Am I bieng silly?

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Tjm2986

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Hi all.

Question. I find lugging all my DSLR kit and lenses around quite cumbersome and tiring. I purchased a panasonic LX100 recently and I love it to death. I am now thinking about ditching the DSLR all together and going for a compact camera with interchangeable lenses. I like the panasonic user interface so I am sticking with them. I am currently looking at a Lumix GX80KEBK. The DSLR i'll be replacing is only an entry level EOS 2000D. My thoughts are to trade in all the DSLR kit and lenses to fund some decent glass for the GX80. Thoughts please?
 
It's a journey many of us have been through and comes down to a few issues such as:

Are you missing opportunities because you are leaving the DSLR gear at home?

Will the Lumix match / surpass the gear you are replacing?

Is it simply a desire for more gear or a genuine need to have a lighter setup?

Back in 2011 I exchanged my D90 and a number of lenses and got the original Fuji X100 - it was liberating and some of my favourite images come from this camera.
 
Not at all. If it gives you the results you want/need, then why take all the extra weight?

I went from a Canon 6D, 7D2, and 7D1 down to a pair of Fuji X bodies. It's lighter, gives great output, and I actually enjoy my photography more now than since I can remember. I'm now awaiting a Fuji X100F fixed lens compact to make sure I have a camera with me all the time.

I don't personally know the Panasonic cameras, but if it works for you, do it.
 
KMPhoto said:
It's a journey many of us have been through and comes down to a few issues such as:

Are you missing opportunities because you are leaving the DSLR gear at home?

Will the Lumix match / surpass the gear you are replacing?

Is it simply a desire for more gear or a genuine need to have a lighter setup?

Back in 2011 I exchanged my D90 and a number of lenses and got the original Fuji X100 - it was liberating and some of my favourite images come from this camera.
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Defintely not really missing opportunites leaving the DSLR at home other than the odd bird shot I could have used my telephoto for. But buying an interchangeble lens compact and not just carrying the LX100 is my remedy for that as a telephoto lens for a compact will be much lighter to carry around right? I have a sigma 100-400 for my 2000D and its so heavy. I have two damaged vertrabrae in my neck as I fractured it at age 15 and carrying the DSLR round my neck with that lens on near on cripples me for days afterwards my recent cornwall holiday I was taking so many anti inflammatories and painkillers due to neck pain.
 
I'm a big fan of m4/3, great balance between weight and image quality. TBH, I don't think you will notice any difference in IQ between m4/3 and APS-C, except Panasonic aren't quite as good at noise handling. There's some superb lenses available for m4/3 too.

You could also look at something like the Olympus EM1-II, great AF, good dynamic range, and (according to DXO) better noise handling than Panasonic and your Canon. DR is also better. I had the EM1-II and can whole heartedly recommend it.

Screenshot 2020-09-19 at 10.00.27.png
 
snerkler said:
I'm a big fan of m4/3, great balance between weight and image quality. TBH, I don't think you will notice any difference in IQ between m4/3 and APS-C, except Panasonic aren't quite as good at noise handling. There's some superb lenses available for m4/3 too.

You could also look at something like the Olympus EM1-II, great AF, good dynamic range, and (according to DXO) better noise handling than Panasonic and your Canon. DR is also better. I had the EM1-II and can whole heartedly recommend it.

View attachment 292926
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I was looking at Olympus. Most of it is a little out of my budget though. How about a OM-D E-M10 Mk3? Or is the Panasonic better?
 
Something you probably know, but worth mentioning here is that you can buy second hand bodies and invest more in better lenses - an Olympus a generation behind the current one will be at a good price / performance ratio.
 
I have a GX80 and I think it's a pretty good camera. Compared to the Canon the Canon has a slightly larger sensor but Canon arguably have been behind the curve for years and the GX80 actually has a slightly higher dynamic range, as per snerkler above who beat me to this but the site I looked at gave the GX80 a 0.7 DR advantage which may be within the margin for error. Whatever the lab bench test figure I think we can take it that the image quality these two cameras offer is probably comparable.

