
 
Last edited:
Terrywoodenpic said:
Since we chased all the European trades men back home, there has been a shortage of skilled tradesmen. It will be worse still after brexit.
Click to expand...
Mr Bump said:
Brexit hasn't helped a lot of Euro trades have gone home.
Click to expand...

Interesting, as all the European tradespeople I've seen sent round from the local housing association to fix things at my girlfriend's fiat have done nothing but total bodge jobs and all the Brits I've found on trade review sites to do work on my house have done great work. Apart from one roofer who I had to take to court.

But don't let stereotypes get in the way of things.

Plenty of people out there. When you can charge £60 to change a tap it's no wonder people are jumping on the tradesman bandwagon. You just have to do plenty of research to get a good one, Brit or other.
 
Last edited:
hashcake said:
I'm a bit dubious about the trade checker websites.
My girlfriend found some glowing reviews on a painter and decorator so she asked them for a quote.
She had a few quotes but decided to go with the guy with most positive reviews.
When they came to doing the job they stopped for a tea break every hour.
After it was completed she noticed that some of the wallpaper had not been cut staight (honestly a 5 year old could have done better) so she held back £400 until they rectified it.
She also believes that they also stole a bracelet although she has no proof as such.
They never returned so the review she left for them wasn't glowing.
Click to expand...

I don't think many are vetted, it's more pay loads of cash to be featured and then the review company wash their hands of it when they don't deliver!
 
I am a tradesman. Most of my work is in London where I have a few long term clients and where I can charge a decent price.
I rarely get (or want) new clients as so many potential customers seem to think that the cheapest price is the best, and that my comparatively high quotes are me ripping them off.
I usually give my clients a rough idea of costs which is high enough to cover the worst possible situation, so if there are no hitches my final price can be as much as 40% less than the figure first discussed (note, I am not giving a quote or estimate here) The few clients I have have been with me for over 30 years and I've never had to charge more than my first figure.
Terrywoddenpic mentions remedial work which unless done properly is often not worth taking on as clients remember you when it fails but don't recall that they wanted a cheap patch-up, which makes me disinclined to take that sort of work on unless I get in writing some sort of agreement which in my experience has often led to me not getting the job.

In reply to chris954, the OP, it might be that roofing and windows require different trades, and some are easier money. However, why the guys who have quoted have not said that they won't do certain parts of the job or passed that part over to someone else with a mark-up I don't know. There are certainly still a lot of cowboy-types around too.

For what it is worth, the local rate here in Cornwall seems to be around £15-£18 per hour for someone like me. How anyone can be self-employed, run a vehicle, buy tools, insurance, pay into a pension and cover quiet time and sickness I don't know, but it may explain why many of the 'good guys' are busy on building sites where they can do a regular 40 hours a week for 40 hours money rather than scratching about for the next job - if a decent £5000 job is followed by a quiet week then the wallet soon starts to look empty again...

Finally, I feel that when going to meet a new client I see it as much about me taking a liking to them as them wanting me in their house - I won't work for someone I don't trust or feel as ease with.
 
Last edited:
I read recently that a self employed person needs to charge something like £235 per day to earn the equivalent of an employee on PAYE at £30k pa.

Seven years ago I bought a house that needed pretty much everything doing to it. I decided to 'project manage' it myself and employ various trades people. I would totally agree with all that’s written above about how difficult it was to find people. The internet 'checkatrade' websites seemed to me to be full of incompetent/inexperienced tradespeople, I had to complain about a builder I found on 'ratedpeople', he was appallingly bad and cost me quite a bit of money, there was no comeback from the website after I complained.

I did get the job done and found some good people, but it was hard work even then with most of them, not turning up sometimes, leaving things unfinished etc. I walk around big cities and marvel at the construction work that seems to get completed so efficiently with hundreds of tradespeople.

When I occasionally watch that 'homes under the hammer' programme on the BBC, they buy the property and a few weeks later it’s all done, I wish I knew how they manage it so easily all the time!
 
Cartus said:
I read recently that a self employed person needs to charge something like £235 per day to earn the equivalent of an employee on PAYE at £30k pa.
Click to expand...

I wish I'd seen that as I'd have copied it to show so many who think that tradesmen earn a fortune - my wife is a nurse and she is the bread winner in our house and she has a pension, which I've never been able to afford...
Certainly it seems that high on my list of (limited) skills are the ability to turn up on time, finish on time, clean up and flush the loo - none of which are too hard to do..
 
