complete amateur DIY overheating

Yardbent

Yardbent

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John
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bought a new radiator for the 'office'...and whilst working on the PC lately, noticed a ''hot paint'' smell - obviously the rad........:thinking:

but the PC has began to shut down every couple hours ...discovered rear of top cover VERY hot .. the fan on the PSU wasn't operating......:shake:......so i guess there's a thermal cut-out.?

1....removed the top/side covers ..didn't touch any boards but 'lightly' brushed vacuumed 3 years dust off all the components

the dusty fan [on the CPU] was vacuumed and the fins on the heat-sink [?] cleaned too
[think that's the correct terminology.?]

2...removed the PSU - removed top cover - removed fan
totally jammed with dust - cleaned - replaced....all OK

re-assembled PSU and covers....:thumbs:....well except for the 2 extra screws....:D

3....downloaded software ''SpeedFan 4.45''

it's showing a temp of 50-55C fan flagged as 'hot'
but i think that's the CPU...?
#1 speed 3119rpm

4...top of case is now COOL however

sorry long-winded ..but posted to ask

is there anything else i should do..?

thanks
 
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speedfan_01.jpg
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Well you were very brave opening a PSU.

As long as the PC works OK, I would say you don't need to do anything else.

If not, then a new PSU is only around £20.
 
Need to know which CPU/Motherboard it is. I've had combinations which ran at ~50deg C at idle but it was a known issue with the motherboard/CPU combo.

Core Temp and CPU-Z will give you more information about CPU temperatures and motherboards without having to open the case.
 
neil_g said:
so is the PC sat near the new radiator?

50c is a bit warm for a CPU at idle.. what CPU is it?

does the case have any fans or the option to add fans?
Click to expand...

1......about 3feet away - fixed wall mounted

2......AMD Athlon 64X2 Dual Core Processor 5400+ 2.81 GHz

now running at 55C - if that the CPU temp

3...only fans are on CPU and PSU

RHS side of the case is blank
the LHS has 2 drilled areas

A...about 8cm circular - bolted inside this is a funnel directing air to the CPU fan

B...a 10cm square area below this
i did assume this was the 'exhaust' because there are no other Vents
[and the PSU sucks air IN rather than blowing OUT]

but Area B does have 4 drilled holes at the corners [ for a fan.?] but i'd be unsure where to pick up a supply.:thinking:

edit so case is at a positive pressure if i add a case fan in the square - or can you get a fan which sucks hot air out.

off to work ATM....thanks...john
 
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neil_g said:
good point, i missed that. you can still get a shock from a PSU that is off so go careful.
Click to expand...

very careful to hold the plastic fan surround whilst unscrewing ...thanks
 
I would replace the PSU, if the fan has been clogged for some time, the motor coils could have been damaged, also clean and repaste the CPU/heatsink assembly, recommended artic silver.

:)
 
.
ACPI x86

is that the motherboard.?

temp now 48C
 
Rob 80386 said:
I would replace the PSU, if the fan has been clogged for some time, the motor coils could have been damaged, also clean and repaste the CPU/heatsink assembly, recommended artic silver.

:)
Click to expand...

the two fans are now spinning freely
the PSU fan wasn't completely stopped - but barely turning

anything more tech - like repaste CPU - i'd get done by local shop who built the system as it will be beyond me

i couldn't even see how to get the fan off the heatsink..........:bang:
 
PS. Yes, I'd recommend a new PSU or possibly a new PC. You'd see a big (4x) improvement in performance on a self build for £300-£400 if you got an i5-2xxx based system.
 
arad85 said:
PS. Yes, I'd recommend a new PSU or possibly a new PC. You'd see a big (4x) improvement in performance on a self build for £300-£400 if you got an i5-2xxx based system.
Click to expand...

on a Pension mate
got to keep things going as long as possible

dont need speed as no games .. just TP and image PP.....:lol:
 
Chuck a couple of fans in your case, new psu... Nova tech do some good home brands, and possibly a new CPU heats sink... All in under £50 ....
 
Wouldn't worry too much as AMD's do run a wee bit hotter and 55 C isn't exactly setting the heather on fire:lol:
 
stokes said:
Chuck a couple of fans in your case, new psu... Nova tech do some good home brands, and possibly a new CPU heats sink... All in under £50 ....
Click to expand...

