- Messages
- 20,926
- Name
- Steve
- Edit My Images
- Yes
There is also the inflationary factor, and increased performance of newer things. But I do see the point, the price of camera gear now is very high
Canon RF 100-300 f2.8 announced
- Thread starter JohnStewart
- Start date
- Messages
- 23,764
- Name
- Toby
- Edit My Images
- No
I'm sure they'll sell, pros can buy it as a business expense, then there's the wealthy people that don't have to worry about the cost of things, then there will be an odd few who see this as the perfect lens for them and they're scrimp and save to get it. It doesn't stop it from being ludicrously expensive though, but then there's a lot of people who will think that some of my gear is ludicrously expensive. I'm one of them
It's all relative I guess.
- Messages
- 3,494
- Name
- Keith
- Edit My Images
- Yes
Good points, but if you think of it as only £128 extra per mm it’s not so badI disagree, just because another manufacturer makes one for an obscene amount of money doesn't mean it's not overpriced. I'm not sure £1.5k for an extra 20mm at the short end is good value either.
Lenses (and cameras) on the whole are getting crazy prices though, £2.5-£2.8k for the latest 70-200mm f2.8's, £1.5k for 50mm f1.4's etc etc. But even with the 70-200mm f2.8 being a whopping £2.5k Canon want a huge/ridiculous (imo) £9k for an extra 70mm
I agree too - the prices for new gear are really steep - and I'm not seeing an increase in creativity from this new tech, just larger outlays.
Raymond Lin
I am Groot
- Messages
- 10,080
- Name
- Raymond
- Edit My Images
- No
Here i am looking at manual lenses and anamorphic lenses because of the creativity aspect!
If i see another Canon 300/2.8 for like £500 i am going to snap it up, use it in manual if i had to lol
If i see another Canon 300/2.8 for like £500 i am going to snap it up, use it in manual if i had to lol
- Messages
- 3,839
- Name
- Chris
- Edit My Images
- Yes
I was at Goodwood 80th Member's Meeting over the weekend and the public side was full of Sony a9IIs, A1s, R3s, R5s (in fact Sony and Canon seem to be utterly dominant now, not many Nikon's about), it's the middle ground that seems to have been squeezed, the 'pro' stuff is where the profit is.
Given an R5 is £4k without even sticking a lens on it, I'd say there are still a few people knocking around willing to spend a hefty chunk of change on the latest gear 'for fun'. Canon wouldn't have produced this if they hadn't done the research.
Given an R5 is £4k without even sticking a lens on it, I'd say there are still a few people knocking around willing to spend a hefty chunk of change on the latest gear 'for fun'. Canon wouldn't have produced this if they hadn't done the research.
- Messages
- 20,926
- Name
- Steve
- Edit My Images
- Yes
Probably a fair amount of "well to do" people go to that, so the latest and greatest stuff is chump change to them. Classic cars/motorsport is an expensive thing.
A lot of the stuff you can get a bit cheaper off the grey importers but yes, when you are out and about, especially at the weekends theres good gear to be seen at the tripod holes.
Raymond Lin
I am Groot
- Messages
- 10,080
- Name
- Raymond
- Edit My Images
- No
I've seen so many hobbyist (tourists) in Japan rocking a R5, some with a 28-70/2.0 !
like £7k of gear and there I was with a £800 A7R3 and a Sigma 24-70 lol.
- Messages
- 1,229
- Name
- Christopher
- Edit My Images
- Yes
Just a thought, the 50-140 with a 1.4x converter will give you 75-210 @f4, same fov as a 112-315, 35mm format lens. Another thought while typing, perhaps that's why Fuji haven't produced a 100-300 f4.
- Messages
- 7,132
- Name
- Lewis
- Edit My Images
- Yes
Maybe 50-140 and a teleconverter is what I need.
- Messages
- 20,926
- Name
- Steve
- Edit My Images
- Yes
The sad thing is, technically there isn very little between the two rigs.
- Messages
- 9,840
- Name
- Andrew
- Edit My Images
- Yes
I've been to a lot of motorsport events, and I've noticed more people with the latest gear on the public side of the fence - so much so, that I've spotted a few people with new Canon RF cameras and I've deliberately engaged them in conversation to find out what they thought with it.