The GX80 does lack a couple of things and I personally prefer the similar but IMO better GX9 but that camera may well be more expensive. Regarding lenses I have the Olympus 17, 25 and 45mm f1.8's and 9-18mm and I'd recommend them all. I also have the Panasonic 12-35mm f2.8, 14-42mm f3.6-5.6, 45-150mm and 100-400mm. The tiny 14-42mm G Vario particularly impresses me as it's truly tiny and yet I can't really fault it optically and it can often be found used at a pretty good price.

Apart from saving bulk and weight you'll get the advantages of mirrorless technology including the in view focus and exposure aids, the ability to focus accurately and consistently anywhere in the frame, eye detect and other goodies too. Face and eye detect and the ability to focus anywhere in the frame are IMO real game changers especially when photographing people and they free you up to concentrate on composition and capturing the moment rather than fiddling with focus points and compromising your composition as you'd probably be doing with a DSLR.

I'd say go for it.
 
Tjm2986 said:
I was looking at Olympus. Most of it is a little out of my budget though. How about a OM-D E-M10 Mk3? Or is the Panasonic better?
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Depends on what you consider better? Some prefer Panny, some Olympus, it will come down to personal preference. Also, I believe Panasonic are better for video. In terms os sensor performance it does appear from the DXO site that the EM1-II is better than the rest (the Mark III hasn't been tested yet) but that may or may not matter to you.

Of the specific cameras you're looking at here's the sensor performance
Screenshot 2020-09-19 at 10.15.29.png


In terms of AF performance I can't say which will be better. I do know that other than the EM1-II, EM1-III, EM5-III and EM1x AF-C isn't great with Olympus so moving subjects can cause frustration. Also, the EM10-II isn't weather sealed, not sure about the Panny.
 
KMPhoto said:
Something you probably know, but worth mentioning here is that you can buy second hand bodies and invest more in better lenses - an Olympus a generation behind the current one will be at a good price / performance ratio.
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Exactly, a used EM1-II in like new condition is around £680-690, that's a lot of camera for the money. I have to say the EM1-II is one of the best cameras I've used.
 
snerkler said:
In terms of AF performance I can't say which will be better. I do know that other than the EM1-II, EM1-III, EM5-III and EM1x AF-C isn't great with Olympus so moving subjects can cause frustration. Also, the EM10-II isn't weather sealed, not sure about the Panny.
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I don't use tracking other than with eye detect for people and that seems to be pretty good and sticky. I can confirm that single focus point focus for general stuff is blisteringly fast with the GX80.

I've seen used GX80's go for around £200 or so but you may need to watch the various used sellers and be patient until one crops up.
 
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snerkler said:
Depends on what you consider better? Some prefer Panny, some Olympus, it will come down to personal preference. Also, I believe Panasonic are better for video. In terms os sensor performance it does appear from the DXO site that the EM1-II is better than the rest (the Mark III hasn't been tested yet) but that may or may not matter to you.

Of the specific cameras you're looking at here's the sensor performance
View attachment 292936


In terms of AF performance I can't say which will be better. I do know that other than the EM1-II, EM1-III, EM5-III and EM1x AF-C isn't great with Olympus so moving subjects can cause frustration. Also, the EM10-II isn't weather sealed, not sure about the Panny.
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Thanks for this gives a lot of food for thought. The GX80 is a little behind when it comes to low light shots but I am sure I could play with some settings to get the best out of it. The DR on landscapes (which I am planning to shoot more of) has suprised me. EOS low light will always be better as the sensor is APS-C right? The big weakness and most frustrating aspect of the 2000D other than its weight with lenses attached is the 9 point AF. I have had to discard so many shots because parts of them are out of focus. My LX100 (which I am using as a comparison as I have one) on the other hand the AF on that seems to manage to get the whole frame in focus when I am taking a scene shot.
 
