British Cycling. Clean or Not?

As a sports lover, my view is not, are they clean or not, but are they within current rules or not.

It is the job of sports team managers, directors, etc. to push the limits of the rules to breaking point, but not beyond.

It's the nature of the beast.
 
A quick google search reveals that around 9% of the UK population has asthma. Yet it is estimated by Cycling Weekly that 40% of the British Olympic Cycling team has Asthma. Indeed 21% of the British Olympic Team as a whole had asthma.

How do we actually know that any of these athletes actually have Asthma.
Maybe a "sympathetic" doctor would diagnose them as such so they can get a TUE.



Sources:

https://www.asthma.org.uk/about/media/facts-and-statistics/

http://www.cyclingweekly.co.uk/news/comment/whats-deal-asthma-pro-cycling-223300
 
Grey77 said:
A quick google search reveals that around 9% of the UK population has asthma. Yet it is estimated by Cycling Weekly that 40% of the British Olympic Cycling team has Asthma. Indeed 21% of the British Olympic Team as a whole had asthma.

How do we actually know that any of these athletes actually have Asthma.
Maybe a "sympathetic" doctor would diagnose them as such so they can get a TUE.



Sources:

https://www.asthma.org.uk/about/media/facts-and-statistics/

http://www.cyclingweekly.co.uk/news/comment/whats-deal-asthma-pro-cycling-223300
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Many people now believe that to be the case.
There was a documentary on the BBC last year which highlighted the "approved" use of drugs in sport, most notable athletics.

https://www.theguardian.com/sport/2...lazar-kara-goucher-17-more-witnesses-mo-farah

That whole thing seemed to have been swept under the carpet prior to the Rio games, and the controversy surrounding Russian athletes.
And on the run up to Rio we never heard anything about this.

http://www.nytimes.com/2016/06/29/s...field-doping-jeffrey-brown-investigation.html
 
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Grey77 said:
A quick google search reveals that around 9% of the UK population has asthma. Yet it is estimated by Cycling Weekly that 40% of the British Olympic Cycling team has Asthma. Indeed 21% of the British Olympic Team as a whole had asthma.
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Exercise Induced Asthma is a recognised thing, endurance athletes, particularly those who spend long durations outdoors exercising often in adverse conditions (extreme cold in winter, high pollen/dust the rest of the year) are exposed to the triggers whilst exercising at a high rate - Thinking back to my own time in a (very) amature cycling club, maybe 20 years or more ago, probably 1 in 4-5 of the members had "issues" with asthma at some point in the season - I myself suffer with it in extreme cold dry conditions - typical winter club-runs of 2-3°C but bright and frosty are definitely enough to require me to reach for the inhalers before the ride as a preventative, and to take them along for the occasional top-up over the 4-5 hours ride.

Check how many Nordic Ski-ers have the same TUE's...

Not saying that they're necessarily all 100% required, but if you're competing at world class level, and you have even one attack while riding, you're team doctor is going to prescribe (and TUE) some form of preventative "just in case of reocurrence" - it's not necessarily going to be used all the time... That's not cheating, that's just pragmatism.
 
POAH said:
Honestly couldn't care less as its road cycling. BC don't care about anything else
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could be argued that frankly they don't really understand anything other than the track, or the 3 week tours where the "process can be managed".

as to the lack of support for MTB / BMX, I agree it's shocking, but the funding is predicated on olympic successes, and the best that you could hope for with pouring money into the dirt-sports is 4 golds... they can pick that up in a morning in the velodrome - and all in a very predictable and measurable way. It's simply pragmatism again - targetting financial resources for maximum gain. Do I agree with it, no, not really, but I do understand why they do it.
 
andy700 said:
Many people now believe that to be the case.
There was a documentary on the BBC last year which highlighted the "approved" use of drugs in sport, most notable athletics.

https://www.theguardian.com/sport/2...lazar-kara-goucher-17-more-witnesses-mo-farah

That whole thing seemed to have been swept under the carpet prior to the Rio games, and the controversy surrounding Russian athletes.
And on the run up to Rio we never heard anything about this.

http://www.nytimes.com/2016/06/29/s...field-doping-jeffrey-brown-investigation.html
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It looks very much like there is so much of it going on that no one really wants to touch it with a barge pole.
 