The accredited photographers generally have the pro grade kit, because it works in all conditions reliable, but they make it last - the public tend to have the prosumer equivalents.
I'm fairly content with my kit, but I generally retire an item of equipment before it becomes unreliable - have just retired my 7D2 which I bought secondhand here with an R7. The 1DX2 will get retired at some point, but not sure what that will get replaced with, maybe a 1DX Mk3, or hang on for an R3 / R3 Mk2 / R1 . Once my bodies are firmly in the mirrorless camp, I will then consider lenses and the advantages of an RF L lens versus an EF L lens with an adaptor.
The accredited photographers generally have the pro grade kit, because it works in all conditions reliable, but they make it last - the public tend to have the prosumer equivalents.
I'm fairly content with my kit, but I generally retire an item of equipment before it becomes unreliable - have just retired my 7D2 which I bought secondhand here with an R7. The 1DX2 will get retired at some point, but not sure what that will get replaced with, maybe a 1DX Mk3, or hang on for an R3 / R3 Mk2 / R1 . Once my bodies are firmly in the mirrorless camp, I will then consider lenses and the advantages of an RF L lens versus an EF L lens with an adaptor.
D
Deleted member 95743
Guest
Another way to look at this is that you will need to carry less equipment and it will work out cheaper.
A Canon R3 body with a RF100-300 lens will cost about £17379.
Two Canon R3 bodies with an RF70-200 attached to one and an EF300 attached to the other will cost approximately £21047.
A Canon R3 body with a RF100-300 lens will cost about £17379.
Two Canon R3 bodies with an RF70-200 attached to one and an EF300 attached to the other will cost approximately £21047.
- Messages
- 23,764
- Name
- Toby
- Edit My Images
- No
My experience is that the majority of the accredited togs are still rocking DSLRs, I guess it's just a tool to them and there's little to no advantage of mirrorless for motorsport. You don't need a new fangled AF system with AI tracking, you don't need 30fps etc etc.
KIPAX
Seriously Likeable
- Messages
- 21,020
- Name
- KIPAX Lancashire UK
- Edit My Images
- No
Canon are still selling there latest DSLR for £7k . https://store.canon.co.uk/canon-eos-1d-x-mark-iii-body/3829C011/
.I have one of these and will be getting another aftre this summer... My sports photogrpahy wont get any better using mirrorless I am sure.
- Messages
- 20,926
- Name
- Steve
- Edit My Images
- Yes
Canon are still selling there latest DSLR for £7k . https://store.canon.co.uk/canon-eos-1d-x-mark-iii-body/3829C011/
.I have one of these and will be getting another aftre this summer... My sports photogrpahy wont get any better using mirrorless I am sure.
Save nearly £3k on 1Dx
or £4k R3
Canon EOS R3 Mirrorless Camera (Body)
Why Buy From Panamoz.com? Free 3 Year UK/EU/US Local Warranty 14 Day Money Back Guarantee Prices include taxes and duties All inclusive prices with no hidden fees Products are 100% brand new and in box Express shipping with insurance and tracking Delivery in 7-14 business days only Secure...
Last edited:
KIPAX
Seriously Likeable
- Messages
- 21,020
- Name
- KIPAX Lancashire UK
- Edit My Images
- No
Save nearly £3k on 1Dx
or £4k R3
Canon EOS R3 Mirrorless Camera (Body)
Why Buy From Panamoz.com? Free 3 Year UK/EU/US Local Warranty 14 Day Money Back Guarantee Prices include taxes and duties All inclusive prices with no hidden fees Products are 100% brand new and in box Express shipping with insurance and tracking Delivery in 7-14 business days only Secure...panamoz.com
I will be buying used from MPB
I was pointing out that canon still sell dslr so not that dead yet
- Messages
- 20,926
- Name
- Steve
- Edit My Images
- Yes
No, they're far from dead - but they're not getting updated, renewed with newer models. I think that's a shame.
My dream camera looks like a D850 with a 61mp A7R4 sensor, or a 645z with the 100mp medium format Fuji GFX100s sensor.
- Messages
- 46
- Edit My Images
- Yes
At Olympics and some of the other major events, many of those lenses would be borrowed from Canon. There's going to be a few staff togs left whose equipment's from employer. The freelancers going to have a range of from the latest to several generations old. From a distance, you'll see a big supertelephoto prime f2.8, not necessarily identify how old it actually is.
