Yongnuo - Now also going to make lenses

John Young

John Young

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This might be interesting, I have used their flashes and they are very good espcially for the price so will be very ineresting to see what they produce

More info Here

First product will be Canon 50mm lens but price is to be confirmed

 
Wow interesting thanks for sharing.
 
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Interesting. Their flashes are great, and 1/4 the price of the top brands. I wonder will they keep that standard up with lenses? a much trickier arena.
 
Don't manufactures just buy in the lens glass from manufactures like Hoya?

If they've just stripped a canon lens and copied everything, and then bought in the glass they should be comparable maybe?
 
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There are quite a few lens manufacturers in China in the CCTV industry at present. Quality wasn't too good in the early days (10-15 years back), but they've come on leaps and bounds since then. Very few cameras that we import at work have anything but Chinese optics these days. Granted it is a totally different market sector, and dare I say quality of lens, but I'm actually surprised that one of the bigger operators has yet to look at the consumer camera market.

Good on Yongnuo for taking that brave step. One in which I am sure they will eventually succeed.
 
The insane BOLT of the world, is now favorite to win race to bottom.

I wonder how their r&d budget will compare to nikon and canon??

I would love to shaft the chinese with a brand new technology that makes the one they just ripped off redundant, MF'S.

At the prices they charge, is there any prospect of them having anything left to invest in better products???

They take and take and are interested in giveing sod all back, possibly the most boring, unsophisticated f/pigs on earth.:canon::nikon::olympus:
 
I can't help thinking that unless Canon are involved in this with Yongnuo, it's not going to get to the European market without serious lawsuits from Canon.

Whilst direct copies are prevalent/accepted within China, I can't see it happening outside as easily.

The lens pictured is basically an exact copy of the Canon lens just with what looks like cheaper plastic, cheaper focus motor and unknown glass.
 
I do find comments like the above (SteveT) intriguing. Whilst I totally understand why you feel that way, and I have personally seen much evidence of it on the streets and in markets over there, there is another side to Chinese manufacturing.

Again, in the field I know very well, CCTV, the Chinese are actually leading the way in the development of cameras and DVR's. It began with an influx of international manufacturers setting up shop there, for all the expected reasons I might add. This was soon followed by Chinese owned and run businesses - who are actually now at the leading edge of their technology field.

In my opinion, based on very frequent trips out there, China is a rapidly evolving technological marvel.
 
stevelmx5 said:
I can't help thinking that unless Canon are involved in this with Yongnuo, it's not going to get to the European market without serious lawsuits from Canon.

Whilst direct copies are prevalent/accepted within China, I can't see it happening outside as easily.

The lens pictured is basically an exact copy of the Canon lens just with what looks like cheaper plastic, cheaper focus motor and unknown glass.
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Guess it depends how they sell them though. I'd bet that most YN stuff gets sold via their eBay store shipped out of China. Not the easiest thing to police...
Having said that, a real canon 50mm is cheap enough that I wouldn't have thought there was much margin in it for them. Interesting idea though...
 
Steve T said:
The insane BOLT of the world, is now favorite to win race to bottom.

I wonder how their r&d budget will compare to nikon and canon??

I would love to shaft the chinese with a brand new technology that makes the one they just ripped off redundant, MF'S.

At the prices they charge, is there any prospect of them having anything left to invest in better products???

They take and take and are interested in giveing sod all back, possibly the most boring, unsophisticated f/pigs on earth.:canon::nikon::olympus:
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Bit racist! :O

I couldn't give a monkey's who copies who, once the end product is decent. And who knows? maybe it will be! Their flashes are used by pro photograhers around the world, they don't seem to be upset about it. Why should lenses be any different? It's just .... gear.
 
While the Canon F1.8 is cheap enough, the Canon F1.4 is not quite so cheap, at least for my wallet at around £279 retail (less for grey market doubtless). The photo and article indicate the Yongnuo to be F1.4. There are certainly knock off copies of the Canon 580EX flashes out in the wild already.
 
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landwomble said:
..,
Having said that, a real canon 50mm is cheap enough that I wouldn't have thought there was much margin in it for them. Interesting idea though...
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It's the 1.4, there's plenty of scope to undercut and make a profit.
 
They dont really care about copyright/branding etc. look at their car market/technology market, they do a decent copy, sometimes improve on the original and sell for less money, production costs less because labour costs less and reasons why it costs less are frequently in the news. They dont give a monkeys about what the international market thinks.
 
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brucegill said:
Interesting! Loving their flashes, you can't really beat them for price (no idea about warranty though).
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Yeah that's a good point, you don't mind so much a dodgy warranty on a £100 flash but maybe if it was a lens costing a lot more it might be more of an issue
 
twist said:
They dont really care about copyright/branding etc. look at their car market/technology market, they do a decent copy, sometimes improve on the original and sell for less money, production costs less because labour costs less and reasons why it costs less are frequently in the news. They dont give a monkeys about what the international market thinks.
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Again, I do fully understand the reason you see things that way, but "They" represents a massive nation, with a massive manufacturing base. It's interesting that you mention cars. In the last twelve months, I have been to... Beijing, Shenzhen, Xian, Shanghai, Chengdu, Xiamen, Guilin amongst others. Home brand cars I would say represent about 70% of all those on the road - very few looking like anything you see at home. The rest are known brands, mostly European, but different models than we see here, made in conjunction with European manufacturers.