It stupid though as medals don't mean anything to anyone else than the people that win them. BC should be promoting cycling not just trying to win a few medals. Too much power for too little work done.
 
POAH said:
BC should be promoting cycling not just trying to win a few medals
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I agree - I think the money would probably be better spent on lobbying for proper training for car drivers and police to help make it safe to actually ride on the road, and help turn cycling back into a viable form of transport for commuting and general getting around for short distances (say, under 10 miles each way)...
 
Well Team Sky aren’t looking squeaky clean are they. What a surprise!

Sir Bradley Wiggins and Team Sky "crossed an ethical line" by using drugs allowed under anti-doping rules to enhance performance instead of just for medical need, a report by MPs says.

The case against Froome is still ongoing of course.
 
Ricardodaforce said:
Well Team Sky aren’t looking squeaky clean are they. What a surprise!

Sir Bradley Wiggins and Team Sky "crossed an ethical line" by using drugs allowed under anti-doping rules to enhance performance instead of just for medical need, a report by MPs says.

The case against Froome is still ongoing of course.
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Whilst I totally agree with you, I have "bolded" the bit which I think is most important.
I am totally against giving athletes, from all sports TUE's - Therapeutic Use Exemptions - because if they need drugs to compete, then they must be ill, so they shouldn't be competing.
I didn't like the "hatchet" job which the BBC have done on Wiggins, because Froome has used TUE's in the past for a really bad chest infection. He was so ill he went on to beat the Worlds greatest cyclists in the Tour of Romandie.
The BBC also glossed over Mo Farah using a TUE - mustn't shine a negative light on one of our most loved athletes.
There must be hundreds of Western athletes using TUE's - Williams sisters, Simone Biles, and if you look at the recent Winter Olympics in South Korea, the Norwegian team took 6000 doses of asthma medication with them, and these poor, sickly athletes went on to top the medal table.
There is a lot of hypocrisy in sport when it comes to doping, with athletes from the USA routinely being let off doping allegations.

https://www.nytimes.com/2018/01/25/sports/gil-roberts-doping-kissing.html

The BBC didn't bother to say anything about this, which to my mind is far more serious.

http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/que...s-ordered-at-team-sky-and-british-cycling-hq/

Finally, the case against Froome will just die a death as the lawyers drain the resources of UKAD, which is disgusting IMO.
 
Sky have shot themselves in the foot with this one and just hoping it goes away.
This is a team that takes OCD to a new level and has done for years but no record of a medication that goes in a jiffy bag?
Not even a mobile phone photo?

absolutely blatent lies for me.
 
Ricardodaforce said:
Well Team Sky aren’t looking squeaky clean are they. What a surprise!

Sir Bradley Wiggins and Team Sky "crossed an ethical line" by using drugs allowed under anti-doping rules to enhance performance instead of just for medical need, a report by MPs says.

The case against Froome is still ongoing of course.
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Makes me chuckle that Sky, Brailsford and Wiggins are being judged by Parliament. Sky didn't break the rules it seems, but neither did the MPs when the expenses scandal erupted 'IT WAS WITHIN THE RULES'....bit like Nick Griffin calling someone a xenophobe.
 
I reckon that if the UCI or any other governing bodies of cycling look into this deep enough, they may find all the teams are into doping in one way or another, cycling is a dirty sport always has been, this goes way back to its beginnings, so now the question, has Bradley taken something that gave him an unfair advantage, no, because they were all probably taking something, lets also look at Froome, one of our greatest TDF winners multiple times, no one could match him in the mountains, yet doping reared its head and it looks like Sky suspended something and now Froome gets dropped even on modest hills, something isn't quite right,
 
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If anyone really wants to know the vast sums involved and the depths people will sink to just to win a medal or title, go watch the documentary Icarus, that will open your eyes a bit.
 
