canon 7d or 1DMK3

the black fox

the black fox

Messages
15,462
Name
Jeff
Edit My Images
No
got a bit of a quandary at the moment ,i shoot mainly wildlife 98% of the time ,now using a 400mm f5.6 lens on a 7d body ,however i cannot for the love of me GEL with the 7d and having had a 1dmkii before wondered if a idmkiii would be a better choice of body .
i know full well i would lose some reach and crop ability but would it be the right move to make or not given what i do .has anybody used the 1d3 with the 400mm f5.6 ,or done that move which looks on paper to be retrograde i.e going from 18mp cropped to a c-sensor and 10m.p
 
I'd be interested in the opinions here too. I've looked at both the Mark III and IV. I believe the IQ and noise handling at higher ISO's are incomparably better than anything the 7D could ever hope to achieve. I have the 100-400L, 400 5.6L and 500L IS Mark one on a 7D body (not at the same time before Frac or Rich pipe in).
 
When I sold my D300, I decided that I would use full frame only due entirely to the better ISO.

You lose the reach of a crop body, but given the better shutter speed that we need for a lot of the time in the UK, it was a decent trade off for me.

The only two guys I go out doing wildlife stuff with that have tried the 7D, have both sold them and now use the FF canons instead. I think they use the 5D, don`t know much about canon bodies so may well be wrong on the 5D thing, but both dropped the 7d and went back to full frame.
 
fracster said:
When I sold my D300, I decided that I would use full frame only due entirely to the better ISO.

You lose the reach of a crop body, but given the better shutter speed that we need for a lot of the time in the UK, it was a decent trade off for me.

The only two guys I go out doing wildlife stuff with that have tried the 7D, have both sold them and now use the FF canons instead. I think they use the 5D, don`t know much about canon bodies so may well be wrong on the 5D thing, but both dropped the 7d and went back to full frame.
Click to expand...


The Mark III and IV are not FF tho. They are 1.3 crops against the 1.6 of the 7D. So, it's a bit of a compromise not a capitulation to FF.
 
I had both the 7D and the 1D mkiii.....
I didn't get on with the 7D, and I no longer have it..... I use the 1D mkiii for birds and wildlife....
 
BRASH said:
The Mark III and IV are not FF tho. They are 1.3 crops against the 1.6 of the 7D. So, it's a bit of a compromise not a capitulation to FF.
Click to expand...
Ah, ok then, I remember Ian Cook using a MK3 now. So your not losing that much crop but gaining massively on the ISO front?
 
fracster said:
Ah, ok then, I remember Ian Cook using a MK3 now. So your not losing that much crop but gaining massively on the ISO front?
Click to expand...


I think so, That's my understanding as well as better IQ. Obviously being Pro bodies the build quality is superior too.
 
Is the 5d full frame then Brian?
 
I've got both, and the 400mm f5.6. The only reason I've kept the 7d is that I've got a heavy investment in it with an underwater setup. If I couldn't dive any more it would be straight up for sale. It works decent enough underwater but that's mainly shooting at low ISO. For topside use I find the 1d3 far superior in focusing ability, IQ and high ISO. My 400mm sprung to life when I bought the 1d3.
 
pooley said:
I've got both, and the 400mm f5.6. The only reason I've kept the 7d is that I've got a heavy investment in it with an underwater setup. If I couldn't dive any more it would be straight up for sale. It works decent enough underwater but that's mainly shooting at low ISO. For topside use I find the 1d3 far superior in focusing ability, IQ and high ISO. My 400mm sprung to life when I bought the 1d3.
Click to expand...
Yep, I agree with this, both of mine were paired up with the 400mm F5.6, and it works much better with the 1D mkiii
 
I'm sure someone will point out the differences in these, but as a quick reference, check out the 2 shots below.

