Advice on buying a standalone camera

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Tedeschi76

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Name
Darren
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Yes
Hi folks,

Many years ago i had a Fuji s3 pro as well as a Pentax 6x7 medium format camera. However, I have just been using either whats been an iphone 14 pro max or currently the s24 ultra. Just bak from a lovely city break in Gdansk where I saw many tourists with what looked like Fujifilms, Sony Alpha cameras etc.

My budget is around £600 used and wondered what would be a great all round camera and lens for portrait shots and general landscape photos. Been looking at Fujifilm x-t20 as well as used Sony A7ii cameras. Any advice would be greatly appreciated as i feel out of the loop currently.
 
By standalone, do you mean essentially a 1 camera+lens solution? If you fancied a Sony A7 series then I'd recommend the A7III because of better battery life, AF and IBIS.

For your budget I'd probably look at an Olympus M43 type cameras: E-M5 or E-M10 with a 12-60mm lens.
 
If going for Micro Four Thirds and if going for a zoom I'd recommend a 12-35/12-40mm f2.8. I'm not really a zoom person myself but I can see the attraction in going for a more do it all zoom lens but if that's the case I think MFT needs help when compared to larger sensor systems and a quality lens with an aperture of f2.8 or wider helps for both IQ and depth control.
 
Alan
Sorry to disagree but the image quality, at least from my Panasonic G9ii, is as good as any FF camera. Yes small sensor is not as good in low light agreed,but the advantage far outweight the disadvantages. I could go on about videoing at 300 fps or dual image stablisation- or weight reduction-save on a USB drive direct- from a USB port etc etc. A lot depends as well on the lens not just the camera, I have had absolutely terrible lenses and also ones so good they blew my mind

I think your statement is far removed from, what at least this camera of mine is capable of. The question I have to ask is "do you own one, or just quoting from whereever"?

This of course is leaving out colour redition which is among the best as well

UNEDITED @ 400MM EQUIVILENT TO 800MM WITH A full frame CAMERA (hand held)

P1007138.JPG




To Darren I say take a look a The panasonic earlier G9 camera. you won't be disappointed. Any make of MFT lenses can be uses

link to used prices under £400
www.camerapricebuster.co.uk

Panasonic G9 Camera Body: Compare UK Prices Here

Compare genuine UK new and used prices for the Panasonic G9 Camera Body.
www.camerapricebuster.co.uk
 
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If possible I would try to go a generation newer with Fuji - the X-T2/X-T20 generation cameras are still good, but the X-T3/X-T30 that replaced them are easier to live with, they have better connectivity and autofocus.
 
realspeed said:
Alan
Sorry to disagree but the image quality, at least from my Panasonic G9ii, is as good as any FF camera. Yes small sensor is not as good in low light agreed,but the advantage far outweight the disadvantages. I could go on about videoing at 300 fps or dual image stablisation- or weight reduction-save on a USB drive direct- from a USB port etc etc. A lot depends as well on the lens not just the camera, I have had absolutely terrible lenses and also ones so good they blew my mind

I think your statement is far removed from, what at least this camera of mine is capable of. The question I have to ask is "do you own one, or just quoting from whereever"?

This of course is leaving out colour redition which is among the best as well

UNEDITED @ 400MM EQUIVILENT TO 800MM WITH A full frame CAMERA (hand held)
Click to expand...

No I don't own a G9. Have you tried a Sony A7cII?

I've had MFT since the GF1, I've had multiple Panasonic bodies and lenses and here's my opinion.

MFT will not give you the ultimate file image quality of a "FF" system of anything like a similar tech generation even in good light if you go looking for the differences, it's just not going to happen. You can just not look for the differences and be happy or you can give MFT the best possible chance by using good lenses at wider apertures.

For me MFT makes less sense these days when FF cameras like the A7c range and even the A7 series mini SLR bodies exist as they can be smaller than a MFT camera like the G9 plus there are compact FF primes too. Here's your G9 and two cameras I have, Sony A7III and A7cII...

Untitled-1.jpg

Untitled-12.jpg

That's why I've sold most of my MFT kit and now just have one RF style camera and four lenses two of which are zooms, the 45-150mm and the 100-400mm. One problem with the 100-400mm is the aperture range which when coupled to a smaller sensor is not going to do you too many favours. MFT and longer lenses are very probably going to be smaller, lighter and probably cheaper than the FF alternatives though, so there's that but lets not kid ourselves that MFT is going to equal let alone get you better IQ than FF if you go looking for the differences. It simply isn't.

I feel the same about APS-C these days too. I think the supposed advantage of size and weight can melt away unless with specific combinations particularly with longer lenses and IQ wise these smaller systems are going to take at least some IQ hit... if you go looking and care about the differences. Not that FF is the ultimate though as there are larger systems but bang for £ wise FF is enough for me.

I don't really like commenting on the quality of other peoples pictures as when posting here pictures can often look soft and that might be the case with your picture as on my screen nothing looks sharp and I can't tell where you've focussed. I wouldn't be looking at that picture as an advert for MFT. Sorry.

If just starting out now and looking at a budget of £600 I'd look at the earlier A7 cameras. I had the original A7 for 7 years or more. One of those or an A7II with a Sony 35mm f2.8 or 28mm f2 will probably be well within budget or there's the original 28-70mm f3.5-5.6 or the newer collapsible 28-60mm f4-5.6. I've had both. Might even get two lenses within budget, a prime and a zoom, which might be more use as a general and holiday combination / set up than a MFT camera with 100-400mm lens. YMMV.