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woof woof said:
I don't use tracking other than with eye detect for people and that seems to be pretty good and sticky. I can confirm that single focus point focus for general stuff is blisteringly fast with the GX80.
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Yeah, AF-S on m4/3 is really fast (y)
 
Tjm2986 said:
Thanks for this gives a lot of food for thought. The GX80 is a little behind when it comes to low light shots but I am sure I could play with some settings to get the best out of it. The DR on landscapes (which I am planning to shoot more of) has suprised me. EOS low light will always be better as the sensor is APS-C right? The big weakness and most frustrating aspect of the 2000D other than its weight with lenses attached is the 9 point AF. I have had to discard so many shots because parts of them are out of focus. My LX100 (which I am using as a comparison as I have one) on the other hand the AF on that seems to manage to get the whole frame in focus if when I am taking a scene shot.
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Some of my favourite landscapes have been with m4/3. I use filters though to help with the DR, and of course you can always bracket.
 
Tjm2986 said:
Thanks for this gives a lot of food for thought. The GX80 is a little behind when it comes to low light shots but I am sure I could play with some settings to get the best out of it. The DR on landscapes (which I am planning to shoot more of) has suprised me. EOS low light will always be better as the sensor is APS-C right? The big weakness and most frustrating aspect of the 2000D other than its weight with lenses attached is the 9 point AF. I have had to discard so many shots because parts of them are out of focus. My LX100 (which I am using as a comparison as I have one) on the other hand the AF on that seems to manage to get the whole frame in focus when I am taking a scene shot.
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No, see above.

Canon aren't cutting edge in sensors and the bench testers give the 16mp GX80 a slight advantage in DR.

I can tell you that the GX80 files are quite malleable and you can get away with quite a bit of processing.
 
woof woof said:
No, see above.

Canon aren't cutting edge in sensors and the bench testers give the 16mp GX80 a slight advantage in DR.

I can tell you that the GX80 files are quite malleable and you can get away with quite a bit of processing.
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One thing I can't tell with the GX80 is if the EVF is the same size as the one on my LX100? If its the same size as my other panasonic (tz90) then its a no go as its near on useless haha.
 
No idea. The review sites may help you with this.

I do have a TZ100 and I think the GX80 evf is better... I'm not generally a fan of the Panasonic field sequential evf's but when I'm using the cameras I usually forget my gripes and just get on with it. It does seem bright and contrasty.
 
woof woof said:
No idea. The review sites may help you with this.

I do have a TZ100 and I think the GX80 evf is better... I'm not generally a fan of the Panasonic field sequential evf's but when I'm using the cameras I usually forget my gripes and just get on with it. It does seem bright and contrasty.
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Just looked at some comparison the evf is the same as the LX100. Well thanks for all the help guys. I have now ordered a GX80. I will keep hold of my DSLR kit for a few weeks whilst I try the GX80 out as my main camera. Problem with cameras is you can't really make the decision by just reading facts and figures and reviews. I find actually holding and using the camera gives you a better idea of whether its for you. For me it makes the hobby expensive but also fun. Thank you for all the suggestions and advice its given me a lot more insight which I will always appreciate. I chose to stick with panasonic as I have used them for a while and I am used to the control and menu layouts.
 
Tjm2986 said:
Just looked at some comparison the evf is the same as the LX100. Well thanks for all the help guys. I have now ordered a GX80. I will keep hold of my DSLR kit for a few weeks whilst I try the GX80 out as my main camera. Problem with cameras is you can't really make the decision by just reading facts and figures and reviews. I find actually holding and using the camera gives you a better idea of whether its for you. For me it makes the hobby expensive but also fun. Thank you for all the suggestions and advice its given me a lot more insight which I will always appreciate. I chose to stick with panasonic as I have used them for a while and I am used to the control and menu layouts.
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Yup.

You're going from a SLR style DSLR to an RF style GX80 but as you have the LX100 the GX80 shouldn't be too much of a shock to your system.

I do prefer my GX9 but I actually use the GX80 more, I think because I like the inverse snobbery of using the cheaper simpler camera :D
 
woof woof said:
Yup.

You're going from a SLR style DSLR to an RF style GX80 but as you have the LX100 the GX80 shouldn't be too much of a shock to your system.