TOM .. thanks....easy when you know how.....;)

read above about the square 10cm mesh

if i add a fan - it seems all 3 are then blowing INTO the case ...:shrug:

i'd get the local man to do the heat-sink...but =££££
 
John, stop worrying and just get using it. 55 degrees won't kill your CPU, I've had machines run hotter. If all the fans are spinning then there's not to worry about.
 
Yardbent said:
TOM .. thanks....easy when you know how.....;)

read above about the square 10cm mesh

if i add a fan - it seems all 3 are then blowing INTO the case ...:shrug:

i'd get the local man to do the heat-sink...but =££££
Click to expand...

Fans blow one way but have holes on both sides so you can just flip them over, then they blow the other way :) try one fan first and see what happens to the temps. A lot of fans are molex, which is easily recognisable when you open the case, and they all come ready to "daisy chain" so no extra cables needed. On iPad otherwise would find you a utube link
 
Bear in mind, Speedfan isn't the most accurate for temps. Check the temps in the BIOS.
 
John,

You may find this page useful: http://www.msi.com/product/mb/K9N6SGM-V---K9N6PGM-FI---K9N6PGM-F.html

as it's your motherboard driver/docs page. You MAY want to run the live update and see if the BIOS and any drivers need updating. Don't update the BIOS if you don't feel comfortable with the instructions though (most are pretty simple to do). Getting the BIOS flashing wrong can leave you with a brick, but it may give a more accurate reading of temperatures.

Fans should blow through the case, so any fan at the front should be pulling air in any CPU cooler (if it is side mounted) should be blowing up into the power supply or towards the back if side mounted. Any fan on the back should be blowing out of the enclosure.

One final thing you might like to download is Real Temp and Prime95. These two programs allow you to stress your CPU and monitor the temperatures. Doing this will enable you to find out whether you have any thermal issues (the prime95 keeps your CPU 100% active for as long as you run it). Real temp is here: http://www.techpowerup.com/realtemp/ and contains a download button for prime95.
 
neil_g said:
55c at idle isnt too bad no, but start stressing the machine and it may still thermal shutdown.
Click to expand...

That's a few times you've mentioned idle, have I missed something?

I've had AMD's running at 70 C all day long.
 
Mikesphotaes said:
That's a few times you've mentioned idle, have I missed something?

I've had AMD's running at 70 C all day long.
Click to expand...
Depending on age and power management, there is a power differential between idle and full usage. The difference depending on how the chip has been implemented and what power saving strategies it has. Realtemp and prime95 are the best way of illustrating this over time as they give you the measurements.

At the end of the day, the hotter the chip itself gets, the shorter the time it will last. I think an awful lot of BS is pandered about this - particularly with todays length of time of ownership - a 3 year old mid range computer will generally just be replaced if it goes phut. The cost of sourcing non-current technology just makes it almost economically non-viable.

Having said that, I work for a company that produces Silicon chips for set-top boxes. Our latest chips are tested and have a normal operating envelope that goes to 125 deg. C junction temperature (i.e. the heat on the chip - which is where all these temp measurements come from). That's 125 deg, day in, day out. The product engineers don't have a problem with that (although I don't know offhand how long our chips are guaranteed for) so take from that what you will...

Some light reading can be found here: http://www.anandtech.com/show/2468/6

(I'm sure you can start googling relevant terms if you want).
 
scottthehat said:
thats a wee bit much a new computer, i doubt the computers that old.
Click to expand...
Why? I saw a massive jump from my E8400 (few years old) to the machine I'm on now. Cpubenchmark.net gives the processor in Johns machine a rating of 1500, an i5 is around 5500. I know you can't just translate numbers into multiples, but if you're doing any post processing, it's more than likely it can be split into multiple threads and that does scale quite well with the numbers on that site. Remember, it isn't just processor speed that matters, newer chips have much higher bandwidth and larger caches which help enormously.

For comparison the E8400 is 2200 on that site, the i7 I run now gets 11000 using that benchmark. I've found the "feel" of the machine to scale quite well with those numbers TBH...
 
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I know chips differ but 50C does sound hot if the machine is idling.

I'm using an Intel 2.66GHz dual core machine and it idles at about 36C. Just being running a stress test that run the cores at 100% and the temperature reached 55C.

BTW if you do get a new psu, don't buy a cheap one. You need something that can deliver steady power.