- Messages
- 3,839
- Name
- Chris
- Edit My Images
- Yes
I found something that exists that makes this lens look cheap...https://www.wexphotovideo.com/canon-et-160-ii-lens-hood-for-canon-ef-600mm-f4l-is-ii-usm-1532868/
- Messages
- 3,839
- Name
- Richard
- Edit My Images
- Yes
I don't think anybody really needs AI tracking and 30FPS, it's just a way for manufacturers to keep selling new stuff. Any high end camera from the last 10-15 years will take images that are good enough for professional work. As you say, cameras are just a tool to professional photographers, it's amateurs who tend to get excited and drop loads of cash on the latest and greatest new technology.
Raymond Lin
I am Groot
- Messages
- 10,080
- Name
- Raymond
- Edit My Images
- No
I turn the camera on my A7III and R3 rapid rates DOWN from their 10fps to like 8 on the 3 and 5 on the R3.
The tech has got to the point where it doesn't improve my photography, to capture the kind of photos that i like, a "story", requires more than tech, and the tech from 5 years ago is plenty capable for that. To know that however, require insight and a pinch of experience.
The tech has got to the point where it doesn't improve my photography, to capture the kind of photos that i like, a "story", requires more than tech, and the tech from 5 years ago is plenty capable for that. To know that however, require insight and a pinch of experience.
OP
- Messages
- 1,006
- Name
- John Stewart
- Edit My Images
- Yes
WEX currently have some "well used" 1DX3s for just over £2k, over £1k cheaper than the cheapest at MPB albeit it with a lot more actuations.
OP
- Messages
- 1,006
- Name
- John Stewart
- Edit My Images
- Yes
I'm the same - my Mk1 1DX is getting on a bit now at almost 11 years old and my 1DX2 which is now about 7 years old. Both still do what I need them for, but I'll replace them if and when they break and are beyond economical repair or I win the lottery. I'm not sure whether to look at the mirrorless bodies or go for a well used 1DX3 (prices seem to be in free fall at the moment) and save some money. An R3 i still well outside my budget, but I might look at the free hire option from Canon to see how I get on with it.
KIPAX
Seriously Likeable
- Messages
- 21,020
- Name
- KIPAX Lancashire UK
- Edit My Images
- No
Last edited:
KIPAX
Seriously Likeable
- Messages
- 21,020
- Name
- KIPAX Lancashire UK
- Edit My Images
- No
I have found to my dismay that the newer cameras including my 1dx3 dont give me the same FPS on older lens.. eg i use a canon 400 f2.8 IS and dont get full frame rate unless i shoot at 2.8 only.. any higher and the framerate drops... this doesnt happen on newer 400 lens... but as mine gives me pin sharp 2.8 pics I am not spending 12K to upgrade it
- Messages
- 12,783
- Name
- Mark
- Edit My Images
- No
Re the point on not needing the latest tech. Depends how frequently you upgrade i guess. I moved (2 years ago) from a 7D mk1 to an R5 and in the forests I live by the AI tracking (as long as its picking up the front of the car and not the windscreen banner) because it allows me to do things the 7D didn't - and that has improved the varienty and composition of my images massivly.
1st thing is to take multiple, maybe 3/4 differently composed images of the same car on the same corner in one pass. Using ranged or spot focus points this is impossible because you have to keep the car at that part of the frame.
As a result, this has allowed for much better composition, especailly in cases where the car does not appear in the expected position - as often happens in a rally, especially if you are shooting after a blind corner or at a hairpin where lines are significantly different.
For example on a hairpin (shooting towards apex on outside) you need a different focus point for the entry (right most, if right hand hairpin), mid (central) and exit (left most) - now I can get a well composed scene in all 3 without even setting a focus point.... Job done.
Secondly - panning and electronic shutter - so much easier - I hadn't tried it but a well respected national motorsports circuit photographer recently upgraded to a nikon mirrorless and mentioned the advantages he found with panning on electronic shutter... I tried it, and wow, yes hit rate around 1/20s and below so much higher, without the shutter shock etc and well still being able to track the car and not loosing the viewfinder for each of those 1/20s frames
I think some people need to lift the "we've always done it this way" mentality....!
