450D: Upgrade to 60D, or upgrade lens?

M

Mini1

Messages
16
Edit My Images
No
Hi guys, newbie here!

Right... I've had my EOS 450D for just over three years now. I'm starting to get a bit tired of the standard 18-55mm lens, and the noise in low-light situations.

I do have two other lenses - a Canon 50mm f/1.8, and a Canon 55-250mm. I absolutely love these two lenses. I had always been fine with the kit 18-55, but I just get the impression that it's starting to lag behind the other two in my collection.

I've come to the dilemma of upgrading the body, or getting a better lens. I've seen that plenty of people seem to recommend Canon's 24-105mm, but at £850 (cheapest price) it does seem very, very expensive for a lens, however amazing it may be (particularly considering I'm a student!). If I went for an upgrade, I would probably go for a 60D, probably with the 17-85mm lens (I think?) that comes with one of the kit deals.

So... is there anyone who's upgraded from 450D to 60D? I know the general rule people seem to go by is upgrade the lens first, but I feel like I've already got a few good lenses! I personally feel that the 450D seems a bit beginner-ish (this is how it constantly gets labeled) and do feel ready for an upgrade body-wise. However, I'm keen to see what other people think. Any recommendations? Would you stick or upgrade? Maybe you'd do both? And if you'd stick, what lens would anyone recommend to act as a replacement for the 18-55 kit?

Sorry it's a long post but I'd really love some opinions! Thank you all in advance :)
 
A lot of interesting thoughts there. I don't really think that the upgrade from 450d to 60d is enough (my opinion) - but you do get better AF and faster FPS on continous. A 7D would be an awesome upgrade!

I think that there a few lenses to look at - the 17-55 f/2.8, the 15-85 ef-s and the mighty 70-200 f/4 which is so sharp, but you'll lose the extra 50 off the tele end on your 55-250.
 
upgrade the lens everytime , better glass will make more difference. I use a 70-200 2.8 non is on the wifes 450d occasionally and way better than the kit lens.
 
manualfocus-g said:
Depends what your needs are. The 60D is way better than the 450D in terms of control, build, screen, high ISO performance, AF, viewfinder, video etc.

If you need any of those things to improve your photos, then a new body is the right move.
Click to expand...

The high ISO performance is certainly appealing. I notice the poor ISO performance on my 450 particularly when using the 50mm lens indoors. We were at a restaurant yesterday for example, and there was quite a bit of noise. And I'm not a fan of using flash. The video is also appealing. I'm fine with the build of the 450, but the 60D definitely feels like a step-up quality-wise when I had a hold of it...
 
aeronic said:
A lot of interesting thoughts there. I don't really think that the upgrade from 450d to 60d is enough (my opinion) - but you do get better AF and faster FPS on continous. A 7D would be an awesome upgrade!

I think that there a few lenses to look at - the 17-55 f/2.8, the 15-85 ef-s and the mighty 70-200 f/4 which is so sharp, but you'll lose the extra 50 off the tele end on your 55-250.
Click to expand...

I bet a 7D would be a brilliant upgrade... but unfortunately I think it's probably a bit too expensive and heavy for my needs. I'll take a look at the lenses you've mentioned - is there a definite marked improvement with these over and above my 18-55 IS kit?
 
Thanks for the replies guys... I'm still as confused as every! I'll look at the lenses mentioned, any other comments would still be very welcome! Need as many views as I can get before I make a decision :)
 
I'm being swayed towards upgrading my lens and getting some other equipment to go with it, and maybe upgrade the camera next year or something.
So, the lenses you guys have mentioned:
17-55mm f/2.8
15-85mm EF-S
70-200mm F/4 - not sure if this may be a bit big/heavy as a walkabout lens.

Any others to add to that list? Are the Sigma/Tamron ones worth a look? Cheers.
 
I would avoid the 17-85, whilst the build and focus speed is much better than an 18-55, it's not that sharp IMO, and the contrast is a bit lacking too.

The 15-85 is it's sort of replacement, and it's a lot more expensive.

The 17-55 is very popular, but also comes with a hefty price tag.

