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Have any of you worked for an agency in the past that has stated you can only crop images to a set ratio? i'm not talking about guys selling prints but sending to the nationals.
and please use their services
Agency shooters
- Thread starter Rovers_Andy
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it is pointless making a 2 column crop when you should be looking to keep a 4x3 dimension.
Keep the ratio as a slide mount would be. In the eyes of a picture researcher they can always crop if need be, but if you have a square shaped image, it basically wont fit onto a double page spread will it... lost sale!
Keep the ratio as a slide mount would be. In the eyes of a picture researcher they can always crop if need be, but if you have a square shaped image, it basically wont fit onto a double page spread will it... lost sale!
OP
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Agency requesting to only crop images 20x30, can't see the sense in using that ratio myself, usually i take 7x5 as a starting point then tweek it
OP
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OP
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My point exactly Graham, the pictures look awful when restricted to the set ratio, their thinking is that if they send looser crops then the images will be used at a bigger size and get more money for a usage, personally i don't think it will.........
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you are ONLY a photographer
how about researching what a design page layout editor does or a sub and see how THEY work - after all they are responsible for the mechanics that go into making a magazine. Your pictures dont get there because they are nice, they go there because it is what THEY want. Why provide images to clients with pictures that they dont want?
Space is important for text and double pages mean double the money
pic eds are quite intelligent people and probably see more pictures than you ever will
Without patronising look at the bigger picture... A magazine or The Guardian will use a bigger frame with more space, the Daily Star can always crop.
Think about your role in providing material to a client - you are only the beginning.
If anyone supplied constantly badly cropped pics they are given stern words or end up on the scrap heap as you would be wasting my time, the client is the most important cog in the wheel not the ego of a photographer who wants his work to appease him... I dont give a damn what the photographer thinks, only providing what the client wants.
If you have ever worked under an art director this point is even more exaggerated. You simply do not care what you want to do, you are under the directorship of the art director as you are working for them and they are paying you. People who take pictures to please their own ego and make a living are very hard to come across. Stick to your day job and have some nice pictures that you feel are nice, or do what the bosses ask and earn a living... harsh but true
He has sadly passed away now but there was a marvellous photographer called Peter Jay. He worked for the Daily Star for years producing what THEY wanted and earnt a great wage back in the good old days. He then went to The Independent when it was a paper worth looking at. Many including myself severely doubted his talents but he surprised us all with his amazing art, something he had been doing for years but we never saw in print. You do what your picture editor asks for, otherwise you will crash and die.
I could not disagree more strongly with your thoughts on your agencies needs for looser crops... travel and get magazines from Japan, Germany, Switzerland and especially L'Equippe magazine in France. Then you may understand how your images get used. Most photographers sadly brain wash themselves into their own little world of doing things. What i still find alarming to this day is like syndicating 100 pic to clients around the world, the Germans choose say 20, the Japanese will choose a completely different set and equally the Swiss another 20. Cultural differnce
how about researching what a design page layout editor does or a sub and see how THEY work - after all they are responsible for the mechanics that go into making a magazine. Your pictures dont get there because they are nice, they go there because it is what THEY want. Why provide images to clients with pictures that they dont want?
Space is important for text and double pages mean double the money
pic eds are quite intelligent people and probably see more pictures than you ever will
Without patronising look at the bigger picture... A magazine or The Guardian will use a bigger frame with more space, the Daily Star can always crop.
Think about your role in providing material to a client - you are only the beginning.
If anyone supplied constantly badly cropped pics they are given stern words or end up on the scrap heap as you would be wasting my time, the client is the most important cog in the wheel not the ego of a photographer who wants his work to appease him... I dont give a damn what the photographer thinks, only providing what the client wants.
If you have ever worked under an art director this point is even more exaggerated. You simply do not care what you want to do, you are under the directorship of the art director as you are working for them and they are paying you. People who take pictures to please their own ego and make a living are very hard to come across. Stick to your day job and have some nice pictures that you feel are nice, or do what the bosses ask and earn a living... harsh but true
He has sadly passed away now but there was a marvellous photographer called Peter Jay. He worked for the Daily Star for years producing what THEY wanted and earnt a great wage back in the good old days. He then went to The Independent when it was a paper worth looking at. Many including myself severely doubted his talents but he surprised us all with his amazing art, something he had been doing for years but we never saw in print. You do what your picture editor asks for, otherwise you will crash and die.
