making a HTML website

SOPHMB

SOPHMB

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Name
Sophie
Edit My Images
Yes
right, so i'd like to make my own website, does anyone know how you'd start this? for example what programs do you need for starting html websites? is photoshop any good for it?

to be honest i don't have a clue on what i'm doing, and some advice would be brilliant, seeing as i'm seventeen and looking at doing something for myself!

thanks in advance!
 
Hi Sophie

Do you know how to code HTML at the moment?

If not and you want to do this yourself then I would reccomend going to waterstones and getting some sort of 'HTML for beginners' type book

I would also reccomend learning CSS as well as HTML as they work together to layout and style the pages you want.

Photoshop isnt the best tool for creating websites as its designed for editing images.

If your new to website design then i would reccomend getting something like Dreamweaver as it has a lot of built in tools to help you with your website.

I hope this helps
 
all you need is notepad. once you have cracked that, something like dreamweaver
 
The best thing to do before you even start to think about a website is to work out what you want its purpose to be, the target audience and also write down roughly what you want to say and a layout. It's so much easier to build a website when you have something in mind than creating pages as you go along and hope it all comes together.

The other option would be to search for a free template that suits your requrements and customise it.

Have you got as far as getting a domain name / hosting?
 
johnsy said:
The best thing to do before you even start to think about a website is to work out what you want its purpose to be, the target audience and also write down roughly what you want to say and a layout. It's so much easier to build a website when you have something in mind than creating pages as you go along and hope it all comes together.

The other option would be to search for a free template that suits your requrements and customise it.

Have you got as far as getting a domain name / hosting?
Click to expand...

This is all good advice. I got this book from amazon (http://www.amazon.co.uk/Essential-Guide-HTML-Design-Essentials/dp/1590599071/ref=) and learned all the basics of css and html. Very good book, goes through everything thoroughly and has lots of examples and exercises to learn from. I programmed all my site in notepad, not ideal but at the end of the day any text editor will do.

If you can, write all the content and do all the design before you write a single line of code. As already stated, its much easier to code once you have the idea drawn out, and it takes a lot less time as you can design the barebones of the whole site and then make changes to the individual pages.

Get your domain name and hosting sorted, i used tsohost after recommendations on here and found them to be great, no probs at all so far and very cheap.
 
all very sensible advice, the 'bar' to starting website development has gone up substantially over the last 5 years. Once html was all you needed, but now you really must understand CSS so you can keep content and presentation separate.
Get the basics right with a text editor first - if you are on a pc look out notepad++ and if you are on a mac get smultron, both are free but do really good highlighting of language constructs. Get the basics of html tags and css first, which is not as easy as it sounds. Once you can do that experiment with php mysql and javascript - don't try and run before time. Sign up for an evening class at your local college. Don't spend any money on expensive software - use the open source versions.
 
Sophie, if I was you I really wouldn't bother learning HTML and CSS unless this is something you really want to get into. If it is then my recommendation would be to invest in Dreamweaver.

If you are simply wanting to learn this to build one site, I wouldn't bother. It will take you ages to learn skills you probably don't need.

My advice would be to use a free or minimul cost service. I know a lot of my friend use click pic (http://www.clikpic.com) which is around £30 per year. This will be much easier to get up and running, and is cheaper compared to Dreamweaver + Books + Hosting Costs.

Good luck anyway!
 
tpd said:
Sophie, if I was you I really wouldn't bother learning HTML and CSS unless this is something you really want to get into. If it is then my recommendation would be to invest in Dreamweaver.

If you are simply wanting to learn this to build one site, I wouldn't bother. It will take you ages to learn skills you probably don't need.

My advice would be to use a free or minimul cost service. I know a lot of my friend use click pic (http://www.clikpic.com) which is around £30 per year. This will be much easier to get up and running, and is cheaper compared to Dreamweaver + Books + Hosting Costs.

Good luck anyway!
Click to expand...

I'd agree, if you want to build sites for a living or even as a hobby then learn HTML & CSS, however if all you want is a site then as tpd suggests there are many ways to go about getting a decent site without any coding knowledge.

Good luck!
 
There are various site building packages avalible fro free to hundreds.
design packages come in tow flavours

Content Management Systems (the structure of the site is managed by the software Ie Layout is limited

html type the designer controls look and feel of the site as well as the content

joomla (CMS) free (never used it myself)
serif webplus (html Type/CMS) a free version (very good for the money)
Serif webplus x4 £70 (html Type/CMS) (a very competent product , and easy to use)
Dreameaver £400-£600 (html Type) (the best but not designed for 1st time designers)

there are other packages out there but i have not tried them

just find one that you are comfortable using but keep an open mind on what others are capable of. ands dont be afried of mix and matching the packages

Cheers Steve
 
Denyerec said:
I wonder whether I live on a different planet. I see many recommendations for Dreamweaver, yet in 6 years of web development have never once managed to figure out its confusing mess of dialogs and output code...
Click to expand...

