NAS / backup / storage questions and solutions

technics100 said:
Have a safe place for all my files (wifes work stuff and my wedding photos) that's about it.. Can it act as a media server and stream to TV?
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Safe as secure from other people or safe as in a backup or safe as in redundancy.

If it's just file sharing I'd use a normal nas or install something like freenas etc on it. Something you manage through the browser.
 
technics100 said:
Just found this, is this what I need? price seems awesome..

https://www.serversdirect.co.uk/p/1...9Ut5Ot-qvifcWIT8_tdCHSo1AdAdmd1XdaxoCWKrw_wcB
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It's not that awesome as VAT isn't included. Add it to your basket and you'll see that it saves you a tenner.

Regarding the OS, I would say install what you're comfortable with. W7 will work well enough as a simple file sharer and will probably do anything else with standard applications.
I would start with three drives: a smallish one for the operating system such as a 120GB SSD if you can then two drives the same size as RAID1 (mirrored pair) for the data.
There's no HDMI output, only VGA so it depends on your telly.....
 
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I have a HP N54L Microserver. Bought for something like £70, brand new. It's got a few WD Red drives in it, running Synology OS. I have Plex running for all my streaming needs to my TV/iPad/Laptop etc (all done without HDMI), an in-built Download client, and backups for my laptop/phones via Time Machine (running a Retina Macbook Pro). Added native app support (on iOS & Android) and I can access, upload and download from my server anywhere in the world, even from my phone.

Cheap, reliable & functional. Frankly, i'm not sure what else you'd need! :D
 
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ohms12 said:
I have a HP N54L Microserver. Bought for something like £70, brand new. It's got a few WD Red drives in it, running Synology OS. I have Plex running for all my streaming needs to my TV/iPad/Laptop etc (all done without HDMI), an in-built Download client, and backups for my laptop/phones via Time Machine (running a Retina Macbook Pro). Added native app support (on iOS & Android) and I can access, upload and download from my server anywhere in the world, even from my phone.

Cheap, reliable & functional. Frankly, i'm not sure what else you'd need! :D
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I would do that anyday over installing a desktop os on a server; no need to have a keyboard/monitor/mouse either to operate this one.
 
In purist terms you're perfectly correct but you have to allow for Adam's level of experience and willingness to learn something alien like Synology or NAS4free. Remote desktop should let him operate the Gen8 headless anyway once it's set up.
 
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Snapsh0t said:
In purist terms you're perfectly correct but you have to allow for Adam's level of experience and willingness to learn something alien like Synology or NAS4free. Remote desktop should let him operate the Gen8 headless anyway once it's set up.
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I would argue that operating something like Synology for sharing files, photos and build in media server is hugely more intuitive then trying to build and layer it up yourself using a desktop operating system.
 
dejongj said:
I would argue that operating something like Synology for sharing files, photos and build in media server is hugely more intuitive then trying to build and layer it up yourself using a desktop operating system.
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Exactly. I've had no formal training within the IT sector - just building computers and tinkering at home. I was able to setup and run my server without any real need for coding or anything I don't think a vaguely intelligent human being could achieve. Synology, or in my case Xpenology, is really intuitive, simple, has a nice GUI & is by far better for home applications than a desktop server OS, imo.
 
yeah, sounds like a plan.. will order a microerver and HDD's tonight.. Do I need a 3rd Hdd or can I install a OS using USB drive?
 
technics100 said:
yeah, sounds like a plan.. will order a microerver and HDD's tonight.. Do I need a 3rd Hdd or can I install a OS using USB drive?
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I used a USB Disk On Module (DOM) for my microserver for the operating system, again not something recommended to do for a desktop operating system but absolutely fine for VMWare ESXi or Synology DSM. That way you can use the HDD disks for your data. Mine is the N54L so I wouldn't know what DOM to recommend for the GEN8 model.
 
I was about to order last night and I then started looking at HDD's for it.. I think 2 x 3TB will do.. I see most people go for WD Red, is there any reason for this? is that what I should be going for? they seem to be £99 each anywhere doing them cheaper at the minute?
 
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Personally I use Toshiba Deskstar drives, on the premise that they are reasonably reliable (relative to WD and Seagate consumer drives) and cheaper, allowing me to have more drives and more copies of my data*.

