Canon 300 f4L IS with converters or Sigma Zoom Lens. Which would you prefer.

modchild

modchild

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I have a 5D3 and 70D and use them both with a Sigma 150-500 OS for wildlife and aviation shots. The Sigma is very sharp and works great with the 5D3 but even with MFA it's not as sharp with the 70D (maybe something to do with the dual pixel tech with an older lens) and a lot of examples are on various threads. However, I've recently been toying with the idea of changing the Sigma for a Canon 300 f4L IS and 2x and 1.4x MkIII converters. Would the 300mm and converters be sharper than the Sigma and give me a better IQ overall and does anyone think that would be a good idea. I could also swap the 150-500 OS for the wifes 120-400 OS and exchange that for the Canon 300 so I'd still have access to the 150-500 OS that I know is great on the 5D3.

With the 5D3 able to AF at f8 I could use the 2x and lens to get 600mm (I'd also be able to get 300mm and 420mm with the 5D3) whereas with the 150-500 OS I only get around 500mm and I usually use it at f8 anyway as it's a bit sharper at that rather than wide open at f6.3. With the 70D I could get 300mm (equivalent to 480 on FF) and 420mm with the 1.4x converter (equivalent to 672 on FF) so I'd end up losing a bit of reach on the 70D but gain a bit on the 5D3.
 
modchild said:
I have a 5D3 and 70D and use them both with a Sigma 150-500 OS for wildlife and aviation shots. The Sigma is very sharp and works great with the 5D3 but even with MFA it's not as sharp with the 70D (maybe something to do with the dual pixel tech with an older lens) and a lot of examples are on various threads. However, I've recently been toying with the idea of changing the Sigma for a Canon 300 f4L IS and 2x and 1.4x MkIII converters. Would the 300mm and converters be sharper than the Sigma and give me a better IQ overall and does anyone think that would be a good idea. I could also swap the 150-500 OS for the wifes 120-400 OS and exchange that for the Canon 300 so I'd still have access to the 150-500 OS that I know is great on the 5D3.

With the 5D3 able to AF at f8 I could use the 2x and lens to get 600mm (I'd also be able to get 300mm and 420mm with the 5D3) whereas with the 150-500 OS I only get around 500mm and I usually use it at f8 anyway as it's a bit sharper at that rather than wide open at f6.3. With the 70D I could get 300mm (equivalent to 480 on FF) and 420mm with the 1.4x converter (equivalent to 672 on FF) so I'd end up losing a bit of reach on the 70D but gain a bit on the 5D3.
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Just to say, dual-pixels has nothing to do with reduced sharpness on the 70D vs 5D3. You will always get that because APS-C crop-format sensors are less than half the area of full-frame and the lens is having to work a lot harder to deliver the same resolution. Basically, as resolution demands go up, so image contrast goes down and the image looks softer. To get very good sharpness on APS-C you need a very, very good lens to start with (ie, usually an expensive prime) and pixel count or telecons etc don't change that.

I have a hunch Tamron's new 150-600 might be pretty good. But no price info yet, and suspect it could be quite expensive.
 
I don't know what it is that affects the sharpness but it only appears on my Sigma 150-500 OS lens on the 70D. When it's on the 5D3 and focussed with Liveview it's very crisp but on the 70D the crispness isn't quite there, but all the other Canon lenses I've got when focussed the same are also crisp on the 70D. I've tried to MFA the lens on the 70D and while it's good it's just not as good as with the Canon lenses. My 17-40 f4L and 24-105 f4L, which aren't the best L lenses there is, are perfect and also my 35 f2, 40 f2.8, 50 f1.4 and 85 f1.8 are the same so it's not just the expensive L lenses I've tried.

TBH I'd not really want to let the 150-500 go as mine is a very sharp example on my 5D3 so I might swap it with the wifes 120-400 and then part ex that against the 300 f4L IS.
 
modchild said:
I don't know what it is that affects the sharpness but it only appears on my Sigma 150-500 OS lens on the 70D. When it's on the 5D3 and focussed with Liveview it's very crisp but on the 70D the crispness isn't quite there, but all the other Canon lenses I've got when focussed the same are also crisp on the 70D. I've tried to MFA the lens on the 70D and while it's good it's just not as good as with the Canon lenses. My 17-40 f4L and 24-105 f4L, which aren't the best L lenses there is, are perfect and also my 35 f2, 40 f2.8, 50 f1.4 and 85 f1.8 are the same so it's not just the expensive L lenses I've tried.

TBH I'd not really want to let the 150-500 go as mine is a very sharp example on my 5D3 so I might swap it with the wifes 120-400 and then part ex that against the 300 f4L IS.
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Telezooms are almost always least sharp at the long end, and TBH most consumer grade versions like the Sigma 150-500 suffer quite markedly. When you put it on the 70D, you're asking for an extra 50% resolution compared to 5D3 and it simply doesn't have that 'in reserve' so to speak. Unfortunately really high grade long lenses are just expensive.