I do prefer my GX9 but I actually use the GX80 more, I think because I like the inverse snobbery of using the cheaper simpler camera :D
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Haha I am still very much on low budget when it comes to the hobby. I mean the DSLR kit will have to go if I stick with the GX80 just to fund lenses for it. Its coming with a 12-32mm lens so that will let me get into the city and take some scene shots with it and I plan on taking it for a walk to the derbyshire dales next week so I can get some landscapes with it. I'll probably carry my TZ90 (if its back from panasonic by then) Just in case I see any birds I want to get a shot of.
 
Tjm2986 said:
Haha I am still very much on low budget when it comes to the hobby. I mean the DSLR kit will have to go if I stick with the GX80 just to fund lenses for it. Its coming with a 12-32mm lens so that will let me get into the city and take some scene shots with it and I plan on taking it for a walk to the derbyshire dales next week so I can get some landscapes with it. I'll probably carry my TZ90 (if its back from panasonic by then) Just in case I see any birds I want to get a shot of.
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Fwiw I have the g80 with the 12-32 which does all I need. If I really need to drag anything in I use my TZ90.
I find them a great combination.
 
Personally I don't like the idea of the 12-32mm as as far as I know it lacks the ability to focus manually other than by a sliding scale on the back screen. I'd much rather have the conventional zoom and focus ring equipped but still small 14-42mm G Vario. I do appreciate that many people will be happy with the 12-32mm and AF but I like to override the AF at times such as when taking pictures of flowers, leaves and other detail and sometimes when shooting through foliage, branches and even windows when shooting whatever is happening in the garden as sometime AF can hit the first thing it sees rather than the subject I want in focus.
 
woof woof said:
Personally I don't like the idea of the 12-32mm as as far as I know it lacks the ability to focus manually other than by a sliding scale on the back screen. I'd much rather have the conventional zoom and focus ring equipped but still small 14-42mm G Vario. I do appreciate that many people will be happy with the 12-32mm and AF but I like to override the AF at times such as when taking pictures of flowers, leaves and other detail and sometimes when shooting through foliage, branches and even windows when shooting whatever is happening in the garden as sometime AF can hit the first thing it sees rather than the subject I want in focus.
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Its the lens supplied with it. I plan on getting a 45mm prime for it fairly soon. Probably the Olympus F1.8 Zuiko.
 
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I've bought most of my lenses on the used market including my 45mm f1.8. It does seem to be a very nice lens, and very compact. I've no idea about the Panasonic equivalent lens, I just bought the Oly as I found one at a good price. I hope you do realise this is a x2 crop system and 45mm for Micro Four Thirds is about the same field of view as a 56mm on Canon APS-C and 90mm on FF.
 
Tjm2986 said:
Hi all.

Question. I find lugging all my DSLR kit and lenses around quite cumbersome and tiring.
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you do realise that you do not need to lug ALL your kit around? I just take the body and lens that I am going to use that day. On a challenging day, I might take two lenses.
 
I usually take just the one lens but sometimes take another one, two or three.

The first mirrorless camera I bought was a Panasonic GF1 with 20mm f1.7 but that camera doesn't have an evf and I found I couldn't live with just the back screen so I swapped it for a G1 which was a mini SLR style design with an evf and fully articulated screen. Anyway, the first time I took that G1 out instead of my 5D and Sigma 50mm f1.4 I honestly kept checking the bag to make sure it was still in there such was the feeling of carrying it rather than the 5D and 50mm f1.4.
 
Tjm2986 said:
Question. I find lugging all my DSLR kit and lenses around quite cumbersome and tiring. I purchased a panasonic LX100 recently and I love it to death. I am now thinking about ditching the DSLR all together and going for a compact camera with interchangeable lenses. I like the panasonic user interface so I am sticking with them. I am currently looking at a Lumix GX80KEBK. The DSLR i'll be replacing is only an entry level EOS 2000D. My thoughts are to trade in all the DSLR kit and lenses to fund some decent glass for the GX80. Thoughts please?
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The smaller Panasonic and Olympus MFT bodies are a really good compromise in terms of features / size. Very liberating when travelling. The Oly EM10 and EM5 family and the GX80 and GX8 will fit in a small bag with two or three small lenses.

