D700, D3 or D3s

[fracster]

How is it nonsensical when I never claimed, nor have I ever claimed, that they Nikon 'make' batteries?

Producing something is entirely different to making it, but even then it's still irrelevant and has no bearing on the point in question.

So explain, oh wise one, when you buy a grip with a AA battery tray, where do Nikon state which AA batteries one should buy?

You are wrong. We all are at times,no shame in it, just hold your hand up and admit it.

 

[NorthernNikon]

because it not a submarine
and your wrong end of, and are you not a nikon pro member, you get it when you buy so many bits of nikon pro gear, it gets you better faster service.

Being a Nikon Pro member doesn't give you special dispensation for repairs outside of the warranty except at certain major events when the Nikon Pro centre will service and clean kit for accredited pros.

Hence the suggestion to try them out with a repair that isn't covered under warranty.

 

[NorthernNikon]

So explain, oh wise one, when you buy a grip with a AA battery tray, where do Nikon state which AA batteries one should buy?

You are wrong. We all are at times,no shame in it, just hold your hand up and admit it.

I've listed them in a post above.

 

[scottthehat]

so i can walk in to poundland and buy 8 ni-mh bateries for my nikon to use and thats ok because they approve ni-mh batteries.

 

[NorthernNikon]

The sign of someone that is losing an argument is when they resort to personal insults. You'll be invoking Godwin's Law next

If you say so, but I wouldn't give this thread the status of argument, it's more me responding to a number of people who mis-read posts and who seem to have difficulty grasping a simple concept.

Uh-huh and they only "approve" non-oem batteries of the type they don't "manufacture". Funny that.

Nikon's motives for doing so is neither here nor there, it doesn't alter the wording of the user manual and warranty.

 

[fixedimage]

as i said the use of 3rd party lens will not be approved to use on nikon bodys next.
Just incase the motor shorts out and damages the camera.

You think that if a Sigma or a Tamron lens were to develop a fault which damaged an otherwise fine Nikon body that Nikon would entertain any sort of warranty claim? If you want to kid yourself on that they will then go right ahead, I'll be taking my claim to the lens manufacturer if that happens though and I would do so safe in the knowledge that Sigma, Tamron, Tokina etc were all big, well established companies with reputations to uphold. Do an ebay search for D3 battery and look at how few of the cheapo 3rd party batteries have manufacturers names on them, think there might be a reason for that?

As for where the batteries come from, in reality none of us probably know whether or not Nikon employees wearing Nikon uniforms, working in a factory with Nikon on the front of it and drinking Nikon brand tea on their breaks manufacture "Nikon" batteries or if they buy them in and brand them, nor do we know which other parts of their cameras are made in a Nikon factory and which are simply bought in and assembled in a Nikon factory and we don't have to, Nikon have taken the time to find reliable sources of high quality parts and are willing to take responsibility for them so we don't have to, they just charge you accordingly.

To whoever argued that they had some genuine Nikon batteries that they could switch out to in the case of a warranty claim, a) the OP was talking about buying a grip and battery so doesn't have any genuines to switch with and b) if your 3rd party leaks into your camera or shorts and causes a fire or any melting and you think sending a non-leaking, undamaged genuine Nikon battery in with the warranty claim will wash then go for it, I'd give the Nikon loss adjuster a bit more credit though.

 

[Flash In The Pan]

If you say so, but I wouldn't give this thread the status of argument, it's more me responding to a number of people who mis-read posts and who seem to have difficulty grasping a simple concept.

It's not a case of "if I say so" you made a personal comment, which, as I said in my previous post, is usually the sign of someone that knows they've lost the argument discussion.

 

[fixedimage]

so i can walk in to poundland and buy 8 ni-mh bateries for my nikon to use and thats ok because they approve ni-mh batteries.

Yes, exactly.

 

[NorthernNikon]

so i can walk in to poundland and buy 8 ni-mh bateries for my nikon to use and thats ok because they approve ni-mh batteries.

Yep. You could even go wild and buy yourself one of those mutli-packs of mini Daim bars while you're there.

The AA is standard fair, Nikon aren't going to have any concerns with the use of such a ubiquitous battery in their kit except, perhaps, the more exotic Li-ion versions which could be prone to damaging kit if the short.

 

[scottthehat]

You think that if a Sigma or a Tamron lens were to develop a fault which damaged an otherwise fine Nikon body that Nikon would entertain any sort of warranty claim? If you want to kid yourself on that they will then go right ahead, I'll be taking my claim to the lens manufacturer if that happens though and I would do so safe in the knowledge that Sigma, Tamron, Tokina etc were all big, well established companies with reputations to uphold. Do an ebay search for D3 battery and look at how few of the cheapo 3rd party batteries have manufacturers names on them, think there might be a reason for that?

