24-70mm lenses

[LongLensPhotography]

As an owner of Canon EF 24-70mm f/2.8 II lens and facing a very uncertain upgrade path I am starting to look at modern alternatives; pretty much any brand...

I would say this current lens leaves me wanting quite a lot compared with something like 70-200mm or even 16-35 f/4. I felt about it much better in the beginning after moving on from the really mediocre mk1 but I realise it still lacks a bit when you want corner to corner sharpness particularly on the 5DS and some sort of image stabilisation. I will essentially want a notable improvement in these two areas and also durability, metal construction and longevity (don't care about size or weight at all).
The alternatives for EF mount don't look inspiring at all. Sigma not great, 24-105 I/II even worse, maybe only Tamron G2 is a more interesting side step.

24-70 is probably the go to lens for landscapes and video so it will be the one to replace, and then adapt all the rest.

So the contenders are of course the Canon RF version, Sony G, Sigma and perhaps even Nikon and the rest... So what do you think are the best ones and are they notably better than the EF one?

 

[LongLensPhotography]

Never mind, nobody buys 24-70mm since dSLR days.

 

[f/2.8]

24-70 is a good multi purpose lens but it’s also a bit boring. I guess that’s why they are not as popular these days with everyone chasing lenses with large apertures.

The difference in image quality and focus speed etc between all the major brands for all the new versions is very small. There isn’t really a bad choice any more if you feel you need one.

 

[SFTPhotography]

Never mind, nobody buys 24-70mm since dSLR days.

Nikon's Z 24-70 and Sony's GM 24-70 2.8's I heard are really good.

 

[ancient_mariner]

There is also a new Sigma in FE mount that reviews well.

 

[chrism_scotland]

In full frame the Sony GM 24-70 f2.8 is incredible; its an over-used phrase but "lens full of primes" fits that one nicely; probably the best 24-70 IQ wise I've ever used.
I was a huge fan of the original version of the Tamron 24-70 f2.8 on Nikon mount as well (especially for the price); the G2 version is even better.

Also the new Sigma FE seems to get rave reviews but I've never used it myself.

Its funny; before (and even for a while after) the Sony GM 24-70 came out a lot of folk were rushing to the Canon 24-70ii with the Metabones adapter as the best 24-70 for Sony FE!

 

[nandbytes]

The mirrorless versions of 24-105mm from Sony or Canon are actually very good. Sony is slightly better in that is give 0.31x magnification vs. 0.2x on Canon RF. But Canon RF version is better stabilised. but regardless IQ wise they are excellent throughout the range range from f4.

As for 24-70mm f2.8 the best option in terms of quality to price is the Sigma 24-70mm f2.8 DN (i.e. mirrorless version).
The Nikon Z version is the absolute best of the bunch but its also largest I believe. RF is second in line almost similar to sigma in performance and Sony GM being the oldest of the bunch is the weakest.

 

[SFTPhotography]

@LongLensPhotography given the price difference between an R5 and A7r4 and the superior resolution of the A7r4 you'd be best served by a Sony mirrorless system if you want a 24-70 lens as the GM is by all accounts good.

Although I still think a GFX system might be more you...there is no doubt the Sony G master stuff isn't good.

 

[nandbytes]

In full frame the Sony GM 24-70 f2.8 is incredible; its an over-used phrase but "lens full of primes" fits that one nicely; probably the best 24-70 IQ wise I've ever used.
I was a huge fan of the original version of the Tamron 24-70 f2.8 on Nikon mount as well (especially for the price); the G2 version is even better.

Also the new Sigma FE seems to get rave reviews but I've never used it myself.

Its funny; before (and even for a while after) the Sony GM 24-70 came out a lot of folk were rushing to the Canon 24-70ii with the Metabones adapter as the best 24-70 for Sony FE!

