Procamerashop.co.uk - anyone recommend?

DrRusty said:
Check the distance selling regulations. If you return something under DSR then the whole amount you paid must be returned (you would cover return postage costs). Although DSR allows for return within 7 days and some companies offer 14 days return policy, so it might depend on when you returned it.
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DSRs only apply to UK purchases AFAIK.


Heather
 
Tigger.ufo said:
DSRs only apply to UK purchases AFAIK.


Heather
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correctamundo - although trying to exercise your rights under DSR might work if they want to maintain that they are based in sussex / carlisle
 
I ordered a Lumix 12-35mm from ProCameraShop a few months ago and paid via Bank Transfer.
The Bank account I transferred to was a UK HSBC account based in a Kingston Upon Thames branch.
So, technically you are making payment to a UK company and should be covered by DSR.

I still don't understand the statement on the website about customs/taxes etc - since both my purchases were shipped from a UK address by a UK based courier for next day delivery...So, how on earth can customs get involved in such a transaction???

With regards whether they are based in the UK or not - they must have some staff here in the UK in order to pack up the items etc - there was no sign of any import / international shipping labels on the packages I received.
Also, the two times I rang their helpline, the guys I spoke to sounded English to me - no hint of a off shored accent...
 
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i know they are a hk based company but i returned my camera to a uk warehouse for my refund and the box was factory sealed with a uk plug and uk/european instructions
 
mini0ne said:
i know they are a hk based company but i returned my camera to a uk warehouse for my refund and the box was factory sealed with a uk plug and uk/european instructions
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Just out of interest, was there a UK/EU manufacturers warranty card included?
 
mini0ne said:
ProCameraShop Return
International Logistics Group
C/O Smart Choice
Unit 2D Gatwick Gate Ind. Est.
Lowfield heath, Crawley
RH11 0TG
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According to google that address is a mail handling service ie like a post office box but for parcels - its also "home" to , radial labs, derma lift, outsourced fulfiment services, lifestyle alerts, and various other people

In short its an international logistics group handling facility (confirmed by street view), where they sort parcels and send them on to their final destination - what it doent appear to be is anyone's (other than ILGs) warehouse.
 
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mini0ne said:
ProCameraShop Return
International Logistics Group
C/O Smart Choice
Unit 2D Gatwick Gate Ind. Est.
Lowfield heath, Crawley
RH11 0TG
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LOL

So their "warehouse" is just a collection point at a couriers office :shake:

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Click to expand...
 
doesnt really matter what it is i sent it got my refund they were excellent throughout more than can be said for quite a few uk retailers ive used

if i can buy it for much cheaper than a regular uk retailer i will

dont think there is that great a discount at moment especially when you factor in promotions

i bought my om-d from srs as it worked out a great deal with the freebies

i use wex and mpb quite a bit
 
I ended up going with Cliftoncameras.co.uk
5D Mark III on the way with 85 F1.2 II
 
mini0ne said:
doesnt really matter what it is i sent it got my refund they were excellent throughout more than can be said for quite a few uk retailers ive used

if i can buy it for much cheaper than a regular uk retailer i will

dont think there is that great a discount at moment especially when you factor in promotions

i bought my om-d from srs as it worked out a great deal with the freebies

i use wex and mpb quite a bit
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I am glad to hear about your refund going smoothly. I have bought two items from ProCameraShop earlier in the year but was a bit nervous about future purchases after reading some negative comments from a few posters on here - particularly about follow up service.
Like yourself I think I will continue to use them when they are considerably cheaper than UK sellers - I pay enough flipping tax!
 
harry66 said:
I am glad to hear about your refund going smoothly. I have bought two items from ProCameraShop earlier in the year but was a bit nervous about future purchases after reading some negative comments from a few posters on here - particularly about follow up service.
Like yourself I think I will continue to use them when they are considerably cheaper than UK sellers - I pay enough flipping tax!
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I fully understand anyone trying to save money, we all do it where possible, that's sensible (& human nature really)

But the more people that buy stuff which avoids certain taxes, the less our Govt gets in revenue, which in turn leads ..... to more/higher taxes.
It also costs jobs in our country & helps foreign economies.