I have the 24-105, and it was a huge improvement over the 17-85, but whether it's of use to you depends on how much you use wide angle. I don't use it much and have a Sigma 12-24, so the 24-105 wasn't too much of a compromise for me. I'd say the 15-85 and 17-55 would make more sense without a dedicated wide angle lens in your bag already.
 
The higher ISO of the 450D surely shouldn't be that bad? Maybe you could look at how you are processing your shots?

As for lenses v bodies, I like smaller and lighter bodies but I also like wide apertures and one issue that I would have with a smaller body is that you're limited to 1/4000 sec as your max shutter speed. That's no problem in most situations but if using a fast aperture in strong light it's easy to exceed 1/4000 and on a xxxD that pushes you towards filters so that pushes me towards the XXD.
 
woof woof said:
The higher ISO of the 450D surely shouldn't be that bad? Maybe you could look at how you are processing your shots?

As for lenses v bodies, I like smaller and lighter bodies but I also like wide apertures and one issue that I would have with a smaller body is that you're limited to 1/4000 sec as your max shutter speed. That's no problem in most situations but if using a fast aperture in strong light it's easy to exceed 1/4000 and on a xxxD that pushes you towards filters so that pushes me towards the XXD.
Click to expand...

It's by no means awful, no... it's just that sometimes when boosting the colour during processing, it really shows. In most circumstances, it's absolutely fine. I think when I was writing that I was just gearing up to change my camera :p

Think I'll be changing the lens for now, so keep the suggestions coming, people!...
 
HoppyUK said:
Check out this deal from Tescos - 60D plus 17-55 2.8 for £999 http://direct.tesco.com/q/R.211-1426.aspx

It's a mistake, should be £500 more than that :eek:
Click to expand...

Goodness gracious me... and that's with a good lens, right?!! As in that 17-55mm lens is the one everyone is recommending?!!! The one that's on Amazon for ~£700 ALONE???? Well this throws a spanner in the works... thanks for pointing it out! They'll be out of stock in no time! Oooh tempted.
 
Last edited:
Mini1 said:
They'll be out of stock in no time! Oooh tempted.
Click to expand...
I wouldn't hang around if you're thinking of that. It may be a mistake that they subsequently refuse to sell you, but that does look like a bargain. You couldn't pick that up second hand at that price IMHO.
 
Have you thought about picking up a second hand 40D or 50D as a cheaper way of upgrading your body without blowing loads of cash that's probably better spent on a lens? Probably much better bang-for-buck than a new 60D.

Your 450d might not feel so "beginner" anymore if you slap, say, a 17-55 f2.8 on it. When I put my 70-200 f4 IS on my old 350d the impressively sharp and colorful images made me realised that the sensor was actually pretty good. The f2.8 would help your AF as well.
 
Xenon54 said:
Have you thought about picking up a second hand 40D or 50D as a cheaper way of upgrading your body without blowing loads of cash that's probably better spent on a lens? Probably much better bang-for-buck than a new 60D.

Your 450d might not feel so "beginner" anymore if you slap, say, a 17-55 f2.8 on it. When I put my 70-200 f4 IS on my old 350d the impressively sharp and colorful images made me realised that the sensor was actually pretty good. The f2.8 would help your AF as well.
Click to expand...

Yeah that's another thought. I'm still steering more toward lenses, but that 60D deal does seem to be a good one. Liking the look of 17-55mm too...
 
Get the 17-55. While the 60D is pretty awesome, you won't get the same WHAM in terms of new capabilities that the 17-55 will provide. Maybe the addition of video and flippy screen might make it seem like a huge upgrade, but that 2.8 glass and USM will make that seem like childs play! The 24-105 is terrific, as I can attest for it being my main walkaround, but the 17-55 is just... better when it comes to APS-C. If they made it for FF you'd better bet that it would have a red ring on it!

Besides, going back to another kit lens will probably make you less happy than going for the best EF-S lens you can buy!
 
Last edited:
Seriously, that deal is probably a typo, or only limited stock, and will be removed soon. As mentioned before, even if you buy it you might get a call saying they can't sell it at that price and it was a mistake ... in which case you're into arguing they honour the original price etc etc.

If you want the deal, buy it today. Remember you have a 14 day right to return "cooling off period" under the distance selling laws (as long as you don't use it).
 
