Advice Needed NEW CAMERA?

Roxanne Withy

Roxanne Withy

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Roxanne
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Advice Needed

I am looking to upgrade my camera. I am pretty set on a mirrorless. However from there I am overwhelmed by the options available to me. Hence you guys come in...
I like the Olympus em10 Mark 3 and that is the top of my price range at this point in time.
I have a few criteria that I’m am focusing on:
-good all round multi purpose camera as I have yet to hone in a certain form of photography (and not sure I want to)
-good in lowlight
-affordable range of lenses (don’t we all)

What are your thoughts?
 
The OMD EM10 is a great camera and I can’t see you being unhappy with it. Although perhaps not the greatest in low light it’s good enough.

But I’d look at the Mk ii as it’s just as good as the mk iii in fact it’s less dumbed down.
 
Roxanne Withy said:
I like the Olympus em10 Mark 3 and that is the top of my price range at this point in time.
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The E-M10 3 is definitely a good camera: small, decent image stabilisation and a good range of lenses available. We have an E-M10 Mk1 here that my wife uses, and in good light it was hard to tell the difference between her pictures and those from the full frame Nikon DSLR I was using last year. In low light my experience of M43 cameras like the Oly is that they simply aren't as good as those with larger sensors, generally down to the physics of a smaller sensor not gathering as much light per pixel as a larger one.

A couple of questions that may also be helpful for people to offer advice:
1) is this just for taking family and holiday snaps or is there a more serious intention behind it?
2) is weight and size very important?
3) do you think that you're likely to want to use wider lenses for stuff like interiors or longer lenses for wildlife?
4) are the things you're interested in photographing likely to be moving fast or slowly (so will the autofocus need to be quick, or can it be a little slower)?
5) are you looking for a stepping stone into a hobby or a foundation to building a serious outfit?
 
what is your budget for camera and lens as the EM10 mk3 can be had for £400 with the 14-42 lens.

Toni above makes a good point about weight and size, you really need to handle the camera to see if it is to your liking, personally I could not get the feel for a mirrorless camera, thought they were to small and fidgity buttons did not help, but at the end of the day it is you that must decide.
 
Surely the EM10 mk2/mk3 with a faster-than-kit lens and the IBIS would be great in low light?
 
Having changed to Olympus earlier this year and been fortunate enough to afford decent lenses all I can add is don’t listen to the you need a bigger sensor crew . You sound like you just want something to use generally . Noise only becomes a problem if you let it bother you .. but I would advise getting some decent lenses or even just one good one it really does make a difference to I.q
 
Look at used and look at the EM10 Mark II and the 12-40mm f2.8 lens if that works out in budget. The extra 1-2 stops of light gathering of that lens will really help in low light over the 14-42mm kit lens.
 
realspeed said:
If I were youI would save a bit more and then start looking for a mirrorless camera.
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The camera OP mentions is a mirrorless camera.

I'd go for the em10 mkII over the III too, it's not lacking anything significant and is actually better built.

snerkler said:
Look at used and look at the EM10 Mark II and the 12-40mm f2.8 lens if that works out in budget. The extra 1-2 stops of light gathering of that lens will really help in low light over the 14-42mm kit lens.
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This is a lovely combination, excellent all-rounder lens
 
I would imagine that the price of the E-M5 ii will be dropping quite a bit with the release of the mkiii
Read somewhere that Olympus plans a hefty reduction to clear stocks of the older model
That would be an excellent choice and even better with the 12-40 f/2.8

It doesn't matter how good the photos from a big FF sensor camera are if you don't take it out because of size and/or weight
I went from Canon FF to mirrorless and have never looked back, just one small bag and that's all I need
 
Some Micro Four Thirds lenses are available at fairly reasonable prices on the used market, most of my lenses were bought used, it's a system that definitely deserves a close look. The Sony A6000 might be worth a look too and again some of the lenses are relatively cheap.

Other than that I'm a fan of the Sony A7 which is a FF mirrorless camera which can be found at reasonable prices and with old film era primes can be a very cheap way into FF. Adapters can be found for £10-20 and a set made up of a 28mm f2.8, 50mm f1.8 and 135mm f3.5 or f2.8 could very possibly cost under £100, if manual focus is practical for your usage. You'd need to find a cheap A7 mk1 though to keep the budget down.
 
ancient_mariner said:
The E-M10 3 is definitely a good camera: small, decent image stabilisation and a good range of lenses available. We have an E-M10 Mk1 here that my wife uses, and in good light it was hard to tell the difference between her pictures and those from the full frame Nikon DSLR I was using last year. In low light my experience of M43 cameras like the Oly is that they simply aren't as good as those with larger sensors, generally down to the physics of a smaller sensor not gathering as much light per pixel as a larger one.