It's a vicious circle really.

A bit like, the less that folk drink or smoke, the more everyone else has to cough up (excuse the pun :D )

I'm not having a pop at anyone btw, just saying as I see it.
 
I agree but the thing that agravates me is that prices (on many things not just cameras) are so high in the UK that its possible to buy from abroad and pay Vat and import tax but still get a lower than uk price

trouble is virtually no importer offers that as clearly many of them feel they can make more money by not paying all the appropriate charges on import
 
OldCarlos said:
I fully understand anyone trying to save money, we all do it where possible, that's sensible (& human nature really)

But the more people that buy stuff which avoids certain taxes, the less our Govt gets in revenue, which in turn leads ..... to more/higher taxes.
It also costs jobs in our country & helps foreign economies.

It's a vicious circle really.

A bit like, the less that folk drink or smoke, the more everyone else has to cough up (excuse the pun :D )

I'm not having a pop at anyone btw, just saying as I see it.
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Carl - don't suppose you work for HMRC do you?:D

I can sense from your previous posts that you really, really don't like import websites and in particular ProCamera...but the tax avoidance argument is a bit weak dont you think?

As a higher rate tax payer with VAT and fuel duty factored in, I am probably paying close to 50% of my salary in taxes. And I have spent more in-store at CameraWorld / Mathers etc then I will ever spend on HK imports.

A few people buying saving a few pounds on VAT on a lens is not going mess up our economy or cost jobs. The reality is if I had to pay the UK prices of £950 for my recent lens or £350 for my camera I definitely would have not bothered. The £300 saving on the lens and £100 saving on camera made them affordable/justifiable after selling my old camera and lenses.

I suspect all those thousands of Amazon customers are probably costing the economy more loss of tax than all the HK websites put together. Just like all those greedy corporations paying minimal or zero tax we keep hearing about.
 
harry66 said:
I suspect all those thousands of Amazon customers are probably costing the economy more loss of tax than all the HK websites put together. Just like all those greedy corporations paying minimal or zero tax we keep hearing about.
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you know that thing parents used to say about 'two wrongs not making a right'

its not really a defence to charges of tax evasion/ conspiring to evade tax that lots of other people are doing it too

in straightened times of austerity and public cuts all tax evasion needs to be stamped on - including both the examples you mention and companies importing without paying appropriate tax
 
lol Harry, no I don't. :LOL:

Hey man I don't disagree with you about the UK tax system! :bang:

I know where you're coming from & like I said, I don't blame anyone/individual for buying this way, but even though amaz0n will far outstrip all the other suppliers for revenue loss, every single item on it's own adds up to an absolute fortune as a whole.

We all play a small part in a massive problem. ;)
 
I agree with you fully but I the point I was trying to make is that I don't recall people on this forum saying we should boycott Amazon because of their tax avoidance - so using tax avoidance as a reason for not importing from ProCameraShop is a bit bleurgh...

Until recently most of my online purchases were from Amazon - it was my default go to site for almost anything - but now, when I can get something locally or from another UK online website without paying too much extra I have started using them e.g. bought a book from Foyles last week, CDs from HMV (yes showing my age) and some bike stuff from a Halfords store - even though all the items were cheaper on Amazon!
 
harry66 said:
I agree with you fully but I the point I was trying to make is that I don't recall people on this forum saying we should boycott Amazon because of their tax avoidance - so using tax avoidance as a reason for not importing from ProCameraShop is a bit bleurgh...
!
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Difference is amazon are alledgely guilty of tax avoidance (ie using a loophole in the law to avoid paying tax ) which is legal - many grey importers (and I'm not saying PCS definitely fall into this category) are guilty of tax evasion (ie mislabbeling or otherwise smuggling products to evade import duty and Vat) which is illegal.
 
