£500,000,000,000 gamble

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Hi all

I'm a member on three very poular forums and am amazed that it looks like this will be the first post regarding the gov't gambling £500,000,000,000 propping up the banks, just seems like no one's bothered or even considering the implications :thinking: not meant to be a rant :shrug: Just an observation :D
 
Because considering the implications of not taking such action is even more horrific.
 
Stop scaremongering



It's only £400,000,000,000 :LOL:


They have to do something, not to prop up banks, but to stop the stock market going even more into a nose dive. The FT100 has lost approx 30% over the last 18 months.

That's 30% off our pension, 30% off our endowment policy :eek:
 
Scary stuff - we're in a world of serious trouble people! I just hope the big cash injection works, and yep - they really had to do it.
 
2blue4u said:
Because considering the implications of not taking such action is even more horrific.
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As I said, my post was meant to point out that no one is talking about it :thumbsdown: not if it was right or wrong :cautious:
 
were doomed, were all doomed (said with a Scottish accent)






There is the hope that things get hard for Canon and Apple and the prices of all the things I want to buy drop.
 
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whiteflyer said:
Stop scaremongering

It's only £400,000,000,000 :LOL:

They have to do something, not to prop up banks, but to stop the stock market going even more into a nose dive. The FT100 has lost approx 30% over the last 18 months.

That's 30% off our pension, 30% off our endowment policy :eek:
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:LOL: so now when we retire we give them £20,000 for an income £700 pa.

as said elsewhere 'scary stuff'
 
Keep your money under your bed, or in plastic bags stored in your cistern, like me, and you'll be much better off!

Hurrah for capitalism! The big bank bosses will still sleep well knowing they'll continue to get their multi-million bonuses and golden parachutes, so we shouldn't worry.
 
welly said:
Keep your money under your bed, or in plastic bags stored in your cistern, like me, and you'll be much better off!
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That doesn't sound very safe - if you pm me your address (and a note of the times that you'll be out of the house) I'll send you a free leaflet on financial security :LOL:
 
<--- looking out stripy jumper and bag marked "swag".

Hmmm....can't find them anywhere.....I don't think Tony Blair can have returned them to me before he jumped ship with all our money went off to promote peace in the Middle East ;)
 
Flash In The Pan said:
<--- looking out stripy jumper and bag marked "swag".

Hmmm....can't find them anywhere.....I don't think Tony Blair can have returned them to me before he jumped ship with all our money went off to promote peace in the Middle East ;)
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:LOL: :LOL: :LOL:
 
Flash In The Pan said:
<--- looking out stripy jumper and bag marked "swag".

Hmmm....can't find them anywhere.....I don't think Tony Blair can have returned them to me before he jumped ship with all our money went off to promote peace in the Middle East ;)
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So your saying Blair did a Maxwell, but didn't drown.

The bank bale out will give Brown yet another excuse to raise taxes, not to worry I'm sure he'll find a few hundred million to give to the little kiddies in Africa, so they can get a better education. Our kiddies will just have to pay for their own education, because the government can't afford to pay for OUR kiddies at Uni. :shake::shake:
 
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we are about to go through some serious turmoil, but to be honest i think its for the best in the long run

we might start realising again that we dont always have to buy new stuff
we'll stop wasting so much stuff because we wont be able to afford to
rediculously priced things will actually come down to a sensible price (houses, fuel)
families might spend more time together
we'll stop borrowing money thinking that it'll magically pay itself back
we'll stop buying stuff just to get one up on the neighbours

and then of course once we are out of the recession things will gradually get back to how they are today and we'll be back in deep **** again. these things normally happen in 20 year cycles roughly
 
Yesterday was rather fraught for me, wondering where my Icesave savings had evaporated to. So, thanks to the rest of you for not (yet) rioting and allowing Mr Dahlink to attempt to bribe/rescue me.

Paper money isn't as much value to the Icelanders with their rapidly devaluing currency. What's worth accumulating, to barter, I wonder?

My sister has about 20 watercolours by our grandfather, and I'd consider myself lucky to leave 20 photos of equal interest. The painting paraphernalia is much cheaper and the endeavour must be more satisfying, and many materials can be pressed into service when the fuel for far eastern tog imports starts to peter out.

I've grown veggies this year -- first time for ages. I'll swap you some nice curly kale for that lens, Mister.

I've ordered fleece fabric for a background. Less creases and easy to wash, plus its sections can be used as blankets and to keep the draughts out.
 
badgerbaiter said:
we are about to go through some serious turmoil, but to be honest i think its for the best in the long run

we might start realising again that we dont always have to buy new stuff
we'll stop wasting so much stuff because we wont be able to afford to
rediculously priced things will actually come down to a sensible price (houses, fuel)
families might spend more time together
we'll stop borrowing money thinking that it'll magically pay itself back
we'll stop buying stuff just to get one up on the neighbours

and then of course once we are out of the recession things will gradually get back to how they are today and we'll be back in deep **** again. these things normally happen in 20 year cycles roughly
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:agree:

Many be the banks will start to treat those of us who have savings a little better, and realize the best customers are not always the ones in debt.


