UPDATE: Brothers Wedding (done)

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Matt
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A couple of weeks ago my brother and his fiance asked me if i would be happy to be "the official" photographer for their wedding.
Simply put, i said no, and told them that they would get infinately better results from a pro who knows what they are doing and has the correct gear, insurance etc.
After a few days they asked me if i would reconsider because they had decided that they wouldnt be hiring a pro, and would only ask family and guests to send in their shots on a disc. They are both in good jobs and can easily afford a pro but have chosen not to, suggesting that it would mean more to them if i did it.

I have asked for a few days to think about it.
I am confident that i could get some decent candid shots etc but i am far from pro standard.

What would you do?
 
It depends, do you think you can manage their expectations sufficiently? Do they REALLY mean it when they say they'd be happy with whatever you did or are they expecting to get professional shots on the cheap?

If your camera broke on the day and you got nothing, would that be the start of a family feud or would they be relaxed about it?
 
Well they say they are only hoping for people to send them photos they take, surely yours will be better than what others shoot on a phone. Just go for it. You have nothing to lose and neither does he if he isn't having a pro anyway
 
Broric said:
It depends, do you think you can manage their expectations sufficiently? Do they REALLY mean it when they say they'd be happy with whatever you did or are they expecting to get professional shots on the cheap?

If your camera broke on the day and you got nothing, would that be the start of a family feud or would they be relaxed about it?
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I think id need to sit down with them and ask exactly what theyd want/expect to be able to answer that. Cheers. Regards your second point, they would probably be more on tbe relaxed side.
 
I would say have another go at convincing them to hire a photographer and let you enjoy the day as a guest, not through the viewfinder on a camera. IMHO
 
I did the same for my sister a year ago and really enjoyed it. Didn't spoil the day for me one bit, I love taking photos and love a good wedding. Why not combine the two?
 
I think you've made the right decision, take your camera, tqke some good photos without pressure. Above all enjoy the day. If as @Tunbridge suggests you'll enjoy the photography do it, if not don't. Simples
 
blakester said:
I would say have another go at convincing them to hire a photographer and let you enjoy the day as a guest, not through the viewfinder on a camera. IMHO
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I thought I put a good case across in the first instance, obviously not convincing enough. They don't seem interested.

boyfalldown said:
I think you've made the right decision, take your camera, tqke some good photos without pressure. Above all enjoy the day. If as @Tunbridge suggests you'll enjoy the photography do it, if not don't. Simples
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I have just got off the phone to my brother and he said they would be happy if I could "get some good ones" from the ceremony, a few formal group shots and a few candids. He stressed that he would want me to pack the camera away for the evening so I could relax with everyone else.
 
Sorry but get sick of hearing this on here , excuses of why people are doing there first weddings for people who can obviously afford to pay the going rate, if you do it you are taking money from photographers pockets its a simple as that. If that's what you want to do and you want to be a wedding tog then charge them. I started out with a relatives wedding and they paid me as like you I was already of a certain standard. You have invested your time and effort and money in your photography DO NOT just give it away.
 
Andrew Davies Photography said:
Sorry but get sick of hearing this on here , excuses of why people are doing there first weddings for people who can obviously afford to pay the going rate, if you do it you are taking money from photographers pockets its a simple as that. If that's what you want to do and you want to be a wedding tog then charge them. I started out with a relatives wedding and they paid me as like you I was already of a certain standard. You have invested your time and effort and money in your photography DO NOT just give it away.
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I was recently asked to take some shots at my brothers wedding, I declined. In the end he didn't hire anyone either.

If I had accepted would I have been taking money out of professional photographers pockets?
 
JBuk said:
I was recently asked to take some shots at my brothers wedding, I declined. In the end he didn't hire anyone either.

If I had accepted would I have been taking money out of professional photographers pockets?
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Yes you would as you would be providing them with a service, you should also be paying tax on and preferably insured to do , but well done for saying no. Too many people treat wedding photography as a ' Oh well you can use a camera so you can do our wedding' cheapskate affair and it really pees me off when you work hard at it as a full time business.
 
I have a box of spanners out the back if my father wants his plumbing fixed would i go and do it not knowing anything about how the job need to be done ? no.

