Canon DPP users - tried DLO yet?

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fulwood

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Canon Dpp fans, wondered if any of you have tried out the recent DLO modules?

If so what do you think - does it turn 'pigs ears into silk purses?

I'm toying with re-getting a 5D original so downloaded latest DPP and had a look at some of my old RAWs with my ex 5D and a 17-40mm L.

Also got the DLO module for the 17-40. Was pleased to see that landscape pics I'd taken at 17mm f8, which had softish edges were greatly improved by the DLO tune up. So much so that I'd happily print edge to edge A3 prints from the results, in the past I'd crop the fuzzy bits.

If DLO is as good as it seems in my limited trials, then the bogey of cheaper lenses not being edge sharp on FF may have been laid.

Wondered what you had found? Does DxO do it better?
 
Well I asked a similar question a while ago, not much response.

Yes I find it does seem to improve edge definition on my landscapes especially, but at the cost of virtually doubling the file size, interested to hear others experiences...........
 
It definitely helps with poor performance areas lenses. I just find the workflow too much. I'd love to use it if Lightroom or ACR supported it but they don't.
 
Photogaz said:
It definitely helps with poor performance areas lenses. I just find the workflow too much. I'd love to use it if Lightroom or ACR supported it but they don't.
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DLO as in Digital Lens Optimiser? Lightroom probably has the most effective set of corrections available, and a huge range of supported lenses from all manufacturers. I use it all the time.
 
HoppyUK said:
DLO as in Digital Lens Optimiser? Lightroom probably has the most effective set of corrections available, and a huge range of supported lenses from all manufacturers. I use it all the time.
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It has some nice tools yes but they are not based on the lens itself. The distortion is good but it doesn't affect the sharpness. Removing CA requires a lot of care and tweaking. DLO does it in one click and does a very good job.
 
Photogaz said:
It has some nice tools yes but they are not based on the lens itself.
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Yes they are. Custom, lens-specific profiles.

The distortion is good but it doesn't affect the sharpness.
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It's not supposed to.

Removing CA requires a lot of care and tweaking. DLO does it in one click and does a very good job.
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LightRoom CA correction is one click. Are we talking about the same software? :thinking:

I used to use DPP specifically for its lens corrections, but not any more. LR4 is better IMHO, and couldn't be easier. The default custom corrections are very good, and the fine tune adjustments too (though I hardly touch them). LR's noise reduction is excellent, and sharpening.
 
What I'm saying is that Canon's DLO setting takes their lens profile and knows exactly how much CA happens based on the lens in sue and does an excellent job of removing it.

With Lighroomt you have to specify how much CA and fringing there is in order to get rid of it. DPP gets out sharpness from the shot that Lightroom just can't touch.
 
Photogaz said:
What I'm saying is that Canon's DLO setting takes their lens profile and knows exactly how much CA happens based on the lens in sue and does an excellent job of removing it.

With Lighroom you have to specify how much CA and fringing there is in order to get rid of it. DPP gets out sharpness from the shot that Lightroom just can't touch.
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Yes, that's how Lightroom works. It picks up the Exif, knows what lens has been used, focal length and aperture etc. You can apply corrections completely automatically on upload, or do it with one mouse-click, tweak it manually, do the whole thing manually, or even create your own lens profile.

It is pre-loaded with hundreds of custom lens profiles, has been since LR3, with improvements in LR4 (eg purple fringing and bokeh-CA) with more lenses continually being added.

Edit: download a free trial of LR4, see how it compares. Be interested to see :)
 
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I have Lightroom 4, to be honest I only use it if I've got 100's of pictures to process. If I take a few grabs, I load ACR.

I'm obviously missing something, perhaps you could point me to somewhere or show me screen grabs of where this is applied. I just tried it on my 35L photos which do have a lot of CA at f1.4, but it didn't make much difference. In DPP, it cleared it up no problem.
 
Photogaz said:
I have Lightroom 4, to be honest I only use it if I've got 100's of pictures to process. If I take a few grabs, I load ACR.

I'm obviously missing something, perhaps you could point me to somewhere or show me screen grabs of where this is applied. I just tried it on my 35L photos which do have a lot of CA at f1.4, but it didn't make much difference. In DPP, it cleared it up no problem.
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It's under Lens Corrections, towards the bottom of the Develop module panel. Click profile to correct distortion and vignetting, click Color to sort CA. Lens used comes up automatically or select from the pull-down menu, manual adjustments pop up at the same time.

I posted a couple of extreme examples of what it can do in this thread, post #16 http://www.talkphotography.co.uk/forums/showthread.php?t=436221

Edit: for ease, here it is below.

HoppyUK said:
Lens corrections examples from LightRoom 4, including getting a rectinlinear corrected shot from a fisheye (edge sharpness is not great though with this much stretch applied).


Sigma 15mm fisheye
Sigma%2015mm%20f16-9645_zps15955fee.jpg



Sigma 15mm fisheye, distortion corrected (roughly equivalent to 12mm on full-frame)
Sigma%2015mm%20f11%20dist%20correct-9646_zps0a3e783d.jpg



Tokina 10-17mm fisheye
Tokina%20f8%20edge%20-9677_zpsa98a8f26.jpg



Tokina 10-17mm fisheye with CA correction applied
Tokina%20f8%20edge.%20No%20CA%20-9677_zps7db3950b.jpg
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Thanks for the replies, seems that not many users of DPP + DLO have replied, give it a try and see for yourself.

As far as large file sizes are concerned, no reason not to do all your PPing, save/print your pic and on exiting DPP don't save your changes. I always do this as it means my originals are still originals and the same size as before.

Hoppy thanks for the LR illustrations, similar corrections have been available in previous versions of DPP. What DLO brings to the table besides improved CA correction is selective sharpening for soft edges, diffraction and other lens nasties removal. I've tested it out on my 40D + 17/85, 5D + 17/40 RAWs and I'm impressed. Edges are much sharper. the effect is like buying a better lens!

Have a look at this link which explains what's going on -

http://web.canon.jp/imaging/dlo/sample/index.html

Better still download latest DPP and try a few modules, it won't turn your mediocre lens into an L, but my landscape edges have been improved considerably for free.
 
Willid1 said:
I use DPP quite a bit, but only because I'm too lazy to get my head round Lightroom. Was a bit surprised by this

http://www.talkphotography.co.uk/forums/showthread.php?t=430273&highlight=DPP

And quite impressed by this

http://www.talkphotography.co.uk/forums/showthread.php?t=403543&highlight=DPP

I have also found that with some high ISO files ARC (Adobe RAW convertor) does a different/better? job of converting the Canon RAW files.

HTH

David
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David

Just followed up your links, seems like your finding the same as me, DLO transforms weak edges for free.

Just look at David's 17/85 before and after DLO crops to see what I'm on about!
 
fulwood said:
Thanks for the replies, seems that not many users of DPP + DLO have replied, give it a try and see for yourself.

As far as large file sizes are concerned, no reason not to do all your PPing, save/print your pic and on exiting DPP don't save your changes. I always do this as it means my originals are still originals and the same size as before.

Hoppy thanks for the LR illustrations, similar corrections have been available in previous versions of DPP. What DLO brings to the table besides improved CA correction is selective sharpening for soft edges, diffraction and other lens nasties removal. I've tested it out on my 40D + 17/85, 5D + 17/40 RAWs and I'm impressed. Edges are much sharper. the effect is like buying a better lens!

Have a look at this link which explains what's going on -

http://web.canon.jp/imaging/dlo/sample/index.html

Better still download latest DPP and try a few modules, it won't turn your mediocre lens into an L, but my landscape edges have been improved considerably for free.
Click to expand...

Yes, DPP is very good. I think Canon was the first to use software enhancements quite so extensively, and now incorporates them into some of its cameras too, though compact manufacturers have been using them in-camera for a long time (though they often didn't let on what was actually happening).

You cannot 'remove' diffraction effects though. It's just an inherant reduction in sharpness caused by high f/numbers and is generally tackled in the sharpneing process as a separate operation, like noise reduction.

The big advantage of Lightroom's lens corrections is their lens database is far wider, including a large number of third-party lenses. Almost all Sigmas are included I think, who collaborated with Adobe in providing specific lens data.
 
Hi Hoppy, not trying to prove the superiority of one bit of software over another, and totally agree about LR much bigger lens database.

BUT if you click on my Canon link there is an explanation of how many lens problems can be remedied by use of a lens specific DLO module - including diffraction!! I'm surprised at diffraction being sorted as I take it to be inherent with using large sensor sizes and stopped down f numbers. Canon shows the effect of going for maximum dof - stopping down to f22 i.e somewhat diffracted, and how the DLO 'smoke and mirrors' recovers the image to be little different from if it had been taken at a more IQ friendly aperture, whilst still maintaining the large dof.

It seems perfectly reasonable to do your initial PP in DPP, save as a TIFF and then continue with LR to get your final image.

Suppose that might seem to be a bit elaborate if you have 100's of images to process, but for me, with only a very occasional pic worthy of special treatment doing the above isn't too onorous!
 
fulwood said:
Hi Hoppy, not trying to prove the superiority of one bit of software over another, and totally agree about LR much bigger lens database.

BUT if you click on my Canon link there is an explanation of how many lens problems can be remedied by use of a lens specific DLO module - including diffraction!! I'm surprised at diffraction being sorted as I take it to be inherent with using large sensor sizes and stopped down f numbers. Canon shows the effect of going for maximum dof - stopping down to f22 i.e somewhat diffracted, and how the DLO 'smoke and mirrors' recovers the image to be little different from if it had been taken at a more IQ friendly aperture, whilst still maintaining the large dof.

It seems perfectly reasonable to do your initial PP in DPP, save as a TIFF and then continue with LR to get your final image.

Suppose that might seem to be a bit elaborate if you have 100's of images to process, but for me, with only a very occasional pic worthy of special treatment doing the above isn't too onorous!
Click to expand...

Diffraction is not being sorted specifically, that link is misleading, it's just a bit of localised sharpening - though no less effective for that.

See what Tim Dodd has done to the sharpness in an image in this thread, post #16 http://www.talkphotography.co.uk/forums/showthread.php?t=450330 Same difference.
 
fulwood said:
Hi Hoppy, not trying to prove the superiority of one bit of software over another, and totally agree about LR much bigger lens database.

BUT if you click on my Canon link there is an explanation of how many lens problems can be remedied by use of a lens specific DLO module - including diffraction!! I'm surprised at diffraction being sorted as I take it to be inherent with using large sensor sizes and stopped down f numbers. Canon shows the effect of going for maximum dof - stopping down to f22 i.e somewhat diffracted, and how the DLO 'smoke and mirrors' recovers the image to be little different from if it had been taken at a more IQ friendly aperture, whilst still maintaining the large dof.
Click to expand...

probably by setting the sharpness way up...

I've tried it a few times for fun and every time it wasn't even funny at the end
 
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