I think Dreamweaver will always get slated by developers but for for a lot of people (like designers and those of us that don't see php/asp/html etc as our first language) it can be helpful.

I've been using it on and off for over 10 years (as a designer, not a coder) and my technical guys always have a go! :D The code might need cleaning up from time to time but it still works well out of the box.
 
hi all

Whilst it is not designed to design quick sites , i has a large user base,.
to get help and advice on the web, it also is the most veristile and is only limit by your imaginaion and knowlege of dreamwaver

it also links to many other web design tools

Cheers Steve
 
Place like this help with templates although there will be many sites that look similar you can use as a good base to adapt your ideas

http://www.free-css.com/free-css-templates/page1.php

get one, and start messing with the code if it fails, download again and try again.

As said above if you are only doing for 1 site then it maybe long winded but if you have the time and effort then do so.

there are books out there but give us a nod first i may have a pdf version for you to browse at.

Another thumbs up for w3schools.
 
Why not get some hosting sorted out and then install Wordpress or any other contact management system, there are plenty of free templates about and with Wordpress you can have a site up and running a lot quicker than it would take you to learn html & CSS.


Cheers
Ian
 
have a look at site that are of the same type as you want to create. make a list of things you like and dislike about the sites. it is most important you have a clear view of what you want it to look like.

in saying this if you then try it and it doesn`t work don`t be afried of changing you mind.

Cheers Steve
 
Denyerec said:
I wonder whether I live on a different planet. I see many recommendations for Dreamweaver, yet in 6 years of web development have never once managed to figure out its confusing mess of dialogs and output code...
Click to expand...

I've never been able to understand the number of people that fork over £400+ for something to design a hobby website.

:shrug:
 
dreamweaver is a pro tool , i quite agree that most poeple wont need it.

i would say that most poeple would be fine with serif products or the free offerings.

the difference seems to be the level of support you get. Free products tend to be limited support (apart from users), this is a horrible generalisation and is not meant to say that all free stuff is not supported.

Serif webplus(free) and webplus x4 (approx £70) are commerial products and have very good tech support.

Dreamweaver has the support you would expect from a pro program and is probably overkill for most web sites.

finallly if you use dreamweaver at work , it is difficlt to adapt to using the other products.

Cheers Steve
 
Denyerec said:
I wonder whether I live on a different planet. I see many recommendations for Dreamweaver, yet in 6 years of web development have never once managed to figure out its confusing mess of dialogs and output code...
Click to expand...

Depends how you use it - makes complete sense to me - WYSIWYG in one screen and source code on the other. The HTML is pretty neat too, and not particularly messy or abstract

for me, most of the time, most of the dialouge boxes are just closed

Weaker coders, who rely only on the WYSIWYG side, will struggle with dreamweaver. At the end of the day, it is a tool, that needs to be underpinned with knowledge, organisation and skill

__

On a different note..

I do find that increasingly people want to get to stage 10, skipping stages 1-9. Same with photography, and website design. Essentially unless the OP is prepared to invest a lot of time and effort into learning HTML, CSS, SEO, Javascript properly, I cant see how they can produce a modern decent looking site without help or a template that looks like all the others
 
poeple do want instant results , as richard Said. planning and testing ideas is essential to making a good site. A design should be able to handle change and expansion with the minimal work possible.

WYSIWYG is good for getting an idea of how the layout looks
HTML code is more efficient and more powerful (it may take longer to get it to look right)

Cheers Steve
 
HTML, CSS, Java etc can be a helluva lot to swallow and master. If your not too fussed about learning them try www.moonfruit.com . Its flash based and has a fantastic interface, if you can use MS word etc then youll pick this up fast.

Ive managed to produce this with it. http://www.mmcphotos.moonfruit.com/

(its still not complete but it should give you an idea of what can be accomplished)

Good luck, if you need any advice let me know.
 
that site look very impressive it go to show what can be achieved.

the main advantages html based designers

1) are that they can generally be move between html based web design programs.

2) they can grow with the design (ie the more you learn)


the content management systems can only be transfered to the same content management system (some of the page details are held on the cms suplier system host. they also are dpendant on developers creating addons to increase versatility.

Cheers Steve
 
Ian_H said:
Why not get some hosting sorted out and then install Wordpress or any other contact management system, there are plenty of free templates about and with Wordpress you can have a site up and running a lot quicker than it would take you to learn html & CSS.


Cheers
Ian
Click to expand...

Ian makes a good point - in fact you could set yourself up on Google or Wordpress.com with a blog and be away in no time. If, however, you want to build something yourself, then with respect to learning HTML, CSS etc, I don't think there are any shortcuts.
W3Schools was mentioned. This is an excellent resource for starting to learn most if not all of the skills required to build a functional site.

