Apple :(

[Sangoma]

My daughter bought a new 1GB iPad Pro.

She put them next to each other and started the transfer process, from old to new.
The basic part went OK, then it started on the data. After just over an hour, it stopped with a message to move them closer to each other. They were already touching.
It wouldn't carry on, so eventually after several tries I suggested that she reset it and set it up manually then restore from the cloud.

After just over 4 hours, it stopped with a lost network connection! The router she was connected to has a very strong signal, it's about 8' from the ipad, through one wall. She uses that connection every day all day for work.

She connected to another router downstairs, and the whole process has started all over again, and I think that may fail, because although the connection is faster, the signal is not as strong.

We can't back up the old ipad to a PC, as it does not have enough free memory (tried), and there are no more files accessible to delete.

Of course on apple, the data files are not accessible like Android or Windows, and the application with all the data can export one file at a time, but not the whole lot.

Total of 8 hours so far

Oh what joy!

Does any one know of an app or way to get access directly to the apps data?

 

[Sky]

That's Apple for you. I won't touch their stuff any more.

That doesn't really help I know, but good luck with it - I feel your pain . . .

 

[gramps]

On the other hand I've done this with numerous iphones and ipads and never had a problem.
No help to Steve I know but it is very odd!

 

[Sangoma]

On the other hand I've done this with numerous iphones and ipads and never had a problem.
No help to Steve I know but it is very odd!

Unfortunately, it is not unusual to me, not this particular problem, but things that just don't go as expected.

I feel for my daughter, as she likes her apple (the only way she can run the software she uses) and now says she sees why I spoke about them being hard work.

No doubt once it has been done, and is working, all will be fine

Personally I think the problem is lack of available memory on the old one, and lack of error handling on problems cause by that, but I am not an apple "expert" I ran NT and Linux systems mainly.

 

[Nikon f1.8]

If it is new then a call to apple support will help, they are great to deal with, unlike dare I say Dell.

 

[Sangoma]

If it is new then a call to apple support will help, they are great to deal with, unlike dare I say Dell.

Have to agree with that, I stopped buying Dell at 5 sites because of their CS

 

[sphexx]

I’ve done this lots of times without problem. As already said, call support if it’s new or if you suspect it’s faulty, just return it if you got it from Apple as that’s entirely painless (they collect it etc) and then re-purchase it.

 

[Sangoma]

I’ve done this lots of times without problem. As already said, call support if it’s new or if you suspect it’s faulty, just return it if you got it from Apple as that’s entirely painless (they collect it etc) and then re-purchase it.

As I said, I think the issue is with lack of available memory on the old ipad, and the inability to properly manage that, no mention of any idea that the new one is faulty.

 

[sphexx]

As I said, I think the issue is with lack of available memory on the old ipad, and the inability to properly manage that, no mention of any idea that the new one is faulty.

Maybe I’m missing something. iPads/iPhones may refuse to accept an update online if there is insufficient memory to store the new update but I haven’t come across one that can’t provide its contents to another iDevice or iCloud and I can’t see how that would make sense otherwise you would t be able to make iCloud backups.

When setting up a new iDevice you are offered the choice of doing from a nearby iDevice (quicker) or from an iCloud backup (slower) of that iDevice.

You don’t mention trying the latter version.

If there are “no accessible files to delete” as you say then there is only the OS & apps so there’d be no penalty to setting it up as a new iPad!

 

[CavGez]

Cant you free space by uploading files to iCloud? Its all folder managed, you get 5gb gratis, and then you're done?

 

[PJH99]

I had a Similar issue and I ended up copying all of my photos/videos on to an SD card, then deleted them from the old iPad along with any apps I didn’t care about, then restarted both devices. No problem after that.

 

[Sangoma]

Maybe I’m missing something. iPads/iPhones may refuse to accept an update online if there is insufficient memory to store the new update but I haven’t come across one that can’t provide its contents to another iDevice or iCloud and I can’t see how that would make sense otherwise you would t be able to make iCloud backups.

When setting up a new iDevice you are offered the choice of doing from a nearby iDevice (quicker) or from an iCloud backup (slower) of that iDevice.

You don’t mention trying the latter version.

If there are “no accessible files to delete” as you say then there is only the OS & apps so there’d be no penalty to setting it up as a new iPad!

Couple of things there.

It was when trying to restore from the cloud that the network connection dropped after several hours, and the whole thing had to be re-started.
I will hear later today if that was successful..

The second part is only partially true. The only files that can be directly accessed are photos and movies, the apps store their data in areas that are not accessible, so setting it up as a new ipad loses all that data. The only way to get that data is to restore from the cloud or PC.
It last successfully backed up to the cloud about a month ago, it will not back up to PC due to lack of memory.
Once it has successfully restored from the cloud, she could then, from the app, delete some of the older now restored files , and again from the app, export the last few that have not been backed up.

The old ipad is reporting that the one app is using 70GB, not bad on a 64GB device I've no idea how or why it is reporting that amount, but maybe connected with the lack of memory to backup.

Hopefully it will end well, but certainly not plain sailing.

 

[Sangoma]

Cant you free space by uploading files to iCloud? Its all folder managed, you get 5gb gratis, and then you're done?