Cartus said:
I read recently that a self employed person needs to charge something like £235 per day to earn the equivalent of an employee on PAYE at £30k pa.

Seven years ago I bought a house that needed pretty much everything doing to it. I decided to 'project manage' it myself and employ various trades people. I would totally agree with all that’s written above about how difficult it was to find people. The internet 'checkatrade' websites seemed to me to be full of incompetent/inexperienced tradespeople, I had to complain about a builder I found on 'ratedpeople', he was appallingly bad and cost me quite a bit of money, there was no comeback from the website after I complained.

I did get the job done and found some good people, but it was hard work even then with most of them, not turning up sometimes, leaving things unfinished etc. I walk around big cities and marvel at the construction work that seems to get completed so efficiently with hundreds of tradespeople.

When I occasionally watch that 'homes under the hammer' programme on the BBC, they buy the property and a few weeks later it’s all done, I wish I knew how they manage it so easily all the time!
Click to expand...


As a self employed person myself I would agree with a lot of that above. We have to pay more NI than PAYE folk, we don't get any free pension top ups.
One of the firms I contract for gives up to 8% pension top up. Full paid holiday, self employed, don't work don't get paid.

All fairness to @stevewestern I couldn't make headway at £18/hour in my profession.
 
AshleyC said:
Interesting, as all the European tradespeople I've seen sent round from the local housing association to fix things at my girlfriend's fiat have done nothing but total bodge jobs and all the Brits I've found on trade review sites to do work on my house have done great work. Apart from one roofer who I had to take to court.

But don't let stereotypes get in the way of things.

Plenty of people out there. When you can charge £60 to change a tap it's no wonder people are jumping on the tradesman bandwagon. You just have to do plenty of research to get a good one, Brit or other.
Click to expand...

If you remove tradesmen from the supply, of what ever nationality, it leads to a shortage of skills
I assume trades people from every nationality are on a scale from excellent to terrible, It is not a nationality thing.

We see few if any American trades men, but their workers in wood are exceptional, with a wider range of timber construction skills than we would ever meet here.
I have experience of a number of Polish building workers, and I would put them among the best workers and problem solvers that I have met.

For any one to change a tap it is likely to take two to three hours out of their day. first to inspect and quote, book an appointment then come to do the Job. and the journey times. £60 would seem very much at the lower end of things for any such job.
If the plumber is already familiar with your house water system, you are more likely to get and more accurate and lower estimate than a new unfamiliar customer/ premises would get.
I changed my own garden tap last year, and all it cost me was the price a new tap. I would have expected to pay at least £40 for someone else to come out and do the same thing however quick and easy that job is.

A new sink mixer tap can be a nightmare to even remove. When mine was replaced It took the whole morning, (mainly removing the rusted mount of the old tap) and I am sure the plumber was a contortionist/Strong man in his spare time. And he still charged me what he had estimated.

I was recommended their roofer by my local church, he came along replaced 3 storm damaged tiles and re-fixed the ridge and was gone again inside half an hour.
All for no more than a few of pints of the best beer....
 
5 years ago we wanted our kitchen redone completely. We went to a couple specialists, and not only were they really expensive, but there was always bits that they wouldn't do, such as the electrics as we needed a new consumer unit. My wife works for an estate agent and they recommended a guy. He came and had a chat, and nothing was a problem. "I've got a plumber mate to do that, and my brother's a sparky" etc. It took us a while to find him, but he was terrific when we finally got him.

Roll on to last year when we wanted a load of redecorating done (I'm really crap at DIY) and it took us ages to find somebody, and again nobody would do all of it, some people never turned up to view, and some that did never provided a quote. The guy we took on was great, but he didn't do outside, or tiling and he wouldn't even unscrew a socket from the wall (I did that bit). We got another guy to do outside & tiling.

Had to wait nearly 7 weeks for him to be available too.

There just isn't that many out there, and I'm convinced the ones that don't reply are cowboys who know you'll not be an easy target.
 
Cartus said:
When I occasionally watch that 'homes under the hammer' programme on the BBC, they buy the property and a few weeks later it’s all done, I wish I knew how they manage it so easily all the time!
Click to expand...

Ha, we wonder this too and also how they can renovate an entire house for £8k when I can’t even do my front garden for that!!!
 
Cartus said:
I walk around big cities and marvel at the construction work that seems to get completed so efficiently with hundreds of tradespeople.
Click to expand...