Harry, I DID boycott amaz0n!!!!


Well, more acurately, I never used them to start with. ;) (i'm showing MY age now :crying: )

I firmly believe in the `use it, or lose it` philosophy and like yourself support local businesses as much as possible, but occasionally non-local, but that only extends to national even if I have to pay more.

All imho :cool:
 
Pete, even though I don't like tax-avoidance (govt approved, or not) i'm in agreement on tax-evasion, it really annoys me.....especially when some sellers try to disguise the fact from unsuspecting buyers! (again no seller in particular)
 
I just blame SWMBO - it would have been easier to justify a £950 lens otherwise. :love:
 
OldCarlos said:
Harry, I DID boycott amaz0n!!!!


Well, more acurately, I never used them to start with. ;) (i'm showing MY age now :crying: )

I firmly believe in the `use it, or lose it` philosophy and like yourself support local businesses as much as possible, but occasionally non-local, but that only extends to national even if I have to pay more.

All imho :cool:
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if you live in a rural or semi rural area like me you dont get to use local suppliers as they seem to think you are a captive buyer the only local camera shop is extortionate in its pricing ive never bought a single thing from them

i use amazon for there price and service as i do any supplier i dont always go for cheapest
 
Duncan, I too live on the outskirts of nowhere :LOL: but do have the time to drive to our nearest town, but I know others don't.

btw, spent a fair bit of time in a pub, Disneys Old Thatched cottage? in Ilfracombe many years ago, also The Red Barn cafe, further along the beach.
 
i can see the thatch from my house i go there a lot

red barn is woolacombe :)
 
Its not that far to Mifsuds (okay its on the wrong shore but its a nice day trip - particularly if you tie in a trip to living coats or paignton) - that aside there are loads of uk based online retailers / dealers with an online presence , so living in the sticks doesnt really justfy having to go grey

( I buy most of my kit from MPB )
 
i havent been to mifsuds yet will get there we go to zoo and living coasts
barstaple is only town near me and if its not there its a trip to exeter bristol or plymouth :(
i find online easier
i mainly use wex for new or mpb for used stuff
amazon when i have vouchers
 
Oh aye, Woolacombe, that was it, surfers paradise. Crikey 1st time was nearly 40 yrs ago. Lovely part of the world. :cool:

I'd used Mifsuds before, then last Summer stayed in Brixham so got chance to call in. Proper Aladdin's cave & great staff.

I tend to use WEX mainly, but also Jessops in the past, if I can't get something locally.
 
Just to bring this thread up-to-date: I've just made a third purchase from Procamerashop (a Canon 600EX) and there were no problems. I paid by bank transfer to get the 3% discount and paid less than what DigitalRev wanted. Ordered late Thursday afternoon and delivered Monday morning with no risk of UPS wanting to collect any import charges.

No connection other than that of a satisfied customer who has more than one post on TP!
 
digital said:
I paid by bank transfer to get the 3% discount
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Leaving aside the legality and morality (they've been well debated in this thread).

I am amazed by the trust you (and others) put into an unknown person many thousands of miles away in Hong Kong for a relatively small discount.
 
Dave1 said:
Leaving aside the legality and morality (they've been well debated in this thread).
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They have been well debated but it seems that there has to be a reference to them at any and every opportunity...

Dave1 said:
I am amazed by the trust you (and others) put into an unknown person many thousands of miles away in Hong Kong for a relatively small discount.
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For all three of my orders over the last couple or three years I have made a phone call to a UK number and spoken to someone in the UK. Only for the second and third did I use the direct transfer for the 3% discount. All three orders were dispatched from within the UK.

You don't have to order from 'an unknown person many thousands of miles away in Hong Kong' to be taken for a ride. There are many purchases which I, and others, make every day which involve trust. The vast majority go well, some don't. Do your research and you can cut the risks.
 
digital said:
For all three of my orders over the last couple or three years I have made a phone call to a UK number and spoken to someone in the UK.
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How did you confirm the call terminated in the UK? Both 0845 and 01/02 numbers can be used with VOIP diverts to anywhere in the world.