As the nation becomes more advanced it is moving rapidly away from the copy culture you detest. In the last 20 years that I have been travelling there, the rate of advancement is simply astonishing.
 
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braddersmd said:
Again, I do fully understand the reason you see things that way, but "They" represents a massive nation, with a massive manufacturing base. It's interesting that you mention cars. In the last twelve months, I have been to... Beijing, Shenzhen, Xian, Shanghai, Chengdu, Xiamen, Guilin amongst others. Home brand cars I would say represent about 70% of all those on the road - very few looking like anything you see at home. The rest are known brands, mostly European, but different models than we see here, made in conjunction with European manufacturers.

As the nation becomes more advanced it is moving rapidly away from the copy culture you detest. In the last 20 years that I have been travelling there, the rate of advancement is simply astonishing.
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Of course, by 'they' I mean no disrespect and the word detest is a bit harsh and not how I wanted the post to come across. We would pay so much more for everything if 'they' did not copy/implement/perfect etc original designs. And our own demand drives conditions that those poor people (sometimes) work in.

I can only imagine what you mustve seen in the past 20 years in terms of development, must be fascinating.
 
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John Young said:
Yeah that's a good point, you don't mind so much a dodgy warranty on a £100 flash but maybe if it was a lens costing a lot more it might be more of an issue
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I got two YN560III and a YN560TX controller for arround £110 delivered via Amazon UK. That's an incredible price in my book. I chose Amazon as its (normally) easy to return faulty items. But at this cost, if the break after a year of use, they'll go in the bin and I'll buy more. I'm not profesional so paying for an item with great warranty or after sales is not high on my list when comparing costs of said items.

I had light strands already, bought the two flashes and controller, some flash grids, two brollies all for under £180 ish. To be able to jump in to flash photography for this sort of price is great. If they bring out glass that's cheap and easy to get into, it can only help people get into creative photography easier. Thumbs up from me. Copy or not.
 
landwomble said:
Guess it depends how they sell them though. I'd bet that most YN stuff gets sold via their eBay store shipped out of China. Not the easiest thing to police...
Having said that, a real canon 50mm is cheap enough that I wouldn't have thought there was much margin in it for them. Interesting idea though...
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if its anything like specticle optics cost its huge margins.
 
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brucegill said:
I recon this is the real point. we're used to paying exstorsinate prices for big brand name glass. The mark up will be huge!
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Hey if someone else does the R&D and marketing theres not that much left to recoup. Copy a decent design that someone else researched and developed, let the web do some user/blog reviews, sell it for less, product will sell.
 
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They dont really care about copyright/branding etc.
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Maybe the Chinese realise that the European\USA copyright patent system is broken, they have seen US & UK companies use it as an additional revenue stream rather than a system of protecting their genuine inventions.
 
twist said:
Hey if someone else does the R&D and marketing theres not that much left to recoup. Copy a decent design that someone else researched and developed, let the web do some user/blog reviews, sell it for less, product will sell.
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They just run it through a computer program now don't they?
 
twist said:
Of course, by 'they' I mean no disrespect and the word detest is a bit harsh and not how I wanted the post to come across. We would pay so much more for everything if 'they' did not copy/implement/perfect etc original designs. And our own demand drives conditions that those poor people (sometimes) work in.

I can only imagine what you mustve seen in the past 20 years in terms of development, must be fascinating.
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Apologies for using the word detest. You are correct, it was a tad harsh. As to development, to illustrate what I've seen, look at the changes in Shanghai, and the Pudong district - 1987 to now....http://www.theatlantic.com/infocus/2013/08/26-years-of-growth-shanghai-then-and-now/100569/

The first place I ever visited was during a trip to HK, when I agreed to meet a supplier in Shenzhen. It was a designated special economic zone, mainly I believe, due to it's proximity with HK. It had a quaint small city feel about it - almost like a large scale fishing town. The population had just started to boom - around 1m at the time and growing. It now has a population of over 10m, and I would say its one of the most industrial cities I have visited.

That said, the business district of Futian is an incredibly complex and modern CBD.

Sadly, I have only relatively recently taken an interest in photography. It would have been great to compare directly my first sights there to now.
 
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Wow! Thanks for the link. It is a shame youve missed those opportunities but at least you still have the opportunity to visit all these amazing places and make up for it.
 
rjbell said:
They just run it through a computer program now don't they?
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And who wrote the computer program?

Face it, designing and manufacturing lenses isn't easy. I'm sure computers make designing lenses easier than it used to be, but ask yourself why Canon and Nikon only release a handful of new lens designs every year despite still having some "dogs" in their ranges. Meanwhile manufacturing lenses is difficult, as testified by the continual concerns about Sigma's and Tamron's QA, and it's getting harder because of the demand for ever higher pixel counts.
 
Maybe Canon sold them the hopeless design? It is almost certain the old 1.4 is getting discontinued soon for something new potentially f/1.8 or f/2 with IS...