The main feature of WD Reds is TLER (time limited error recovery) which stops them from dropping out of a hardware RAID setup when they try and recover from an on disk data corruption. As you well be most likely relying on a software RAID solution (unless you but a RAID add on card), this feature is unnecessary.

*I have disks in my backup server and when I get around to it, an off site backup server too
 
Unfortunately, the drop in the value of the pound has affected disk prices and I think £99 is as good as you'll get from a reputable seller. Although you shouldn't use the on-board RAID controller of the Gen8 if you're using something like Synology or FreeNAS so, as afasoas says, you don't need NAS-rated drives, I've found that 3TB WD Reds are very good drives and I have lots of them.

afasoas said:
Personally I use Toshiba Deskstar drives, on the premise that they are reasonably reliable (relative to WD and Seagate consumer drives) and cheaper, allowing me to have more drives and more copies of my data*.
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Toshiba or HGST?
 
I last bought these:
https://www.scan.co.uk/products/3tb...rd-drive-6gb-s-5700rpm-32mb-cache-8ms-oem-ncq

A scout around the Backblaze website suggests failure rates are not terrible, but not brilliant either. Failure rates of 3.5 - 4.6%. WD Reds (WD30EFRX) clock in at 3.2 - 9%. That said, issues have been raised with the backblaze tests so if concerned, I'd suggest doing your own research.

The HGST Desktar NAS and Ultrastar models do better (<2%), but they seem to clock in at least 20% more expensive than the WD Reds.
 
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I use 2x 3TB WD Red in my Synology NAS as they weren't too expensive at the time and supposedly better life than standard drives when run 24/7.
Couple of thoughts though, the only point of RAID is protecting against drive failure, so if you're using RAID to an extent is it worth paying for more expensive drives which are less likely to fail if you're protected against it anyway? All drives will fail eventually, it's just a matter of whether it's sooner or later.
Secondly (and I completely ignored this but the logic does seem to make sense) one of my colleagues mentioned that in a RAID array it's worth buying two different types of disk as if you buy two identical disks at the same time it's likely they've come from the same batch and with current tolerances that increases the chance of them failing at a similar time, potentially increasing the risk that the second drive dies before you replace the first. Worth considering.

FWIW this is my backup setup which I wrote up following a Twitter discussion a while back, very similar to a previous posters, using FreeFileSync to copy everything to the NAS with RAID which I do every time I've put new photos on the laptop, then every few weeks or so I copy it all to an external USB which lives at work to protect against fire/theft/corrupted files/accidental deletion...
http://chrismdale.co.uk/blog/backing-up/
You mentioned earlier about giving a USB drive to family when you're on holiday, you could still have a fire or burglary when you're in the house or at work etc. so if you want to protect against this you should have an offsite or cloud backup at all times.
 
Cheers Chris, yes I really do need some offsite cloud storage.. Anything you recommend? Just ordered the Microserver and 2 x 3TB WD Red's.. Now let the questions begin about getting nas4free running on it!!
 
technics100 said:
Cheers Chris, yes I really do need some offsite cloud storage.. Anything you recommend? Just ordered the Microserver and 2 x 3TB WD Red's.. Now let the questions begin about getting nas4free running on it!!
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I can't speak from experience as I just use an offsite USB drive rather than cloud, though I've heard a few people using Amazon Prime and remembered Doug Chinnery mentioning one a while back which was this http://www.dougchinnery.com/syncservice/ - might be worth a look.
I'd be even less help with nas4free questions!
 
Microserver arrived - it's massive.. not sure what I was expecting, possibly thinking it was nas drive size, but def a lot bigger.. waiting on HDD's to come now..
 
right folks, any help is appreciated.. I got my HP server and HDD's arrived today, so have just mounted them.. Reading up on FreeNAS and version 9 needs 8Gb RAM, I only have 4Gb.. don't fancy spending more money at the minute, so what are my options?

Older version of FreeNAS
Synology
something else?
 
You could try NAS4free instead of FreeNAS. Although 8GB is recommended you can probably get away with 4GB with two data disks in a mirror.
 
