Beginner Action shots are pants!

JD007F

JD007F

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Name
James Franklin
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Hi guys,

Need a little help when taking action shots of things, I use to be pretty good with my old lenses and camera but since having my 760d and tamron lens all action shot I get are blurry and look awful[emoji85], it's just simple picture like last night playing around taking some of the dog running round etc.
Hope someone can point me in the right direction, I have the camera on manual and the lens on af and vc on too of this helps.

Many thanks
 
Are you using AI Servo, and how are you selecting your focus points?

Why Manual? Try TV mode to keep the shutter speed up,many Auto ISO too. Concentrate on the important things when taking pictures, too many people think the 'important stuff' is using Manual mode or spot metering or a load of other stuff that can make the job harder rather than 'better'.
 
What shutter speed are you using? You need at least 1/640, preferably 1/1000 for a racing dog. As said above, you are making things unnecessarily complicated using manual. Tv and auto-ISO would simplify things greatly.
 
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Hi guys,

Okey dokey I see what you mean about making things more complicated than I need to. I only shoot on manual as I find I take most photos a lot easier it's only since I started taking a few action shot I was confused why I couldn't take them any more.

Phil- no I'm on one shot so that could be one issue I'm guessing! The iso is on auto. Okey dokey that's cool, I'll give tv ago over the weekend when I get a while to play around.

Madwoman- I didn't have the shutter speed no where near that [emoji85]useless I am. So if you have the shutter speed up around that then the aperture would need to be around f5.0-f8 that right? But I guess if I have it on tv I wouldn't have to worry about the aperture.

Thanks for the help guys I'll take a few pics over the weekend and pop them up on here to see how things have gone.

Hope that's ok and thanks for all the help [emoji1360]
 
JD007F said:
Hi guys,

Okey dokey I see what you mean about making things more complicated than I need to. I only shoot on manual as I find I take most photos a lot easier it's only since I started taking a few action shot I was confused why I couldn't take them any more.

Phil- no I'm on one shot so that could be one issue I'm guessing! The iso is on auto. Okey dokey that's cool, I'll give tv ago over the weekend when I get a while to play around.

Madwoman- I didn't have the shutter speed no where near that [emoji85]useless I am. So if you have the shutter speed up around that then the aperture would need to be around f5.0-f8 that right? But I guess if I have it on tv I wouldn't have to worry about the aperture.
Click to expand...
If you're shooting Manual on a Canon 760d with auto ISO, you're not shooting Manual at all. Desist immediately, you're just creating frustration, you have no control over your exposure, you're just knob twiddling and allowing the camera complete control over your actual exposure (Canon don't give you exp comp in Manual - so all your settings are just choice of SS and aperture with Canon setting your exposure with the ISO).

For action, use TV and auto ISO, then at least you can either use exp lock or exp comp, and you can be confidant that your chosen SS will get you the shot.

And totally confused why you would imagine that one shot AF will get you a shot of something moving.

As above, you're making life difficult, really it's quite simple if you apply a tiny bit of logic.
 
Just on the TV v Manual thing... There is a disadvantage to shooting TV as the camera may well select the widest aperture, or at least that's what my cameras usually do and that can lead to thinner DoF than you'd ideally want.

I normally shoot in aperture priority until the shutter speeds drops too low and then I often switch to manual mode, dial in the shutter speed and aperture I want and let auto ISO float. OK, There may be no exposure compensation with the Canon but at least you get to set the shutter speed and an acceptable aperture. There may be scope to change the exposure post capture although I do realise that with Canon this may mean taking an image quality hit.
 
woof woof said:
Just on the TV v Manual thing... There is a disadvantage to shooting TV as the camera may well select the widest aperture, or at least that's what my cameras usually do and that can lead to thinner DoF than you'd ideally want.
Click to expand...
Less DOF and most likely less sharpness. I never use S/Tv because I always care about the aperture (my desired aperture) *the most.*
I typically work in A/Av with auto ISO and appropriate auto ISO limits set. But I have no issue using manual with auto ISO... I do this when I care equally about the aperture and the shutter speed. On Nikons EC works, and also on some (very few) Canons. Where EC does not work, changing the metering mode can be enough to shift the exposure to where you want it. If not, back to A/Av or even full manual. TBH, full manual is probably the easiest way to get good exposure if the light/situation is relatively constant.

Basically, you need an aperture that is sharp enough, a shutter speed that is fast enough, and an ISO that allows for them. You need an AF mode that will keep up with the subject (continuous/tracking) and a larger DOF helps compensate for AF errors. Exactly how you get there is fairly irrelevant...
 