A couple of questions that may also be helpful for people to offer advice:
1) is this just for taking family and holiday snaps or is there a more serious intention behind it?
2) is weight and size very important?
3) do you think that you're likely to want to use wider lenses for stuff like interiors or longer lenses for wildlife?
4) are the things you're interested in photographing likely to be moving fast or slowly (so will the autofocus need to be quick, or can it be a little slower)?
5) are you looking for a stepping stone into a hobby or a foundation to building a serious outfit?
Click to expand...

thank you so much for your help.
So I am looking for it to be used on a more serious level than holiday snaps. I like doing portraits as well as needing a longer lens for wildlife/roaming photography. I won’t be photographing things at super speed but something suitable for children
 
snerkler said:
Look at used and look at the EM10 Mark II and the 12-40mm f2.8 lens if that works out in budget. The extra 1-2 stops of light gathering of that lens will really help in low light over the 14-42mm kit lens.
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that’s what I was thinking
 
Roxanne Withy said:
that’s what I was thinking
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The 12-40mm is a great lens, then when funds allow you could pick up a used 45mm f1.8 for around £100 which would be nice for portraits.
 
If you plan to shoot children running around, you will need 1/1000 sec shutter speed. If your aperture setting is smaller than, say F2.8, you will need a lot of light to prevent noise- even in FF format. If your kids are running around on the beach in the sun, great - you can have 1,250 sec at F5.6 and a crop sensor will look virtually identical to a FF. However, if they are charging around in a colourful, equally picturesque -but-cloudy autumnal setting, you might need F1.4 at ISO2000 to get 1/1000 shutter. This is when noise handling becomes important.
 
Roxanne Withy said:
I like doing portraits as well as needing a longer lens for wildlife/roaming photography. I won’t be photographing things at super speed but something suitable for children
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There's a tension in the things you want to photograph - to me at any rate. For portraits I'd want a camera that will allow me a lot of control over depth of field of sharp focus. That generally means full frame or a larger format and a lens with a larger aperture. Not everyone will agree, but this is my personal preference. The kind of effect I'm talking about is this (shot at ISO6400 in a dark pub - notice how clean the image is too):
GospelBell-7733 by Toni Ertl, on Flickr

Also have a look at some of the pictures near the bottom of this page to see what full frame and large apertures can acheive: https://www.talkphotography.co.uk/t...ing-else-welcome-mega-thread.511885/page-1390

For children you'll need quite responsive autofocus, because they often move randomly and at close range, and the best AF for this kind of work is generally found in Sony full-frame mirrorless cameras - the (in)famous eye-AF where the camera will track the subects eye in real-time.

However.

Cameras with small sensors like the M43 ranges tend to have smaller, cheaper 'long' lenses compared to APS-C and full frame cameras. If you're semi-serious about wildlife then the lenses for M43 can be quite a bit cheaper than the FF equivalents - there's a bunch of wildlife photographers here that all use M43 cameras and produce some excellent work.

I suspect the E-M10-II & that 12-40 f2.8 will be a good start, and you could add a decent tele zoom for wildlife for not too much money - you will be able to get some great shots with it. But for the uses you describe I find it hard to recommend if intending to build a system
 
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Go to a few shops and have a play and see what grabs you. I fell in love with an Olympus pen f and then hunted down a cheap used one. You will struggle to buy a poor camera these days and you can get some cracking cheaper lenses. I recently bought the cheap Olympus 45-150 f4.5-6 for £60 brand new open box and been pretty impressed. The Panasonic 25 f1.7 is also a cheap lens with good results.
 
Good starting point and new kit lenses aren't as bad as everyone makes out. Just Google users of lenses to find plenty of video reviews. Can always upgrade later.
 
Gary...LFC said:
Good starting point and new kit lenses aren't as bad as everyone makes out. Just Google users of lenses to find plenty of video reviews. Can always upgrade later.
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Didn’t say they were bad, but the OP specifically mentioned low light (y) Fuji lenses tend to be considerably more expensive than ‘equivalent’ m4/3 too.
 
snerkler said:
Didn’t say they were bad, but the OP specifically mentioned low light (y) Fuji lenses tend to be considerably more expensive than ‘equivalent’ m4/3 too.
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I wasn't referencing you as such about the lens just there seems to be an opinion kit lenses aren't very good when they are. I have m43 myself and have the cheap Panasonic 25mm f1.7 which is very good in low light and £140 brand new.
 
snerkler said:
Didn’t say they were bad, but the OP specifically mentioned low light (y) Fuji lenses tend to be considerably more expensive than ‘equivalent’ m4/3 too.
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I started typing almost exactly that, then decided you'd probably cover it. :)

I'm sure it's a great outfit, but probably not 'ideal' in this particular situation. I'd love to own a Fuji as jewellery or a camera to admire, but not really sure I'd use it so much.
 