I heard a financial guy a few months ago saying this would be the best time to get rich. When the markets bottom out those of us with savings/money will be able to buy buy buy and make a killing later. ;)
 
whiteflyer said:
So your saying Blair did a Maxwell, but didn't drown.
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Shame...

whiteflyer said:
The bank bale out will give Brown yet another excuse to raise taxes.
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:eek: WHAT... He needs an excuse...

Anyone care to work out the intrest rate on £500,000,000,000 pa ? This is actually quite interesting in that they have to borrow the money to prop up the banks from the banks :thinking: then pay the intrest to the banks... WTF sorry... it's getting too complicated :puke:
 
badgerbaiter said:
we are about to go through some serious turmoil, but to be honest i think its for the best in the long run

we might start realising again that we dont always have to buy new stuff
we'll stop wasting so much stuff because we wont be able to afford to
rediculously priced things will actually come down to a sensible price (houses, fuel)
families might spend more time together
we'll stop borrowing money thinking that it'll magically pay itself back
we'll stop buying stuff just to get one up on the neighbours

and then of course once we are out of the recession things will gradually get back to how they are today and we'll be back in deep **** again. these things normally happen in 20 year cycles roughly
Click to expand...

The kind of people who get themselves into huge amounts of debt will always do so, recession or not. I know a guy who ran up a 6-figure cc debt in two years and was (unsurprisingly) bankrupted.

You'd think that would be a lesson, but the first thing he did when he was clear of his repayment orders was to take out a whole new raft of credit cards and two new mortgages....:shrug:
 
whiteflyer said:
:agree:

Many be the banks will start to treat those of us who have savings a little better, and realize the best customers are not always the ones in debt.


I heard a financial guy a few months ago saying this would be the best time to get rich. When the markets bottom out those of us with savings/money will be able to buy buy buy and make a killing later. ;)
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That's how Joseph Kennedy ( father of JFK) became so wealthy, he was able to buy up huge amounts of real estate at bargain-basement prices when the markets collapsed in 1929..
 
whiteflyer said:
:agree:

Many be the banks will start to treat those of us who have savings a little better, and realize the best customers are not always the ones in debt.
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True, but they cost the banks money so they are not that interested :cautious:

whiteflyer said:
I heard a financial guy a few months ago saying this would be the best time to get rich. When the markets bottom out those of us with savings/money will be able to buy buy buy and make a killing later. ;)
Click to expand...

True again... Hopefully
 
So, can anyone explain how it affects us normal folk - ie those of us with no savings ?
We have nothing in any bank/building society, no pension funds - nothing at all, bar the cash in our pockets. We do own a house, and a car - all paid for.
How will it change our lives ?
I imagine those with savings will suffer to some extend, but I can't be the only one who spends all he gets (I do have a 5d and a few lenses !) and lurches from one pay cheque to the next here, or can I..?
 
whiteflyer said:
They have to do something, not to prop up banks, but to stop the stock market going even more into a nose dive. The FT100 has lost approx 30% over the last 18 months.

That's 30% off our pension, 30% off our endowment policy :eek:
Click to expand...

Everyone has an opinion, but it's wrong to say they HAD to do something - there is always a choice. In my opinion it is an enormous mistake. In the US the same thing - the pressure on congress and senate was massive, the market will crash if a huge bailout is not given. The bailout was given...and the market continued (and continues) to crash anyway.

Before people state what should and should not be the solution, they really need to understand the problem. If the explanation of the problem does not include the phrases "credit default swaps", "counterparty risk", and "quadrillion dollars", they need to spend a bit more time defining the problem, before taking money out of the REAL economy and throwing it into the disneyland that the financial sector has become. If the banks fail, the real economy goes on. If the real economy is taken down, everything goes with it - the banks are secondary, but they're not being treated like that.

Look at AIG, huge news as they were "bailed out" a couple of weeks ago with 85 billion. How many people read that they got another 38 billion dollars this week? Where did the previous 85 billion dollars go?! In two weeks?!?!

