A new take on auction hijack!!

mjb123

mjb123

Messages
1,187
Edit My Images
Yes
I'm an avid ebay watcher i've nearly always got half a dozen things that i'm watching on ebay intrigued into how much they will sell for and more often than not they go for not far off a brand new item!! So i very rarely by anything unless its a buy it now bargain!
So i had the idea the other day of contacting one of the sellers in this case he was selling a canon 15-85! I explained that these lenses sell on average for around 380 and that when you take off the fees he would be looking at cashing in less than 340, so i made him an offer to which i had no reply for a couple of days, then i had a message from him saying that he would happily except my offer!
Unfortunatly he was to late i had already spent the allocated money on something else but i will defo give it a go again!!
I no if someone messaged me when i was trying to sell something i would bite there hand off!! :)
 
As a seller ebay are very very careful about off ebay selling via a message etc

They will ban a seller just for hinting at selling and not getting their fees

Ebay fees of 15 % with paypal are unreal and they now go only cap at £750 or £75

so you sell a £750 camera you will give ebay almost £100
 
I do it regularly if I find something (not necessarily photography equipment) that is local to me. But I'll only ever collect in this sort of arrangement.
 
twist said:
Works fine if you collect but it's a huge risk if you don't.
Click to expand...

If you still pay through PayPal then you should be covered! No??
 
mjb123 said:
If you still pay through PayPal then you should be covered! No??
Click to expand...

No, as you would have to pay via ppg to avoid the fees you're using as a bargaining tool. there won't be a transaction associated with it so it would be no different to doing a bank transfer to a stranger.
 
faddius said:
No, as you would have to pay via ppg to avoid the fees you're using as a bargaining tool. there won't be a transaction associated with it so it would be no different to doing a bank transfer to a stranger.
Click to expand...

I thought paypal fees were about 3-4%, that's a far cry from what it's been said above that ebay take.
You can pay via paypal and state the payment is for goods and / or services without it being related to ebay, or as a paypal gift.
 
Last edited:
Paypal is a sister company of ebay! So you pay paypal is like paying ebay!
 
I understand that, but if the paypal fee is 3-4% then that's a lot lower than the fees related to the auction. So you sell the item and get hit with 3-4% fees instead of 15% fees.
Makes a bit of a difference surely ?
 
So with regards to the classifieds on here! How safe is it to do a bank tranfer with someone you don't no??
 
mjb123 said:
So with regards to the classifieds on here! How safe is it to do a bank tranfer with someone you don't no??
Click to expand...

I've seen a dodgy character selling a 150-500mm lens recently!:naughty:

I suppose you can check their name / address and phone them up for a quick chat but beyond that there's a lot just based on trust and the feeling you get through their interactions on the forum. Is that any better than someone on ebay with 100+ psotive feedback and nothing remotely negative ?
 
stu.artd said:
I've seen a dodgy character selling a 150-500mm lens recently!:naughty:

I suppose you can check their name / address and phone them up for a quick chat but beyond that there's a lot just based on trust and the feeling you get through their interactions on the forum. Is that any better than someone on ebay with 100+ psotive feedback and nothing remotely negative ?
Click to expand...

I no I've been trying to sell that for ages, and it was only when I did sell it to one member I exchanged my bank details and then he pulled out that I started to worry about safe it really was!!
 
Last edited:
On here the mods will try to help you if they can so you can go to the police. It's also why it's strongly recommended to exchange full contact details and to check them as best as you can so you have a starting point to work from if things go wrong. There again it's debatable as to whether most people actually read the rules or guidelines, and often get upset because they haven't. So on their own heads be it. Even so, I'd very wary of spending large sums of money on here, I'd rather take a trip, meet up with the seller and pay cash so I can check goods beforehand.

With PayPal, it's extremely easy to set up a fake account with false information and use the money in other ways even if they dont register and confirm a bank account. Such as buying items from online stores and collecting them in person, addresses wont get checked as the shop isnt posting and even the name is unlikely to be checked. Neither PayPal or eBay will care if you get stung like this, half the time they don't care if you get stung by a recognised scam. At least PayPal has some sort kind of support if things go wrong, but for eBay it's non existent in my experience.