I think part of the issue at the time was price of the Sony GM glass. They seemed expensive compared to DSLR glass. Now that canon and Nikon have entered into the mirrorless world people can actually see Sony weren't simply overpricing everything, they actually seem cheaper now

 

[nandbytes]

@LongLensPhotography given the price difference between an R5 and A7r4 and the superior resolution of the A7r4 you'd be best served by a Sony mirrorless system

And superior cheaper smaller lenses

 

[SFTPhotography]

And superior cheaper smaller lenses

Canon's RF series would be the last in line of the mirrorless, first inline Fuji GFX, then Sony, then Nikon Z joint 2nd. The 60mp of the A7r4 over the 45mp of the Z7ii would be a huge factor in my decision if I was looking at FF. The Z lenses are awesome, the 45mp less awesome. That'll change in time.

 

[nandbytes]

The Z lenses are awesome,

Sony ones are better
Though tbh depends on what you are after.
But Sony definitely has the edge for smaller, sharper, faster primes.

 

[LongLensPhotography]

@LongLensPhotography given the price difference between an R5 and A7r4 and the superior resolution of the A7r4 you'd be best served by a Sony mirrorless system if you want a 24-70 lens as the GM is by all accounts good.

Although I still think a GFX system might be more you...there is no doubt the Sony G master stuff isn't good.

Makes sense. Canon appears to be way overpriced. Sony appears to be almost the bargain basement system today with lots of used accessories and GFX is the premium one. Sorry Canon!

Interestingly the Nikon has the best sensible UWA option in the form of 14-30mm f/4.

Nothing really urgent here but may happen this year.

There is also a new Sigma in FE mount that reviews well.

If that is the case then excellent. Canon is over 2x more expensive! Is this lens coming to any other mounts?

 

[LongLensPhotography]

Sony ones are better
Though tbh depends on what you are after.
But Sony definitely has the edge for smaller, sharper, faster primes.

Do you find any issues with dust if you keep swapping them outdoors?

 

[chrism_scotland]

Its scary to see the used value of the original Fuji GFX; yes it has its quirks (Slow AF) but for landscaping its an incredible beast of a camera!

 

[f/2.8]

The mirrorless versions of 24-105mm from Sony or Canon are actually very good. Sony is slightly better in that is give 0.31x magnification vs. 0.2x on Canon RF. But Canon RF version is better stabilised. but regardless IQ wise they are excellent throughout the range range from f4.

As for 24-70mm f2.8 the best option in terms of quality to price is the Sigma 24-70mm f2.8 DN (i.e. mirrorless version).
The Nikon Z version is the absolute best of the bunch but its also largest I believe. RF is second in line almost similar to sigma in performance and Sony GM being the oldest of the bunch is the weakest.

Pity about all the issues with that Sigma lens, it sucking in a ton of dust and basically unusable in backlit situations because of striping. Talk of a recall soon because so many are having issues.

 

[LongLensPhotography]

Z7ii would be a huge factor in my decision if I was looking at FF

I think you will only notice anything between them only if you shoot with the best primes at optimal aperture and also provided the cameras have no AA filter (not sure on that?). This also presumes printing at ridiculous sizes like over 44" long. I think I'd be happy with either; I don't really find 22MP 5D3 files too limiting unless the corners are bad.

or this:


A very uncooperative pheasant at 400mm and a massive crop from 50 -> 11MP @ ISO3200. Not fun with 5Ds but pretty much impossible with lower res cameras. I had to take some ridiculous measures to clean this up. The background here has no detail so Texture -80%, sharpness 0, noise +50%. Pheasant sorted out with SharpenAI.

 

[SFTPhotography]

Makes sense. Canon appears to be way overpriced. Sony appears to be almost the bargain basement system today with lots of used accessories and GFX is the premium one. Sorry Canon!

Interestingly the Nikon has the best sensible UWA option in the form of 14-30mm f/4.

Nothing really urgent here but may happen this year.



If that is the case then excellent. Canon is over 2x more expensive! Is this lens coming to any other mounts?

I wouldn't touch a Canon mirrorless system - with the overheating, the fact it costs at least as much as GFX50s and not heard great things about the lenses. Indeed there was a complaint about the new RF 70-180 being smeary in the sides. FFS....

A 70-200 2.8 would be a staple lens for you - so consider sony's excellent GM 70-200 2.8 or the stellar Z 70-200 2.8.