-----
Anyway the reason I came here was thinking about alternatives to this lens because its stupidly expensive and given the ISO capabilities of mirrorless - what advantages does it really offer over the 100-500 unless you are in a dark tunnel with no light.... not sure. I often use that lens in the forest upto ISO3200 and beyond and get clean cropable images...
I was thinking - does anyone still use the 35-350 and how does it perform on mirrorless. Few examples in Japan on ebay for the £500 mark. Might be worth a punt for "fun"?
1st thing is to take multiple, maybe 3/4 differently composed images of the same car on the same corner in one pass. Using ranged or spot focus points this is impossible because you have to keep the car at that part of the frame.
As a result, this has allowed for much better composition, especailly in cases where the car does not appear in the expected position - as often happens in a rally, especially if you are shooting after a blind corner or at a hairpin where lines are significantly different.
For example on a hairpin (shooting towards apex on outside) you need a different focus point for the entry (right most, if right hand hairpin), mid (central) and exit (left most) - now I can get a well composed scene in all 3 without even setting a focus point.... Job done.
Secondly - panning and electronic shutter - so much easier - I hadn't tried it but a well respected national motorsports circuit photographer recently upgraded to a nikon mirrorless and mentioned the advantages he found with panning on electronic shutter... I tried it, and wow, yes hit rate around 1/20s and below so much higher, without the shutter shock etc and well still being able to track the car and not loosing the viewfinder for each of those 1/20s frames
I think some people need to lift the "we've always done it this way" mentality....!
-----
Anyway the reason I came here was thinking about alternatives to this lens because its stupidly expensive and given the ISO capabilities of mirrorless - what advantages does it really offer over the 100-500 unless you are in a dark tunnel with no light.... not sure. I often use that lens in the forest upto ISO3200 and beyond and get clean cropable images...
I was thinking - does anyone still use the 35-350 and how does it perform on mirrorless. Few examples in Japan on ebay for the £500 mark. Might be worth a punt for "fun"?
Last edited:
- Messages
- 23,764
- Name
- Toby
- Edit My Images
- No
I know the R5 has vehicle recognition for the tracking but I’m not sure why you can’t get the shots without it, obviously I need to take your word for it as I can’t fully picture the scene.
As for panning, I still believe DSLRs are better as there is zero lag in the viewfinder, unless of course what you’re actually referring to is blackout free shooting which does make it easier (at least with shutter speeds over 1/50) however the R5 doesn’t have true blackout free shooting and I guess it’s then a case of some will prefer the blackout of the DSLR over the slideshow of mirrorless and vice versa. Also, it will depend on what DSLR you’re coming from as if you have one that can shoot 12-15fps the blackout between shots is minimal vs those shooting at 6-8fps.
I am referencing what’s possible on the 7D no idea if a 1D, 5D is capable of more but the same applies to my previous 20D to
Basically you have a number of ways of selecting your focus point either selecting a specific point or selecting a zone - be that zone in the middle left 3rd or the top right 3rd.
So if that’s generally the case without ‘tracking’ once the point or zone is selected you are limited to the subject having to be in that area to nail the focus.
In the example below and using the same logic I would need a focus point in bottom or central right 3rd to achieve no1 bottom/central middle to achieve 2 and bottom or central left to achieve 3 while keeping the same scene composition as in the photo. Which as far as my previous slrs go is impossible without tracking ability.
Added to this I can also take a 4th and 5th shot of the same car by zooming and framing the vehicle in the top left 3rd while it enters the scene appearinf from behind the hill and keeping the context of where it’s going. The 5th option being the same logic but on the exit to get some nice detail in the stones kicked up.
- Messages
- 25,366
- Name
- Phil
- Edit My Images
- No
And tracking that follows the subject all around the frame too.Ahh I see what you mean, it's certainly handy having focus points that go pretty much edge to edge for things like this
To add to Andrews post, in the old days we’d have got a shot of the car all the way round the corner, but we’d have had to pan to keep the car the same place in the frame.
- Messages
- 23,764
- Name
- Toby
- Edit My Images
- No
Yep been there done that. However more modern DSLRs had tracking too so the mirrorless doesn't really have an advantage in this instance hence why I only discussed the AF point spread