First, the 1d3, ISO 1000


Red stag by Pooleypix, on Flickr

Then a 7d shot taken at a similar distance but at ISO 800. (ignore the exif, for some reason, all my shots taken over a set distance report at 76.6m with this lens)


Stag portrait by Pooleypix, on Flickr

Granted this is far from a perfect studio setup, but gives a guide to the IQ
 
That is one thing I love about the D800, it shoots FF or 1.5 crop.Does other crops that I cannot remember off the top of my head. It will video in the crop mode as well, which is handy.

What don`t you like about the 7d out of interest chief?

Sorry aimed at Brian.
 
Last edited:
fracster said:
That is one thing I love about the D800, it shoots FF or 1.5 crop.Does other crops that I cannot remember off the top of my head. It will video in the crop mode as well, which is handy.

What don`t you like about the 7d out of interest chief?

Sorry aimed at Brian.
Click to expand...

Mainly the naffish noise handling and want the best complimentary body for the 500mm.
 
hmmmmm anyone in range of north wales/chester/wirral area so we could have a meet up and try session PRETTY PLEASE :rolleyes::rolleyes:
 
I'm in Manchester. in 2 weeks I'm off on my jollies for a week and happy to lend you my 1d3 for that time if you want. PM me if you're interested. I'll be taking my 7d with me
 
compared to most members i'm probably classed as an amateur, but here's my 2 pence...
I had a 7D and was disappointed in the poor ISO performance, so i traded it in for a 5D3.
I now have a 1D3 too, and would never go back to a 7D.
Even though the 7 has a great build, the 1 series is so much better, feels much better in the hand and also has much better IQ and hit rate.
Accepted i use it for sports and not wildlife.
Hardly use the 5D, but when i do the IQ is even better than the 1D3 but obviously find i have to crop much more due to the lack of reach.
 
I swithered between a 7D and a 1D3 when I wanted to change from my 1D2

Cut a long story short I ended up with both the 7D and 1D3 but the 1D3 was the camera I kept.
 
same quandry for me, being primarily a landscape portrait photographer, I upgraded from the 7d to a full frame sensor of the 5d mkii and now 5d mkiii. however, because I wanted to get back into doing more wildlife/bird photography, I bought the 7d again as I heard different copies of the 7d maybe more noisey than others. I sold it within two weeks because of the noise grain at low iso and also tbe tonality of the images (remember I have been very much used to fullframe). I decided to buy a well cherised 1d mkiii and I havent look ed back at all! the noise handling beats the 7d easily and the raw files are a pleasure to handle, and it holds its own in terms of noise against the 5d3 upto iso 3200. yes the fullframe is better at higher isos but I am very happy I have this as a second body to the 5d3.I do cconsider it a good buy when you can pick one up from around 750 to 850 pounds, for a well cherished not too high shutter count one.

Images from the 1DMKIII, 1st Image 300mm f2.8, 2nd image 300mm f2.8 with 2x tc, 3rd image 300mm f2.8 with 1.4 tc

10814993464_76682ff3df_c.jpg


10337396233_d662a41250_c.jpg


1417531_465575076891424_1937981975_o.jpg
 
Last edited:
just a quicky looking at the physical shape of both cameras have you tried the 7d with a battery grip?
 
The only canon crop I'd use would be the mark iv. The iso ability of that body is exceptional.
 
Interesting thread
I was using a 7D with 100 400 lens which was great and in good light the IQ was excellent
I was struggling in low light tho
I thought about getting a 5D but would have been cropping all the time
I thought about a 1D mk 3 but I would have still been cropping sometimes
I think the mk3 is 10MP I may be wrong about that
I went for a faster lens the 300 2.8 with 1.4 and 2x tc and kept the 7 D am very pleased with how it's going am getting shots that I couldn't before
I think that the 7D does have very good IQ up to ISO 800 just have to get the exposure right
Don't find that noise is the issue just at 1600 and higher the dynamic range (colours) aren't as good
 
Last edited:
The23rdman said:
The only canon crop I'd use would be the mark iv. The iso ability of that body is exceptional.
Click to expand...

