Copyright theft

We are also talking about a wedding here. Why wouldn't you want to show off your big day to your friends and family and the best way (or one of the most popular) is facebook.

To ask someone they cannot put it up on the worlds most popular social network is rather strange/unreasonable and somewhat mean, must admit. Sounds all Kim-Il Jong to me. :D

You've got it watermarked. I doubt she would have the cropped out the watermarks.
 
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don't ask for advice then get huffy when you don't like it. :nono:

you have a total storm in a tea cup for no reason at all.

if you charged them and they have not paid ask for the cash

if you did it for free stop complaining

stop complaining about people showing off their wedding pics on FB


suze23 said:
POAH - bog off my thread and go insult someone else - i wanted helpful advice not insulting crap.
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It's been asked but you haven't answered.

Was a contract signed that stated exactly what the terms and conditions were including prices etc?

Also, as poah says, calm down, its not the end of the earth.
 
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TBH, the agreement's not clear at all here.

And if you put it in perspective...someone has just got married. They don't give a hoot about copyright (and why should they, that's not their job?). They're just excited to show their friends and family the pictures of their wedding, which they have been given.

Doesn't seem like much of a crime.
 
suze23 said:
Ok basically i did my mum a favour for her friend by doing her wedding pics. These pics (As requested) are on a CD (i know i know!) all with my copyright on them....

Today ive found them on facebook..... naturally i will be sending her a message requesting the removal of them (she dosent realise i can actually see her pictures...)...

How can I word it politely as i'm incredibly annoyed.....

Thanks.

p.s - i DO NOT do this for a living - its my hobby and i make a few quid (from friends!!) now and again and i do not advertise as i have no intention whatsoever of making a career out of rphotography.....
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You have no intention of making this a career and you don't do this for a living, you did it as a favour but now you want to be paid? Sorry I'm confused. You know people don't get paid when its a hobby.

OK just 2 things quickly, did you have an agreement in writing, even email, that spelt out your conditions? And if not, why did you hand over the images if you were expecting payment and haven't received it?
 
These threads are always hilarious. I don't get why people start trying to claim payment for pictures that get shown on FB. I could understand if they were claiming they took them or were trying to sell them fair enough, but really most people have friends and family on FB and a wedding the biggest day for most people want to share that day with people who couldn't be there, where can you do that...............FB is the most convenient way.

The second issue is you agreed to do it as a favour, favours are generally done for nothing, hence the favour part. If you wanted to be paid you should have either charged for the wedding with the pics thrown in or agreed on which pictures they wanted at the cost you wanted.

Thirdly without a written contract its just your word against theirs. Whilst they are your pictures, you handed them a CD of images which we could have included the rights to do as they please with them, without in writing how does anyone know that you said you can't put them on FB, you can't print them out etc.

Fourthly you have had your fingers burnt and learnt a valuable lesson, something your likely not to repeat again. Next time you'll make sure an agreement is made prior to doing the gig and you'll make sure you get payment before handing over a disk of images. Suck it up and put it down to experience.

Sticking a big invoice in won't do you any favours, its likely not to get paid and you'll just get bad mouthed for making terms and conditions up as you go along. Of course you may have set those T&C's before hand but no one will care when the person with the pics is spouting you are trying to get payment for some pictures you did as a favour. You'd be better off asking her politely to credit you with the pictures and you never know it may lead to some more work.
 
pitkin2020 said:
These threads are always hilarious. I don't get why people start trying to claim payment for pictures that get shown on FB.
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we found a facebook profile with over 40 of our photos screenshot'd from our website, that wasnt so funny.. ;)

and copyright is copyright, if the OP didnt specify in writing that copyright was transferred to the bride (or whoever) then the OP can ask/get them taken down whether they have been paid for or not ;)
 
Suggest you just be chuffed that your mum's friend liked the photos you took so much that she wanted to share them with the world on facebook. Lots of positive karma to be had here be being generous.
 
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neil_g said:
we found a facebook profile with over 40 of our photos screenshot'd from our website, that wasnt so funny.. ;)

and copyright is copyright, if the OP didnt specify in writing that copyright was transferred to the bride (or whoever) then the OP can ask/get them taken down whether they have been paid for or not ;)
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Your talking about something different though, those images were stolen not handed over on a disk!!

I agree copyright is copyright but what I am saying is you can't say your doing it as a favour then start asking for payment over loosely applied terms. I suspect if he goes around to her house she may have one or two on the wall, will he ask for payment for those too and maybe charge more because they are in a pine frame rather than a metal frame he verbally specified.

Your either doing it for payment or a favour. You don't have to do as a job to receive payment but you do have to make it perfectly clear from the outset. If you hand someone a disk of images what are you really expecting them to do with it, they will show them to friends either at home or online and they will get them printed.
 
suze23 said:
im not naieve - but i knew her.... and her friend and told her specifically "i do not want to see these images on facebook".....!!

Last time i don anyone a "favour" - a complete waste of 3 hours of my life for her to take the p*55 out of me and not even a thank you....
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After reading all your comments in this thread I get the impression that its more the fact that she hasn't thanked you that's ticking you off. I agree that is pretty rude and annoying, but getting nasty won't help. Have you tried friending her on FB? Maybe she is expecting you to and she will thank you there. Of course this will also let you see if she had other photos you took there and see what's being said.

Forcing a thank-you by getting nasty won't feel like real gratitude anyway, and if she feels your terms were not clear, regardless of what you think, it won't look good if she starts saying bad things about you. Try a friendly approach and before it gets out of hand just chalk it up to experience.

BTW 3 hours isn't a lot of wedding coverage, maybe look on the brightside and be thankfull it wasn't 14 hours.
 