Another factor may be that if you're using it for long range work, pulling in more distant subjects on the 70D, you'll be putting a lot more atmosphere between you and that will soften things significantly in anything less than ideal conditions.
 
I realise the zooms aren't going to be as good on a crop body and are also not likely to be as sharp as a prime, but do you think the 300 f4L IS and converters will give me IQ at least a good as the zooms are now. My 70-200 f2.8L IS MkII and 2x MkIII converter are an excellent combo and if I can get anywhere near that IQ I'd be more than happy.
 
modchild said:
I realise the zooms aren't going to be as good on a crop body and are also not likely to be as sharp as a prime, but do you think the 300 f4L IS and converters will give me IQ at least a good as the zooms are now. My 70-200 f2.8L IS MkII and 2x MkIII converter are an excellent combo and if I can get anywhere near that IQ I'd be more than happy.
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Try the comparison tool on TheDigitalPicture.com where you can load up all sorts of comparisons, including Sigma 150-500 OS (that looks very soft at 500mm...). Hope this link works, 70-200/2.8 II with 2x, vs 300/4L with 2x. Toggle the arrow in the middle - looks like the answer is no :(

http://www.the-digital-picture.com/...meraComp=453&SampleComp=0&FLIComp=4&APIComp=0

Try this one, 70-200/2.8 II with 2x, vs Sigma 150-500 OS at 500mm:

http://www.the-digital-picture.com/...meraComp=453&SampleComp=0&FLIComp=5&APIComp=2

Warning! Don't load the Sigma at 1000mm :eek:
 
TBH after looking at their results from the Sigma 150-500 OS and looking at the results from my 150-500 OS it seems theirs has got a layer of vaseline over it. That lens they used is far worse than mine looks on my 70D and TBH I'd of returned mine if it had been that bad. I've seen some examples of real world shots with the 300 with both 1.4x and 2x converters and they seem good enough in IQ, maybe the AF will be slowed down a bit but it should be good enough for what I want.
 
If you're happy with your Sigma, I would be very tempted to stick with that. Not least because it's a known quantity but also since there will be no extra outlay of cash that the 300/2.8 plus converters would entail. While I understand that the prime will work on the doubler, how well will it cope at AF? I know the Sigma isn't the fastest at it but it doesn't take too long in real terms and might be faster than the combination.
 
Canon 300 f4 with a 1.4 x give cracking shots ! light weight , close focus and built in hood all plus points , i used one with a canon 50d and only changed to a 300 2.8 when funds allowed ( wish i could have kept both ! ) . If you are going to try a 2x converter i'd get the mk111
 
I've already got a couple of converters, a Canon 2x MkIII and a Kenko Pro300 DGX 1.4x, but I'd be happy to get a Canon 1.4x if it gave me better IQ and faster AF than the Kenko. If the Sigma was as sharp on my 70D as it was on my 60D and 7D I would of happily kept it, but despite taking a good while to MFA it on the 70D I just can't seem to get it right. Maybe it would require a trip to Canon or Sigma to have it calibrated would be the wise thing to do, however I really do fancy getting the 300 and seeing what that does. I'll swap my 150-500 for the wifes 120-400 and part ex that against the 300 so I'll still have access to the 150-500 when necessary.
 
The Canon 300F4 with a Canon 1.4TC works very well and gives excellent results.

The 300F4 on it's own is a belter of a lens as well.

I'd certainly recommend one :thumbs:
 
Well I got my 300 f4L IS just before christmas and have only had a limited amount of time to try it out. With the lens alone the crispness on Liveview on the 70D is amazing, even with the 1.4x converter the IQ is still excellent compared to the Sigma lenses I had tried. It's strange why the 70D didn't like the Sigma lenses, they were both great on my 7D and 60D before that and didn't need any MFA, but even with MFA on the 70D I just couldn't get it right on.

I tried it with my Canon 2x MkIII converter on my 5D3 and while the AF speed was abysmal the IQ was acceptable when I did get it focussed (mostly with Manual override). With my Kenko 1.4x converter the AF speed will be fast enough for my aviation shots and most of my wildlife shots (even got some BIF shots) and the IQ is equal or better than my Sigma lenses so I'm very happy with my purchase. With my 5D3 and Sigma 150-500 OS and 70D with the Canon 300 f4L IS (with or without a converter) I'll be fully armed come airshow season this year and I can't wait for spring to arrive to capture all the wildlife again.
 
modchild said:
With my Kenko 1.4x converter the AF speed will be fast enough for my aviation shots and most of my wildlife shots (even got some BIF shots) and the IQ is equal or better than my Sigma lenses so I'm very happy with my purchase.
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I've not used the Kenko TC, but with my Canon 1.4 mkIII TC I've not really noticed much of a drop off with the lens - I was out at the super bikes and was tracking them and the 125cc bikes with it connected no problem at all...

Enjoy your new lens :)
 
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