Nikon D700 + 24-70mm F2.8

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cloudhunter

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Hi,

Been told that when using the nikon 24-70mm f2.8 lens on the d700 casts a shadow when using the onboard flash

Is this true , if so why would they make sucvh a fault?

Also is it just the nikon 24-70 or would a sigma do the same?
 
It is not a fault if the camera or the lens, it is the angle, because the lens is so big it just gets in the way and casts a shadow. It is worse with the hood on...!!!

Only when you care close up to stuff though if you are further away the shadow is not so bad..!
 
If your investing that much in kit (D700 + 24-70mm) it would make a lot of sense to spend a little extra on an external flash, even if its just an SB400/600. Or were you hoping for a more mobile setup without having to carry the flash extra?
 
Hi,

I would probably use an external flash anyway but would you be able to disable the internal flash for good?
 
I also get a 'shadow' when using the onboard flash. After buying and using an SB-600 that has all but stopped happening (unless I am too close to the subject)
 
crashtestmac said:
It is not a fault if the camera or the lens, it is the angle, because the lens is so big it just gets in the way and casts a shadow. It is worse with the hood on...!!!

Only when you care close up to stuff though if you are further away the shadow is not so bad..!
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So would say a sigma f2.8 24-70 do the same as it looks smaller
 
viper_biker said:
I also get a 'shadow' when using the onboard flash. After buying and using an SB-600 that has all but stopped happening (unless I am too close to the subject)
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So it does still happen then?

WHy would nikon drop a bo****k like that?
 
cloudhunter said:
So it does still happen then?

WHy would nikon drop a bo****k like that?
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Nikon haven't dropped anything with this one. The lens is big and casts a sadow from the onboard flash. Its far from the only lens cobmination to do this. I think the only questionable decision Nikon made with the onboard flash for the D700 was to leave it there in the first place

Hugh
 
I would image that canon would have the same problem as the lens is massive, that is why it gets in the way, i have had the same problem with my 18-200 as well so it is not just this one lens..!
 
so when a pic is taken and you have the shadow , how hard is it to get rid of it and does it degrade the quality?
 
cloudhunter said:
so when a pic is taken and you have the shadow , how hard is it to get rid of it and does it degrade the quality?
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yes, quite hard and you'll still have all the other issues created by pop up flash. If you're planning on spending £3k+ on a set-up then an external flash and time learning to use it would seem a sensible investment.

Hugh
 
cloudhunter said:
so when a pic is taken and you have the shadow , how hard is it to get rid of it and does it degrade the quality?
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I think if you are that worried about the shadow then the D700 is not the right camera for you.
 
cloudhunter said:
Been told that when using the nikon 24-70mm f2.8 lens on the d700 casts a shadow when using the onboard flash

Is this true , if so why would they make sucvh a fault?
Click to expand...

What leads you to believe the on-board flash should not cast a shadow when using this lens?
 
Sorry guys but you are all missing the point here....

It is not a fault on the D700 it is across the range, my d70s had it my d80 has it and my d300 has it.....

The lens gets in the way because of its length it is not a fault with the camera or lens it is the combination of the 2 that causes the problem.

As said above if you get an sb600/800/900 the flash is higher up and does not get in the way to cast the shadow.
 
A quick web search bings up this...

lensShadow.jpg


Same problem with a lens getting in the way of the onboard flash but this is a nikon coolpix little camera not a dslr...!
 
_DSC1404.jpg


It does it on the D300 as well, as you can see above with the 24-70mm, I think the hood was on to keep out the rain. I only tried it on this shot out of desperation for a bit more light.

The onboard flash on this level of camera is only there for snapshots, frankly they should bin it and shave 50 quid off the camera body price;)

Don't ask about the picture it's a long story!
 
crashtestmac said:
Sorry guys but you are all missing the point here....

It is not a fault on the D700 it is across the range, my d70s had it my d80 has it and my d300 has it.....

The lens gets in the way because of its length it is not a fault with the camera or lens it is the combination of the 2 that causes the problem.

As said above if you get an sb600/800/900 the flash is higher up and does not get in the way to cast the shadow.
Click to expand...

not sure its a fault at all or a problem
 
crashtestmac said:
The lens gets in the way because of its length it is not a fault with the camera or lens it is the combination of the 2 that causes the problem.

As said above if you get an sb600/800/900 the flash is higher up and does not get in the way to cast the shadow.
Click to expand...

I think most of us in this thread already appreciate this hence why we're questioning the OP's expectations of being able to use the on-board flash with this particular lens.
 
treeman said:
_DSC1404.jpg


It does it on the D300 as well, as you can see above with the 24-70mm, I think the hood was on to keep out the rain. I only tried it on this shot out of desperation for a bit more light.

The onboard flash on this level of camera is only there for snapshots, frankly they should bin it and shave 50 quid off the camera body price;)

Don't ask about the picture it's a long story!
Click to expand...


exactly, theres a reason the pro cameras dont have in built flashes...
most were a bit suprised when the d700 had one. if you're using top end glass you really shouldnt be using the inbuilt flash anyway, so the shadowing should be a problem anyone normally encounters.
 