Xenon54 said:
Seriously, that deal is probably a typo, or only limited stock, and will be removed soon. As mentioned before, even if you buy it you might get a call saying they can't sell it at that price and it was a mistake ... in which case you're into arguing they honour the original price etc etc.

If you want the deal, buy it today. Remember you have a 14 day right to return "cooling off period" under the distance selling laws (as long as you don't use it).
Click to expand...

...so if it ends up actually being the 17-85mm, I could return it. Hmm. I'm gonna have to make a decision pretty sharpish...
 
Not sure exactly what the laws are, maybe someone else could chime in, but I think if they advertise an item at a specific price and in stock, and physically take the money from your card, they might be obliged to sell you the item at that price regardless. I could be wrong though. At the very least, Tesco have a reputation to uphold, so they might honour the price even if they don't actually have to (there's always hope!).
 
Mini1 said:
...so if it ends up actually being the 17-85mm, I could return it. Hmm. I'm gonna have to make a decision pretty sharpish...
Click to expand...

It's a typo. And if you look on Tescos listings there are a few other typos, but they're just inventing non-existant lenses! One digit changes everything LOL That bundle is £1530-1600 anywhere else http://www.camerapricebuster.co.uk/prod1605.html

I'm amazed it's still up, but it's been there all weekend and chatted about on other forums. Looks like they mean the 60D/17-85 which is also listed at that price, but the lens shown in the 17-55 and the catalogue number is different.

Worst case scenario - they honour the deal, and you sell it on for £1250 :eek:
 
Don't waste your time. It's a pricing error. Tesco is cancelling all those orders.

(And, yes, you'd think they'd update their website first....)
 
furq said:
Don't waste your time. It's a pricing error. Tesco is cancelling all those orders.

(And, yes, you'd think they'd update their website first....)
Click to expand...

How do you know? :-/ It all seems very real - they've even got the right lens in the picture... but as I and everyone else thought, it does seem too good to be true.
 
Xenon54 said:
Not sure exactly what the laws are, maybe someone else could chime in, but I think if they advertise an item at a specific price and in stock, and physically take the money from your card, they might be obliged to sell you the item at that price regardless. I could be wrong though. At the very least, Tesco have a reputation to uphold, so they might honour the price even if they don't actually have to (there's always hope!).
Click to expand...

Well yeah, considering nobody seems to be doing anything about it, if it is an error. I'm with you - they technically have it advertised at said price, and logically, that would be the price I'd pay at the checkout online. Hmm...
 
HoppyUK said:
It's a typo. And if you look on Tescos listings there are a few other typos, but they're just inventing non-existant lenses! One digit changes everything LOL That bundle is £1530-1600 anywhere else http://www.camerapricebuster.co.uk/prod1605.html

I'm amazed it's still up, but it's been there all weekend and chatted about on other forums. Looks like they mean the 60D/17-85 which is also listed at that price, but the lens shown in the 17-55 and the catalogue number is different.

Worst case scenario - they honour the deal, and you sell it on for £1250 :eek:
Click to expand...

Yeah... I'm fairly sure the 18-85mm they've got advertised doesn't exist! And yeah the 17-85mm is also listed, but as you say the saving is different (obviously) as is the photograph and the catalogue number.
 
Xenon54 said:
Have you thought about picking up a second hand 40D or 50D as a cheaper way of upgrading your body without blowing loads of cash that's probably better spent on a lens? Probably much better bang-for-buck than a new 60D.

Your 450d might not feel so "beginner" anymore if you slap, say, a 17-55 f2.8 on it. When I put my 70-200 f4 IS on my old 350d the impressively sharp and colorful images made me realised that the sensor was actually pretty good. The f2.8 would help your AF as well.
Click to expand...

:plus1:
 
Have they actually cancelled peoples orders on that then? It's gotta be worth a punt just to see if they'll actually do it!
 
Personally, as I used to have a 300D and upgraded to the 30D. The improvement was immense, just from an ease of use stand point. I've just bought a 60D and that's a big improvement over the 30D again (although I prefer the feel of the 30D).