I started looking at it all last night, I opened the microserver and it has 4gb in one slot, so will get another 4Gb of RAM.. it will make a better job of it.. I might try and install freenas and get it running with 4gb without loading any data and then upgrade to 8gb in a few days when the ram arrives.. Ahh more money!!

I started to feel a bit out of my depth last night when reading all the stuff, I would say i'm reasonably techinally minded, but this stuff just seems to go over my head. freenas on USB stick and loaded into machine, so just need to rob a VGA cable from work
 
Right, I have it up and running.. although is there a decent guide for setup of the HDD's? Basically all I'm after are a network drive letter with folders. which is mirrored onto both 3TB drives.. getting lost on youtube and online with all the different guides..
 
ohms12 said:
I have a HP N54L Microserver. Bought for something like £70, brand new. It's got a few WD Red drives in it, running Synology OS. I have Plex running for all my streaming needs to my TV/iPad/Laptop etc (all done without HDMI), an in-built Download client, and backups for my laptop/phones via Time Machine (running a Retina Macbook Pro). Added native app support (on iOS & Android) and I can access, upload and download from my server anywhere in the world, even from my phone.

Cheap, reliable & functional. Frankly, i'm not sure what else you'd need! :D
Click to expand...

How are you streaming with Plex to your TV without a HDMI connection?
 
I have Synology installed - its built in natively via an app! I just direct my tv to the IP Plex creates for itself. Easy.
 
FreeNAS needs the RAM mainly for disk caching. I suspect it will be fine with 4GB.

By running Plex on a server, you still need a client that can connect to a server and play back the content. This could be:
a) A Raspberry Pi or another computer connected to your TV via HDMI
b) A web browser on a PC, Smartphone or Tablet
c) A native app on a Smart TV, Roku or similar such device

I've never actually used FreeNAS, but I would imagine there are many guides on the Internet which should walk through a fairly typical set-up.
Storage on the disks will be handled by the file system, in this case ZFS (which stands for Zetabyte File System). You will need to create a storage pool (zpool) with your drives (vdevs) in. I'm guessing you want the data on the disks mirrored. Under Linux, this is the command I used to create my zpool, with optimisations to suit Windows file sharing:

sudo zpool create -f -O aclinherit=passthrough -O casesensitivity=mixed -O nbmand=on -m /zfs/biz biz mirror /dev/disk/by-id/ata-Hitachi_HDS723020BLA642_MN1220F32027XD /dev/disk/by-id/ata-ST2000DM001-9YN164_W1E21B0T

This command specifies a mount point of /zfs/biz, a pool name of 'biz' and a vdev arrangement of 'mirror'. And then it goes on to specify the two physical disks I'm using, one is a Hitachi drive and the other is a Seagate.
Once the storage pool is created, it's then possible to create ZFS file systems on top of it.

The file system can then be shared using Samba. It is the Samba sharing (over Server Message Block protocol) that allows Windows devices to map the network drives as drive letters you can see in File Explorer. ZFS features built in support for Samba, so you can share ZFS file systems just by setting a property on them.

With FreeNAS, you shouldn't need to get that involved in creating zpools and ZFS file systems, I just thought it might help to try and explain a little bit about what was going on under the hood.
 
Finally got it up and running. it now has 8Gb ram and running freenas 9.1.. got user and permissions working and have got a mapped network drive.

How do I check if it's mirroring all my data on the two drives?
What would be the best way / tool to backup this drive up onto an external USB HDD? synctoy or similar?

Thanks
 
It will be. If you have root terminal access you should be able to do:

Code: 
# zpool status

  pool: biz
 state: ONLINE
  scan: scrub repaired 0 in 2h8m with 0 errors on Sun Oct 30 09:08:57 2016
config:

   NAME                                  STATE     READ WRITE CKSUM
   biz                                   ONLINE       0     0     0
     mirror-0                            ONLINE       0     0     0
       ata-TOSHIBA_DT01ACA300_Z3FHGA0GS  ONLINE       0     0     0
       ata-TOSHIBA_DT01ACA300_Z3FHG9SGS  ONLINE       0     0     0

errors: No known data errors

That will confirm your vDevs are mirrored, in which case you can be certain your data is being written to both drives.
 
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