Change to eBay selling rules ... return of faulty/not as described goods.

gramps

gramps

Messages
41,835
Name
'Gramps'
Edit My Images
No
eBay have announced a change to the rules affecting returning faulty/not as described goods to sellers:-

Starting from 15 September, we will introduce requirements that all sellers take responsibility for return postage on items which are faulty or not as described. The majority of our sellers are already providing a great returns service, but for those sellers who choose not to facilitate a return or provide/fund return postage for items that are faulty or not as described, we may refund their buyers without requiring them to return the item and in turn we will seek reimbursement from sellers.
Click to expand...
 
Postage costs are high enough just sending out, let alone having to pay returns postage as required. What if they just change there mind and return, descriptions of items will need to be extremely detailed to avoid returns. But I suppose it will stop the few who try to rip people off.
 
If I was returning something faulty or not as described to anyone, eBay or otherwise, I would expect the seller to refund the return postage as well as the purchase price and original postage cost.

The buyer should not be one penny out of pocket if the item is not correct.

I don't see this as a change, more of a clarification.


Steve.
 
I'd also make sure as a seller you have evidence of the item condition and serial number as I'm assuming this could be the ideal opportunity for someone to buy a working whatever it is and return the broken one to the seller claiming it didn't work. I wonder what ebay will do about that?
 
So whats to stop the buyer changing his mind, damaging the goods in some way then returning for a refund ??
It's like any rule it will be abused and some sellers will consider this another nail :arghh: with the buyer being handed a bigger Hammer..

I'm glad i only sell the odd item as most of us do :ty:
 
It's an easy fix.... Stop selling on eBay.
eBay has made it so difficult for sellers these days, but forget that without sellers, they wouldn't have any buyers.

I agree that faulty returns should be covered by the seller, but how will ebay police abuse?
Since when to auctions and private sales fall under distance selling regulations anyway.

Ebid is sitting there waiting to be used. If sellers just packed and moved there, eBay would have to rethink their strategy
 
Last edited:
ebay is getting more strict and greedy. not only they want 10% even from postage cost now, they leave open gate for not honest buyers. guaranteed return in this case may be to much abused - buy for weeknd , treat as free hire, and return with silly excuse.. no good i think.
we should ban ebay.
 
Flip side of it...if you bought a lens from anther country such as US or Asia, the return tracked and insured shipping is usually £30-50 depending on level of insurance required. And if you got really high value goods the insurance for that alone is likely to be high enough to put off anyone try to return it.
 
I stopped selling on eBay a long time ago - in part due to being fleeced by dishonest buyers claiming things didn't arrive - not as described etc - as any of you who have dealt with me on here will know I don't falsely advertise or scam, but sadly there are a lot of people out there who will try it on - I even know someone I used to work with who bragged they would buy something swap it and return saying not it was the wrong thing and a myriad of other scams - needless to say he got an earful! The oddest thing is that other than that he was a really nice guy.

To me it all started to go wrong when negative feedback for the buyer was stopped.

Anyway now I just stick to here (for photo kit) or my wife's facebook groups - sure I don't get anywhere near as much, but at least I won't be out of pocket.
 
Last edited:
Ebay is really doing themselves over slowly... Sellers have no rights and as said above the system will be abused and how are Ebay going to ensure that the return item actual got returned?

Trust is with the buyer and not a 2 way system that it should be.

I just sold a sofa on ebay and at the time didn't know about the paypal collection scam... luckily buyer was honest and all was good but that scam is all about the buyers having far too many rights.
 
From a buyers perspective I think its a good move, I have bought a couple of items which I have had to return as they were either faulty or not in the condition as described, each time I had to fork out the return postage cost(s). It has certainly put me off buying and to paraphrase a post above, without buyers there will be no sellers, it's two way street. I can see it making sellers more accurate in their description, after all in a real auction you would be allowed to see an item before bidding. From a sellers point of view and I have sold a few things it now makes it pretty pointless selling something really cheap, maybe E-Bay are trying to go upmarket.
Matt
 
I no longer sell on ebay since they hiked fees up years ago. They are greedy, and policies like paypal on collection (a sure way to lose item and money) only support that.

But refunding of postage is actually in line with distance selling regulations - i.e. nothing new here at all.
 
I have a small business on eBay as well as my full time job. Ever since the start of this year they have been getting greedy and implementing things that are just plain stupid. At the start of the year i had hardly any claims for INAD then they introduced the new seller standards and boom cases opened constantly and pretty much any time a seller contacts you now it opens a case unless they click the other function but this hasn't been sent out to buyers, just something I've noticed when googling.

I also will have to offer this silly round the world shipping service (unless I can opt out). I like the idea in theory but they are forcing rules on people that are arbitrary and going against the whole point of eBay.

I have also seen in some faq's about these new services that I also need to offer free returns until jan 31st on purchases made in November and December if I want to keep my seller standards (already trashed because of the amount of claims all of a sudden for silly little things)

Claims are geared towards buyers and it is so hard to win a case opened against you. I had one for non delivery where the signature was the same name as the recipient. Case opened as non delivery, signature provided, eBay refunds seller anyway. His wife signed for the parcel it turns out and had forgot to tell him it was there. Had to fight eBay to get my money back.