Question is what do you want to do with lenses. There's quite a bit of choice.- and again decisions to make on weight / size vs performance.

Also note that you can get a decent price on new Oly EM10ii or EM10iii kit from HDEW.
 
Tjm2986 said:
I have a sigma 100-400 for my 2000D and its so heavy.
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I have a Canon 80D and a Tamron 100-400 and was feeling the same as you.
I've just bought a used Olympus E-M10 mk II because of the weight issue.
I won't be getting rid of the 80D setup as I still enjoy wildlife photography.
The question you have to ask yourself is would you regret selling and buying a MFT body?
Perhaps delving into the MFT's via a cheaper used option at first might be an option?
Don't forget you will be going from an optical VF to a EVF which may take some getting use to?
 
woof woof said:
Personally I don't like the idea of the 12-32mm as as far as I know it lacks the ability to focus manually other than by a sliding scale on the back screen. I'd much rather have the conventional zoom and focus ring equipped but still small 14-42mm G Vario. I do appreciate that many people will be happy with the 12-32mm and AF but I like to override the AF at times such as when taking pictures of flowers, leaves and other detail and sometimes when shooting through foliage, branches and even windows when shooting whatever is happening in the garden as sometime AF can hit the first thing it sees rather than the subject I want in focus.
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Tjm2986 said:
Wow perfect for me then with my Tz90 :D
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Sorry guys I must have had a brain fart. Mine is the 12-60 kit which has MF. I blame it on the wine.
 
Cockney said:
Sorry guys I must have had a brain fart. Mine is the 12-60 kit which has MF. I blame it on the wine.
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Those 12-60mm lenses (I think there's a budget and an expensive one?) look good.
 
LeeRatters said:
What do you typically carry? How much stuff do you have? Can you leave stuff at home?
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The problem I have is the only lens I really use is the 400mm telephoto and the camera body and the wieght of it kills my neck. My plan is to get the compact (already ordered the GX80) and get the equivalent telephoto for it.
 
200mm f2.8? That looks nice.

ps.
There's one at London Camera Exchange for £1,759.99.
 
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Tjm2986 said:
The problem I have is the only lens I really use is the 400mm telephoto and the camera body and the wieght of it kills my neck. My plan is to get the compact (already ordered the GX80) and get the equivalent telephoto for it.
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(y) I think the telephoto birding wildlife situation is where there's benefits in the smaller sensor cameras for sure.
 
Tjm2986 said:
The problem I have is the only lens I really use is the 400mm telephoto and the camera body and the wieght of it kills my neck. My plan is to get the compact (already ordered the GX80) and get the equivalent telephoto for it.
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Have you tried a sling strap rather than a neck strap, makes the world of difference?
 
snerkler said:
Have you tried a sling strap rather than a neck strap, makes the world of difference?
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Yeah the problem is theres very little strength in my shoulders due to the instability in my neck. So I get shoulder and neck ache as it puts too much pressure on my trapezius muscle so I stiffen up it makes raising my arms up very painful. I fell off a tree swing about 20feet and landed on my head and suffered compression fractures to several vertabrae and as a result of me getting older I now have athritis in my neck. Daily life in painful enough without my hobby causing extra pain lol.
 
Tjm2986 said:
The problem I have is the only lens I really use is the 400mm telephoto and the camera body and the wieght of it kills my neck. My plan is to get the compact (already ordered the GX80) and get the equivalent telephoto for it.
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When I use my EOS80D plus 600mm lens, I use a shoulder harness rather than neck strap.
 
woof woof said:
200mm f2.8? That looks nice.

ps.
There's one at London Camera Exchange for £1,759.99.
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Just ordered a Olympus M.Zuiko Digital ED 75-300mm F4.8-6.7 from London Camera Exchange which is more within my budget haha. Id love the 200mm F2.8 but the price is a little steep for me currently. Especially after just shelling for the camera itself.
 
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