As for where the batteries come from, in reality none of us probably know whether or not Nikon employees wearing Nikon uniforms, working in a factory with Nikon on the front of it and drinking Nikon brand tea on their breaks manufacture "Nikon" batteries or if they buy them in and brand them, nor do we know which other parts of their cameras are made in a Nikon factory and which are simply bought in and assembled in a Nikon factory and we don't have to, Nikon have taken the time to find reliable sources of high quality parts and are willing to take responsibility for them so we don't have to, they just charge you accordingly.

To whoever argued that they had some genuine Nikon batteries that they could switch out to in the case of a warranty claim, a) the OP was talking about buying a grip and battery so doesn't have any genuines to switch with and b) if your 3rd party leaks into your camera or shorts and causes a fire or any melting and you think sending a non-leaking, undamaged genuine Nikon battery in with the warranty claim will wash then go for it, I'd give the Nikon loss adjuster a bit more credit though.

its not the point is it, its no different to using non oem batteries is it (what ever type they are), and if i was worried thats what i pay my insurance for.

 

[scottthehat]

Yep. You could even go wild and buy yourself one of those mutli-packs of mini Daim bars while you're there.

The AA is standard fair, Nikon aren't going to have any concerns with the use of such a ubiquitous battery in their kit except, perhaps, the more exotic Li-ion versions which could be prone to damaging kit if the short.

what so not all the batteries mentioned can damage the grip and body if a fault happend with them.

 

[fixedimage]

its not the point is it, its no different to using non oem batteries is it (what ever type they are), and if i was worried thats what i pay my insurance for.

Which part of my post are you referring to?

 

[fixedimage]

what so not all the batteries mentioned can damage the grip and body if a fault happend with them.

Who knows, who cares. If Nikon told you that you could cram white grapes into the battery compartment and you put red grapes in their you'd be up the creek without a paddle when your D3 realised it wasn't a wine making machine n stopped working.

 

[NorthernNikon]

It's not a case of "if I say so" you made a personal comment, which, as I said in my previous post, is usually the sign of someone that knows they've lost the argument discussion.

No I said 'if you say so' because suggesting that someone has 'lost an argument' not because of an inability to construct a reasoned argument or under the charge of spouting meaningless rhetoric, but simply because of a throw away remark, is just a bit pathetic.

What's more, your spurious claim above combined with the lack of further posts from you regarding the actual question in hand, would suggest to me that, contrary to your assertion, victory is mine.

 

[Flash In The Pan]

The AA is standard fair, Nikon aren't going to have any concerns with the use of such a ubiquitous battery in their kit

Why, is it only 3rd party versions of Nikon batteries (where they have a high profit margin) that leak?

The non-oem battery scare is no different from the way the manufacturers coined the term "grey market" (inferring that this was somehow something dodgy in the way "black market" is) for cameras bought outwith the official channels. It's to do with protecting revenue streams and nothing else.

 

[scottthehat]

Who knows, who cares. If Nikon told you that you could cram white grapes into the battery compartment and you put red grapes in their you'd be up the creek without a paddle when your D3 realised it wasn't a wine making machine n stopped working.

sorry but if you dont care why comment, people on here care when there getting told false information, all nikon say is Use only batteries approved for
use in this equipment.
i dont see in any of my books that i must only use nikon en-el3 batteries

 

[Flash In The Pan]

No I said 'if you say so' because suggesting that someone has 'lost an argument' not because of an inability to construct a reasoned argument or under the charge of spouting meaningless rhetoric, but simply because of a throw away remark, is just a bit pathetic.

What's more, your spurious claim above combined with the lack of further posts from you regarding the actual question in hand, would suggest to me that, contrary to your assertion, victory is mine.

Hardly a spurious claim, I merely pointed out that you lowered yourself to a personal attack when you couldn't come up with a valid response. I'd say that was pathetic.....

 

[fixedimage]

No one has actually argued that a non oem battery is more (or less) likely to leak in your camera than a genuine item, the discussion has simply been about what will hapen to your warranty IF a non oem battery goes wrong.

Of course it's to do with protecting revenue streams, does anyone actually think or has anyone argued that it's for any other reason?

 

[fixedimage]

sorry but if you dont care why comment, people on here care when there getting told false information, all nikon say is Use only batteries approved for
use in this equipment.

What I don't know or care about is the likelyhood of damage occurring if a non oem battery fails while in your camera. My point was that Nikon can approve whatever they want for use in their equipment but it's still tha case that if you use something that is not approved for use then your invalidating the warranty.

 

[scottthehat]

i dont see in any of my books that i must only use nikon en-el3 batteries
it states Use only batteries approved for
use in this equipment.
which an en-el3 battery is.