There are companies that will sell you a 01xx or 02xx number for the sole purpose of appearing to be a normal UK number.

digital said:
You don't have to order from 'an unknown person many thousands of miles away in Hong Kong' to be taken for a ride. There are many purchases which I, and others, make every day which involve trust. The vast majority go well, some don't. Do your research and you can cut the risks.
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Quite right, but the likelihood of a problem is significantly higher, and sending the money by bank transfer removes any extra protections offered by paying with a credit card,Google Wallet or Paypal.
 
Your response says nothing I didn't know.

I take a view on where and how I make my purchases based on experience and research. If you want to take a different route, fine.
 
digital said:
Your response says nothing I didn't know.

I take a view on where and how I make my purchases based on experience and research. If you want to take a different route, fine.
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If I'm honest, I wasn't trying to educate you, my original post was a statement, not a question.

It wasn't a personal comment only directed at you, but at all the people who will blissfully send money off to an unknown person with absolutely no chance of a clawback if something went wrong.

This isn't directed as a criticism of ProCameraShop, merely an observation of the extremely trusting nature of some people.
 
You may well have spoken to someone in the UK (although, as Dave said, you don't actually know for sure) P-shop had/have a serviced office in a Carlisle business park, but they aren't a UK company & don't have their own warehouse in the UK either.

tbh, their price is only £10 cheaper than DR, who have a decent customer service & reputation.I cringe at buyers who risk direct bank transfers....to anyone, let alone a Hong Kong supplier.
If everything goes well, that's fine, but how many times do we hear folk complaining when they get `stung` at some point.
Giving away protection for a few quid doesn't make sense to me, but each to their own I guess.
 
OldCarlos said:
tbh, their price is only £10 cheaper than DR, who have a decent customer service & reputation.I cringe at buyers who risk direct bank transfers....to anyone, let alone a Hong Kong supplier.
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Well as far my experience of ProCameraShop goes, they have decent customer service too. The only negative comments I have read are few and far between. You seem to ignore the number of positive comments posted on this forum.

And I cant imagine any company out there for whom you will fail to find at least a few reports of poor customer service. For example if you search for 'John Lewis poor customer service' you will get quite a few hits.

We recently had really poor service from Bosch for a new oven we bought. Took several emails and phone calls to get a satisfactory outcome. Now this is meant to be a premium manufacturer who prides themselves on providing excellent customer service. Even though the problem was eventually solved, my wife refuses to buy another Bosch product ever again.
 
Thing is though you didn't presumably pay Bosch by bank transfer for a 3% discount - had you done so they might well have told you to do one (well Bosch probably wouldn't - but some random HK trader might)

Also Bosch probably didn't avoid import taxes and VAT on your item
 
The `few` negative comments that remain on various sites & forums, will no doubt vanish the same as many others?
 
No I didn't pay for the Bosch oven via bank transfer - but at one point I did consider making a claim on my credit card if things did not get resolved. The bank transfer is not the sole reason stated on this forum for avoiding ProCamerashop - I was referring to Carl's reference to customer service etc.

I don't have problems saving a bit of Tax here or there. As a higher rate tax payer, I think I pay more than enough of my share and am sick of the government milking the working person and letting the huge corporates get away with paying minimal or zero taxes or even worse expecting the tax payer to subsidise the profits of corporates - e.g. the supermarkets paying sub-living wages to their staff who then have to claim topup benefits in order to make ends meet.

If all the muggins out there are perfectly happy to pay up-to 70% tax (income tax+NI+VAT) on some of their earnings that is their choice. If I can find a way of saving some tax I will do it. And dont get me started on Stamp Duty or even worse Inheritance tax! Aggghhh! I can't believe people on here are so keen on the tax man getting every single penny they are due!!
 
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