I could not disagree more strongly with your thoughts on your agencies needs for looser crops... travel and get magazines from Japan, Germany, Switzerland and especially L'Equippe magazine in France. Then you may understand how your images get used. Most photographers sadly brain wash themselves into their own little world of doing things. What i still find alarming to this day is like syndicating 100 pic to clients around the world, the Germans choose say 20, the Japanese will choose a completely different set and equally the Swiss another 20. Cultural differnce
OP
- Messages
- 5,021
- Name
- Andy
- Edit My Images
- Yes
you are ONLY a photographer
how about researching what a design page layout editor does or a sub and see how THEY work - after all they are responsible for the mechanics that go into making a magazine. Your pictures dont get there because they are nice, they go there because it is what THEY want. Why provide images to clients with pictures that they dont want?
Space is important for text and double pages mean double the money
pic eds are quite intelligent people and probably see more pictures than you ever will
Without patronising look at the bigger picture... A magazine or The Guardian will use a bigger frame with more space, the Daily Star can always crop.
Think about your role in providing material to a client - you are only the beginning.
If anyone supplied constantly badly cropped pics they are given stern words or end up on the scrap heap as you would be wasting my time, the client is the most important cog in the wheel not the ego of a photographer who wants his work to appease him... I dont give a damn what the photographer thinks, only providing what the client wants.
If you have ever worked under an art director this point is even more exaggerated. You simply do not care what you want to do, you are under the directorship of the art director as you are working for them and they are paying you. People who take pictures to please their own ego and make a living are very hard to come across. Stick to your day job and have some nice pictures that you feel are nice, or do what the bosses ask and earn a living... harsh but true
He has sadly passed away now but there was a marvellous photographer called Peter Jay. He worked for the Daily Star for years producing what THEY wanted and earnt a great wage back in the good old days. He then went to The Independent when it was a paper worth looking at. Many including myself severely doubted his talents but he surprised us all with his amazing art, something he had been doing for years but we never saw in print. You do what your picture editor asks for, otherwise you will crash and die.
I could not disagree more strongly with your thoughts on your agencies needs for looser crops... travel and get magazines from Japan, Germany, Switzerland and especially L'Equippe magazine in France. Then you may understand how your images get used. Most photographers sadly brain wash themselves into their own little world of doing things. What i still find alarming to this day is like syndicating 100 pic to clients around the world, the Germans choose say 20, the Japanese will choose a completely different set and equally the Swiss another 20. Cultural differnce
Once again thanks for the feedback, interesting to hear the views of people with experience of the industry
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- Graham
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Some fair points raised here. If I work on a commission for any newspapers I find out what sort of crop they prefer and supply accordingly. But if working on spec its very difficult, sometimes I send in various crops, some tight, some loose and maybe one with space to the left (or right). Feedback I use to get from agencies was mixed. Sometimes they would say keep it tight as editors will go for a crop that fits the space especially if times were tight. Othertimes they'd say look at the newspapers and see whats being used.
The truth is unless we have contact directly with the picture editors (many of us dont) then we are back to second guessing, are we not?
The truth is unless we have contact directly with the picture editors (many of us dont) then we are back to second guessing, are we not?
That is a very good point, and the whole post is extremely useful! My agency asks for crops to suit the image...but if one looks at what gets used it's a real eye-opener.
Soccersnapper is right, you always give the person who's paying you WHAT THEY WANT! In many ways it's easier if you're working to commission for one paper rather than an agency, as what Soccersnapper says is right, you need to please so many people who usually all want different things.
Sticking to a "mount" ratio is a good way to allow the layout designer (or whoever does it these days) to alter the picture however they like.
What I do, if I want my ego boosted, I'll take one of my shots for my desktop BG but it'll be cropped differently to how it goes to my bosses at the desk...they're usually very different!
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So are you suggesting your work was awful because of the agency and not your terrible photography ??
:bonk:
- Messages
- 2,901
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- Graham
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So are you suggesting your work was awful because of the agency and not your terrible photography ??
I guess it may be as it was a crappy 0-0 draw (Hull v WHU) and the crops didnt help either :shrug: :thumbsdown: