Been up in a microlight (done it - update)

[kelack]

I wonder if I could ask you some advice.

I'm getting for my birthday a 60 minute trip in a microlight (http://www.ravenmad.co.uk/trial-flights.htm) Quite excited about it.

Now, they have told me that I am more than welcome to bring my camera along but I'm not sure that my kit will be any good.

Does anyone have any advice for me? Should I hire a lens for the trip? What sort of lens?

Is HimUpNorth around?

 

[Sparkles33]

no advice - but have fun!

I bought my brother one of these years ago and he loved it!

 

[Dave Stone]

I would say take something wide and fast. Microlights vibrate a fair bit, as does any light aircraft. If you are wanting to shoot something specific i.e. your house, take something longer. Above all make sure your camera is secured to you. Especially if it is an open cockpit.

 

[scottduffy]

You are braver than me. Enjoy yourself.

 

[PsiFox]

You are braver than me. Enjoy yourself.

why unless the wing rips at the same time as the engine fails there is no problem

 

[princeclan]

Make sure your camera can take the cold. Even on a sunny day it can be really cold up there. Also get a superzoom if possible so you can have the best of both worlds. Yes they vibrate like hell if they are a flexiwing. If they are a fixed wing then not as bad at all.

Personally i think you will be holding on for dear life if its a flexiwing as they can turn left to right very quickly to compensate turbulence and wind.

Matt

 

[Dave Stone]

Shouldn't be too cold. The dry adiabatic lapse rate is 1.98 c per 1000ft. You will probably not go much higher than 2 or 3000ft. e.g. 6 c colder at 3000ft.

 

[jockwav]

Remember lifejacket,you never know.

 

[mmcp42]

you won't need a tripod!
high ISO and fast shutter speed should kill any vibration

oh and take sunnies!

 

[princeclan]

Shouldn't be too cold. The dry adiabatic lapse rate is 1.98 c per 1000ft. You will probably not go much higher than 2 or 3000ft. e.g. 6 c colder at 3000ft.

Actually its more than that.

For the atmosphere, the drop in temperature of rising, unsaturated air is about 5 ½ deg F per 1000 feet altitude.

So if its 60 deg F on the ground at 3000ft it will be 43.5 deg F. When you take into consideration the chill factor it can get quite cold.

Trust me i go up in them.

 

[princeclan]

In fact if you read on the internet virtually every different website quotes differfent lapse rates. It depends on how saturated the air is to how much the difference is. Its not as clear cut as a certain figure.

All i would say is it aint warm up there put it that way. I would wear something warm.

 

[Craikeybaby]

I was taught 1.98 deg c per 1000ft when I did weather exams for both my pilots licence and air traffic control exams, but that is based on a standard atmosphere, so it could be more, or less

 

[princeclan]

Standard atmosphere in the Uk?

 

[kelack]

no advice - but have fun!

I bought my brother one of these years ago and he loved it!

Cool - thanks

I would say take something wide and fast. Microlights vibrate a fair bit, as does any light aircraft. If you are wanting to shoot something specific i.e. your house, take something longer. Above all make sure your camera is secured to you. Especially if it is an open cockpit.

So what would be wide and fast, a f2.8 18-55 might be a bit too short though?

You are braver than me. Enjoy yourself.

Cheers

why unless the wing rips at the same time as the engine fails there is no problem

you funny!

 

[kelack]

Make sure your camera can take the cold. Even on a sunny day it can be really cold up there. Also get a superzoom if possible so you can have the best of both worlds. Yes they vibrate like hell if they are a flexiwing. If they are a fixed wing then not as bad at all.

Personally i think you will be holding on for dear life if its a flexiwing as they can turn left to right very quickly to compensate turbulence and wind.

Matt

Hmmm, I've got a choice of fixed wing or flexi wing I think. Half of me wants to go in flexi wing as it's open but half of me wants to go in fixed wing for the photos! Thanks for the advice

Shouldn't be too cold. The dry adiabatic lapse rate is 1.98 c per 1000ft. You will probably not go much higher than 2 or 3000ft. e.g. 6 c colder at 3000ft.

I think 2000 is the max we're going, will have my thermals on

Remember lifejacket,you never know.

you won't need a tripod!
high ISO and fast shutter speed should kill any vibration

oh and take sunnies!

Thanks, will bear that in mind

 

[kelack]

Actually its more than that.