Gary...LFC said:
Whats wrong with Ken? Am I missing something?
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He has a particular take on things, that can be just a little disconnected from reality at times. Useful as an info source, but sometimes he'll declare something wonderful, when it's just a hunk of junk (Nikon 28-200 springs to mind as one example - bought one, went right back again).

The fuji kit lens has an excellent reputation regardless of his views.
 
Cagey75 said:
The 18-55 2.8-4 does, not so sure about the XC 15-45.
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I've had a fair few Fuji lenses, 18-55 is pretty good, but can have some issues focusing
XC 16-50 ois is a lot cheaper, plastic mount and slower, but gives very good results for the price
XF 16-55, much heavier, bigger, no ois and lot more expensive, but constant f/2.8 and excellent image quality
XC 15-45 is again slower , cheaper and power zoom, appears to be the worst of the standard zooms
 
Gary...LFC said:
Whats wrong with Ken? Am I missing something?
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His reviews are very subjective. Useful as resource info such as weight, filter size etc, but in terms of lens performance I wouldn’t read too much into it (y)
 
Roxanne Withy said:
So I am looking for it to be used on a more serious level than holiday snaps. I like doing portraits as well as needing a longer lens for wildlife/roaming photography. I won’t be photographing things at super speed but something suitable for children
Click to expand...
I think that wildlife is the odd person out here, in that it tends to need much longer focal lengths, thus is a bit specialised. But of course a lens for that can be got later.

Things like 'good in low light' are relative. Yes bigger sensors are better - hence the APS-C format is likely better than the M43 of the Olympus mentioned. But it's also generational - cameras across the board from the last 5 years, say, are incrementally better in that regard than cameras from 10 or more years ago.

A wider aperture lens, eg f/2.8 rather than f/5.6, will gather more light when wide open, but at wider apertures exact focus becomes more critical.

Thus I'd probably counsel going with your current choice of body with 'kit' zoom, since you seem to like it. Have you handled it? The alternative might be something like this (bigger sensor but still quite compact - has a mirror, though, but I wouldn't worry about that) - https://www.currys.co.uk/gbuk/camer...18-55-mm-f-3-5-5-6g-vr-lens-10156610-pdt.html

Does that blow the budget? Other issues are how a given camera / lens combo fit your hands and eyesight, and how its controls and menus (far too many of those these days!) fit your brain. Definitely handle and look through what you're after. The menus etc will have to come later!
 
droj said:
I think that wildlife is the odd person out here, in that it tends to need much longer focal lengths, thus is a bit specialised. But of course a lens for that can be got later.

Things like 'good in low light' are relative. Yes bigger sensors are better - hence the APS-C format is likely better than the M43 of the Olympus mentioned. But it's also generational - cameras across the board from the last 5 years, say, are incrementally better in that regard than cameras from 10 or more years ago.

A wider aperture lens, eg f/2.8 rather than f/5.6, will gather more light when wide open, but at wider apertures exact focus becomes more critical.

Thus I'd probably counsel going with your current choice of body with 'kit' zoom, since you seem to like it. Have you handled it? The alternative might be something like this (bigger sensor but still quite compact - has a mirror, though, but I wouldn't worry about that) - https://www.currys.co.uk/gbuk/camer...18-55-mm-f-3-5-5-6g-vr-lens-10156610-pdt.html

Does that blow the budget? Other issues are how a given camera / lens combo fit your hands and eyesight, and how its controls and menus (far too many of those these days!) fit your brain. Definitely handle and look through what you're after. The menus etc will have to come later!
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Tbh dof on the 12-40mm f2.8 isn’t that shallow, it’s only like f5.6 on FF. Plus mirrorless focus tends to be very accurate. Ergonomics are mighty important though as you say. On that note a used EM1 could be worth looking at.
 
snerkler said:
Tbh dof on the 12-40mm f2.8 isn’t that shallow, it’s only like f5.6 on FF. Plus mirrorless focus tends to be very accurate. Ergonomics are mighty important though as you say. On that note a used EM1 could be worth looking at.
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I suspect that an E-M10 with that 12-40 f2.8 would win out in image quality terms in pretty much every conceivable situation over a D5600 & kit lens.
 
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