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sk66 said:
On Nikons EC works, and also on some (very few) Canons. Where EC does not work, changing the metering mode can be enough to shift the exposure to where you want it. If not, back to A/Av or even full manual. TBH, full manual is probably the easiest way to get good exposure if the light/situation is relatively constant.
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I use a Sony A7 and Panasonic MFT cameras. The former allows exposure compensation with auto ISO in manual mode but the latter don't and to me this seems such a shocking omission that I have a problem understanding why. Allowing auto ISO and exposure comp in manual seems a brain out win win decision to me.

As the MFT cameras have x2 crop for DoF I suppose the issue of the camera selection the widest aperture might not be quite so bad unless a very wide aperture lens is being used, not having auto ISO and exposure comp in manual is still a PITA though.
 
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woof woof said:
I use a Sony A7 and Panasonic MFT cameras. The former allows exposure compensation with auto ISO in manual mode but the latter don't and to me this seems such a shocking omission that I have a problem understanding why. Allowing auto ISO and exposure comp in manual seems a brain out win win decision to me.

As the MFT cameras have x2 crop for DoF I suppose the issue of the camera selection the widest aperture might not be quite so bad unless a very wide aperture lens is being used, not having auto ISO and exposure comp in manual is still a PITA though.
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We get it Alan, but it doesn't help the OP or the vast majority of Canon users (and let's not underestimate that means a possible majority of all photographers) for whom Manual with Auto ISO just doesn't fly because of the lack of EC.

It's OK discussing it as a great feature, but it's a pipe dream for too many, including the OP. :thinking:

Let's take that a step further, the OP has clearly been picking up tips on the interwebs that have led to him making mistakes we're trying to fix, and one of those mistakes is using M and auto ISO. :(
 
JD007F said:
Madwoman- I didn't have the shutter speed no where near that [emoji85]useless I am. So if you have the shutter speed up around that then the aperture would need to be around f5.0-f8 that right? But I guess if I have it on tv I wouldn't have to worry about the aperture.
[emoji1360]
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I tend to use f/4 on fast lenses (using manual with auto ISO and exposure compensation on my 7D2), but with slower lenses I just use Tv and let the camera open the lens up to its widest aperture. I do a LOT of dog photography.
 
Hi guys,
Thanks for the huge response and different views of opinion. I have given it all a good read and going out maybe later to give it a go and see what images I can get. Soon as I have a few I'll pop them on and see what the opinions are and see which way I need pointing in the right direction. Thanks for all the responses [emoji1360][emoji1360]
 
Phil V said:
We get it Alan, but it doesn't help the OP or the vast majority of Canon users (and let's not underestimate that means a possible majority of all photographers) for whom Manual with Auto ISO just doesn't fly because of the lack of EC.

It's OK discussing it as a great feature, but it's a pipe dream for too many, including the OP. :thinking:

Let's take that a step further, the OP has clearly been picking up tips on the interwebs that have led to him making mistakes we're trying to fix, and one of those mistakes is using M and auto ISO. :(
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Phil, I take it you missed my first post. The post you quote is in response to the post above it rather than helping the op and my point... as you missed it is that using M with auto ISO even without EC can be a valid choice. Using a Canon like this isn't impossible and wont bring about Armageddon. I use my own cameras that don't allow EC in M like this when I think it's the best choice. You just need to think about the implications of shooting with the various options.

The worst case scenario that I can see when shooting in M without EC is that the image quality may take a hit if you're fiddling with the exposure post capture and we all know that Canon aren't the best in this situation so the question is how big a hit (if any) and this then needs to be balanced against the advantage of being able to set both your shutter speed and the aperture whilst in M.

The alternatives of shooting in AP or TV aren't exactly the ultimate answer to life the universe and everything as Ap may give too low a shutter speed and Tv may give too wide an aperture. With f3.5-5.6 lenses Tv may not be an issue but with a fast prime you can end up with every shot being taken at f1.4.

As to if this helps the OP. I hope it does. Thought and knowing your camera and the results it's capable of (with PP) and some practice sessions should help the OP decide the best settings.
 
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woof woof said:
Phil, I take it you missed my first post. The post you quote is in response to the post above it rather than helping the op and my point... as you missed it is that using M with auto ISO even without EC can be a valid choice. Using a Canon like this isn't impossible and wont bring about Armageddon. I use my own cameras that don't allow EC in M like this when I think it's the best choice. You just need to think about the implications of shooting with the various options.

The worst case scenario that I can see when shooting in M without EC is that the image quality may take a hit if you're fiddling with the exposure post capture and we all know that Canon aren't the best in this situation so the question is how big a hit (if any) and this then needs to be balanced against the advantage of being able to set both your shutter speed and the aperture whilst in M.

The alternatives of shooting in AP or TV aren't exactly the ultimate answer to life the universe and everything as Ap may give too low a shutter speed and Tv may give too wide an aperture. With f3.5-5.6 lenses Tv may not be an issue but with a fast prime you can end up with every shot being taken at f1.4.