For the atmosphere, the drop in temperature of rising, unsaturated air is about 5 ½ deg F per 1000 feet altitude.

So if its 60 deg F on the ground at 3000ft it will be 43.5 deg F. When you take into consideration the chill factor it can get quite cold.

Trust me i go up in them.

In fact if you read on the internet virtually every different website quotes differfent lapse rates. It depends on how saturated the air is to how much the difference is. Its not as clear cut as a certain figure.

All i would say is it aint warm up there put it that way. I would wear something warm.

I was taught 1.98 deg c per 1000ft when I did weather exams for both my pilots licence and air traffic control exams, but that is based on a standard atmosphere, so it could be more, or less

Standard atmosphere in the Uk?

So it'll be cold then! Again, thermals will be on

 

[Dave Stone]

Trust me i go up in them.

So do I, and used to teach people to go up in them.

Dry (=unsaturated) air cools at a constant 3C/1000ft.
This is reversible.

When saturated air (RH=100%) expands and cools, moisture condenses
and latent heat is released - offsetting some of the cooling. The moist
(saturated) adiabatic lapse rate varies with temperature: 1C/1000ft at
high temperatures to 3C/1000ft well below freezing - depending on the
absolute moisture content.
This is typically not reversible. The condensed moisture precipitates out
and is not available to be absorbed if the parcel descends and compresses.

The standard lapse rate of 2°C/1000ft: performance/reference.

 

[princeclan]

I know all that but the point i am making is that nobody know exactly the amount of saturation so cant put an exact figure on it. Either of our figures could be out to the tune of 10 degrees depending on the saturation level. Thats alot of difference in temperature.

Matt

 

[kelack]

So do I, and used to teach people to go up in them.

Dry (=unsaturated) air cools at a constant 3C/1000ft.
This is reversible.

When saturated air (RH=100%) expands and cools, moisture condenses
and latent heat is released - offsetting some of the cooling. The moist
(saturated) adiabatic lapse rate varies with temperature: 1C/1000ft at
high temperatures to 3C/1000ft well below freezing - depending on the
absolute moisture content.
This is typically not reversible. The condensed moisture precipitates out
and is not available to be absorbed if the parcel descends and compresses.

The standard lapse rate of 2°C/1000ft: performance/reference.

I know all that but the point i am making is that nobody know exactly the amount of saturation so cant put an exact figure on it. Either of our figures could be out to the tune of 10 degrees depending on the saturation level. Thats alot of difference in temperature.

Matt

So we've established it will be cold thank you. Not really staying on the topic of what kit would I take other than thermals

 

[48thEagle]

Remember lifejacket,you never know.

She is going up in a microlight, not an Airbus.

 

[Keith W]

You wouldn't catch me going up in a microlight, I don't do heights very well

Mind you one one would probably not be able to take off with my weight anyway

 

[kelack]

Going in a fixed wing on 28th June

All booked

I can take my SLR and we'll be going about 2,500 - 3,000 feet up.

Planned route is over to my village to get aerial shot, down to Leeds Castle then up along the seawall



So excited

Now the question is, what lens do I need!!!!! Still hasn't been answered, I know wide and fast but how wide?

 

[jgs001]

Have a wonderful time. There's just something about small aircraft... it's a great feeling. From 2500 to 3000 feet up, everything will look teeny tiny on the ground, I hope that helps in some way.

 

[kelack]

I've never been in a small aircraft and the highest I've been off the ground other than a big plane is 100ft when I did my aerial slide.

My favourite part of going on holiday is staring out the window when we're low enough to land and seeing how toy like everything is so this is going to be super cool

 

[mmcp42]

3000 feet is about 3/5 of a mile so everything will be a long way off = tiny
10-22mm will give you wall to wall coverage but is probably overkill

if you can take a "normal" wide angle - but as fast as you can to avoid vibration
don't be tempted to lean the lens hood against the window

put a telephoto on your 2nd camera (!!) in case you do see something you'd like to get close to
but again vibration will get you so keep the shutter speed up

if you can, get the pilot to reduce power when you want to snap - that'll help no end

but most important ENJOY IT

oh and do report back with loads of pictures!!