They are trying to be like amazon / physical retail shops and it's not working. If anything it's killing eBay and I am seriously looking at moving to amazon to sell my items as the fees are on about a par now.

Distance selling regulations are another annoying thing. I had someone buy a brand new laptop, use it for a weekend (I know they did as they left their files on it) and then return it so I had to issue a refund. They only wanted it for the weekend as they asked me to get it up to them for the Friday on a special delivery as they had to do a presentation on the Saturday. I know why we have the DSR and that this person was a jerk and I'm just venting at the rubbishness of eBay and I've been up since 4am and grumpy
 
I no longer sell anything on ebay it's just not worth the hassle, I will only buy on there. It's just far too risky for sellers, as there are so many opportunities for buyers to cheat the seller :(
 
Last edited:
daugirdas said:
But refunding of postage is actually in line with distance selling regulations - i.e. nothing new here at all.
Click to expand...

It's also common sense. There is no reason why the buyer should have to pay for a seller's mistake.

This week we had an example of great customer service by Amazon. My wife bought an illuminated bathroom mirror for £99. Whilst she was out, an electrician fitted it and got rid of the packaging. When she got home, my wife realised that Amazon had sent the wrong one. She contacted them and was initially offered a £40 refund (which would have been fine) but she asked about any other mirrors they had similar to the one she actually ordered.

They agreed to send us a slightly larger one which would have cost £140 and just keep the one we already had.

The new one turned up the next day.


Steve.
 
ecoleman said:
It's an easy fix.... Stop selling on eBay.
eBay has made it so difficult for sellers these days, but forget that without sellers, they wouldn't have any buyers.

Ebid is sitting there waiting to be used. If sellers just packed and moved there, eBay would have to rethink their strategy
Click to expand...

They just need to tidy things up, and change the layout..
 
But refunding of postage is actually in line with distance selling regulations - i.e. nothing new here at all.
Click to expand...

DSR only applies to businesses, not private individuals selling something on eBay.
Not everybody on eBay is a business and should not be forced to adhere to business rules such as having to accept returns until the end of January for sales made in November and December.

Customers just expect too much these days. I had a customer call me yesterday wanting to return something he bought at the end of June. He got quite upset when I told him to p*** off.
 
Last edited:
ecoleman said:
I agree it's no eBay, but who wants another eBay? Remember what eBay looked like 10 years ago?
Click to expand...

Unfortunately ebid has always looked ugly and messy, I suppose that's what puts me off at the moment. Plus the fact that it's dead and nothing seems to get listed other than junk! Maybe if they tidied things up, and made it look more appealing more people may try it out. I know they probably don't have the money to invest in it yet, maybe they need an investor. But there again if they do invest money in it, they will have to recoup it somehow !
 
ecoleman said:
DSR only applies to businesses, not private individuals selling something on eBay.
Not everybody on eBay is a business and should not be forced to adhere to business rules such as having to accept returns until the end of January for sales made in November and December.

Customers just expect too much these days. I had a customer call me yesterday wanting to return something he bought at the end of June. He got quite upset when I told him to p*** off.
Click to expand...
Had a very similar experience with a bag I sold. As the time frame for buyer to open case against seller gets ever longer...I always worry till then.

The buyer had the bag for about 6 weeks then all of sudden contacted through eBay and accusing me of selling fake item and that wasn't as described and made some story that someone else accepted the parcel for him etc etc. Basically highly implausible situations.

Well I told him that I will need the bag returned to me and as I have pictures of the original sale and I will verify those with what he had described and if I found it was true...(unlikely as I am very maticulius in my descriptions of listings) I will refund. But if it isn't true he will have to pay the postage again for me to ship the bag back to him etc etc. The guy wasn't happy about the arrangement and threaten to open case etc etc. And I simply told him he should do what he believes is right and see what happens. So I have not heard anything from him then. He probably realise he can't get away with fraud...
 
This is standard practice with most online retailers these days anyway. I've never had a seller refuse to reimburse return postage costs (when returning due to damage, faulty, not as described, etc.), eBay or otherwise.
 
Tintin124 said:
I just sold a sofa on ebay and at the time didn't know about the paypal collection scam... luckily buyer was honest and all was good but that scam is all about the buyers having far too many rights.
Click to expand...

Made me smile as I read that and then virtually straight away saw this for sale on Ebay LINK

At bottom of page : Quote

If you wish to collect the item and are local to Worthing then that can be arranged, but I will not accept cash payments. Payment needs to be made via Paypal prior to collection.
Click to expand...
 
Mike.P said:
Made me smile as I read that and then virtually straight away saw this for sale on Ebay LINK

At bottom of page : Quote
Click to expand...

Well they can be taken for a ride. Honestly ebay I never collected... give me my money back.
 
daugirdas said:
I no longer sell on ebay since they hiked fees up years ago. They are greedy, and policies like paypal on collection (a sure way to lose item and money) only support that.