As to if this helps the OP. I hope it does. Thought and knowing your camera and the results it's capable of (with PP) and some practice sessions should help the OP decide the best settings.
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I get it, and that's the other point, whilst loads of modern DSLR's have great latitude recovering exposures, the Canon crops (apart from the 80d) don't.

It's not Armageddon, bu its not good advice for a crop canon shooter, and this isn't personal, but the internet is full of this kind of advice, and 'the largest sector' of photographers are probably Canon crop shooters, so they're getting bad advice on 2 counts based on advice that is perfectly valid for owners of 'most' camera models, they just happen to be a majority buying the wrong camera for that advice.
 
Hi guys,

Well I've had a few goes today nothing amazing just pictures of our dog out for a walk. See what you think and point me in the right direction of you don't mind, I've done no editing theses are straight from the camera.

IMG_6616.JPG
1/1000 - f7.1 - iso400

IMG_6617.JPG
1/1000 - f6.3. - iso320

IMG_6615.JPG
1/1000 - f6.3 - iso800
 
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maybe my old eyes - but I'm puzzled - something not right.!

pic#1 at f7.1......none of the pebbles seem to be in focus at all along the path.?

pic#3 at f6.3.......nothing seems to be in focus at all

EDIT - what focal length.?

assumimg a walk-about lens of 50mm to 80mm
and the #3 dog about 5m away
I would expect an adequate DoF...:(
 
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Yardbent said:
maybe my old eyes - but I'm puzzled - something not right.!

pic#1 at f7.1......none of the pebbles seem to be in focus at all along the path.?

pic#3 at f6.3.......nothing seems to be in focus at all
Click to expand...

I see what you mean about those 2 pictures [emoji85]hmmm little more work needed I think.

When u say walk about lens I used tamron 28-270mm lens. Is tht too much?
 
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(A) lens = Tamron = which.? ..I read 'somewhere'

'''.. the VR needs time to settler...''
maybe utter rubbish - but try with the VR 'off'

(B)......try another lens

(C) camera - i dont know Canon digital
can u set 1/1000 and f8 and let the ISO Auto ramp up to get the shot
f8 will allow a big DoF
you should be able to shoot upto (about) ISO 1600 with no visible effects (maybe..:)

try along a fence post line to see what is in focus
 
A - tamron [emoji1360]
Okey dokey I'll give that a go.

B- I've only got that one lens at the mo. But I'll see if I can try a friends as he's got a couple of different ones.

C- okey dokey I'll see if I can try all that in a bit as I'm currently out now without the camera

Thank you. [emoji1360]
 
Phil V said:
Canon don't give you exp comp in Manual - so all your settings are just choice of SS and aperture with Canon setting your exposure with the ISO).
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The 7D Mark II (I have no idea about other Canon's) allows you to set exposure compensation in Manual when ISO is set to Auto. I'll leave the value of that to someone else, but it can be done.
 
Turn off VR if it's not helping...
F/8 from f/6.3 won't make much difference at all in DOF, but it will be a sharper aperture for that lens. F/11 is also worth trying as long as it doesn't cause too slow a SS or too high of ISO.

I suspect some of the lack of sharpness is jpeg compression/resizing for display here... but not all of it.
 
JD007F said:
I see what you mean about those 2 pictures [emoji85]hmmm little more work needed I think.

When u say walk about lens I used tamron 28-270mm lens. Is tht too much?
Click to expand...

Were you shooting these at 270mm or 50mm or ? It makes a difference.

Also, I've got that lens, and you *do* need to wait a tiny bit after the focus locks before the image stabilisation kicks in, you have to practice with the lens - you learn to recognise when the IS (VC in Tamron terms) has triggered. So you might be getting some hand-shake on top of everything else.
 
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EightBitTony said:
The 7D Mark II (I have no idea about other Canon's) allows you to set exposure compensation in Manual when ISO is set to Auto. I'll leave the value of that to someone else, but it can be done.
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1D X, 5D III, 6D, 7D II, and probably many/most that are made after this timeframe...

The value of automation is that it is quicker, and often more accurate than you are/can be. The negative is that it is based around the camera metering.
The truth is that even manual mode is based around the camera metering, at least initially. And the truth is that the camera metering will probably have some error to it at least 50% of the time.

You can "fix" metering errors by
- using exposure compensation
- changing the metering mode
- ignoring the camera meter in manual mode
 
EightBitTony said:
The 7D Mark II (I have no idea about other Canon's) allows you to set exposure compensation in Manual when ISO is set to Auto. I'll leave the value of that to someone else, but it can be done.
Click to expand...
And the 1dx's, and I think the 5dIII (5ds & 5dr), but that's all AFAIK
 
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