Can you clarify, did you do the wedding as a favor for your mum (a wedding gift for the couple) or did you quote them a price but only did it as your mum knows them, I'm a bit confused as to whether they realise they owe you money. If it's the later did they pay a deposit/booking fee up front?
When you gave them the disk of images were they full size or small sample/preview size, and was there anything printed on it, terms of usage etc?
 
I get the impression this is I'll do it as a favour to my mum, it'll be fun and an experience, then it's turned into hang on I could make money from this?

Not putting things on Facebook is a strange request these days.

I found a picture of Poah "Calm down dear"
winnny.jpg
 
pitkin2020 said:
Your talking about something different though, those images were stolen not handed over on a disk!!

I agree copyright is copyright but what I am saying is you can't say your doing it as a favour then start asking for payment over loosely applied terms. I suspect if he goes around to her house she may have one or two on the wall, will he ask for payment for those too and maybe charge more because they are in a pine frame rather than a metal frame he verbally specified.

Your either doing it for payment or a favour. You don't have to do as a job to receive payment but you do have to make it perfectly clear from the outset. If you hand someone a disk of images what are you really expecting them to do with it, they will show them to friends either at home or online and they will get them printed.
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yeah i know slightly different but my point was its not funny to find your photos rehosted without permission.

and my 2nd point still stands regarding copyright and having no persmission to reuse the images whether they were handed over on disk or not :)
 
neil_g said:
yeah i know slightly different but my point was its not funny to find your photos rehosted without permission.

and my 2nd point still stands regarding copyright and having no persmission to reuse the images whether they were handed over on disk or not :)
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Yes I understand what you are saying but we are still talking a different scenerio here, i'm guessing your a tog by trade so its your business. If you gave me a CD of images I would expect them to preview images, you would have also explained copyright atleast a little as to what I can and cant do with that disk of images. Now if a friend gave me a disk of images they had taken as a favour I would expect them to be mine, not come with conditions of use.

I wouldn't expect my mate a plumber to offer to fit my bathroom for free but then come round a few weeks later and say "I hear you have been using the taps, that wasn't agreed I need to be paid £6 for each use of the tap!!".

Copyright is copyright I totally agree but its no good complaining when people use the images if they haven't been fully made aware of what copyright actually is, you had a disk of images to someone who has no idea what do you expect to happen.
 
pitkin2020 said:
Yes I understand what you are saying but we are still talking a different scenerio here, i'm guessing your a tog by trade so its your business. If you gave me a CD of images I would expect them to preview images, you would have also explained copyright atleast a little as to what I can and cant do with that disk of images. Now if a friend gave me a disk of images they had taken as a favour I would expect them to be mine, not come with conditions of use.
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youd be surprised how many even ignore those conditions of use but yes i see what youre saying :)
 
neil_g said:
youd be surprised how many even ignore those conditions of use but yes i see what youre saying :)
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That doesn't surprise me lol but atleast then you have the opportunity to take it further as its probably in writing as well as being explained verbally. This is the problem with doing things as "favours", the person offering the favour can invariably have a different idea of how things are going to pan out to the person receiving the favour. Plus we only have the story to go by that the OP has put up here. I suspect if the bride had given the OP a big thank you and said how great the pictures were there would be no real issue I think TBH.

I suspect the OP has learnt a valuable lesson but personally trying to claim copyright theft or breach of copyright isn't going to do you many favours. Plus the OP has said that only 2 images are on FB as they are aware so you can only charge for the ones you can prove, is it worth it for £12!!
 
artyman said:
Seems to me you agreed to photograph the wedding for free, so no payment due. You requested they werenot to be displayed on facebook, but to be honest in this day and age how do you expect people to show their friends their wedding photos, a bit unrealistic to be honest. If the couple printed copies of shots and distributed them to friends would you also feel agrieved. I think you are being unrealistic here, if you want to be paid for shooting establish conditions beforehand not after the event.
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I think you have hit the nail right on the head.

End of the day you did it as a favor and the photos are not only OF them but of an important day in their life. Simply put to expect them not to distribute their wedding photos over whatever medium is currently popular when you handed it over Gratis is extremely Nieve. That would be like the church or photographer stipulating that none of your graduation photos could appear on Facebook.

The issue here is that she wants people to see them (their her wedding after all) and you want either some sort of recognition or payment for the photos. Unless you have some sort of written agreement saying if the photos ended up in the pubic domain best you can do is issue her a take-down request.

Either way with photos of this nature I think your going to be taking it to court anyway which is going to make your mum look bad and probably cause more arguments than it's worth.

Look at it as free advertising and next time offer images watermarked to hell and £6 for the original (large version) jpg. Your never going to be able to able to control photos of this nature that you give away so you either do it for a favour or a favour with a handoff.
 
From how I understand this...

It was communicated that photographs would be taken and any that they wanted would be paid for at £6 each or whatever.
There would be no fee for taking the photos themselves, only they wanted to use/keep.

A CD with watermarked photos was provided so they could choose which ones they liked.
They have not paid for any of the photos on this CD.
It was made clear that these watermarked photos must not end up on facebook as they are copyrighted.

They have now taken those watermarked photos which they DO NOT have right to distribute and used them without payment.

When you consider the cost of a wedding altogether, a few extra quid doesn't seem that out of sorts. I don't know the cost of normal wedding photography, but these prices don't seem excessive.

This seems to be similar to cases where event photographers (say horses, motorbikes racing, etc) take photographs for 'free', then list them on their web site to allow people to buy them. Understandably, these people are often annoyed (I know some just see it as free publicity) when they then find their copyrighted photos on people's forums, blogs and facebook pages without payment.
 
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