Dangermouse1964 said:
I reckon that if the UCI or any other governing bodies of cycling look into this deep enough, they may find all the teams are into doping in one way or another, cycling is a dirty sport always has been, this goes way back to its beginnings
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I don't think this is anything specific to cycling, there will always be people at the top looking for the 1%, or even the 0.1% gains that are legal but push the boundaries.

Look at recent GB olympic success - a lot of other countries complaining about GB tech/equipment. The rules state that anything you use has be available to all, so GB (and I'm sure other countries as well) only release the new stuff for sale to other countries the day before a big event. 4 years later other countries are using that and a the newer generation is released, shame no-one else will get to use it until the next Olympics by which time
 
Dangermouse1964 said:
If anyone really wants to know the vast sums involved and the depths people will sink to just to win a medal or title, go watch the documentary Icarus, that will open your eyes a bit.
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Icarus is NOT a documentary, despite the director wishing it would look like one.
The ingredients were these - Take a Russian criminal who was head of their anti doping and doped athletes (which is why the Russians put him in prison), offer him asylum in the US, and then let him tell whatever story he wishes to tell about Russia.
I am not saying that Russians don't dope, because most Eastern European countries have high levels of doping in certain sports.
However, one look at the UKAD site would tell you that UK athletes certainly DO dope, and cycling is far from the worst offender.

https://www.ukad.org.uk/anti-doping-rule-violations/current-violations/

For you to say "cycling is a dirty sport" is quite insulting, because I raced for about twenty years, and never experienced any doping in races or in clubs which I belonged to.
You are also using the Lance Armstrong excuse - "They were all doping", which is a sad lie, but not that surprising from an habitual liar.
Our media has concentrated on Wiggins, when his Sky Teammate Froome has used TUE's before as well (in addition to the Salbutamol asthma medication).
The media seems to be keeping very quiet about Mo Farah at the moment - I wonder how long that will last?
 
Friend of mine used to be a sports reporter on a national paper and there were very serious doubts in the industry about Mo's cleanliness and his rapid progression at what one would consider quite a mature age.

Very dissapointing, but if most are "at it" perhaps it's time to have a 2 tier sport (bit like F1) where tier 1 is anything goes and tier 2 is clean?
 
Th
MatBin said:
Friend of mine used to be a sports reporter on a national paper and there were very serious doubts in the industry about Mo's cleanliness and his rapid progression at what one would consider quite a mature age.

Very dissapointing, but if most are "at it" perhaps it's time to have a 2 tier sport (bit like F1) where tier 1 is anything goes and tier 2 is clean?
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problem with "unlimited" sport, is that you will end up with many more dead athletes.
I honestly do not think that "most are at it", but there is a significant number.
Adopt a zero tolerance approach.
First offence - 4 year ban.
Second offence - lifetime ban.
Ban all in competition TUE's. As I said in my earlier post, the Norwegian medal topping Olympic team took 6000 doses of asthma medication with them to the games, plus an assortment of other painkillers and corticosteroids. It certainly seemed to work for them when you look at all their gold medals.
 
MatBin said:
Very dissapointing, but if most are "at it" perhaps it's time to have a 2 tier sport (bit like F1) where tier 1 is anything goes and tier 2 is clean?
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I'd hope not. Naively I'd like to enjoy sport for what a human can achieve cleanly.

andy700 said:
Ban all in competition TUE's.
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I'd like to see that too . If there is a genuine need outside of competition then a competitor could legitimately take it, but stop in time for any benefits to have worn off. By definition a TUE must be a licensed product so its action and longevity will be well understood
 
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MatBin said:
Friend of mine used to be a sports reporter on a national paper and there were very serious doubts in the industry about Mo's cleanliness and his rapid progression at what one would consider quite a mature age.
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I know - All that Quorn...
 
Anyone seen Wiggins response and what was the source not identified? It's already been said russian hackers provided some information or possible misinformation based on what we know of their efforts on the Us election, european elections?
 