I used to take my Sony A7 and 35mm f2.8 on holidays but these days I take my A7cII and 40mm f2.5.

Sorry for the long reply. Just trying to be clear and give the OP my honest opinion. Hope it helps.
 
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woof woof said:
No I don't own a G9. Have you tried a Sony A7cII?

I've had MFT since the GF1, I've had multiple Panasonic bodies and lenses and here's my opinion.

MFT will not give you the ultimate file image quality of a "FF" system of anything like a similar tech generation even in good light if you go looking for the differences, it's just not going to happen. You can just not look for the differences and be happy or you can give MFT the best possible chance by using good lenses at wider apertures.

For me MFT makes less sense these days when FF cameras like the A7c range and even the A7 series mini SLR bodies exist as they can be smaller than a MFT camera like the G9 plus there are compact FF primes too. Here's your G9 and two cameras I have, Sony A7III and A7cII...

View attachment 485614

View attachment 485616

That's why I've sold most of my MFT kit and now just have one RF style camera and four lenses two of which are zooms, the 45-150mm and the 100-400mm. One problem with the 100-400mm is the aperture range which when coupled to a smaller sensor is not going to do you too many favours. MFT and longer lenses are very probably going to be smaller, lighter and probably cheaper than the FF alternatives though, so there's that but lets not kid ourselves that MFT is going to equal let alone get you better IQ than FF if you go looking for the differences. It simply isn't.

I feel the same about APS-C these days too. I think the supposed advantage of size and weight can melt away unless with specific combinations particularly with longer lenses and IQ wise these smaller systems are going to take at least some IQ hit... if you go looking and care about the differences. Not that FF is the ultimate though as there are larger systems but bang for £ wise FF is enough for me.

I don't really like commenting on the quality of other peoples pictures as when posting here pictures can often look soft and that might be the case with your picture as on my screen nothing looks sharp and I can't tell where you've focussed. I wouldn't be looking at that picture as an advert for MFT. Sorry.

If just starting out now and looking at a budget of £600 I'd look at the earlier A7 cameras. I had the original A7 for 7 years or more. One of those or an A7II with a Sony 35mm f2.8 or 28mm f2 will probably be well within budget or there's the original 28-70mm f3.5-5.6 or the newer collapsible 28-60mm f4-5.6. I've had both. Might even get two lenses within budget, a prime and a zoom, which might be more use as a general and holiday combination / set up than a MFT camera with 100-400mm lens. YMMV.

I used to take my Sony A7 and 35mm f2.8 on holidays but these days I take my A7cII and 40mm f2.5.

Sorry for the long reply. Just trying to be clear and give the OP my honest opinion. Hope it helps.
Click to expand...

That is crazy that the G9ii with a M43 sensor is that much bigger than a FF Sony body! I didn't realise that...

I guess it also depends on whether you want something to change lenses on or something compact and fixed like the X100 range or is it the Xf10 or X10 or something..... There might be a few like that or the Ricoh range that might be worth looking into even if just to say no to them.
 
Alan I respect your opinion . I can still hand hold a camera and a lens equivelent to 800mm which would be impossible for most photographers. Please bear in mind age also affects camera choice regarding weight. At my age of 81 a full frame camera and long lens starts to become an issue. this is the main reason why I went after more years than i can remember using Nikon cameras to panasonic MFT.

You mentioned my photo I posted, so could you please show me what you mean by posting a photo of yours hand held at 800mm with a full frame camera so I can understand your point of view better
 
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realspeed said:
Alan I respect your opinion . I can still hand hold a camera and a lens equivelent to 800mm which would be impossible for most photographers. Please bear in mind age also affects camera choice regarding weight. At my age of 81 a full frame camera and long lens starts to become an issue. this is the main reason why I went after more years than i can remember using Nikon cameras to panasonic MFT.

You mentioned my photo I posted, so could you please show me what you mean by posting a photo of yours hand held at 800mm with a full frame camera so I can understand your point of view better
Click to expand...

Note what the mod said above. We don't want to derail the thread. If you need advice on settings and getting sharp pictures posted looking sharp you should open a thread and I'm sure people will be more than willing to try and help.
 
realspeed said:
Alan I respect your opinion . I can still hand hold a camera and a lens equivelent to 800mm which would be impossible for most photographers. Please bear in mind age also affects camera choice regarding weight. At my age of 81 a full frame camera and long lens starts to become an issue. this is the main reason why I went after more years than i can remember using Nikon cameras to panasonic MFT.

You mentioned my photo I posted, so could you please show me what you mean by posting a photo of yours hand held at 800mm with a full frame camera so I can understand your point of view better
Click to expand...

I don't think hand holding at focal lengths and weight is the thing Alan's first reply was getting at.... You said the image quality from a G9ii is the equivalent of say a Sony A7rv, and I'm pretty sure, like Alan said, that isn't correct. The IQ from my old A7 is better than my X100f - and they are both around the same release date.
 
My original A7 with an Olympus manual focus lens beats my EM1X with Oly pro lens.

FF is better but for the average tog who posts on forums etc. there's no benefit for FF.
 
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