I work at management level in construction and can tell you that it’s unusual for construction work to be completed efficiently.

Look at the tv programmes that show house makeovers with 40 tradesmen delivering a couple of rooms in 2 days and think what happens on the average site when Bobby is not finished his last job ( cause he’s on the telly tarting up a house in 2 days), Freddy is ill, the bits haven’t arrived for Jerry to start and Kenny hasn’t sorted out his paperwork to let him sign on.

Work out how to programme that lot plus 500 other reasons at day 1 and you’d make a fortune in construction programming. Instead there’s float through the programme to make allowance for this, all of which represents inefficiencies- not contractors fault, just real world but a long way from inefficient
 
The shortage of tradesmen is due to the fact that this country is now reaping what was sown in the 1970's.

Firstly the big unions, who then even more than now, told the Labour Party what to do, got a law introduced which meant that all apprentices had to be paid a minimum of 50% of a tradesman's wage on starting their apprenticeship, which made it completely uneconomical to employ them.

Secondly, under both the Labour and Tory governments, academics were allowed to take over the education system which resulted in the closing of most of the Technical Colleges which had given non academic pupils a good grounding in practical subjects.

Thirdly, unlike most of the European countries, in this country tradesmen were not and are not, valued nor protected by laws which state that they must be qualified in that trade in order to practice it.
 
My brother in law and his mates make enough off the books that they only want to do enough 8 to 4 to look legal, maybe you need to suggest after hours?
Not that I agree with this but it is the nature of the beast.
 
Electric doesn't always need qualification. Any competent person can undertake many tasks and even some more complicated ones BUT the more complicated ones may need to be signed off by a qualified person.
 
Mr Bump said:
As a self employed person myself I would agree with a lot of that above. We have to pay more NI than PAYE folk.
Click to expand...
Really? I am PAYE and I have already paid more in NI than a self employed person on the same income would pay in a year and I have 3 more weeks pay to add to my total.
 
I have 2 sons that are both tradesman, one plumber and the other a carpenter. My carpenter son charges a minimum of £240 a day, which to me is eye popping. He gets plenty of work but has to decline jobs as it would take more men, but he can’t find anyone that is in his words ”up to his standards”. All that aside, I’ll ask them to do little jobs for me and they both say “ yes I’ll pop round” but they never do. Always get excuses.
 
Last edited:
Nod said:
Electric doesn't always need qualification. Any competent person can undertake many tasks and even some more complicated ones BUT the more complicated ones may need to be signed off by a qualified person.
Click to expand...

Nvq diploma minimum and you can be a domestic installer...
 
You can do some of your own bits as a competent person, no NVQ or other qualification needed.
 
You can do anything for yourself including gas as long as your competent but I thought we were talking about getting tradesmen.
 
chris954 said:
Since Christmas I have had five tradesmen from well reviewed local companies come to give me quotes for a new bay window, back door with skylight and front door with side windows, the bay also needs the roof re felting. Of these five, only one has sent me a quote and that didn’t include the bay roof, probably the most important job as it sometimes leaks. Whats wrong with people. Dont they want a 4-5k job. This is possibly how the cowboys make a living, people getting disilusioned.
Click to expand...

Getting a tradesman is only the first hurdle. Getting them to turn up after agreeing to do the work is another. When they turn up they wander about for half the day with a mobile phone stuck to an ear.
 
Terrywoodenpic said:
Since we chased all the European trades men back home, there has been a shortage of skilled tradesmen. It will be worse still after brexit.
It is not that there are no skilled workmen around, it is that there are nowhere near enough.
However there are far too many scammers.

Remedial work in particular, needs very high skill levels and experience, and takes far longer to do than new work.
It is usually better to strip right back and start afresh on things like bay roofs, and flat roofs.
Click to expand...

One major loss of skilled trades was the big building proramme the Polish Government started 18 months ago.

The word went out and it included the tiny issue of increased hourly rates and housing assistance for those returning home.

We still have our Polish builders as they married local women but, currently, they have work till the late Autumn and their diary is closed.

Local well off householders are offering up to double their hourly rate!

The local tech college has vacancies on their trades courses.... low birth rate or laziness?
 
Have had a kitchen fitter booked for over two months now. Due to fit our kitchen within the next week or two.
I have a house full of pre-build kitchen units, worktops, sinks, a bloody great ranger cooker and just had a text message from his this morning saying he can't do it until end of May as his current job is over running and then he's off on a months holiday!!!!

I'm f**king fuming!!
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top