Critique Barn Owl, Sharpness?

russellsnr

russellsnr

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Russell
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Have been out photographing these great birds over the last 3 evenings, Sony A7 iv, 200-600mm and now a 1.4 converter, i'm getting minimum 1600 on the shutter with ISO's from 800 to 12,800,
F9 with 1.4, but still having to do a lot of work in Lightroom to make them look even half decent, other birds not such a hassle but these Barn Owls!!!
Barn Owl_6_27 Feb 24.jpg
 
Why F9? That's a very narrow aperture for wildlife.

Shutter speed is everything for wildlife, lower aperture, faster shutter = sharper shots.
 
smr said:
Why F9? That's a very narrow aperture for wildlife.

Shutter speed is everything for wildlife, lower aperture, faster shutter = sharper shots.
Click to expand...
Hi thanks for the reply, F9 with 1.4 converter as lowest on 200-600 at 600 is F6.3 +1 stop, or is that wrong? Russ.
 
smr said:
Why F9? That's a very narrow aperture for wildlife.

Shutter speed is everything for wildlife, lower aperture, faster shutter = sharper shots.
Click to expand...
F6.3 at max zoom
With a x1.4 TC losing one stop = f9
 
Do you really need that much reach? Is it cropped in or not, if not then it's better to go with a wider fov and crop in., you want to get the fastest shutter possible and 1/1600th isn't that fast at such long focal lengths.

You'd definitely need a smooth gimbal and even then it's practice, technique and precision.
 
Personally for me, unless you're doing a large crop already with the converter on, then I'd look at going bare lens and having extra shutter speed. Get a pin sharp image and it'll stand a little more cropping that will more than make up for having the converter on

I like the lit face here though

Mike
 
russellsnr said:
Just wonder if the 1.4 is a help or a hindrance for that extra 140mm approx in low light ?
Click to expand...
Well, it's an extra 240mm effective.

One advantage of using the TC is that it can aid in focus/autofocus. But if the owl is still to far/small it won't make much difference.
If the lens is capable of resolving far more than the sensor, then a TC can provide a bit of an advantage over cropping in terms of pixels on subject; probably not so much in this case.
IMO, the main benefit of using a TC is that it causes you to use settings more appropriate for a harder crop; which is really what a TC primarily causes.

You're working in the circle of equivalence; where every choice is a tradeoff, and not really any better than any other choice. To actually make much difference you would need to step up to a big prime... and even that wouldn't make a huge difference.
 
Can I ask what focus points you are using and what are your exposure metering
I use single point focus (on eye if possible) and centre weighted spot metering to get my best focus and expose on the body not the background average
 
Compuwight said:
Can I ask what focus points you are using and what are your exposure metering
I use single point focus (on eye if possible) and centre weighted spot metering to get my best focus and expose on the body not the background average
Click to expand...
Hi, I was using Zone when out on Sunday but yesterday I used expanded spot (very difficult to keep on the bird I found) but going to practice more with that option.
Also the 1.4 is going as seems the light is not good enough for that just now.
As for metering I use Auto ISO, F6.3 without the 1.4 and 1600 or faster if available.
Thank you, Russ.
 
russellsnr said:
Hi, I was using Zone when out on Sunday but yesterday I used expanded spot (very difficult to keep on the bird I found) but going to practice more with that option.
Also the 1.4 is going as seems the light is not good enough for that just now.
As for metering I use Auto ISO, F6.3 without the 1.4 and 1600 or faster if available.
Thank you, Russ.
Click to expand...
if your using auto iso you want to add -1 to -1.5 stops of exposure comp , zebras work well for this
I prefer manual iso
 
mav said:
if your using auto iso you want to add -1 to -1.5 stops of exposure comp , zebras work well for this
I prefer manual iso
Click to expand...
Amazing, read and watch all the hype on Auto ISO and you are the second person recently who uses manual as I used to do and yes I do go minus on exp comp
 
mav said:
if your using auto iso you want to add -1 to -1.5 stops of exposure comp
Click to expand...
Really depends on the metering mode being used... I used to use spot metering (linked to focus point/area) a lot; now I mostly use highlight weighted. Either of those modes are likely to need +EC with a barn owl; but I generally just let it underexpose by lowering the ISO (with my Nikon bodies).

But if the light/direction isn't really changing, then manual can be easier.
 
russellsnr said:
Also the 1.4 is going as seems the light is not good enough for that just now.
Click to expand...
There won't really be an advantage either way... without the TC the images will require harder cropping and greater enlargement for any given output size. That will reduce the light/area and make any recorded noise level more apparent. The net result is the same light/area and apparent noise as if the TC was used and the resulting images cropped less.

You also cannot use a lower SS or less sharp aperture with the shorter FL if the images are going to be cropped more.
 
Great opportunity russellsnr so your frustration is understood. Looking at the pic I think (1) the light level had just been below the level required by your setup, hence challenging AF, and (2) under these circumstances, the converter slowed your AF too.

Comments based on my setup, my experience - so YMMV:
- 1/1600 is fast enough for slower, larger birds - maybe close to the limit but still OK
- I don't venture beyond ISO6400 though my camera would (YMMV)
- Not sure if the focus was spot on, AF performance might be compromised by converter and low light level
- Not clear how much it has been cropped
- Don't know your lens - does it normally deliver well when used wide open with a 1.4x?
- Not clear how the rig was supported

Apologies if I've missed some details you've provided.

Best bet, get as close as possible, use the fastest lens you can, and support if off a gimball head,

Maybe post the original, uncropped image?

Best regards
 
Hi, so here is the original image (Jpeg as RAW is too big for the forum) ISO was 1600
Sony A7 iv 200-600mm lens and 1.4 converter, now no expert when it comes to how noise is created but just seems to me for ISO 1600 there is a lot, maybe expecting too much from the camera? Thanks, Russ.

Barn Owl_raw_27 Feb 24.jpgBarn Owl_raw_noise_27 Feb 24.jpg
 
russellsnr said:
maybe expecting too much from the camera?
Click to expand...
Yes, probably... but if you had more light, there would be less noise even at ISO 1600. With owls I will drop the SS and hope for decent results with panning/gliding shots.
Also note that blue sky is particularly troublesome and often shows color noise even when recorded with a low ISO; only 25% of the pixels are masked to allow/record primarily blue wavelengths.

GreenNinja67 said:
I think it's noisy due to under exposure.
Click to expand...
Yes, due to a lack of light; but not due to using too low of an ISO (the A7IV is dual gain but otherwise effectively ISO invariant).
 
Looks a little OOF or quite soft focus. Or both... The lens may not be the sharpest ever at 600mm and 1.4x will really crystallise the problem. I'd really try and work without TC whenever possible.

Topaz sharpen AI might just about salvage it; it is very borderline and it won't be same as sharp focus and good exposure.
 
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