If i did it do i think another plumber might be annoyed. Yes

If i then go on a plumbing forum and ask for advice of the hard working self employed plumbers do you think they will take kindly to it ? LOL
 
Andrew Davies Photography said:
Sorry but get sick of hearing this on here , excuses of why people are doing there first weddings for people who can obviously afford to pay the going rate, if you do it you are taking money from photographers pockets its a simple as that. If that's what you want to do and you want to be a wedding tog then charge them. I started out with a relatives wedding and they paid me as like you I was already of a certain standard. You have invested your time and effort and money in your photography DO NOT just give it away.
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I shot my brothers wedding for free. Both brothers infact. In andrew's world I am a bad man off to burn in hell.
 
Andrew Davies Photography said:
Sorry but get sick of hearing this on here , excuses of why people are doing there first weddings for people who can obviously afford to pay the going rate, if you do it you are taking money from photographers pockets its a simple as that. If that's what you want to do and you want to be a wedding tog then charge them. I started out with a relatives wedding and they paid me as like you I was already of a certain standard. You have invested your time and effort and money in your photography DO NOT just give it away.
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Thanks for taking time to comment Andrew.
I did try and persuade them to hire a pro and am still suggesting that they do if they want the best results.
I have no interest in becoming a wedding photgropher or any other kind of photograher professionally. It is my hobby and i enjoy it.
I have a set of studio strobes at home which i enjoy using for photos of my family and hanging the results on the wall, does this mean i am taking money from my local studio photographers pockets, no, because i wouldnt hire them to take photos of my family anyway.
 
Andrew Davies Photography said:
Yes you would as you would be providing them with a service, you should also be paying tax on and preferably insured to do , but well done for saying no. Too many people treat wedding photography as a ' Oh well you can use a camera so you can do our wedding' cheapskate affair and it really pees me off when you work hard at it as a full time business.
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Ha hahaha.

You are on a wind up, aren't you?
 
Andrew Davies Photography said:
Yes you would as you would be providing them with a service, you should also be paying tax on and preferably insured to do , but well done for saying no. Too many people treat wedding photography as a ' Oh well you can use a camera so you can do our wedding' cheapskate affair and it really pees me off when you work hard at it as a full time business.
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If I had did it I wouldn't have charged him as its a hobby for me not something I earn from, besides he didn't ask in the hope of saving some money , he just thought I might have wanted to do it because he knows I enjoy taking photos, I explained how much effort is involved and that I felt it was a burden to do it and would prefer to enjoy the day.

I disagree that a pro would have lost out as there was never any intention to hire one in the first place

As for cheapskate wedding photography, well I guess lots of people want a bargain whether its getting some building work done, car fixed , decorating ,etc , and who could blame them if the person doing the work is cheap and is known to do a good job. If this is losing people business then they need to adapt and make their services more appealing.
 
Go for it Matt (y) I did a friends wedding a few weeks back, scared sh1less I was but the pccies came out great, they even stuck some on Facebook :)
 
What if you mess it up? The fact he said you will "get some good ones" means he is expecting pro photography on the cheap. I just hope there isn't a thread after the wedding asking how to rescue these pics as my brother is furious or how do I break it to my brother my shots are not good enough.

I would imagine in their heads official means pro because, well you have a good camera that takes great photos.

I have learnt the hard way, never do business with family.
 
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simon ess said:
I'd do anything for my brother - for free. And he is very wealthy indeed.

He is my brother.

How much would you charge him?
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Ditto this.

You have explained to your brother that you are by no means a professional and he's happy with that, so go for it and enjoy the challenge. Just make sure you're well prepared ... Spare batteries/cards etc and even a spare camera if you have one (a compact is better than nothing). Agree with your brother and his fiancé a list of group shots they would like if possible and keep the list handy.

Also, do you have any friends who are photographers too (club members etc?). Maybe they could come along to the church on the day and act as second shooter to back you up?

How about attending one or two other weddings ahead of time to get the feel for it and build confidence?

I'm sure you'll be fine, so go for it. Good luck.
 
I would point him in the direction of some 'high end' wedding photographers websites and tell him if he wants that standard he needs to hire a professional. The key point is to lower his and his fiance's expectations.

With regards to taking money away from a pro, well thats just irrelevant and absurd.

