Bird Photography

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Angie

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Angie
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I have a new camera a Canon 550D (very happy with) and a new X2 teleconverter to go with my 70-300 sigma lens.

Its probably trail and error but I just cannot get use to using this lens with the new camera. I am trying and failing to take good crisp shots of birds, the images are coming out over exposed or too much grain.

It is cloudy outside where I am living but still quite light and I do use a tripod. Could any one help with the type of creative mode I should use, manual, AV or TV. (use to using AV) I am trying to understand speeds, so some help on that would also help.

Any advice please. Thank you
 
Afraid I cant help directly Angie, but I did post a thread titled "My First Attempt" in the bird section at the wekend. I received some very good advice, take a look there might be something there that helps you.
 
Welcome to TP. Not keen on the 2x TC myself and normally use AV myself.

Would suggest that you post one or two of your images in the thread so people can help you with some objective comments. Details of your tripod, tripod head and your technique would also be helpful.

PLEASE don't be concerned about putting up a photo you know could be better - we all started somewhere and I would consider that not even a handful of people on this forum have not learnt something.

If you are still concerned have a look at my thread here: http://www.talkphotography.co.uk/forums/showthread.php?t=185186&highlight=duffers

many of the people who post cracking bird shots here have contributed to that thread are also quite capable of shots at the other end of the quality spectrum :D
 
Tara, thanks I had tried several ISO settings. Thank you ghost dancer, this is going to be so helpful, well appriciated. Mark, I did wonder whether it was the converter, will still try other ways or just go back to 70-300 lens. Dogfish, I only manual focus, so this was not the issue. Thank you for your comment and its so nice that I have received so much advice.
 
Erding, I have deleted these photo's but just looked up thread, mine is very similar to your first one. Good thread.
 
Tom (erding) I did keep one but will have to work out how to post it on here. will try now. ha
 
Angie said:
Erding, I have deleted these photo's but just looked up thread, mine is very similar to your first one. Good thread.
Click to expand...

Ahh..... long lens handheld, too low a shutter speed, wrong ISO, raining and being too slow - the dive was good though :D
 
Thank you Mark I will practise with the settings you gave, but my converter cost £170 so maybe its better to use not at the full 300 X2, hopefully I explained that right.
 
You'll get a lot of softness using the 2x with that lens - but your shutter's far to slow 1/125 at 600mm - you need to have at least 1/(crop*focal length) to stop camera shake 1/(1.6*600) so minimum 1/1000
 
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Angie, the problem is the TC. With a 2x TC you lose 2 f-stops of light, so you sigma 70-300mm f4-5.6 becomes a 140-600mm f8-f11 (you won't get autofocus anyway, you camera is limited to lenses upto f5.6, although you are manually focusing anyway) and that is where the problem lies. At f11 and 600mm manual focus, you still need very good light conditions to achieve reasonable shots, another thing to think about is shutter speeds, are you handholding? the equivalent of a 600mm lens, so you need a faster shutter speed to compensate for hand holding this combination, rule of thumb is 600mm lens = 1/600 sec but because you also have the crop factor, perhaps higher, so you need good light to achieve these shutter speeds. You could put the camera on a tripod to reduce this.

Unfortunately you gone down the route of many, but unfortunately the TC isn't always the easier answer to the question of how to achieve more reach on a budget. The TCs, especially the 2x TC are more specifically designed to be used with the faster more expensive prime lens.

I bought myself a 2x TC for my 300mm f2.8 and had lots of problems in the beginning, mainly because I left my brain at work and forgot all about the rule of thumb with shutter speeds and was wondering why my images weren't sharp, but now I've mastered it, happy with the results.

I think unless the light conditions are in your favour, avoid using the 2x TC on your 70-300mm

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Dogfish, thank you for that, I am experimenting with the shutter speed and will try this tomorrow.
 
If that was hand held - well done.

From the exif you were 600mm (so using your teleconverter), f11 and 1/125. So you have a number of things going against you. The Sigma lens with the 2x converter on at max aperture isn't going to be sharp, combined with a very slow shutter speed for the focal length, especially if handholding the camera.

As other say lose the teleconverter to start off with. And with the 550 you can up the ISO and still get good results. Try 800 or even 1600. If you lose the 2x converter and up the iso to 800 you will be able to use f5.6 1/1000th. The grain should be very manageble at that. I've used 3200 on my 550d with acceptable results.
 
Great advice Pete, I understand now and also forgot I really need the good light. I live and learn. ha Thanks for sharing your great pictures.
 
As everyone has said Angela, forget the 2X TC with a zoom lens- image quality will suffer and you'll lose 2 stops off your max aperture so you'll struggle to get a fast enough shutter speed.

With 18mp your 550 is a good camera for bird photography allowing you to crop to make up for lack of focal length with that zoom lens, but you will need to get a bit closer.

Use AV
Set ISO at 800
Keep the lens wide open unless it's very bright.
Select just the centre AF point.
Select Servo AF
Use a tripod.

Get that single AF point over the eye of the bird or on the head of the bird at least - you want the head/eye as sharp as you can get it.