It's not a 7D or 1DIII though.

I'm sure everybody would opt for a 1DiV over the above two cameras but it's in a completely different price range.
 
I've had 2 7D's and a 1D3 and I got cleaner files with the 1D3 at over ISO800 than I did with either of the 7D's. However, there are downsides to the 1D3 as well, you only have 10Mp to crop with and you onmly start with a 1.3 crop so you do get lesser reach than the 7D. Also the AF system of the 7D is far more 'up to date' than that of the 1D3 and the 'spot focus' ability is a real bonus. Below ISO800 the 7D is a fantastic piece of kit but it tails off as the ISO rises, the 1D3 is a great piece of kit if you don't need the extra reach and you can put up with the older AF technology. I don't know if I could really say which is better overall, they both do their job but TBH I'd look into getting some newer technology than either of them.

In the end I sold the 1D3 and part ex'd the 7D and some other bits for a 70D and couldn't be happier. I wont have another 7D, even if I was given one I'd sell it, and I wont be chasing after any older bodies as the newer technology is far better. The 70D, while not having quite as diverse AF system as the 7D (there's no 'spot focus unfortunately, maybe a firmware update in the future) the ISO and noise handling ability is excellent, the IQ is fantastic, the screen is brilliant, the fps is similar to the 7D and you still get the reach.
 
I've had a MkIIN, MkIII and now a MkIV. I really didn't think that the MkIII was any better than the MkIIN although the extra MP was an advantage. I ran them side by side for a while. The MkIV is better than both of them and with the extra MP negates to a degree the advantages of the 1.6 crop. But as you said MkIV's are still pretty pricey and seem to be holding their value. I looked at getting a 7D as a second body but was put off by the constant tales of poor ISO. ISO 800 is my default setting on both my bodies and it seems that that is the top of the range for the 7D. I bought a 5D3 instead. in good light the 7D seems to produce the goods and I've seen some great shots taken with the camera. One advantage of getting a MkIII would be the opportunity to use a 1.4 on your 400 and still retain AF.

Having said all that I'd probably buy a 70D.

Cheers
 
Yep I would opt for a 1D mkiv if cash allowed, but for what you get, you get a good camera, yes it doesnt allow you to crop in as much, but i have to say, it does work nicely enough.
 
Can't comment on the 1 series but if it helps I've recently bought a 7D, great camera, fast FFS and great at tracking moving objects and gives a good IQ.....
If I was to write the about using anything near or above iso800 it would be very different, low light and high ISO don't blend well with the 7D
 
I'm of the same opinion as most of the others, I had a 7D sold it and got a 1Dmk3. The mk3 was the better camera.
The only thing I would say is if you go for a Mk3 try and get a late one the didn't need the recall.

Iain.
 
Canon are missing a trick here... They need to make a '2D'. A 20mp 1.6x crop sensor in a 1D type body with the AF from the 5DMKIII. Preferably for about £1500 :)

The gap between the crop sensor models is too great. I'd never have another 7D unless it was dirt cheap but I'm very tempted by the 70D. The performance reviews place it in front of the 7D in terms of image quality and better ISO performance.
 
Si you're absolutely spot on. If they made that they'd sell a shed load. Like you I quite like the look of the 70D. If I didn't have a MKIV I'd get one as a second body. I just wonder if its Canons replacement for the 7D and they're going to bring out a higher spec crop. To me the loss of the MkIV was a mistake on canons part.
 
Spiritflier said:
Canon are missing a trick here... They need to make a '2D'. A 20mp 1.6x crop sensor in a 1D type body with the AF from the 5DMKIII. Preferably for about £1500 :)

The gap between the crop sensor models is too great. I'd never have another 7D unless it was dirt cheap but I'm very tempted by the 70D. The performance reviews place it in front of the 7D in terms of image quality and better ISO performance.
Click to expand...

