B&W developing - is this everything?

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Craig
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Just about to order this stuff to develop my own 35mm black and white, just wanted to check this is all I'll need really. I could probably get a couple of the bits and pieces cheaper, but the simplicity of ordering from the one place and a couple of bits from Amazon is appealing.

Below are my shopping baskets. Am I missing anything!?

(Still not decided on a scanner but probably will be a Plustek 8100)

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A small measuring beaker for smaller quantities of fluids - something around 100ml capacity with 10ml or 5ml graduations. (Those big jugs lack accuracy with small quantities.)

Funnel for easy pouring back into the storage containers - something big with good flow.

A second pair of cotton gloves for when one falls on the floor just when you need them to be clean.

I like a glass thermometer - the 12" Paterson ones are very good, but a tad pricey. Handy for stirring as well (although I now use toughened glass stirring rods).


How many 1L jugs do you plan to get?

Maybe a bit early to be able to work this out, but check your chemical quantities for number of films that each can do and balance against shelf life and your expected rate of consumption. If you're mixing up working solution, its shelf life will be shorter than the concentrate.

This sort of thing for the small beaker...

http://www.ag-photographic.co.uk/ap-100ml-graduate-2338-p.asp

...or the Paterson 150ml one. Avoid the tall, thin chemistry lab style - good for accuracy, but very prone to falling over.
 
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I think you're pretty well covered.
The only suggestion is to go for an analogue thermometer
for waaaaay better precision… 5° may make a difference.
 
I've got a cheap digital thermometer - came from Toolstation. In boiling water it reads 100*C and in ice water it reads 1-2*C - close enough for me.

I'd second the suggestion of a more accurate measuring cylinder.

If you might be souping more than 2 films in a session, get extra reels since they need to be bone dry (and spotlessly clean) to load using the ball bearing system.

FWIW, I never used cotton gloves when handling negs. Well, I did once but was more scared of the strips slipping out of my hands than I was of getting finger prints on them!
 
I only really use the cotton gloves when putting the negs into the holders for the scanner. Sometimes when slipping them into the storage sleeves.

Which reminds me...

Scissors for cutting the negs. Long and thin hairdressing types that will cut with one stroke. Make sure the finger holes are comfy.
 
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Looks comprehensive to me
Personally, I wouldn't buy the gloves, the photoflo, the stop or the film clips.
I would buy more jugs.
Heck, I've never owned a film clip and at 6 quid a clip....I'm not gonna...lol
The 1l container I have questions about, for the fix, a 1l milk carton does the job, for dev...well it all depends how you intend to use ID11 powdered developer, but 1l of it shouldn't be around long enough to be an issue
 
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Tesco sell clips -binder clips? - in small tubs of 20 for about £1.00. You'll find them on the bottom shelf in the stationery dept. (Other supermarkets are available :) )

I use 2L plastic milk containers - they're free if you wash them out. Tip- drink the milk first. If you are worried about light getting to the chemicals just put them in a plastic bag.
I did buy a 5L container from a self brew beer shop - opaque with a sealing lid.
 
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PS I just saved you £22, that's a couple of rolls of film.
 
I use these

spring clamps

I swear you can buy them in poundland for a quid for 8, 1 at the top, 2 at the bottom for a weight.
I've used bulldog clips before now, good and strong with a bit of weight to them but they go rusty after a while so I only use them at the bottom and only if I run out of spring clamps after an epic soup sesh..:)
 
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I did buy a 5L container from a self brew beer shop - opaque with a sealing lid.
wine bag ?
I've used those with a tap on, and they are fabulously convenient.
I think the material they're made of is a bit too stiff though, when I got down to about half full, instead of the dev/fix streaming through the tap and collapsing the bag, it stopped collapsing and sucked air in, had to put a weight on it which then made the tap leak, it was all a bit of a faff really but......there ya go, the first 2.5 litres was bonza
 
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Thanks all, I've removed the clips and added the graduated measure. I'm gonna get 3 of the plastic jugs. Also changed the thermometer for an analogue one.

Just picked up an XA3 on the bay too :runaway:
 
Also a much smaller measuring cylinder (or pipette type thing). You'll only need a couple of ml of that Photo-Flo (if I've deciphered the weird instructions correctly!). I use several 500ml jugs to make sure the water is all reasonably up to temperature, but I don't do my washes in running water so that might explain it.

I also use some clipseal beakers for storing mixed fixer and stop in. I'm guessing ID11 is a powder you mix up and then use as stock (*), one-shot. I was going to suggest a bag on marbles to replace used-up liquid and keep the air out (which is what I do with my Ilfosol 3, using 20ml at a time) but what you could use to replace stock I don't know. 9* Maybe it's further diluted, in which case get the marbles!) Otherwise, get a collapsible bottle?
 
Good choice with the AP tank and reels. The wide lip on the reels makes 120 loading a lot easier. Go to the chemists or vets surgery and pick up a couple of syringes in different sizes. I use them for measuring small amounts of developer for stand development. You may have to fill in a form at the chemists when you ask for syringes - something to do with drug use!
 
Should be fine. It's more than I had when I started.

You may have to fill in a form at the chemists when you ask for syringes - something to do with drug use!
Syringes shouldn't be a problem. You're not asking for needles.


Steve.
 
Oh, if you live in a hard water area, get a 5 litre bottle of de-ionised water for the final wash...
 
Should be fine. It's more than I had when I started.