Good luck to yn with that, and hopefully it will be optically better. BTW. where are the 600 EX-RT clones?
 
I love that people auto-imagine that the big names put 10x the amount of effort into any manufacturing, and therefore deserve 5x the price in return ...

Do people still imagine Chinese factories as slave camps in dank, dark, soggy conditions or something?

Perfect example for that sort:


And in the comments, someone actually then suggests that Chinese kids built the robots ... sigh


But ... then, on the copy front:

 
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The point is most products these days including the iphone etc are all made in China under the authority of the different companys so its no stretch to think the Chinese themselves using their knowldge and production skill would not make products themselves with a less inflated price
 
I think the big brands should be worried about this. There is no doubt China has the intellectual and manufacturing capability, and if lenses simply follow the Yongnuo business model of direct supply with no local distributor, while simultaneously dodging import duties and VAT, those two things alone would cut the cost to customer in half.
 
well its one thing to make flashguns and wireless triggers. it is quite another to make decent range of lens and calibrate those to suit all the major camera brands. I don't have high hopes for the first generation of lens. in order to developed zoom lens they will need quite an advance research lab and a lot of money on R&D which i cannot imagine they have the financial muscle to do so. maybe at best they will reach levels such as samyang...

and if they are going to stick with all procured and manufactured in china then they need to find some decent manufacturing plant and it is probably not going to be that cheap. I am not sure where all the optical glass come from but being most of these camera stuff come from Japan, maybe that's where most of the exotic glass are made. therefore if they want to buy cheap glass from chinese supplier then bye bye IQ
 
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You're underestimating the Chinese. Nikon already makes lenses in China, so does Tamron. Canon has plants in Taiwan and Malaysia.

It's already happening under different names. With China's disregard for intellectual property, reverse engineering isn't too much of a problem - just copy it.
 
Frankly speaking, why did they choose the worst 50/1.4 design out there? They could copy Zeiss, and design the case as they wanted with larger focus ring. It is really unbelievable.
 
I remember a TV show that said the Chinese could copy anything to any specification you desired. I know Nikon sued Sigma for patent infringement about the VR/OS and won millions of dollars but not sure you would have much chance with the Chinese courts if you had intellectual property lawsuits.
 
HoppyUK said:
You're underestimating the Chinese. Nikon already makes lenses in China, so does Tamron. Canon has plants in Taiwan and Malaysia.

It's already happening under different names. With China's disregard for intellectual property, reverse engineering isn't too much of a problem - just copy it.
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Which appears to be what they've done with their first lens.

R&D costs for lenses are massive, but taking a product apart and copying it's design is relatively straightforward. A £400 copy of a Canon 70-200 2.8 (non IS) would have quite a market. It'll get really interesting if they decide there's enough of a market for cheap super-teles.
 
There's nothing new in copying stuff. The Japanese did it in a big way years ago with cars and motorbikes. Only recently, Benro got a toe in the tripod market by cloning Gitzo, and Arca-Swiss heads too, and now they're established manufacturers (and designers) in their own right.

There's potentially a big difference here though. Western brands have been able to enforce intellectual property rights by threatening legal action on local retailers and distributors. Off the top of my head, that was enough to stop Benro making aspherical ball heads, an Arca-Swiss patent, because nobody wouldn't stock them.

But if you don't use local retailers and distributors and can ship direct to the customer from China, as Yongnuo now does very effectively, well that puts a whole different spin on it. With local distributors (Introphoto, Kenro, SnapperStuff etc) their role is becoming diluted. Their primary function has always been to service retail accounts, manage stock and provide local marketing support with magazine ads and so on. All essential stuff, that mostly can't be done, or done as well, from the other side of the world, but there's a lot less of those things needed these days.
 
HoppyUK said:
You're underestimating the Chinese. Nikon already makes lenses in China, so does Tamron. Canon has plants in Taiwan and Malaysia.

It's already happening under different names. With China's disregard for intellectual property, reverse engineering isn't too much of a problem - just copy it.
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I think you are over estimating how much they can reverse engineer a lens. The optical formular probably are protected from the production line. So they will have a hard time guessing which glass is doing what to start with nor will they figure out which glass is asphereical which is low dispersion etc etc. Further more simply copying the lens' geometrical layout won't be enough these days. You need to get to the firmware and reverse engineer the machine codes. And do it for at least Nikon and canon mount.

It is an endearing venture. I wish them the best but I don't hold great hopes for them that's all.

Edit: my statement above is correct. The fact that they can only do a prime lens and no auto focus motor means 3 things. Zoom lens is far to complex for them to copy and they are not able to reverse engineer the firmware coding to produce a CPU based focus system. By that extrapolation they also don't have any R&D or expertise to develop a lens motor based AF system that relies on camera body information.

I suspect it is quite simply to produce a lens which requires the body to drive the AF as all you got to do is feed back the lens aperture and range information to the body which needs to be coded to the specification required by canon or Nikon. But being able to take the information back from the camera body and use that to drive the lens motor etc becomes a lot more complex.

As I said earlier the best they can achieve is samyang level based on the current development.
 
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