Put it this way, I don't believe you can have a PayPal or ebay account or direct debits till you're 18. I've had active accounts with direct debits since I was 13. Never used for any illicit or dodgy activity, but I've always had a lot of use for eBay, buying and selling essentially provided me with a healthy amount of pocket money through my teenage years. PayPal did find out my age at one point when a d/d bounced. They didn't care.
 
I customarily ignore people who ask me to end auctions earlier... then report them to Ebay. It's an auction. Place your bid or GTFO. Sorry... but if I wanted to sell it I'd have put a buy it now price on there.
 
mjb123 said:
So with regards to the classifieds on here! How safe is it to do a bank tranfer with someone you don't no??
Click to expand...

The only time I've bought from the classifieds here, I made sure I had the seller's full details -Real name, geographical address etc, then checked on Google Earth (to make sure the address existed) and in his local 'phone book to make sure he actually existed at that address. Only then did I stick a (crossed) cheque in the post to him, upon receipt of which (and clearance time - as agreed), he popped the lens in the post to me, RMSD. I trust banks even less than I trust strangers, so did the cheque thing rather than BT - and I regard PayPal as a completely unregulated bank, so wouldn't trust them as far as I could throw the Old Lady of Threadneedle Street! I don't do direct debits or standing orders either which can be a pain (some organisations give discounts to those who pay by DD) - I'd rather go to the bank and pay a cheque over the counter - that way, I know the payment's been made and have written proof of it!
 
mjb123 said:
So with regards to the classifieds on here! How safe is it to do a bank tranfer with someone you don't no??
Click to expand...

There's always going to be a very slight risk involved in any Internet transaction, but at least here you have the itrader rating to go by, and of course the mods can help to.

I've never had a bad experience on the classifieds here, and to be honest I'd much rather buy here than eBay.
 
EspressoJunkie said:
There's always going to be a very slight risk involved in any Internet transaction, but at least here you have the itrader rating to go by, and of course the mods can help to.

I've never had a bad experience on the classifieds here, and to be honest I'd much rather buy here than eBay.
Click to expand...

:plusone:

Must admit I buy quite a lot of stuff on Ebay and have had very few problems but I try to deal with the "Best rated sellers" when buying items, especially if it involves a fairly large outlay.

But as always it is a case of "Caveat Emptor".

.
 
Last edited:
I to am amazed at the used price of lenses. Do a bit of hunting and you will find new prices with 2-3yr warranties for not much more. Incredible i sold my 50mm f1.4g on ebay at the start of the year for £300, you could buy it new for £295! This is why i've never bought a second-hand lens.

If you pay by paypal outside ebay you are still covered.
 
This is certainly not a new thing, this has been happening since the dawn of eBay, and at the end of the day everyone is out for a bargain (why else would you be looking on an auction site), i see it as no different to haggling over something in a shop or market, ok eBay might lose out on a small %, but a drop in the ocean in the grand scheme of things

But as said, if you buy outside of eBay then you have no protection what so ever on your purchase
 
rpsmith79 said:
But as said, if you buy outside of eBay then you have no protection what so ever on your purchase
Click to expand...

If you pay by paypal you are fully protected. You don't have to be a ebay customer to use there service. Thousands use there shopping cart feature on there own online stores.

I've run ebay stores for about 10yrs now, its my full time job.
 
Last edited:
Yes sorry, i should have said if you pay by gift via Paypal you have no protection, and since buying outside of eBay you are trying to buy cheaply, it seems a lot of people will also send money via the Gift function to avoid paypal fees

I do a lot of buying & selling on car forums and 99% of tranactions to and from me are done as a gift, but you takes your chances and all that jazz ;)

It also means you can't complain to eBay if something isn't as described etc as you didn't buy through eBay, so you do lose a certain amount of protection i suppose
 
Last edited:
rpsmith79 said:
Yes sorry, i should have said if you pay by gift via Paypal you have no protection, and since buying outside of eBay you are trying to buy cheaply, it seems a lot of people will also send money via the Gift function to avoid paypal fees

I do a lot of buying & selling on car forums and 99% of tranactions to and from me are done as a gift, but you takes your chances and all that jazz ;)

It also means you can't complain to eBay if something isn't as described etc as you didn't buy through eBay, so you do lose a certain amount of protection i suppose
Click to expand...