One thing I did when I got the better camera was upgrade the lenses AFTER getting used to the new body, settings, etc. It's entirely up to you, but I preferred getting the body upgrade. However, if you were jumping to the 5dMKII I'd say upgrade lenses first.

I suppose you could drive yourself insane with this, but a cheaper way would be lenses first as there are some very good lenses that cost less than a new body. Sigma 50mm 1.4, 70-200 F4, etc. You could make certain you've surpassed your current camera that way and get to keep the lenses when you do upgrade.
 
Tesco deal has gone up to £1588. Therefore I think I'll be going for just the 17-55mm f/2.8 lens :)
 
Supposed to be a cracking lens, but be warned, it'll lead you down an expensive path.....
 
Xenon54 said:
Supposed to be a cracking lens, but be warned, it'll lead you down an expensive path.....
Click to expand...

Really?

Personally, buying the *best* EF-S lens put an end to me buying lots of cheap, crap lenses. :)
 
I think they meant it more from the point of view that you'll start looking towards the more expensive lenses for the future now you've spoiled yourself :D
 
Xenon54 said:
Supposed to be a cracking lens, but be warned, it'll lead you down an expensive path.....
Click to expand...

I think that if I get this, I won't be purchasing another for a while :p certainly not at this price! However, I've come across a second-hand one that's quite a bit cheaper than Amazon's price, for example. Is it worth buying a second-hand lens, will it be as good?

Cheers people!
 
Bluesmachine said:
I think they meant it more from the point of view that you'll start looking towards the more expensive lenses for the future now you've spoiled yourself :D
Click to expand...

I know it's an expensive hobby isn't it... I'll just have to get the absolute best out of this lens before I purchase another!... :D
 
Just thought I'd let you all know that I went for the 17-55mm f/2.8 lens. It came today. Mixed emotions about it so far... it's kind of like my 50mm f/1.8 but with the zoom functionality. Only really tried it around the house/outside but at the moment, I'm not noticing the enormous difference I was expecting between it and my 18-55mm.
 
I'm in the same position as you were when you started the thread Mini, on afew occasions the 1600ISO has let me down but the biggest problme has been that my 50mm 1.4 is too long indoors and I love the lens but cant use it anywhere :( I'm saving for a 7D or 5DII and should have one in a month or 2.
The 17-55 is supposed to be awsome but theres always the odd few copies that will be off, also if the body is a little off and the lens as well the error may add up. Oh and dont forget the 18-55 IS is a VERY nice lens for what it is, so what if its a kit lens, that doesnt make it any worse than any other lens.
 
Mini1 said:
Just thought I'd let you all know that I went for the 17-55mm f/2.8 lens. It came today. Mixed emotions about it so far... it's kind of like my 50mm f/1.8 but with the zoom functionality. Only really tried it around the house/outside but at the moment, I'm not noticing the enormous difference I was expecting between it and my 18-55mm.
Click to expand...

Perhaps you were expecting too much, or hoping for the wrong things. 17-55 is a superb lens, but the kit jobbie isn't bad either, as I think you said in your OP. If you shoot at mid-range apertures, you will not see much difference unless you're pixel peeping.

However, the kit zoom doesn't run to f/2.8, and at the longer end it's a full two stops down at f/5.6. Translating that back to noise, which was your original reason for upgrading, it's like dropping from ISO1600 to ISO400, or grabbing two stops extra shutter speed.

That's mainly what you're paying for, but you also have the 50 1.8 for that. Maybe look at something like the Sigma 30 1.4 if you don't like using flash - a much more versatile focal length.

Or maybe a new body will give you more of what you're wanting. 60D for example is a couple of generations better than your 450D, and has a few more nice features that would give you more of the 'instant gratification' we all hanker for when spending a lot of money ;) But be assured that your 17-55, even if it's not the jump up you expected, is as good as it gets.
 
An old, old thread I know....but just incase someone comes here via a search on Google, I thought I'd I'd add my 2 penneth worth!!

I've had a 450D for about 3yrs and though it produces great pics, I've always yearned for that 'little bit extra', after renting an L lens a while ago for a family trip...the difference was like night and day....¬

Got myself a D60 on the way.......if anyone fancies a great starter kit in DSLR...giz a bell!! ;)
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top