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This argument has been going on since the dawn of photography,sometimes I think it's just down to how some photographer want to be perceived,as artist rather than photographer.
I'm an art photographer.
This argument has been going on since the dawn of photography,sometimes I think it's just down to how some photographer want to be perceived,as artist rather than photographer.
I am a photographerI'm an art photographer.
it's all about the image
no words needed
"Streetshooter" taught me that
Sorry, bit of a telling off for including some of my images. Couldn't think of anything funny to say
it's all very nice and cuddly and friendly to say that equipment doesn't matter.
but it's also crap.
Anyone can take a nice photo of their kitten or a sunset with a kit lens. In the right hands, iphones take some BEAUTIFUL portraits.
You can't professionally and reliably take photos or make the kinds of images that many types of client require without tens or even hundreds of thousands of pounds worth of equipment (not an exaggeration). The latitude, the noise, the flare handling, the autofocus just isn't there on cheaper cameras, and don't even get me started on frankly most lenses available for 35mm cameras, especially stopped wider open than about f5.6 (when you see phase / 'blad files up close, you find a definition of 'sharp' that simply doesn't really exist in 35mm)
If you could, it would mean I could spend less on kit and more on holidays, hookers and blow. So I dearly wish that it didn't matter. But alas, I'm stuck spending on one single battery powered light, what my brother paid for his last car.
There is not much cuddly about this thread, though it has remained relatively friendly compared to the way some go. However, I think you are missing the point Dave, you are talking about commercial photography, usually with a specific client brief and a desired outcome that will by it's nature have boundaries - and those have already been covered in this thread and pretty much agreed, even by those that prefer the art over the kit, that you need specific and usually expensive equipment for that brief and to be within those defined boundaries.
As a ex pro,yes I had to work within defined boundaries as the job require,but it's also gave me the income to do my own personal work.
Indeed and I guess it's that work that is what this thread is about from the pro perspective. Yes, if you are pro and you have the expensive kit, chances are you are going to use it for personal stuff too, but it isn't the be all and end all. I have also talked to/read/seen lots of pro's getting really excited because they get to 'dump the lump' of big kit and use something different, something small and exciting maybe [remember the almost mass hysteria when the Fuji X100 launched] or unusual, more challenging, such as a good old fashioned film camera, or whatever. In other words, they use the time they have for personal work to take it right away from their day to day stuff.
it's all very nice and cuddly and friendly to say that equipment doesn't matter.
but it's also crap.
Anyone can take a nice photo of their kitten or a sunset with a kit lens. In the right hands, iphones take some BEAUTIFUL portraits.
You can't professionally and reliably take photos or make the kinds of images that many types of client require without tens or even hundreds of thousands of pounds worth of equipment (not an exaggeration). The latitude, the noise, the flare handling, the autofocus just isn't there on cheaper cameras, and don't even get me started on frankly most lenses available for 35mm cameras, especially stopped wider open than about f5.6 (when you see phase / 'blad files up close, you find a definition of 'sharp' that simply doesn't really exist in 35mm)
If you could, it would mean I could spend less on kit and more on holidays, hookers and blow. So I dearly wish that it didn't matter. But alas, I'm stuck spending on one single battery powered light, what my brother paid for his last car.
However, I think you are missing the point Dave, you are talking about commercial photography, usually with a specific client brief and a desired outcome that will by it's nature have boundaries - and those have already been covered in this thread and pretty much agreed, even by those that prefer the art over the kit, that you need specific and usually expensive equipment for that brief and to be within those defined boundaries.
Conversely, give a good pro a 1GB memory card to fill up and a basic camera and I'd expect the average shot quality to be way higher.
Give all-the-gear-no-idea the same and I'd be shocked if, on average (s)he outperformed the pro. It's possible, though, that one picture may be a "wow" shot, but not particularly likely.
If it's not a mod telling you off, it's not a telling offSorry, bit of a telling off for including some of my images. Couldn't think of anything funny to say
A 6 hour bank holiday drive followed rapidly by a couple of bank holiday cocktails may not have helped that...
I know someone who doesn't even need to think, just see's it shoots it, I hate her....lol
She shoots a 35 film or digital compact, the camera takes care of exposure or not as the case maybe, but her pictures are so engaging that technicalities of exposure and construction are completely irrelevant.
I made her take and shoot my D200 on holiday for a week last June, not high end gear but a capable shooter, she came back with 44....yeah 44 on a 16g card.......nothing pictures.
She reckons the gear is a distraction, she doesn't see the same thing with a big lump of technical knobs and buttons in her hands, even the AF focussing as she looks through the finder destroys whatever it was she saw.
I dunno what to say about that....
My analogy.
When you first get a new car, you concentrate more on the controls. Where's the indicator etc etc, too hot how do you turn the hear down. After a few hours, miles, days depending on the individual the car becomes just an extension of your brain. You then just concentrate on the road ahead.....as you should.
A camera is a box with a hole in one side. I like to think that 3.6 billion years of biological evolution makes that fat grey organ housed in my skull, more important.
A camera is a box with a hole in one side. I like to think that 3.6 billion years of biological evolution makes that fat grey organ housed in my skull, more important.
Which is 'one side'Having the hole in one side of the box is an interesting development. The hole in my box is in the front.
You have to train it! Like one of your dogs.i asked my box with a hole in it, to go out and make some creative photographs.
Bugger just sat there.
They come in left and right versions. Or the back for selfies.Which is 'one side'
Yeah my selfies always look like they've been taken by a right old "back side" too...You have to train it! Like one of your dogs.
They come in left and right versions. Or the back for selfies.
i asked my box with a hole in it, to go out and make some creative photographs.
Bugger just sat there.
I'm sure that an future DSLR will have that option in addition to HD video, GPS, tethering, Facebook, etc.Just like mine to make me a cup of tea,every now and then
i asked my box with a hole in it, to go out and make some creative photographs.
Bugger just sat there.
Yeah my selfies always look likethey've been taken bya right old "back side"too...