Nikon 14-30 - heard mixed things - the newer Z 14-24 is the one - and if you can live without that there's a lovely 20 1.8. Sony have the GM 16-35 and 20 1.8 and there is a 12-24 thing they make as well. Lots of offerings on the Sony things. Not sure about the form factor of the camera but if it's not a problem for you why not. Everyone else is.

Nikon Z's also have a terrible PDAF banding and striping issue - terrible also on the A7R3 but not really a thing with the A7R4. As you have Canon glass it really has to be a Sony system which will give you time to adapt some of your other L glass. New Sony GM 24-70 2.8 - keep your Canon 16-35 and 70-200 and other whites and change to sony native at your leasure - seems a financially less painfull path than Z Nikon where you will need to buy everything all at once. I'd keep your 5ds - leave your 16-35 attached and Sony A7R4 with 24-70 attached - no dust bunny issues either in the field.

Or dig deep and get...GFX

 

[LongLensPhotography]

I wouldn't touch a Canon mirrorless system - with the overheating, the fact it costs at least as much as GFX50s and not heard great things about the lenses. Indeed there was a complaint about the new RF 70-180 being smeary in the sides. FFS....

A 70-200 2.8 would be a staple lens for you - so consider sony's excellent GM 70-200 2.8 or the stellar Z 70-200 2.8.

Nikon 14-30 - heard mixed things - the newer Z 14-24 is the one - and if you can live without that there's a lovely 20 1.8. Sony have the GM 16-35 and 20 1.8 and there is a 12-24 thing they make as well. Lots of offerings on the Sony things. Not sure about the form factor of the camera but if it's not a problem for you why not. Everyone else is.

Nikon Z's also have a terrible PDAF banding and striping issue - terrible also on the A7R3 but not really a thing with the A7R4. As you have Canon glass it really has to be a Sony system which will give you time to adapt some of your other L glass. New Sony GM 24-70 2.8 - keep your Canon 16-35 and 70-200 and other whites and change to sony native at your leasure - seems a financially less painfull path than Z Nikon where you will need to buy everything all at once.

Or dig deep and get...GFX

Looks like it may be A7RIV + 5Ds for a while or does that combo not make sense. A7RIV + 5D3 (mostly client stuff)??

The GFX needs all new lenses so would have to build it up slowly side by side. I've seen reports of Canon lenses being adapted but it seems they are not performing their very best? We are talking 24mm TSE and maybe some primes, particularly the longer ones.

 

[nandbytes]

Do you find any issues with dust if you keep swapping them outdoors?

A little bit yes. I don't tend to swap lenses all that often tbh because I have two bodies.

If you are that bothered carry rocket blower with you, that's what I do anyway.

I know canon RF bodies close the shutter while changing lenses but there are arguments that that is not sensible since shutters are very delicate.
Some Sony bodies have the option doing the same but luckily you can turn it off if you want to on them

 

[SFTPhotography]

Looks like it may be A7RIV + 5Ds for a while or does that combo not make sense. A7RIV + 5D3 (mostly client stuff)??

The GFX needs all new lenses so would have to build it up slowly side by side. I've seen reports of Canon lenses being adapted but it seems they are not performing their very best? We are talking 24mm TSE and maybe some primes, particularly the longer ones.

I'd use A7R4 and 5ds. Storage is cheap....and if you do landscapes heavily that combo makes a lot of sense.

The Canon lenses are designed for a sensor sized 36x24 - not 44x33...I cannot imagine they can. Some will project a larger image circle - the TSE (24mm on 44x33 sensor is very wide indeed) but I'd imagine you'll see vignetting and softer sides.

GF lenses aren't too pricey - and all in all in line with buying a new RF Canon system. There just isn't a huge range of them but for landscapes that system has you covered.

You could nab a 645z and just hit up eBay for the lenses. That's the least expensive MF route but the camera is huge and it's screw drive AF. I like huge and noisy AF doesn't bother me. Not everyone does.

 

[SFTPhotography]

A little bit yes. I don't tend to swap lenses all that often tbh because I have two bodies.

If you are that bothered carry rocket blower with you, that's what I do anyway.