If we could see the files that would be great, and of course if we could see them, they could be moved to PC, and if we could see them there would be no problem anyway, because we could just copy them to the cloud or PC and then onto the new one.

That is why I asked "Does any one know of an app or way to get access directly to the apps data?" in my first post.
She has quite a large icloud subscription, and the data from the one app is around 60GB

 

[gramps]

It last successfully backed up to the cloud about a month ago,

I would start by doing a fresh backup.

 

[CavGez]

If we could see the files that would be great, and of course if we could see them, they could be moved to PC, and if we could see them there would be no problem anyway, because we could just copy them to the cloud or PC and then onto the new one.

That is why I asked "Does any one know of an app or way to get access directly to the apps data?" in my first post.
She has quite a large icloud subscription, and the data from the one app is around 60GB

OK - I didn't consider that fully.

There won't be a way to get access to the files. Everything is locked down and sandboxed, primarily for security and privacy, so malicious apps can't interfere with each other.

Some apps themselves would no doubt be backed up on the iCloud then. In fact, most of it will be covered by the auto backup. You can check what's already saved to the cloud and what isn't. If you set up the iPad from a backup (the backup date should be apparent) and you have an idea what data is on that backup, that's another option.

The best bet though is getting a backup onto a computer. Can't the backup file go onto a USB or something? 1GB isn't that much space.

Hope that helps, not trying to preach.

 

[Sangoma]

I would start by doing a fresh backup.

We tried, it won't back up due to lack of memory.
As mentioned above, she has not done much since the last successful backup, so to export a few files manually won't be a problem.

Got a message from her to say it did complete the restore about 2am today, I have yet to hear if it was successful in that she now has everything she needed.
18 hours after she started

 

[Sangoma]

OK - I didn't consider that fully.

There won't be a way to get access to the files. Everything is locked down and sandboxed, primarily for security and privacy, so malicious apps can't interfere with each other.

Some apps themselves would no doubt be backed up on the iCloud then. In fact, most of it will be covered by the auto backup. You can check what's already saved to the cloud and what isn't. If you set up the iPad from a backup (the backup date should be apparent) and you have an idea what data is on that backup, that's another option.

The best bet though is getting a backup onto a computer. Can't the backup file go onto a USB or something? 1GB isn't that much space.

Hope that helps, not trying to preach.

Yes, the new one will be backed up to PC regularly as well as to the cloud, will be looking at the various ways to make it easy for her.
Though, the same issue is not likely to occur during the lifespan of the new one, 1TB will be hard to fill

I don't know if the new ipads will back up to USB directly, I don't think so, I think it has to be done through itunes.
There is also the option of one of our NAS boxes, as they support webdav.

I don't take anything as preaching, any ideas are welcome, we all look at things from different angles.

 

[sphexx]

Couple of things there.

It was when trying to restore from the cloud that the network connection dropped after several hours, and the whole thing had to be re-started.
I will hear later today if that was successful..

The dropped network connection is worrying! I suppose it may have corrupted sometimg.

The second part is only partially true. The only files that can be directly accessed are photos and movies, the apps store their data in areas that are not accessible, so setting it up as a new ipad loses all that data. The only way to get that data is to restore from the cloud or PC.

Ah, yes. I’ve only got one app that doesn’t synch content with other devices automatically but it can transfer the data to other devices on request or I can export/import it.

I suppose I have no conception of how other people use their iPads .

It last successfully backed up to the cloud about a month ago, it will not back up to PC due to lack of memory.

Too late now, but one should always do a backup before updates etc and it’s best to have auto backups turned on .

Once it has successfully restored from the cloud, she could then, from the app, delete some of the older now restored files , and again from the app, export the last few that have not been backed up.

The old ipad is reporting that the one app is using 70GB, not bad on a 64GB device I've no idea how or why it is reporting that amount, but maybe connected with the lack of memory to backup.

Hopefully it will end well, but certainly not plain sailing.

Hope it gets resolved!

 

[CavGez]

Yes, the new one will be backed up to PC regularly as well as to the cloud, will be looking at the various ways to make it easy for her.
Though, the same issue is not likely to occur during the lifespan of the new one, 1TB will be hard to fill

I don't know if the new ipads will back up to USB directly, I don't think so, I think it has to be done through itunes.
There is also the option of one of our NAS boxes, as they support webdav.

I don't take anything as preaching, any ideas are welcome, we all look at things from different angles.

So I was wondering if you could change the iTunes backup location onto a USB, if disk space is a problem. (I think you can).

 

[Nikon f1.8]

I cannot understand why you have not phoned Apple, they would sort it straight away. The wifey bought a new iPad about three month ago to replace an iPad 2 and she had a bit of a problem. Apple support remotely logged into her iPad and sorted it straight away.

 

[Sangoma]

So I was wondering if you could change the iTunes backup location onto a USB, if disk space is a problem. (I think you can).

Disk space is not a problem, it is the memory on the ipad that is full, it reports it does not have sufficient memory to perform the backup

 

[Sangoma]

I cannot understand why you have not phoned Apple, they would sort it straight away. The wifey bought a new iPad about three month ago to replace an iPad 2 and she had a bit of a problem. Apple support remotely logged into her iPad and sorted it straight away.

