5DIII Flash Sync Speed

JohnN

JohnN

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Hi,

I read on strobist that flash sync of 200 was not very good (here) (they were referring to a D600 Nikon body but that neither here nor there), so I though I'd look and see what mine was and I found this in the manual.

Sync Speed
The Camera can synchronize with non-Canon compact flash units at 1/200 sec. and slower speeds.
Click to expand...

So this raised a question - if I'd have had a Canon flash would it have been higher?

Also is the comment I read actually valid or just a hardcore strobist thing?
 
The 5DIII has a maximum sync rate of 1/200 with a Canon Flash.

I did not follow the logic that they gave in the Stobist link as I had thought that the limiting factor was the type of shutter we have in our cameras -viz focal plane shutters which are composed of two curtains, one that slides out of the way to expose the sensor, and another that closes behind it.

Above the max sync speed, your flash fires when the rear curtain has begun closing, and thus part of sensor is blocked and doesn't get any of the light from the flash. Wikipedia's article on the focal-plane shutter does a good job of explaining this - click here
 
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X-sync speed is a limitation imposed by the camera's focal plane shutter. Most are around 1/200sec, some run to 1/250sec, Canon 1D4 will do 1/320sec I think, and with a Pocket Wizard you can push that to 1/500sec.

The case for higher x-sync speeds is put in the link you posted, though for most folks that's greatly exagerated. Just switching the flash (not camera) to high speed sync is the usual fix. You can run right up to 1/8000sec with that and I use it a lot, but you lose a lot of power with HSS and only the better quality guns have it.

The difference between 1/200sec and 1/250sec is there, but it's rarely going to be a deal breaker. 1/500sec, yes now that's a worthwhile difference, but the Nikons mentioned in the link that could do it are long discontinued (D70, D40 etc). They had CCD sensors that could be switched on/off electronically at 1/500sec, overcoming the inherant problems of the mechanical focal plane shutter.
 
With a suitable flashgun and suitable triggers or a long ETTL cable you can use higher shutter speeds - see your camera manual for an explanation of HSS flash (basically the flash pulses for a longer time to cover the travel of the shutter).

The limitation of x sync speeds has always been a factor, one of the reasons wedding photographers used to shoot medium format was for their leaf shutters.
Depending on your flashgun it might be capable of high speed sync. What flashgun is it and what budget do you have for triggering devices? And do you really need higher sync speeds?
 
Cheers all - I've had a look and quick play with my Nissin Di866 MkII and HSS is working well, although it seems I've lost the ability to trigger it wirelessly now - no doubt Canon pushing their very expensive new flash.
 
JohnN said:
Cheers all - I've had a look and quick play with my Nissin Di866 MkII and HSS is working well, although it seems I've lost the ability to trigger it wirelessly now - no doubt Canon pushing their very expensive new flash.
Click to expand...

What are you using to trigger it? I thought remote HSS was supposed to be a feature of the Mk2 Nissin?
 
It is, sadly it looks like Canon ditched the IR transmit on the 5DIII (just google trawling to confirm)
 
I had a pixel king wireless trigger for my 5d2 it let me fire the flats right up to 1/8000 worked great, only problems you need the newer flashes, not sure if it works with studio
 
Aye, confirmed (both here and elsewhere) - had anyone tried the ST-E2 (either Canon or Yongnuo).

I just had a play around with my Yongnuo RF-600TX but that would only trigger on manual mode.
 
JohnN said:
It is, sadly it looks like Canon ditched the IR transmit on the 5DIII (just google trawling to confirm)
Click to expand...

5D3 doesn't have a pop-up flash, therefore it cannot fire/master any remote gun.

Remote triggering is done by the flash gun, using visible light pulses. The camera can control it (with certain guns) but has nothing to do with the actual transmission. There's no true IR involved, just near-IR on the receiver unit behind the dark red panel.

Your MT-24 flash has a master facility, that should trigger the Nissin remotely though it may not allow remote HSS - not sure. Does the MT-24 have HSS? If it does, it probably will; if not, prolly not.

PS There are often a few quirks with third-party kit when a new camera comes out. You should abe able to download a firmware upgrade, or get it upgraded by the manufacturer.

Mark Anthony said:
The 5D Mk3 doesn't support remote HSS yet.
Click to expand...

Yes it does, all Canon DSLRs do. HSS is primarily a flash gun function, all the camera does is provide the trigger signal.
 
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HoppyUK said:
Your MT-24 flash has a master facility, that should trigger the Nissin remotely though it may not allow remote HSS - not sure. Does the MT-24 have HSS? If it does, it probably will; if not, prolly not.
Click to expand...

You are a God, I never even thought of that :)

Thanks for the other advice too - I'd seen it was the pop-up that triggered the flash, I just had it in my head the 5DIII was an all round upgrade, I forgot it was a shift in camera type too
 
Mark Anthony said:
Or another way.. Remote HSS triggering doesn't work using the 5D Mk3 yet.
Click to expand...

I did see a YouTube video saying you can get hss with the st-e2
 
Mark Anthony said:
Ok I'll rephrase it.. Wireless triggers that previously worked with other models don't work with the 5D3 yet. Thought it was pretty obvious what it meant myself though.
Click to expand...

Not obvious at all. That's not what you said.

Mark Anthony said:
Or another way.. Remote HSS triggering doesn't work using the 5D Mk3 yet.
Click to expand...

Using what triggers? If you go outside the Canon system, there are often compatibility issues with new cameras. But the 5D3 absolutely works in remote HSS mode. I have a 5D3 and four 580EX guns here, all doing it fine.

This thread is giving the impression that somehow HSS doesn't work on the 5D3, when of course it does. It's just that some third-party master controllers might need upgrading (if possible).
 
Cheers again - I managed to get the MT-24EX to fire the Nissin, just set the channel and group, Nissin on remote and off it popped at 640\s so HSS looking good too.

Hugely different on the menu's though - the MT-24EX sets everything manually, the camera doesn't seem to have any control over it at all but it does know what settings have been set.

Next challenge is to stop the MT-24EX from firing.
 
Mark Anthony said:
I'm using pw's seemingly like most other frustrated 5d3 owners that I've come across.
So are you using the flashes to trigger the other flashes?
Click to expand...

Yes, using Canon 580EX as master to fire Canon 580EX slaves. I don't use auto-TTL triggers, though I have Phottix Strato II triggers with E-TTL pass-though and they also work 100% with the 5D3. I'd be surprised if they didn't - it's only pass-through after all.

It's not really surprising that Pocket Wizard is having to do a bit of work making their Mini/Flex triggers work with the 5D3. Their whole system is custom- profiled to individual camera models rather than a blanket Canon brand - that's where they get the performance enhancements from.

And very clever and useful they are too, but every camera is different. 5D3 might be a bit more tricky than expected, but they'll get there. Beta version is out now.
 
I just tried using the MT-EX on my son, but I quickly ran into an issue - yesterday I was using the 100mm to test which fits fine, but the 85mm - no adapter so has to dangle and I just learnt first hand that flashes get hot as it warmed my beard :)

I'm now thinking of just abandoning that idea and getting some YN622C's
 
Now, you might think it from some of my kit that I'm minted - sadly not - plus I'm just dabbling so dropping over £2K isn't something I can do, now if I were a pro that might well be different as I could offset the costs, thanks though
 
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As an update I've just ordered a pair of YN-622C's so will give them a test - no doubt if they're okay I'll get another one, having HSS & ETTL on remote flash should be pretty handy.

I did consider selling the YN-600/602's but it hardly seems worth the effort.
 
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