I know canon RF bodies close the shutter while changing lenses but these are arguments that that is not sensible since shutters are very delicate.
Some Sony bodies have the option doing the same but luckily you can turn it off if you want to on them

#I'd use that feature - you'll never touch the actual shutter just moving the lens of and on.

Query though - are the Sony lenses internal zoom - if not they will suck dirt down (my 45-85 on the 645z does, my 200-500 Nikkor does, the 1st gen 24-70 Nikkor did) - mirror less or not dust bunnies get in

 

[nandbytes]

#I'd use that feature - you'll never touch the actual shutter just moving the lens of and on.

Query though - are the Sony lenses internal zoom - if not they will suck dirt down (my 45-85 on the 645z does, my 200-500 Nikkor does, the 1st gen 24-70 Nikkor did) - mirror less or not dust bunnies get in

I wouldn't want to get things like sand or grit on my shutter. Easy enough to clean the sensor in comparison which is lot less delicate.

Depends on the Sony lens, some are internal zoom and some aren't. But i don't think any of them suck in dust. A lot them are are well sealed.

I'll refer you or anyone else to this quote from lens rentals (https://www.lensrentals.com/blog/20...ed-teardown-of-the-canon-rf-70-200mm-f2-8-is/)
"Before we start, though, let’s get the extending barrel discussion out of the way. Some of you HATE extending barrel lenses. That’s cool; don’t get one. Some of you like to call them dust pumps. That’s cool, too, although it’s incorrect. (We take care of over 20,000 lenses. The most common ‘dusters’ among current lenses all happen to be primes that don’t zoom at all.)"

If your are lenses are sucking dust it means they are just poorly sealed or not sealed at all. It's not an issue with the latest lenses on Sony or canon which are pretty well sealed.

 

[nandbytes]

Pity about all the issues with that Sigma lens, it sucking in a ton of dust and basically unusable in backlit situations because of striping. Talk of a recall soon because so many are having issues.

How does a lens cause stripping, still can't get my head around that. It's clearly a sensor thing no?

 

[f/2.8]

How does a lens cause stripping, still can't get my head around that. It's clearly a sensor thing no?

It is mainly a sensor thing but some lenses cause it more than others the Siggy is one of the worst examples.

 

[SFTPhotography]

I wouldn't want to get things like sand or grit on my shutter. Easy enough to clean the sensor in comparison which is lot less delicate.

Depends on the Sony lens, some are internal zoom and some aren't. But i don't think any of them suck in dust. A lot them are are well sealed.

I'll refer you or anyone else to this quote from lens rentals (https://www.lensrentals.com/blog/20...ed-teardown-of-the-canon-rf-70-200mm-f2-8-is/)
"Before we start, though, let’s get the extending barrel discussion out of the way. Some of you HATE extending barrel lenses. That’s cool; don’t get one. Some of you like to call them dust pumps. That’s cool, too, although it’s incorrect. (We take care of over 20,000 lenses. The most common ‘dusters’ among current lenses all happen to be primes that don’t zoom at all.)"

If your are lenses are sucking dust it means they are just poorly sealed or not sealed at all. It's not an issue with the latest lenses on Sony or canon which are pretty well sealed.

Trust me - extending barrel lenses will always let in more than an internal zooming lens - in my experience with both. Good practice mitigates the issue - leave the camera facing downwards when storing it with the lens on - cleaning the lens when zoomed out helps. On an SLR style the mirror saves a lot getting in but not entirely.

 

[LongLensPhotography]

It is mainly a sensor thing but some lenses cause it more than others the Siggy is one of the worst examples.

Would you have any examples please?

 

[f/2.8]

Would you have any examples please?

There is a ton of them online have a look at any of the Sony Facebook groups of which is there is many.

 

[nandbytes]

Would you have any examples please?

I still don't entirely believe it. I haven't seen any credible testing that shows this as an issue.
A lot of the time its just user error or people spreading FUD.
There was some of it when the new sigma 85mm f1.4 DN was released also.
I bought it and none of the BS about not being able to shoot into the light or backlit was true.

the 24-70/2.8 lenses aren't my thing... so not a lens I'll ever bother testing myself. But wouldn't be surprised if it performed just fine.