 

[scottthehat]

sorry andy for this, will stop now, get and buy the d3s and enjoy it mate, man i would love that bad boy.

 

[fixedimage]

That's because if any of your books said only use en-el3 then Nikon couldn't possibly sell you a higher priced en-el3a.
What you will find is something that says something like 'Use only batteries approved for use in this equipment.' and then if you looked at an en-el3 or an en-el3a you'd see that both were approved for use in your equipment.

Sorry, I think the newer battery is the en-el3e not a.

 

[NorthernNikon]

Why, is it only 3rd party versions of Nikon batteries (where they have a high profit margin) that leak?

If a Nikon battery leaked any damage to the camera wouldn't be covered by camera's warranty. Nikon could still be liable if the battery was found to be faulty, but that's a different issue altogether.

The non-oem battery scare is no different from the way the manufacturers coined the term "grey market" (inferring that this was somehow something dodgy in the way "black market" is) for cameras bought outwith the official channels. It's to do with protecting revenue streams and nothing else.

No it's not. This isn't about leaking batteries, this is about the way power supply can affect electronic goods. A non-OEM battery could easily damage a camera if voltage and or current aren't correct and/or consistent.

 

[fixedimage]

If a Nikon battery leaked any damage to the camera wouldn't be covered by camera's warranty. Nikon could still be liable if the battery was found to be faulty, but that's a different issue altogether.

That's a good point, a simple leak doesn't always mean a warranty case. Warranty is usually for 'manufacturing or material defects'.

No it's not. This isn't about leaking batteries, this is about the way power supply can affect electronic goods. A non-OEM battery could easily damage a camera if voltage and or current aren't correct and/or consistent.

As could an Oem battery. In the case of the Oem battery though , Nikon have either tested the battery and approved it or tested a sample from the production run and approved them so such inconsistencies are unlikely. With Non Oem batteries (especially cheap ebay ones) there may be no such testing.

 

[NorthernNikon]

As could an Oem battery. In the case of the Oem battery though , Nikon have either tested the battery and approved it or tested a sample from the production run and approved them so such inconsistencies are unlikely. With Non Oem batteries (especially cheap ebay ones) there may be no such testing.

Indeed, also in the case of OEM batteries the manufacturer is liable either way.

 

[itsdavedotnet]

Oh my god, what did I start, jeeeeesus.
The first person who can bring me substantiated proof of a third party battery's electronics ever actually damaging a professional dslr camera, I'll post you a poundland bag of mini dime bars...

Back to the actual thread.

Andy, I'll be blunt and I apologise in advance for that, but I feel I need to say it.

Haven't you gone through like, 4 different pro cameras in the last 12 months or so? I remember saying this same thing in a thread where you were contemplating the1d4.

If you're as apt at changing your mind as it would appear, definitely don't buy anything new, so you don't have to take a hit if you sell it on.

Buy a d3, and then actually go out and take bloody pictures, instead of spending your life wondering about what £4000 camera to buy next week.

 

[boyfalldown]

Being a Nikon Pro member doesn't give you special dispensation for repairs outside of the warranty except at certain major events when the Nikon Pro centre will service and clean kit for accredited pros.

Hence the suggestion to try them out with a repair that isn't covered under warranty.

Eerrrrr yes it does. That's the major advantage of the service.

Andy they are all great bodies & I doubt youd tell the difference between any of them if you look at the photos. The d3 &d3s bodies do feel much better to use and are a lot tougher. Up to you if this is worth the extra

 

[scottthehat]

Eerrrrr yes it does. That's the major advantage of the service.

Andy they are all great bodies & I doubt youd tell the difference between any of them if you look at the photos. The d3 &d3s bodies do feel much better to use and are a lot tougher. Up to you if this is worth the extra

thanks hugh.

 

[NorthernNikon]

Eerrrrr yes it does. That's the major advantage of the service.

No it doesn't. In the spirit of the thread I'll ask you to show where you think that it says that it does, but before you do, read what I actually said before you go and try to find something that refutes what you think I said.

(And that's goes for both NPU, the service that was being referred to by scotthehat, and NPS, the extended service for actual pros not just those who buy qualifying kit, that I had in mind when talking about Nikon's pro service.)

 

[Flash In The Pan]

Oh my god, what did I start, jeeeeesus.
The first person who can bring me substantiated proof of a third party battery's electronics ever actually damaging a professional dslr camera, I'll post you a poundland bag of mini dime bars...

Make sure they're genuine Dime Bars, Dave. Don't want you liable for making someone ill by sending them third party Dime Bar-like sweets

 

[NorthernNikon]

Make sure they're genuine Dime Bars, Dave. Don't want you liable for making someone ill by sending them third party Dime Bar-like sweets

There's a chance of making someone ill if they were genuine Dime bars, they'd be well past they're best before date seeing as they haven't been called Dime bars for years.