I don't see what all the confusion is about. The on-board flash is fixed in a low position very near to the lens mount. It will cause a shadow to be cast, if the lens is long enough to fall within the path of the light from the flash.

Have Nikon actually stated that the on-board flash is suited for working with the 24-70?
 
I think that the OP does not understand why this is happening because it would obviously also happen with nikon version of the lens as they are the same size, if you take of the lens hood it will reduce it happening but it will still happen it is not just this lens that does it.

As stated if you are spending that much on a camera and lens get an external flash or think about getting the d300 and then having the cash to spend on the camera and flash and other lenses.
 
Jamieconverge said:
exactly, theres a reason the pro cameras dont have in built flashes...
most were a bit suprised when the d700 had one. if you're using top end glass you really shouldnt be using the inbuilt flash anyway, so the shadowing should be a problem anyone normally encounters.
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Built-in flash can be useful to some people. If your external flash is broke or you accidentally left it behind and it's pitch black then having on-board flash can be better than having no flash.

If you don't want to use the on-board flash then simply don't. Why is it an issue that the D700 has one built in?
 
That combination of body and lens is fantastic, for me the shadow is a minor niggle cured by using an external flashgun.
 
not an issue - but it was a surprise Nikon left it in. I don't know of any d700 owners who use onboard flash (except as a controller) routinely

Hugh
 
crashtestmac said:
Sorry guys but you are all missing the point here....

It is not a fault on the D700 it is across the range, my d70s had it my d80 has it and my d300 has it.....

The lens gets in the way because of its length it is not a fault with the camera or lens it is the combination of the 2 that causes the problem.

As said above if you get an sb600/800/900 the flash is higher up and does not get in the way to cast the shadow.
Click to expand...

No, I think you are missing the point. Are you suggesting that Nikon (and Canon) should sacrifice the optical quality of a lens so that it can be used with an on-board flash?
 
I consider the on-board flash to be a bonus! I don't use it regularly as I have a SB-900, but there was one occasion recently when I didn't have it to hand and the on-board flash really helped me out.
 
boyfalldown said:
I don't know of any d700 owners who use onboard flash (except as a controller) routinely
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I think you have hit the nail on the head, quite possibly the only reason Nikon left it in. If you absolutely have to use the onboard flash (and you really shouldn't) the problem should be lessened at the end of the focal range (possibly 50-70mm) as it may just not catch the bottom of the shadow. This is certainly what happens with my Sigma 24-70mm (although part of it will also be that the front element sticks out further at the wider end of the zoom range).

To sum up, not a problem or fault with the Nikon at all and likely to happen using pop-up flash with any Pro lens on any system.
 
inkiboo said:
No, I think you are missing the point. Are you suggesting that Nikon (and Canon) should sacrifice the optical quality of a lens so that it can be used with an on-board flash?
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No, (s)he says,

crashtestmac said:
The lens gets in the way because of its length it is not a fault with the camera or lens it is the combination of the 2 that causes the problem.
Click to expand...
 
cloudhunter said:
Hi,

I would probably use an external flash anyway but would you be able to disable the internal flash for good?
Click to expand...

not too sure what you mean by this. My onboard flash is automatically off unless I want it on in all modes but Auto on my D90 and I doubt the D700 even has that (and if it has it should rarely, if ever, be used)
 
This is NOT Nikon's fault. It's basic physics. Light travels in straight lines. To get the onboard flash high enough to "miss" the front of the lens is impossible without some sort of telescoping mount.

Think about it, the height of the onboard flash, the light travels in straight lines, so the bottom of the picture will be shaded.

The onboard flash is really only for snapshots and a little fill in.
 
Yeah, missed that use :bonk::bonk::bonk:

Have the SU-800 myself - no internal flash on either my cameras.
 
ShawWellPete said:
Or to trigger off camera flashes. The main reason, I'm sure, Nikon left it on.
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I would have liked to have had a distinct IR transmitter on the D700 body for this purpose rather than having to use a flash blocker to exclude the visible light.
 
I picked up the SG-3 IR flash blocker for a few pounds from WHE. I only use the onboard flash as a controller for an external flash gun.
 
sdb123 said:
I picked up the SG-3 IR flash blocker for a few pounds from WHE. I only use the onboard flash as a controller for an external flash gun.
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I also use the SG-31R, but I would have preferred a more elegant solution which can be activated quicker when required.

Maybe even a sticky film which could be stuck onto the flash head? I've read about people coming up with their own DIY solutions such as using the leader from a roll of exposed film, but I've not tried it myself.
 
DigitalRelish said:
I also use the SG-31R, but I would have preferred a more elegant solution which can be activated quicker when required.

Maybe even a sticky film which could be stuck onto the flash head? I've read about people coming up with their own DIY solutions such as using the leader from a roll of exposed film, but I've not tried it myself.
Click to expand...

I've read about people using a film negative stuck across the flash....not tried it myself.

While the Nikon accessory solution isn't elegant it does seem to stop the subjects blinking when the commander is fired. :)
 
On D700 on camera flash is intended mostly as a commander unit. Apart from a fill-in function at -2EV power I have never used one on my cameras (the brand is irrelevant here). SB-900 pointed at the right direction (bounce, multiple flashes, etc) will solve all your problems.
 
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