A team mate will have grassed him up, someone passed over at Sky.
 
Byker28i said:
Anyone seen Wiggins response and what was the source not identified? It's already been said russian hackers provided some information or possible misinformation based on what we know of their efforts on the Us election, european elections?
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The information which the Fancy Bears let out was all correct, because many athletes then tried to justify why they had taken the various medications. Unfortunately our media are not too keen in releasing much information about them.

http://indianexpress.com/article/ex...rena-williams-fancy-bears-russia-tue-3031561/
 
I don’t know if any of you have been following the Fitness to Practice hearing of Dr Richard Freeman, ex Doctor of Team Sky and British Cycling, but the evidence looks very bad indeed. It came out a couple of weeks ago that he’d “lost” data from a third computer, containing rider medical files, when the UCI requested it. Plus the order and delivery of Testogel (banned), mystery packet delivery, confessing to destroying a hard drive, the TUEs, a rider’s testosterone level more than doubling under his medication, and the GMC wanting to ask him more regarding medical records of a “Tour de France winner”.

Interesting stuff.
 
I know someone who used to work for team sky. He quit when he discovered that some riders were being given extra help - mostly without them knowing.
 
andya700 said:
If it was another country's main team or organisation, the BBC would be all over it. This is about as dirty as it gets.

www.cyclingweekly.com

Dr Richard Freeman admits losing rider blood data from a third computer

The former Team Sky and British Cycling doctor is currently facing a medical tribunal
www.cyclingweekly.com www.cyclingweekly.com
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www.bbc.co.uk

'I've never doped a rider' - Freeman

At his tribunal in Manchester, former British Cycling and Team Sky doctor Dr Richard Freeman says he "never doped a rider".
www.bbc.co.uk www.bbc.co.uk
www.bbc.co.uk

'Doctor destroyed laptop', hearing told

A former British Cycling and Team Sky chief doctor used "a screwdriver or blunt instrument" to destroy a laptop, a tribunal hears.
www.bbc.co.uk www.bbc.co.uk
www.bbc.co.uk

Doctor says he destroyed package

A former British Cycling and Team Sky chief medic says for the first time that he destroyed a package of testosterone which he ordered to the national velodrome in 2011.
www.bbc.co.uk www.bbc.co.uk
www.bbc.co.uk

Peters doubts Freeman testosterone claim

British Cycling's former head of medicine casts doubt on Dr Richard Freeman's claim that testosterone was delivered to its headquarters on behalf of Shane Sutton.
www.bbc.co.uk www.bbc.co.uk
 
Ricardodaforce said:
I don’t know if any of you have been following the Fitness to Practice hearing of Dr Richard Freeman, ex Doctor of Team Sky and British Cycling, but the evidence looks very bad indeed. It came out a couple of weeks ago that he’d “lost” data from a third computer, containing rider medical files, when the UCI requested it. Plus the order and delivery of Testogel (banned), mystery packet delivery, confessing to destroying a hard drive, the TUEs, a rider’s testosterone level more than doubling under his medication, and the GMC wanting to ask him more regarding medical records of a “Tour de France winner”.

Interesting stuff.
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To bring this up to date, the General Medical Council’s case against Freeman was summed up yesterday. Today it’s the turn of his defence to start their summing up. To me, it all looks very bad for him, for British Cycling and Team Sky.
 
You should see what happened to the ladies team when they got their hormone boosters!

testosterone.jpg
 
So Dr Freeman was struck off the medical register yesterday for ordering a banned substance “knowing or believing” it was to dope a rider.
No, British cycling is not clean.
 
Ricardodaforce said:
So Dr Freeman was struck off the medical register yesterday for ordering a banned substance “knowing or believing” it was to dope a rider.
No, British cycling is not clean.
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But in the scale of events, I think Dr Freeman has been thrown under the bus so to speak. Anyone who thinks he was solely responsible is either stupid or complicit in this whole mess.
 
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