 

[Flash In The Pan]

There's a chance of making someone ill if they were genuine Dime bars, they'd be well past they're best before date seeing as they haven't been called Dime bars for years.

Make a note of that, Dave - find some Dime bars to send Barney if he ever manages to find evidence of a 3rd party battery damaging a pro dslr

 

[NorthernNikon]

Make a note of that, Dave - find some Dime bars to send Barney if he ever manages to find evidence of a 3rd party battery damaging a pro dslr

Well I'll sleep easily at night. I don't need to find any evidence of damage, it's a complete non sequitur to suggest that I do.

I don't know if any houses have ever been damaged by a sonic boom, but I do know that most house insurance policies exclude cover for damage caused this way. Likewise, I'm not going to trawl the net for examples of third party battery mishaps to 'prove' an exclusion that's already proven.

 

[boyfalldown]

No it doesn't. In the spirit of the thread I'll ask you to show where you think that it says that it does, but before you do, read what I actually said before you go and try to find something that refutes what you think I said.

errr...yes it does. You said (just in case you're not clear), or think you typed something different

Being a Nikon Pro member doesn't give you special dispensation for repairs outside of the warranty except at certain major events when the Nikon Pro centre will service and clean kit for accredited pros.

and in the NPS service guide it says

All NPS members are entitled to use our Pro Track Express Service for repairs to equipment

and then details how to access this.

Or maybe its only available at certain events. Maybe you'd like to point out where they say this though?. Of course having read the guides and read what you said it still sounds like a special dispensation to repairs regardless of whatever you (evidently unclearly) meant

 

[raj_kemp]

Back to the thread.
I need some advice please.

I had D300 and sold it here few days ago and was trying friend's D700 for last month, was extremely happy with it. But now he has changed his mind and not selling his D700. Hey, now I don't have a camera body.

Now, having realised that you have to fork out so much for the grip+better battery (although i had a non-OEM grip on D700) and gripped body never feels as good as D3 (from what I have read), is it wise to buy a used D3 instead of D700. I can't wait for new one (D4 / D800) till next year and also D3S is out of my reach.

IQ wise, is there any major difference between D3 and D700 (they are same sensors), and buying a used D3 means I don't loose much if upgrade, say in one or two years. So should I buy new/used D700 or used D3...decisions:bonk::bang:

 

[scottthehat]

so if my 8 aa poundland batterys went wrong and fried my d700 nikon would say thats fine they were approved to use because there ni-mh so we will fix it..

 

[boyfalldown]

Yes

 

[NorthernNikon]

errr...yes it does. You said (just in case you're not clear), or think you typed something different

and in the NPS service guide it says

All NPS members are entitled to use our Pro Track Express Service for repairs to equipment

and then details how to access this.

All that is is a preferential service in terms of speed of response and the provision of replacement kit for the duration of the repair etc. You still have to pay for repairs outside of warranty unless they make an ad hoc decision not to charge.

Or maybe its only available at certain events. Maybe you'd like to point out where they say this though?. Of course having read the guides and read what you said it still sounds like a special dispensation to repairs regardless of whatever you (evidently unclearly) meant

I believe they call Nikon service centres at events 'Nikon Depot'. If you are a member of NPS they will generally clean, service &, in some cases, repair your kit free of charge.

What I said was quite clear for anyone with an understanding of English. 'Priority' is not the same as 'special dispensation.'

 

[boyfalldown]

All that is is a preferential service in terms of speed of response and the provision of replacement kit for the duration of the repair etc. You still have to pay for repairs outside of warranty unless they make an ad hoc decision not to charge.

I believe they call Nikon service centres at events 'Nikon Depot'. If you are a member of NPS they will generally clean, service &, in some cases, repair your kit free of charge.

What I said was quite clear for anyone with an understanding of English. 'Priority' is not the same as 'special dispensation.'

Ok then whatever you say :shrug:

If reading wasn't to much for you I didn't say they'd do it for free - just that they'd make a special dispensation (look up what it means before slinging the sad little man insults) which a priority repair is

 

[NorthernNikon]

so if my 8 aa poundland batterys went wrong and fried my d700 nikon would say thats fine they were approved to use because there ni-mh so we will fix it..

Yes

Err, no, not necessarily. Warranties only cover manufacturing defects. If the batteries fried the D700 because the circuitry wasn't fit for purpose or a chip was faulty then it would be covered under the terms of the warranty. If however the D700 was technically fine & the cause of the 'frying' was down to faults in the battery then this would not be covered under warranty and you'd have to recover your loss from the place you bought the batteries from.

That's the way it works in theory, in practice there are too many variables for anyone to say 'yes' or 'no' to a general question like that.