I would also investigate implementing a web server on a PC, Mac or Linux box. Something like XAMMP on Windows or Mac, or just install apache on a Linux box. This way you can develop everything locally and upload it once you're happy with it.

As far as development tools are concerned - a simple text editor is OK, but something that highlights the syntax and any errors is worth having. I use Eclipse, which may be overkill for 'just' HTML and CSS,but a real boon if/when you want to start to run PHP.

Firefox supports a suite of development tools which enable you to check your HTML /CSS syntax, highlight CSS etc. This is worth doing to make sure that the code you write is compliant with the HTML and CSS specifications.

All of the things I have mentioned here are open source and thus free to download and use.

Time spent thinking about the design of the site - by this I don't mean the layout, but how the site is structured logically is time well spent (in other words, a site map). This will have a bearing on where components such as images, css files and so forth are stored. It will reduce the risk of having to rework the site as and when things develop.

FWIW I'm starting to think about redesigning my site for the third (or is it fourth?) time. This time it will be built using the Zend PHP framework, though this is probably a bit hard-core for a first site! It uses a design model called MVC or Model View Controller, which means that database (model), layout (view) and logic (controller) are separated. The best thing about it is that most, if not all of the things that a site needs are available in the framework.
 
kiasdad said:
I would also investigate implementing a web server on a PC, Mac or Linux box. Something like XAMMP on Windows or Mac, or just install apache on a Linux box. This way you can develop everything locally and upload it once you're happy with it.
Click to expand...

Hmm, the OP admitted to "not having a clue what she is doing" so I think configuring apache is probably going be asking a bit much :eek:
 
starting with the content, and on paper design is pretty much a must... something that needs to be covered off well before considering what technologies/server/platform/language is needed

Content / on paper design, ought to be pretty easy for creative photographers
 
HTML is being replaced by XHTML which is almost the same but has less "wiggle room" for wrong coding.

You can use http://validator.w3.org/ to check your coding but be aware that trying to sort out wrong code can be very frustrating if you are a beginner.

If you do decide to go the learn it yourself route then XHTML is definitely the way to go along with CSS and PHP.

However I would avoid Dreamweaver as, apart from the price, it produces very bloated code and is definitely not suited for the beginner.
 
petersmart said:
HTML is being replaced by XHTML which is almost the same but has less "wiggle room" for wrong coding.

You can use http://validator.w3.org/ to check your coding but be aware that trying to sort out wrong code can be very frustrating if you are a beginner.

If you do decide to go the learn it yourself route then XHTML is definitely the way to go along with CSS and PHP.

However I would avoid Dreamweaver as, apart from the price, it produces very bloated code and is definitely not suited for the beginner.
Click to expand...

I think an understanding of the differences between HTML and XHTML is needed before qualifying this comment... Internet Explorer currently doesn't support XHTML

Infact there first needs to be an understanding of the difference between flat HTML code as opposed to HTML that is dynamically altered on the client machine using Java Script... and then HTML and Javascript that is served up by a server - generated dynamically by a powerful logical code held on a server (normally PHP)

Then there needs to be an understanding of how data from the browser,and a database on the server can interact with the code and the user

Then and only then is the whole XML / XHTML thing even slightly relevant

The issue here is that just because a new coding/language technology is available, it doesn't mean it is relevant, or should be used on all sites

Regardless of all new advances in coding, at the moment, if you want to serve a page, using any of the advanced techniques, you still need to understand the basics. This forum page is essentially a SIMPLE HTML page, however, the technology involved in dynamically delivering the page includes PHP, CSS, Javascript. On top of just serving this page, the user "session" needs managing, the server needs securing etc. etc. The usage of XML, JS, PHP, SQL, XHTML only has the purpose of delivering the end result - simple code that is rendered by a browser. No point in learning algebra, before you understand what numbers are

On the subject of dreamweavers bloated code, i disagree. Having seen the code generated by Frontpage, Netobjects fusion & Serif etc.. the code generated by Dreamweaver is very good. Besides that, half of the dreamweaver interface is aimed at you editing the code yourself
 
Back to the OP

1. get your self a book (dummies or Sams) on learning basic HTML. Do the exercises in the the book from cover to cover. learn the basics, and dont move onto the next chapter till you truly understand the one you are on
2. get the CSS for dummies book, and work through that

You will now have the skills and knowledge to make a decent looking static HTML site, all you need next is the creativity

Want user interaction? progress to step 3

3. get a javascript for dummies / sams book, and work through it very slowly. learn a bit about DHTML and when to use it

At this point you will be able to do slideshows, have fancy menusand edit any template you buy that isn't Flash/ PHP driven etc..