Dave
 
Mikesphotaes said:
That's a few times you've mentioned idle, have I missed something?

I've had AMD's running at 70 C all day long.
Click to expand...

Well I'm assuming thats the at idle temp, I.e. CPU sat on or around 0%, the op hasn't made it obvious if this is idle or at load temperature though which as andy said will vary.

Example, my overclocked i7 sits around 27c idle and 67c at 100% load (on air)
 
arad85 said:
Why? I saw a massive jump from my E8400 (few years old) to the machine I'm on now. Cpubenchmark.net gives the processor in Johns machine a rating of 1500, an i5 is around 5500. I know you can't just translate numbers into multiples, but if you're doing any post processing, it's more than likely it can be split into multiple threads and that does scale quite well with the numbers on that site. Remember, it isn't just processor speed that matters, newer chips have much higher bandwidth and larger caches which help enormously.

For comparison the E8400 is 2200 on that site, the i7 I run now gets 11000 using that benchmark. I've found the "feel" of the machine to scale quite well with those numbers TBH...
Click to expand...
i know what your saying and wont even say were mine ranks on that :lol:, but i think it all depends what you use it for mine does everything it needs to with cs5 and does a splendid job.
 
arad85 said:
Depending on age and power management, there is a power differential between idle and full usage. The difference depending on how the chip has been implemented and what power saving strategies it has. Realtemp and prime95 are the best way of illustrating this over time as they give you the measurements.

At the end of the day, the hotter the chip itself gets, the shorter the time it will last. I think an awful lot of BS is pandered about this - particularly with todays length of time of ownership - a 3 year old mid range computer will generally just be replaced if it goes phut. The cost of sourcing non-current technology just makes it almost economically non-viable.

Having said that, I work for a company that produces Silicon chips for set-top boxes. Our latest chips are tested and have a normal operating envelope that goes to 125 deg. C junction temperature (i.e. the heat on the chip - which is where all these temp measurements come from). That's 125 deg, day in, day out. The product engineers don't have a problem with that (although I don't know offhand how long our chips are guaranteed for) so take from that what you will...

Some light reading can be found here: http://www.anandtech.com/show/2468/6

(I'm sure you can start googling relevant terms if you want).
Click to expand...

I was Ipod Touch posting so perhaps not quite as clear as I should have been.

My point was where all this idle business came from in this thread?

Anyway, my Specsavers money was well-spent, as folk just assumed it was at idle.

I did know about the idle/full whack temperature increase but amazed at those set-top box temps.
 
neil_g said:
Well I'm assuming thats the at idle temp, I.e. CPU sat on or around 0%, the op hasn't made it obvious if this is idle or at load temperature though which as andy said will vary.

Example, my overclocked i7 sits around 27c idle and 67c at 100% load (on air)
Click to expand...

Yes, my i7 is the coolest running CPU I have ever owned.

It was down at 19 C the other day and have never had it past 45 C, so far.
 
scottthehat said:
but i think it all depends what you use it for mine does everything it needs to with cs5 and does a splendid job.
Click to expand...
I think it all depends what you're used to. The biggest perceived speed increase I've ever had was when I moved from E8400 to i7. Everything just runs very, very snappily. The laptop i7 - whilst fast - is noticeably slower than my main machine even though it ranks at 6000 odd on that benchmark. I'm sure the next upgrade (in a couple of years) will be a similar jump and I'll wondered how I managed with what I have now :shrug:
 
home again.

far too much tech knowledge here for my wee brain...but thanks everyone...:thumbs:

so here's the latest....................

went into see Strathaven Computers
''bring it in tomorrow'' and he will BLOW out all the dust out of the CPU fan and heat-sink [says it works a treat]

gave me a new fan to fit into the PSU - in case mine was a bit 'cooked' after the fan stalling

said i didn't need an extra case fan
[since noticed a large mesh area on the rear cover so lotsa room to expel air...:bonk:

got home - the PC had been idle ALL afternoon having finished a Full Run AV check while i was at work
temp 1 was 39C.....now up to 51C whilst working

have also run PC Wizard 2010; the Processor temps are
core#1 = 25.5C
core#2 = 25.5C

TMPIN0 is 51C
TMPIN1 is 34C

soooooo..no need for a new PC i feel

thanks again for the help everyone on TP...........:clap:
 
new PSU was only £18 but i have to pay for connection labour

I'll try the free fan first
 
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