DOF at f3.5

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Hi
I am after my first DSLR having currently a bridge camera. One of the reasons for upgrade is control over DOF but because I can’t afford f2.8 lens my question is:

How shallow DOF can you achieve using f3.5 lens? (like kit lens on budget cameras) Could you present some photographs where you used f3.5-f5.6 and managed to achieve shallow DOF?
Thanks
 
How shallow DOF can you achieve using f3.5 lens? (like kit lens on budget cameras) Could you present some photographs where you used f3.5-f5.6 and managed to achieve shallow DOF?
Thanks

It's a bit of an open ended question really. DoF is a function of magnification and aperture. The focal length will have a big bearing on the result and the visual effect will be related to the distance between the foreground and subject and the background and subject.

A 600mm lens with a 2x T/C (f/8 effective minimum aperture) has very little DoF when compared to a 24mm lens at f/2.8.

Bob
 
but as an example for you, I just put the canon 500d kit lens on for you and took a few shots of my bonsai sappling.

f/3.5 taken at 18mm from a distance of about 25-30cm the window fram behind is about 15cm from the plant.
img4762i.jpg


taken at f/5.6 same conditions as before.
img4763u.jpg


In the photos above you can see even some of the needles on the plant are out of focus depending on their position front, back or sides, everything depends on distances from the subject if I had been further away and zoomed in the DOF would have been different. and possibly the window frame would have been in focus. I would go to guess if I had a 600mm as sugested above the houses at the back would have been in focus if I had managed to get far enough away to focus on the plant.
 
This is fantastic!!! Big thanks to both of you. It is much shallower Dof than I was expecting. Great.

to put simplisticly.. the background in the example is so far away its bound to look good...
 
Search my past post over the last few days and I did the same thing with the 24-70mm someone wanted to compare f/2.8 and f/4

another example I switched to the 50mm f/1.8 had to move back a little to focus but there is not much of the houses at the back. but also the window fram is nearly gone aswell.
img0002yp.jpg


The houses at the back are not really a good example as they are so far behind the subject and the subject is so close to the camera. Everything is linked depending on the distance between everything else.
 
There is a online DOF calculator Here, just plug the numbers in and it'll give you an idea :)
 
The bit your missing about Bob's reply in post #2 is the part about magnification, which affected by distance, focal length, and also by format.

By changing from a compact to a DSLR you are getting a much bigger sensor format which automatically has much higher magnification. So for a given f/number you'll get much less depth of field.
 
Hoppy UK: bigger sensor = higher magnification? I would thing that it is the other way round isn't it? Smaller the sensor, bigger magnification required to get the picture. Or is it me missing the point? :)
Anyway, this is why I want to upgrade to DSLR, my bridge camera is amazing but lacks big sensor. This results in lack of shallow DOF and high ISO noise.
 
Hoppy UK: bigger sensor = higher magnification? I would thing that it is the other way round isn't it? Smaller the sensor, bigger magnification required to get the picture. Or is it me missing the point? :)
Anyway, this is why I want to upgrade to DSLR, my bridge camera is amazing but lacks big sensor. This results in lack of shallow DOF and high ISO noise.

Haha yes! But no.

The image projected by the lens is bigger. When you roll out all the calculations (circle of confusion size etc) the amount of sharpness lost by enlarging more from a smaller sensor to get a given print size, is outweighed by the gains from starting out with an image that is smaller to start with.

It is basically f/number x crop factor. So if you start with full frame as a standard (24x36mm) then Canon crop factor is 1.6x (15x22mm). F/number x1.6 is a difference of about 1.3 stops. Compact sensors are relatively tiny. They vary but 4x is a typical crop factor relative to full frame, about 4 stops.

In practical terms, if you compose your your subject with a full frame DSLR at f/11, to get the same depth of field and composition with a crop sensor Canon, you would need to set f/6.9 (and use 1.6x shorter focal length lens to maintain the same composition). Picking up your compact, assuming it's 4x crop factor sake of argument, you would need to set f/2.8.

TBH these numbers don't hold exactly true when you are comparing extremes like going from full frame to a compact, and there are other variables like the shape of the sensor, the aspect ratio, which is 3:2 for DLRS and 4:3 for most compacts (it's the diagonal measurement that's important). However, given that depth of field is, in practise, a very inexact science anyway because it depends on various factors that don't usually apply a lot of the time (such as print size, viewing distance, what is deemed acceptably sharp and what isn't etc etc) it's a pretty good approximation.
 
Strumstrum: The image you shown was the most probably taken usin Macro or Super Macro mode. I found that there are two methods of achieving shallow DoF with S9600. 1st is to use one of the Macro modes but that works when you are photographing object very close to the camera. 2nd is to use long focal distance and small aperture - but there is no image stabilization so you need to bump the ISO up. Sadly this camera in not great with high ISO noise.
If you know any other method I would be delighted to know.
 
Strumstrum: The image you shown was the most probably taken usin Macro or Super Macro mode. I found that there are two methods of achieving shallow DoF with S9600. 1st is to use one of the Macro modes but that works when you are photographing object very close to the camera. 2nd is to use long focal distance and small aperture - but there is no image stabilization so you need to bump the ISO up. Sadly this camera in not great with high ISO noise.
If you know any other method I would be delighted to know.

There is no other method. By moving close or using the long end of the lens you are making the subject bigger, increasing magnification. Apart from using a lower f/number that's all you can do without changing to a camera with a larger sensor.
 
remember though that is only 3.5 at 18mm. if it was me i would buy a DSLR but also buy a 50mm f1.8, all companies do them but canon and nikon are older models so they lack advanced coatings and then theres sony's offering for the sony 50mm f1.8 but it is a little bit for expensive (around £30 more) but it has the advanced coatings and SAM motor, or even get a second hand minolta 50mm f1.7.
 
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