At the moment we have deflation, huge deflation. That is not bad for pensions - your money buys more in future. As an example, from 1997 until today our money has lost 10-20% per year in value relative to houses - now your money is gaining in purchasing power again, 10% or more per year relative to housing. It's not all bad. It's bad for debtors, but maybe that's no bad thing.
 
steveinspain said:
So, can anyone explain how it affects us normal folk - ie those of us with no savings ?
We have nothing in any bank/building society, no pension funds - nothing at all, bar the cash in our pockets. We do own a house, and a car - all paid for.
How will it change our lives ?
I imagine those with savings will suffer to some extend, but I can't be the only one who spends all he gets (I do have a 5d and a few lenses !) and lurches from one pay cheque to the next here, or can I..?
Click to expand...

If, as looks increasingly likely, governments try to bail out the banks by monetising the debts, those with savings can wrap them around a cardboard roll, and hang them in the toilet.

With no savings, the major problem will be the hit as the economy slows, plus the much higher tax burden in future as the government pays the interest on the debt (to the bankers....). On top of that, with a slow economy, we may see increased public spending, as a bit of Keynesian stimulus - more tax required for that.

Based on the latest IMF forecast, government borrowing will need to be £150-200bn, versus Darling's current forecast of....£23bn. :wacky: That's a LOT of money we'll be coughing up in the future.

But we have to do it....apparently.:rules:
 
i must be one of the very few people that believes they shouldnt be putting any money into this.

At the end of the day, a bank is a business, and when they were making £50bn a year in profit they at no time said " here my blair have a few million as we have it spare "

Banks are in the business of making money through investment, if they cock this up thats their problem not ours.

Then onto this guaranteed savings policy to put people at ease. Now i can appreciate it cant be a nice feeling to find all your savings have just gone bankrupt, but the saver/investor surely takes this risk to earn interest vs the mattress route.

What happens here is the rich and wealthy get all their savings back that were lost, then next april taxes go up to get back the cost of doing this, and the hard working people who have no savings and merely scrape by, find themselves even worse off than last year because now they haveto pay more in taxes to recoup the money the government gave to rich people to bail them out of a bad investment.
 
The problem is everyone talks like its the governments decision to spend their money.

They are spending our money

I wonder how many people who thinks they have done the right thing would have written a cheque out themselves from their savings to help their bank out in this time of hardship....

May sound silly but that is actually what has happened, we just didnt get a say.
 
i wonder..if my mortgage lender goes bust, who do i owe my mortgage money to?
 
matty said:
i wonder..if my mortgage lender goes bust, who do i owe my mortgage money to?
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If it goes bust and it crashes and it isn't bought/sold on to another company/government, then you have no debt to pay. The only problem you may have is getting the title deeds to your property back.

99.9% of failing banks debt will be sold on unfortunately, so it looks like you will have to pay up whatever happens to your bank.

In the states (this word has more than one meaning :LOL:) there has been a lot of court cases of mortgage payers taking the new owners of the debt to court because THEY DO NOT ACTUALLY HAVE A CONTRACT WITH THE NEW OWNERS OF THE DEBT. Most win the case as even though the banks have been bought they generally cannot find the contract to bring to court.

I wonder who will try this first in the UK.
 
I think if our (local) government had put their money into british banks (instead of foreign banks i.e. Icelandic) in the first place they might not be in such deep doodoo now.
 
what gets me is this meltdown is caused by the americans goverment driving prices up like oil to try and boost the dollar now they are ******** themselfs and asking all the other rich countries to jump in and back them up in the situation they have started

its all greed on a massive scale the general public will foot the bill yet again and pay the fatcats in parliment to eat their 12 course meals and be driven around in there jags to and from their 5 bedroom mansions it just makes me sick why should the goverment of any country stockpile money like 700 billion dollars when they have so many on the poverty line

sorry if i am running lol

but as i rent i am in a better situation than those who own as when the house prices plummet i will buy. those who own will lose money some will be in negative equity if not already and will face losing their house all caused by greedy fat cats
 
tiler65 said:
If it goes bust and it crashes and it isn't bought/sold on to another company/government, then you have no debt to pay. The only problem you may have is getting the title deeds to your property back.
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Are you sure about that?(Because I honestly don't know) I'd have thought like any other business which goes into liquidation the receiver has an obligation to recover all debts outstanding. How the receiver could do that with mortgages though is a bit unclear.
 
tiler65 said:
In the states (this word has more than one meaning :LOL:) there has been a lot of court cases of mortgage payers taking the new owners of the debt to court because THEY DO NOT ACTUALLY HAVE A CONTRACT WITH THE NEW OWNERS OF THE DEBT. Most win the case as even though the banks have been bought they generally cannot find the contract to bring to court.

I wonder who will try this first in the UK.
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It actually happens quite alot.

Mainly when a debt collector buys a debt with no paperwork, i dont know of one thats actually gone to court, the debt collector normally bottles it when this point is made to them.
 
should just split the money between all of us, we put it in the banks which supports them and we have some money as well so public spending goes back up again
 
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