Syringes shouldn't be a problem. You're not asking for needles.


Steve.
They even quizzed me when I asked for just the syringes. Had to sign a form, although it might be because of the salubrious area near the chemists.
 
Think about how many rolls of B&W film you will be processing and how often. If it's going to be relatively infrequently, you may want to think about using a developer that keeps for a long time. I use HC110 for this reason. I'm still using a bottle of syrup that was opened two years ago, and it works perfectly. Ilford's version is Ilfotec HC (https://www.ilfordphoto.com/ilfotec-hc-product). I believe Rodinal has similarly good keeping properties.
 
On the thermometer, I've got one that looks similar to the one in your image which I got for cooking rather than developing but I checked it against my "analog" thermometer and it is spot on and since I can read the digital one without my glasses I now use it for developing as well as cooking
 
Think about how many rolls of B&W film you will be processing and how often. If it's going to be relatively infrequently, you may want to think about using a developer that keeps for a long time. I use HC110 for this reason. I'm still using a bottle of syrup that was opened two years ago, and it works perfectly. Ilford's version is Ilfotec HC (https://www.ilfordphoto.com/ilfotec-hc-product). I believe Rodinal has similarly good keeping properties.

Thanks for the info. I am only getting a small 1L solution of powder of the ID11 as I've never done this before I'm not sure what results I'll get and understand there can be quite a bit of difference depending on the type of developer used. Hopefully I'll get through the 1L within a couple of months easily.

How much developer does it take to fill that AP tank? Presumably at least 500ml, so I'll only get 4 rolls out of that before I decide if I'm happy with it or I want to try something else.
 
I'd have thought the tank would use 300ml per 35mm roll, and about 500ml for a 120. You don't fill it, but use enough dev to cover the reel(s). Need some air above the liquid to get a good slosh when inverting.

ID11 can be used neat or at different dilutions (leading to different developing times). So, the number of rolls can vary.
 
Just checked the dates of my earliest scans from when I restarted using film, and they're April 2010. I'm still using the same bottle of HC-110 (there was a break of a few years), and it works just fine. That's 8 years in a bottle that's been 3/4 to half full. I also use it at what I call dilution 'X' (1+49) with an extra 50% on the times for dilution B (1+31).

£35 for a litre might seem expensive, but it's actually very cheap to use. At current prices, about 21p per 35mm roll (166 rolls per bottle at 1+49). ID11 at £5.95 for a litre, used one-shot, works out at £1.78 per 35mm roll used neat, 89p at 1+1, and 45p at 1+3. At 1+3, the developing times get quite long - double what I do with HC-110 at dil X (Tri-X is 19 minutes at 1+3 in ID11, 9 minutes at 1+49 in HC-110).

The ID11 should be fine for getting started, but it's worth finding out about what else is out there if you think you'll continue with B&W processing in the longer term. As has been noted, HC-110 is a good bet because of its very long shelf life - you're not committing to having to use it up within 6 months or something.
 
Thanks Nomad, good info to know. I've placed the order this morning, I'll develop a couple of rolls first with the ID11 and then really dig into what would be most economical for me going forward.
 
Economy is one aspect, but there are others to consider, like shelf life and convenience, not to mention the effect the stuff has on the film (not all developers behave the same, or produce the same sort of result). Shelf life can affect both economy and convenience - if it's knackered before you've used it all, it costs more in the long run, and you have the hassle of buying it more frequently, and mixing it if it's a powder type.

HC-110 has a convenience consideration in that it's very concentrated and has a syrupy consistency. At 1+49, only 6ml is needed for a 35mm roll, and it's hard to measure that out accurately by pouring some into a beaker. The trick is to use a small syringe, but that means there will soon come a time when the syringe can't reach far enough into the bottle. That's solved by decanting into a smaller bottle regularly and drawing off liquid with the syringe from that. And you need to add the syringe to the stuff to be cleaned every time you dev a film. It sounds like a hassle, but it actually isn't once you get used to it. If anything, it's easier to be accurate quickly with the syringe - can't over-pour into the beaker and then have to put some back into the bottle. And I just wash bits as I go, between tank agitations.

The main reasons I picked HC-110 were the long shelf life, and the fact that Ansel Adams used it (if it's good enough for St Ansel, it's good enough for me). I'm not especially interested in trawling through multiple developers to see what the subtle differences are - as long as the stuff produces decent negs, I'm happy to be pragmatic about it.
 
Other than whats already listed - a large pair of pliers, used to pull off the end of a 35mm film canister, works for me. I have never used cotton gloves and never left a fingerprint on film. I always handled it between 2 fingers across the perforations, though less easy with 120 films.
My preference is a glass mercury thermometer, never broken one, mine is donkey years old. Haven't developed 35mm or 120 film for some time, last was 5x4 B&W.
 
Pliers? I just use an old bottle opener.
 
I always leave the leader sticking out when I rewind. I trim the end and get it started in the reel before it goes into the changing bag, and then load straight from the cassette. Never had any scratches.
 
Pliers? I just use an old bottle opener.
I always used a crown cork type bottle opener too, on the opposite end of the cartridge to the plastic spigot that sticks out, if that makes sense. Done carefully and a bit at a time whilst turning the film cartridge round I could remove the end cap without damaging it, then put it back together again and re-use the cartridge when loading E6 slide film from a daylight bulk film loader... and you try telling that to the kids of today, and they won't believe you! :D
 
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