But refunding of postage is actually in line with distance selling regulations - i.e. nothing new here at all.
Click to expand...

Yes, it might be in line with DSR - but many of the sellers on Ebay still insisted on the buyer paying the return postage. Over the past few years I have had a few instances of faulty or NOT as Described and even fake items from Ebay. Each time the seller would insist I pay the return postage - despite my reminding them of the DSR. I just contacted Ebay customer service and reminded them of the DSR and on each occasion, Ebay emailed me a pre-paid returns label which I then used to send the item back. But I suspect many buyers didn't bother and either paid the return postage or binned the item if the return cost was close to cost of the item.
 
I recently bought some electric screwdriver bits on eBay, carefully selecting a set of 6 different heads. When they arrived, all 6 heads were the same. After I raised a dispute the seller agreed to accept a return if the bits were sent via recorded delivery. Postage inc recorded delivery would have cost more than the bits did so I gave up - but it is this sort of practice that needs to stop.
 
Tulipone said:
I recently bought some electric screwdriver bits on eBay, carefully selecting a set of 6 different heads. When they arrived, all 6 heads were the same. After I raised a dispute the seller agreed to accept a return if the bits were sent via recorded delivery. Postage inc recorded delivery would have cost more than the bits did so I gave up - but it is this sort of practice that needs to stop.
Click to expand...

How much were the bits? I would return them just on principle if you feel the seller is relying on the cost of return postage to dissuade you.
I would first open a case against the seller (if you have not already done so) and demand he pays covers the return postage cost. If he refuses, then contact Ebay - phone is probably best - explain the situation and tell them that DSR requires the seller to pay for returns for faulty / NAS items. You might have to persevere a bit and insist you should not have to pay the return postage. They will then email you a return postage label - either a Royal Mail or Collect+ drop off label.

As mentioned above I have used this technique several times where the seller was clearly selling shoddy goods and then relying on the prohibitive return cost to minimise returns. I even used it return a faulty £5 item - purely out of principle - because when I tried to appeal to the better nature of the seller and suggested he refund me without a return, he accused me of trying to rip him off - only for me to then realise the item was a fake! I sent him proof - photos of the original vs his fake - and he stopped responding! So, I just used the above technique - apparently their seller rating takes a hit each time Ebay have to step to resolve a situation - this rating is separate form the normal Ebay feedback score.
 
The driver bits were something like £3.29 inc postage. If I remember correctly recorded delivery was going to be around £2.30. It was one of those things that I'd have shoved back in the post if the buyer had not stipulated recorded delivery.

I have found in life that if someone wants to screw a tiny amount of money out of you they will go to extra ordinary lengths to do so. Life goes on.
 
gramps said:
eBay have announced a change to the rules affecting returning faulty/not as described goods to sellers:-
Click to expand...
Not a second too late.I have had to take out 3 County Court summonses to get return postage paid on items not as described.The usual "return the item for a refund by recorded delivery at your own expense if you want full refund"that's flebay saying that, after I have opened a case and won it! They(flebay) still say I have to pay the return postage.flebay have been disregarding the DSR for far too long.They have allowed business sellers to state terms and conditions on return postage that were totally illegal.

I only use flebay as a last resort now.Selling or buying.The fees for selling are to go up to from max £45 to £200 +next month I am told.
 
Tulipone said:
The driver bits were something like £3.29 inc postage. If I remember correctly recorded delivery was going to be around £2.30. It was one of those things that I'd have shoved back in the post if the buyer had not stipulated recorded delivery.

I have found in life that if someone wants to screw a tiny amount of money out of you they will go to extra ordinary lengths to do so. Life goes on.
Click to expand...

I know what you mean - usually not worth the hassle - but I just don't like being knowingly ripped off. Too many of these sellers are abusing the Ebay return policy to sell dodgy stuff.
But you are right for a £3.20 item would have probably let it go too - just left horrible feedback.
 
harry66 said:
I know what you mean - usually not worth the hassle - but I just don't like being knowingly ripped off. Too many of these sellers are abusing the Ebay return policy to sell dodgy stuff.
But you are right for a £3.20 item would have probably let it go too - just left horrible feedback.
Click to expand...
The thing is that when the buyer tries to leave negative feedback for the seller who will not pay the return postage and the seller has paid the refund OR flebay have found in the favour of the buyer.The seller will request the negative feedback be removed saying "They have refunded the money(which they have) and that they are leaving the item not as described with the seller and it is stated in their terms and conditions of the listing seller must pay return postage" (against the DSR) and Flebay will remove the negative feedback.Fleabay did it to me and when I complained about the negative feedback being removed which simply stated the facts "seller refused to pay return postage on Item not as described"They claimed it was fair to remove the negative feedback as I had received a refund and the seller had left the defective item with me.
 
Tulipone said:
After I raised a dispute the seller agreed to accept a return if the bits were sent via recorded delivery. Postage inc recorded delivery would have cost more than the bits did so I gave up
Click to expand...

The seller should have paid for all extra costs if it was his mistake.


Steve.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top