Well, if you look through the posts, you will probably understand why, but in brief....
The transfer between the old and new didn't work. Took a long time for that to fail, and determine that it wasn't going to work.
Then there was the obvious route of setting it up as a new ipad and restoring it from the cloud.
That failed with a network problem after several hours, Changed to a faster router and tied again.
You may have seen above that my daughter sent me a message to say that completed very early this morning.

I would have expected the restore to take 6-7 hours, so as yet there has been no absolute need to phone them, though that was her intention anyway if the restore didn't work.

Very frustrating, but until the logical and sensible things had been tried, no point in calling them, they could not make the data transfer any quicker for the restore

 

[CavGez]

Disk space is not a problem, it is the memory on the ipad that is full, it reports it does not have sufficient memory to perform the backup

OK, I find that baffling. No idea why it would need spare space on the iPad itself.

 

[Sangoma]

OK, I find that baffling. No idea why it would need spare space on the iPad itself.

It probably buffers the transfers

 

[CavGez]

What I do is go to General--> iPad storage.

On mine I can delete all the old message attachments.
Thats where I'd go on the iPad

 

[Sangoma]

What I do is go to General--> iPad storage.

On mine I can delete all the old message attachments (right now there are 9.29GB on mine), old messages over a year old (9.26GB) and offload unused apps (which still saves documents and data) 6.65GB.
Thats where I'd go on the iPad

There are no messages on her ipad, and all photos etc have been removed, and the only app left now is the one she uses, and the data for that is stored within the app, so removing it may lose the data.

 

[sphexx]

There are no messages on her ipad, and all photos etc have been removed, and the only app left now is the one she uses, and the data for that is stored within the app, so removing it may lose the data.

I guess you’ve already thought of this but can she export or backup the data from within the mystery app?

I can’t think of any app I’ve used that doesn’t either synch with other devices or with the native apps (like Photos etc) or backup to iCloud No doubt I’m missing something .

The nearest thing I’ve used that can access many other files on iOS is “Documents” by Readdle. which they claim is the “Finder for iOS you’ve always wanted” but I don’t know if it’ll help here.

 

[Sangoma]

I guess you’ve already thought of this but can she export or backup the data from within the mystery app?

I can’t think of any app I’ve used that doesn’t either synch with other devices or with the native apps (like Photos etc) or backup to iCloud No doubt I’m missing something .

The nearest thing I’ve used that can access many other files on iOS is “Documents” by Readdle. which they claim is the “Finder for iOS you’ve always wanted” but I don’t know if it’ll help here.

Yes, it can but as I mentioned in my first post, only one file at a time, not the whole lot.

It is not a mystery app but until now, the app didn't seem relevant, it is however now relevant, as it seems it is somehow the app that is the problem.

The app is Procreate.

I mentioned earlier that the ipad was reporting that procreate was taking up over 70GB on a 64GB machine.
Her restore was successful, and she has all her data, and can now get on with a commission that needs to be approved and printed within 3 weeks.

The amazing thing is that restoring a backup of 64GB machine, the Procreate files alone are now over 128GB!

She has told me that Procreate forums are full of posts about similar issues, and restores failing at around 60%.
I have no idea why that could be, but I can see a possible connection between the restore failures and the file sizes reports being wrong.

 

[sphexx]

Yes, it can but as I mentioned in my first post, only one file at a time, not the whole lot.

It is not a mystery app but until now, the app didn't seem relevant, it is however now relevant, as it seems it is somehow the app that is the problem.

The app is Procreate.

I mentioned earlier that the ipad was reporting that procreate was taking up over 70GB on a 64GB machine.
Her restore was successful, and she has all her data, and can now get on with a commission that needs to be approved and printed within 3 weeks.

Hooray!!

The amazing thing is that restoring a backup of 64GB machine, the Procreate files alone are now over 128GB!

She has told me that Procreate forums are full of posts about similar issues, and restores failing at around 60%.
I have no idea why that could be, but I can see a possible connection between the restore failures and the file sizes reports being wrong.

Ah yes, I don’t use anything like that and can see it might be a problem.

The App Store entry for Procreate (free version I think) say you can export the native x.procreate files so that would be the way to go I would think. If you can export them you must be able to import them too.

 

[sphexx]

The amazing thing is that restoring a backup of 64GB machine, the Procreate files alone are now over 128GB!

I wonder if it’s duplicated the files (64 vs 128!) ? I had that happen with the Photos app though that was synching with a desktop I think.

 

[Sangoma]

Hooray!!



Ah yes, I don’t use anything like that and can see it might be a problem.

The App Store entry for Procreate (free version I think) say you can export the native x.procreate files so that would be the way to go I would think. If you can export them you must be able to import them too.

Yes, you can, but only one at a time!

 

[Yukyum]

For future reference when you get a new apple device they boost your iCloud storage for 30 days to allow a backup and restore. Storage on the old device (not memory) is ok unless there’s less than 1gb free - if you’re at less than 1gb free space it’ll cause glitches.