I would say 12-14mm is the absolute max you could have in 1.6x with the current tech. Maybe more like 10-12 and weak / no AA filter, then that would make sense. But if that was really good, why would anyone buy 1dx for wildlife and sports? This could be the answer why not.

On the other hand what is wrong with 5DIII for wildlife? After cropping to 1.3x it has a little bit more left than 1D3 and is slightly cleaner. Not having one could be a good reason though...
 
Nowt wrong with 5D3 for wildlife. I use mine for that more than the MkIV. 1DX is a great camera but its very expensive. A good 1.6 crop with good AF and decent FPS that has good clean ISO up to 2000 would be very popular. Maybe the 70D is canons take on that but it still leaves a huge price gap between that and the 5D3 and 1DX.

7D must be due for retirement or replacement and there's a price point in canons line up for one.
 
Last edited:
I read over the weekend that a Mark 2 7d will be out in 2014...weather its a rumour or not only time will tell, maybe they've looked at the poor low light performance as that's it's big let down for me.
 
I've had 1DII, 1DIII and 7D. 1DIII was the best from the bunch. Ergonomics advantage over 1DII and AF+IQ advantage over 7D. I was very disappointed with 7D AF. Lot of hunting with 400mm f/5.6L. When I got 1DIII I had no issues at all. If you have long enough lens and don't need much cropping 1DIII is the best choice. I'd still keep it if didn't get 1DIV. So my advice would be: go for 1DIII. You wont regret it. That's a promise!
 
what i missed out of my initial post was the fact that i also have a 60d ,barely used the wife uses it when she comes out ,(not often in winter ) thats got a sigma 120-400mm.os bolted on it .so basically at the moment i,m running two 18mp cameras ,which although different give similar results at the same shutter speeds and iso values .hence my hankering after something different .
the lad says i should go for the 70d as a brand new import is the same price as a s/h 1d3 ,but having got badly stung by the nikon d7100 i,m reluctant to take that path.as i found to my horror the latest stuff can and does go wrong frequently ,two bodies and near insanity in 8 weeks was enough for me .

and thanks for all the comments etc there very helpful ,but my pension will not stretch to some of the suggestions made unfortunately ,not without a divorce or castration or probably both :eek::eek:

heres one from the 7d yesterday at 2000iso ,so i don't seem to have a bad copy .hmmmmmmm

just add snow by blackfox wildlife and nature imaging, on Flickr
 
Last edited:
Pretty Good Jeff, though i'm a little disappointed in the ISO handling of the 7D, being purely a keen amateur it'll do ok for me, just takes a bit more PP work.
I did take one at 3200 and struggled a bit to get rid of the noise... (ignore the white bits as was just trying out LR)


Great Tit by martyndt, on Flickr
 
I must have had bad copies of the 7D as anything over 800 iso was bad. It might be worth waiting till the spring to see if a 7dmk2 is forth coming but I don't thing you would be disappointed with the 1Dmk3 Jeff.
 
daugirdas said:
I would say 12-14mm is the absolute max you could have in 1.6x with the current tech...
Click to expand...

Hi Tomas,

My issue wasn't with the wide-angle side of things... I think that's pretty well covered. :)

The problem lies at the telephoto end. Canon's rationale seems to be that if you want high quality long-reach, you should buy a 1Dx and a 600mm f/4L. Whilst I'm sure we'd all love to be in a situation where we could afford that kind of investment, the truth is that there's a void that needs to be filled with a high-spec crop sensor 1D body. The 7D has existed with no real change apart from a good firmware upgrade and it's lagging a long way behind the competition. As much as it pains me to say it, the Nikon D7100 is the camera to beat with a crop sensor and Canon should have stepped up to match it or better it at least 18 months ago! The 18mp sensor in the 7D is now woefully inadequate by comparison and the only real attempt we've seen from Canon to redress the balance has been in the shape of the 70D. :)
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top