Want to do more than that, serve images or data?

4. Get a PHP and SQL book

At this point, you will have the additional skills to edit the functionality of a Joomla/ wordpress template

At this point, you will start to appreciate the difference between XHTML DHTML and HTML

***
Note just buying the book isnt enough, it is the starting point, the 100's of issues and questions that the process throws up still need answers. The internet is great for this
 
Richard King said:
I think an understanding of the differences between HTML and XHTML is needed before qualifying this comment... Internet Explorer currently doesn't support XHTML
Click to expand...

I'm not sure where you get this idea from as I visit plenty of sites coded in XHTML and IE has no problems with them.
 
onomatopoeia said:
Hmm, the OP admitted to "not having a clue what she is doing" so I think configuring apache is probably going be asking a bit much :eek:
Click to expand...

*sigh* Please read what I wrote - it says investigate.
Just because it's apache doesn't mean you're immediately into hardcore configuration. A default configuration would be good enough for web development, especially if installed as part of a pre-packaged suite such as XAMMP. One can safely assume that there will be no need for bells and whistles.

Since the software costs nothing, enables one to create the site and test it fully in a real web server environment I think it's worthwhile having a go.

Finally, there are some good books out there - the SAMS range of 'Learn XYZ in 24 hours' is a good start. Other excellent titles are available from Apress and finally don't forget the 'for dummys' range of books.

This thread has had excellent replies and good advice. Basically, whilst it doesn't seem straightforward at first, it's a bit like eating an elephant. One slice at a time. If you keep it simple, by which I mean stick to (x)HTML and CSS to start with, use some decent tools (which don't have to cost anything) and make some effort to learn about the various components then you will be fine.

Don't be put off. You do not have to be geek to learn this stuff. Honestly.
 
petersmart said:
I'm not sure where you get this idea from as I visit plenty of sites coded in XHTML and IE has no problems with them.
Click to expand...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/XHTML#Adoption

What you are refering to is that the sites are only using the syntax of XHTML instead of the syntax of HTML, however, are these sites using the added functionality of XHTML? If the site is exactly the same in IE, and there hasnt been a conditional workaround, then they are not. In this case you are just comparing one dialect with another, because you are not leveraging any extra capability out of the markup language. Remember normally browsers are only asked to only interpret markup. For additional functions such as computing maths or parsing documents, you either need Javascript and scripting enabled, or a browser that supports the extended HTML markup

The only reason for using XHTML is you want it to do the additional things that HTML cant do. Because it is a slightly more complex language, essentiually the punctuation and syntax needs to be slightly stricter and slightly different. While most browsers do understand the new punctuation regime, and you can declare a site as XHTML, there is no point in using it if you didnt bother using any of the extra functionality it offers. Thats where IE falls over, it ignores the extra functiuonaity it offers

Read this, and scroll down to IE, to understand what I am going on about...
http://www.w3.org/People/mimasa/test/xhtml/media-types/results

While I think that extending HTML is a superb and useful idea, if it isn't supported by one of the most popular browsers, recommending that one learns to code in it pretty pointless. Especially as the conventioal method of using javascript currently is supported in all the mainstream browsers
 
Hi there well for a start ignore most of the complicated replies as they will not help you by getting into advanced arguments over HTML or XHTML or PHP.

You asked
what programs do you need for starting html websites?
Click to expand...

Well you can code with notepad but that means learning HTMl and let us not get into that for someone that just wants to learn how to setup a simple site.

However, there are what is termed 'WYSWYG' (what you see is what you get) programs such as Microsoft Frontpage or Dreamweaver. Any earlier version will do and there are lots of easy tutorials on the net to get you started. Just try google for help.

You also asked
is photoshop any good for it?
Click to expand...

Well not really, yes for advanced web desingers but not really best tool for novices.

to be honest i don't have a clue on what i'm doing,
Click to expand...

Don't worry about it we all learned at one point or another.

Best thing though like others suggest here is maybe setup a 'wordpress' blog to start with now these do not need to appear like blogs you can add photo pages with galleries some good advice on here in one rely about that.

However, if you are adamant about setting up your own site, then you need webspace from a host. These come in packages and can include you purchasing an domain (for example, www.mysite.com). The benefit of this is that if you choose wisely some of the hosting packages out there include website building software.

Hope this helps and it less confusing.
 
GaryFife said:
Best thing though like others suggest here is maybe setup a 'wordpress' blog to start with now these do not need to appear like blogs you can add photo pages with galleries some good advice on here in one rely about that.
Click to expand...
:agree:

Ignore all this HTML/XHTML/CSS discussion above and set up something easy to use - Wordpress is a great starting point. From there you can learn how to do customisations if you want, or you can just get on with using it. Whatever you prefer :)
 
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