Yep, I think a lot of people don't realise that PPG offers no protection at all. I'm surprised by how many people use it. A safer means to do business is to make a goods payment. The disadvantage is that the receiver then pays the pp fee but this can be offset by the payer over paying in the first place.
 
I bought a camera off another forum a couple of years ago, paid using PP (goods transaction rather than gift) and the item didn't turn up. Turned out that the guy was conning me and a couple of others. I figured I'd be fine as PayPal would sort it, however as it was a private sale (not on eBay or through a shop) they refused to do anything. Fortunately I had no funds in my pp account so used my credit card and my credit card company recovered the funds for me. I doubt that PP would cover you for purchases of eBay items made away from eBay to avoid he fees.
 
mjb123 said:
So with regards to the classifieds on here! How safe is it to do a bank tranfer with someone you don't no??
Click to expand...

I've bought and sold here and I've never had a problem, everyone has been a complete joy to deal with.

Personlly I only buy from ebay when it's cheapo stuff like adapters and DVD's from companies selling at Buy It Now as I've had too many issues with private sellers.
 
I think the reason used auction items sell for the same price as new, is because there are "ebayholics", who have to win the auction at all costs. Hence the bidding becomes unrealistic.
 
Something is really wrong with the used market at the moment, particularly ebay. Recession madness?

And +1 for cash on collection for any transactions not going via ebay (even then it's much better to).
 
It's mad, cash on collection is the safest option if you're a buyer or seller. But I'll make mention of a scam currently doing its rounds and proving quite popular regarding PayPal and collection.

You sell an item, buyer pays via PayPal and collects in person, no problems, no fuss. But the money is then refunded shortly after as the buyer either claims fraudulent activity on their account and denies having anything to do with the transaction or files an item not received case.

In either situation, your word and version of events won't be good enough for PayPal to not leave you out of pocket. As you didn't post, PayPal will claim you have broken their seller protection terms as you must have proof of postage to the buyers verified address (which is usually fake in this situation). The buyers signature on a print out of the auction isn't good enough either, PayPal will only accept proof of postage which you won't have in this situation, leaving you out of pocket without the goods.

Police aren't generally interested either, saying its a eBay / PayPal issue but will let you file a report if you want to be another statistic. It also doesn't matter if you've drawn the money out of PayPal, they'll just put your account in negative figures and hound you with debt collectors / threaten to take you to court. Worse yet, if you have cards registered for automatic payments they will try to draw the money from them.

I know of at least 5 people who have been caught out this way in the last 18 months or so. I'd have deemed it fairly safe as long as I got a signature before I started noticing this situation happening more and more frequently. It's generally happening with small high value items, like laptops and mobile phones so cameras and lenses are likely to fall into what's desirable for this scam.
 
Good thread this I have used E bay since 2004 well over 500 transactions and sell and buy on there. Fees are insane on sales now and like others the fees are differing off paypal between 3 and 5% ( i think it depends if the buyer is using a credit card)

In the years with e bay i had one negative feedback and it really annoys me as the buyer never even paid.

I have used the paypal dispute resolution when someone sold me a dodgy CS4.

Only got 6 trades on here and maybe a dozen on other forums no issues.

The one item i sold on here i basic sold at e bay less the fees i never lost buyer won and if he wanted to sell here he gets most money back e bay after fees gets most of the money back.

Thing i have found remarkable on the classifieds is some really think that you will pay the same used as new, while i am sympathetic they don't want the item any more it does seem fair they loose some money as first buyer and warranty user i guess the biggest issue for all of use is gear is dropping in price and we have a loss bigger than before..
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top