A gimbal head is a huge help in tracking moving birds, but you can make do with your current head competely slacked off to allow free panning and tilting as long as you keep hold of the camera, and remember to tighten up if you let go of the camera.

Let's see some pics. (y)
 
Angie said:
Will do CT, thanks for all that info, a great help. :))
Click to expand...

You're welcome Ange - those are the settings I use. I forgot to mention metering. I use Evaluative mostly, but there are occasions when it will catch you out - like your Robin against the sky, where there was mostly sky in your viewfinder so the camera has exposed for the sky resulting in an under-exposed Robin. Shooting birds against the sky is tricky and unless there's full sunlight falling on them you need to give more exposure with the exposure compensation wheel or switch to spot metering if the 550 has that feature?

Metering situations is something you'll get to grips with as you gain experience, but concentrate on getting good sharp images for starters. :)
 
Hi Angie, I've only just got to read this thread. I don't know where you are taking your shots but getting close with your 300mm is probably part of the challenge you are facing.

The garden can be a good place to practice. This is the setup I have in my conservatory, a blind for the doorway from an old sheet. Just set up some feeders about 8-10 ft away and just sit quietly with the camera on the tripod and wait for your subjects to arrive. Having a nearby bush with a suitable branch that can make a photogenic perch is ideal, as most birds like to check it's safe before approaching the feeder.

Don't be afraid to ask if you want more help.

conservatoryhide.jpg
 
Ken ... that has to be the most comfortable hide I have seen :D

Angie ... basic but important, you want the sun behind you, ideally striking the bird at a slight angle. (y)
 
Thank you Ken for your advice and I just love your set up. Will try something like that here in the south of France. The wildlife is in abundance here.
 
I feel the need to put my 2c here too, mainly because I've been there as well! I started bird photography with the same lens (Sigma 70-300mm APO DG) and I came to realise a few things. Firstly, the lens itself needs to be stepped down quite a bit to get the sharp results I was after, but in order to do that you need quite a bit of light to get the exposure you need. Secondly, I came to appreciate the merits of a good sturdy tripod, a remote shutter release, and most importantly, good long lens technique. Thirdly, as it was previously mentioned, you need to get closer to your subject, and at 300mm you need to get really close to get the results you are after, which means you need a lot of patience. Unfortunately, birds aren't the most obedient models and, besides the occasional tame robin, they will flee as soon as they see you approach. So, just walking about with your camera in hand, looking for birds is a bit like shooting in the dark. You might get lucky but in most occasions you will go home with a few distant shots.
As for the 2x TC, as others mentioned, keep it for when you upgrade to a better lens. After my 70-300mm f/4.5-5.6 I bought a Sigma 120-300mm f/2.8 which was a completely different beast, very sharp, great colours and contrast, but still struggling with a 2x TC, so I ended up selling it and opting for a 1.4x instead. And we are talking about a £1700 lens. I can only imagine the results you are getting with the 70-300 and the 2x.
So, my suggestion would be to follow all the advice you got from this thread regarding your settings, forget the TC for now, and concentrate on getting yourself closest to your subjects instead of trying to bring them closer with zoom. You can never have enough focal length when birding, you must always remember that :). So, if you have a back yard, set up some bird feeders in front of a back window or a back door and wait. Or, like myself, if you don't have this luxury, try visiting a nature reserve with bird hides, or get down and dirty and conceal yourself and lie still for a few hours ;)

And here are a few examples when I couldn't get a hide set up.

Lying on the ground with a blanket over me and a beanbag under the lens.
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My one and only (crappy) KF photo, sitting still in some long reeds for a couple of hours, aiming at that particular perch. The only photo I managed to get of him, and it is a considerable crop, but still a photo of a KF.
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Not a bird photo, but I was stalking this one for almost 2 hours before I managed to get close
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And this one taken from my favourite and most convenient hide of all time...my car! Use your car, you'll see that you can get really close without disturbing them.
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Sometimes you must use bribery to get them to comply. This one noticed I had some mealworms and came to investigate. You'll find robins are the first obedient subject you'll photograph, and you'll be surprised that wherever you'll find them they will get quite tame really fast if you have something to offer (anglers using maggots will know what I'm talking about).
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Bottom line is, try to be patient and always remember that you'll need to get close to a very timid subject. And if you get your technique and approach down, you'll start to get good results in no time.


George
 
Well Stylgeo, thank you so much for the great information. I have been using the advice I have received from this thread and already and I have had much better results. First photographs was the Robin and as you said I gave it some meal worms and he came two feet away from me and didn't leave me alone (really chuffed) too close actually, lol. I will have to get some more feeders in the garden and hopefully a hide in the future, the blue and great tits are enjoying the fat balls (spread on some trees aswell)
I also have put the 2X away and like you said I will get it out when I can afford that new lens, it is bright and sunny here on some days so may try it out on another occasion. Looking forward to sitting still and waiting, now I feel alot more confident in what I should do. Do use the tripod and will use my shutter release in the future.
Love your perfect pictures and thank you for making me jealous with my favourite bird the Hoopee. Thank you again.
 
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