I would echo the advice to have a spare camera/lens and spare batteries and cards. I would get a good idea of the running order on the day, visit the venue(s) and walk through your positions and shots. This will give you more confidence. Relax and enjoy it.
 
ding76uk said:
What if you mess it up? The fact he said you will "get some good ones" means he is expecting pro photography on the cheap. I just hope there isn't a thread after the wedding asking how to rescue these pics as my brother is furious or how do I break it to my brother my shots are not good enough.

I would imagine in their heads official means pro because, well you have a good camera that takes great photos.

I have learnt the hard way, never do business with family.
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Fear of failing to get any good shots scares me a little but he is familiar with what my level of experience is.



Quicksnapper said:
Ditto this.

You have explained to your brother that you are by no means a professional and he's happy with that, so go for it and enjoy the challenge. Just make sure you're well prepared ... Spare batteries/cards etc and even a spare camera if you have one (a compact is better than nothing). Agree with your brother and his fiancé a list of group shots they would like if possible and keep the list handy.

Also, do you have any friends who are photographers too (club members etc?). Maybe they could come along to the church on the day and act as second shooter to back you up?

How about attending one or two other weddings ahead of time to get the feel for it and build confidence?

I'm sure you'll be fine, so go for it. Good luck.
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Got plenty batteries, cards etc and could borrow my wifes compact. None of my friends are into photography that could help, my cousins husband is a likeminded amature but they live in New Zealand are unable to attend.
Im not sure how i would go about attending other weddings, bearing in mind that most pro wedding photographers get a bit touchy when amatures start suggesting taking pictures at a wedding.

BBR said:
I would point him in the direction of some 'high end' wedding photographers websites and tell him if he wants that standard he needs to hire a professional. The key point is to lower his and his fiance's expectations.

With regards to taking money away from a pro, well thats just irrelevant and absurd.

I would echo the advice to have a spare camera/lens and spare batteries and cards. I would get a good idea of the running order on the day, visit the venue(s) and walk through your positions and shots. This will give you more confidence. Relax and enjoy it.
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I have name dropped 3 local photographers whos images i consider to be of high quality and encouraged him to look at their work, but he has come back and said that they arent interested in hiring a professional.

If i could get him to forget the idea of me being there as 'the' photographer, and just there as his brother/guest with a camera then i would probably be comfortable documenting the day from my viewpoint.
How would i go about lowering his expectations? would you suggest a side by side comparrison of shots i have taken from family functions to some of those from local pro's?

Thanks very much for the replies, i am very much on the fence still.
 
When I did a wedding for friends I told them the reason I was not professional was that I was not good enough and that it is harder than it looks and could easily be a disaster. It is a good idea if you email them that message too, just in case.
As it turned out they were delighted but at least I had covered myself!
 
ding76uk said:
What if you mess it up? The fact he said you will "get some good ones" means he is expecting pro photography on the cheap. I just hope there isn't a thread after the wedding asking how to rescue these pics as my brother is furious or how do I break it to my brother my shots are not good enough.

I would imagine in their heads official means pro because, well you have a good camera that takes great photos.

I have learnt the hard way, never do business with family.
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Nail on head.

The fact that your brother is wealthy and could easily afford a pro makes it even worse in my opinion. Clearly he is simply trying to save money and thinks you can do just as good a job. Before the fact they all say things like 'just do your best, if you can get a few good ones we'll be happy' but it's often a very different story later on if your photos don't match up to those of a top-flight snapper. The fact that you have tried to make it clear to your brother that you're uncomfortable doing this, and that he is still pressing you to do it, is further evidence that he is being extremely selfish. Surely you, as the brother of the groom, have the right to enjoy the wedding day just like everyone else? But no, this man wants you on duty, and I presume he is aware of the many hours you will be spending afterwards sorting out all the pictures and processing them.

In my experience the people closest to you are the least likely to appreciate your time or your efforts - whilst expecting so much. I'm at the stage now where I feel compelled to decline many of the invitations I get to gatherings, simply because there is an unspoken expectation that I will assume professional photographic duties, instead of enjoying a much-needed day off.

Of course, if you feel confident you can meet your brother's expectations (let alone those of his bride) and if you fancy kicking off a wedding portfolio, then you should certainly consider doing it. Unfortunately your brother has put you in a very difficult position - if you say no and he reacts badly to that, then you have full and final confirmation that he is indeed a tight-ar*e.
 
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