 

[kelack]

Argh - just typed out a long reply and got called away to sort someone's system out, came back, clicked submit and I'd been logged out and lost my reply :bang::bang::bang:

Anyway, thanks Mike

I have a 18-55 f2.8 - will that be fast and wide enough? I could always hire a 10-22 for the weekend

2nd camera? That'll be my compact - not sure if a telephoto will attach to that

Do you think my 18-200 might be okay, it's a 3.5-5.6 though

 

[mmcp42]

Argh - just typed out a long reply and got called away to sort someone's system out, came back, clicked submit and I'd been logged out and lost my reply :bang::bang::bang:

Anyway, thanks Mike

I have a 18-55 f2.8 - will that be fast and wide enough? I could always hire a 10-22 for the weekend

2nd camera? That'll be my compact - not sure if a telephoto will attach to that

Do you think my 18-200 might be okay, it's a 3.5-5.6 though

I'd say 18-55 2.8 is nigh on perfect
zoom not to shabby either
I wouldn't bother with 10-22 personally

have fun!

 

[kelack]

Super, just need a second body now

 

[DUNKS]

Never mind the camera get some insurance!
nomatter what kit you take just enjoy.

 

[kelack]

Never mind the camera get some insurance!
nomatter what kit you take just enjoy.

Husband has made sure insurance covers everything

I really can't wait for next week now

 

[Steve2]

Kelack, could you just fly over Bredhurst and take some shots please

Im sure you will enjoy it and just hope its a nice day

 

[kelack]

I think we might possibly fly over Bredhurst. Stand in your garden and wave

 

[Duncan.F]

I was a hang glider and paraglider pilot for years. I can assure you on a hot day it will be pleasantly cool at 2-3000' and on a cold day it will be bloody freezing.

18-55 will be plenty wide enough but do take a long lens for the close ups of your village. At 2000' at 55mm you will get all of the village plus. 200mm would be good for the closer shots.

One of the problems you may have is visibility, what appears to be a typical clear day at ground level can be quite different up high. Low pressure weather, generally brings fantastic visibility and high pressure days [typically hot and still] will be very poor. You can often see a layer of trapped dirty air on these days.

You will absolutely love it, there is nothing like leaving the bounds of earth! [Although I was always grateful to hit terra firma gently].

Enjoy and post your shots!

Dunc

 

[kelack]

Thanks Duncan

Let's hope for a clear day next Sunday then

 

[tdodd]

My sister borrowed my old P&S to take some shots from a microlight. Here are two at the short end of the lens, equivalent to 38mm focal length in 35mm terms....

1/125, f/5.6, 100 ISO :

1/200, f/5.6, 100 ISO :

Here is the contraption she went up in. It looks like reflection off the canopy from the inside is a problem to try to mitigate.

 

[kelack]

Cool - thanks for sharing Tim Did she enjoy it? Silly question I suppose

 

[kelack]

Oo - you added a bit as I was posting my reply

I'm hoping that I will get my lens close to the "window". If not, does anyone know how I can reduce reflection?

 

[tdodd]

Close to the window should help enormously. I would say touching the window but that might pick up a lot of vibration, I guess, so probably just 0.5cm away would be better.

If you have a bit of black cloth - tee-shirt for example - then drape that over the end of the lens (not in front of it ) to seal off any gaps at the edges. You might even use your spare hand to block a gap.

Actually I'm afraid she did not enjoy the flight. It was a lovely sunny day in July but the cockpit was very warm - think greenhouse - and it was a bit bumpy and she felt really quite ill. In fact I think she cut the flight a little short. Such a shame If you are prone to queasiness perhaps some travel sickness tablets would be a wise precaution.

I hope you enjoy your experience

 

[kelack]

Thanks for the advice Tim

Oh, that's a shame she didn't enjoy it. I am prone to travel sickness and have already checked that I have some tablets

 

[tdodd]

It seems like there are a few conflicting thoughts - It'll be cold, but my sister found it to be uncomfortably warm. I guess it depends on whether there is a canopy or you are in open air. I imagine the difference between the two will be considerable - greenhouse vs 60mph rush of cool air is quite a variation.

Some say you'll need a fast lens, to overcome vibration, but my sister's results at f/5.6 and 100 ISO suggest otherwise.

Wide angle seems the right choice. As you will see above, 38mm equivalent gives a reasonable field of view. A bit wider wouldn't hurt. I think your 17(18?)-55 would be fine, as would the 18-200. I can't see a need for two camera bodies in the cockpit.