Enlarger contrast help needed!

[Nebular89]

The student set of ilford contrast just turned up so I tried them out today. Whilst easier than using the colour head I am still getting low contrast prints, I can’t seem to grasp where I’m going wrong.

My method is I make a test strip with no filters to judge the best overall exposure. Then I make a larger test with the time I’ve picked. If the contrast is too low I work my way up the contrast filters until I’m happy.
However I made a print today that even with the contrast 5 filter looked too dark and had no bright whites.
The “final” print was made at f8 with the 5 filter for 10 seconds.
What should be my next step? Would reducing the exposure time allow the highlights to pop more whilst keeping the darks dark? I’m assuming that increasing the exposure time wouldn’t help as it would just burn in the highlights more. Or have I not understood it?

 

[GreenNinja67]

Are they genuine Ilford Multigrade filters?

~Are you sure the paper is Multigrade? Could normal paper have been put in the Multigrade box?

Are the negs thin and washed out?

Do you have other correctly exposed negs to try and compare to?

Lots of possible variables

If the print is too dark you've exposed for too long, a no. 5 filter will increase the contract. Different exposure times will make the print darker or lighter.

 

[Nebular89]

Are they genuine Ilford Multigrade filters?

~Are you sure the paper is Multigrade? Could normal paper have been put in the Multigrade box?

Are the negs thin and washed out?

Do you have other correctly exposed negs to try and compare to?

Lots of possible variables

If the print is too dark you've exposed for too long, a no. 5 filter will increase the contract. Different exposure times will make the print darker or lighter.

Genuine filters, it’s kentmere paper bought from new. The negative is fine, I printed it years ago when I had another enlarger but I used the colour head for that.
I probably just exposed it for too long then. I had been doing some contact printing before hand so I’d had enough at that point. I’ll play around with the exposure time.

I seem to have forgotten how to make decent prints. Granted it was with a different enlarger but I had no problems 6 years ago

 

[GreenNinja67]

I'm amazed I remembered all that as I've not printed since the early 90's!

It all came flooding back as I was reading your questions.

Hopefully what I've posted is good info.

If not someone who has more recent experience will put you right.

 

[Nebular89]

I'm amazed I remembered all that as I've not printed since the early 90's!

It all came flooding back as I was reading your questions.

Hopefully what I've posted is good info.

If not someone who has more recent experience will put you right.

No it helps. I think I try to change too many variables at once. I’ll add a filter as well as adjusting the time. I should be doing test strips when I add/change a filter. I think I just end up guessing.

 

[GreenNinja67]

I used to be able to look at a negative and know which multigrade filter was required for the look I wanted as well as the exposure length. Remember @flashp ?

No way could I do it now.

Best of luck with it mate.

Change one thing at a time is my advice.

 

[Nebular89]

I used to be able to look at a negative and know which multigrade filter was required for the look I wanted as well as the exposure length. Remember @flashp ?

No way could I do it now.

Best of luck with it mate.

Change one thing at a time is my advice.

Ultimately I want to get the under lens filter set, I’ve only got the set without the halves. Ilford have a few videos on split grade which make it look fairly fool proof.

I’ll have another crack tomorrow.

 

[joxby]

My method is I make a test strip with no filters to judge the best overall exposure. Then I make a larger test with the time I’ve picked. If the contrast is too low I work my way up the contrast filters until I’m happy.

Never done that in my life....lol, you're going to zero in on exposure timing through a with filter test strip so to test strip without a filter seems like an unnecessary step unless you do not intend to use a filter.
Choose your filter first and test strip that for exposure
If you don't like the contrast change the filter and test strip that, over time you'll get the hang of best guessing which grade of filter to start with that will suit your needs.
I've done quite a bit of split grade printing but it never seemed to lessen my use of paper or speed anything up so I just went back to the chaos I understand...lol

 

[Nebular89]

Never done that in my life....lol, you're going to zero in on exposure timing through a with filter test strip so to test strip without a filter seems like an unnecessary step unless you do not intend to use a filter.
Choose your filter first and test strip that for exposure
If you don't like the contrast change the filter and test strip that, over time you'll get the hang of best guessing which grade of filter to start with that will suit your needs.
I've done quite a bit of split grade printing but it never seemed to lessen my use of paper or speed anything up so I just went back to the chaos I understand...lol

That does seems to make more sense!

 

[flashp]

I used to be able to look at a negative and know which multigrade filter was required for the look I wanted as well as the exposure length. Remember @flashp ?

No way could I do it now.

Best of luck with it mate.

Change one thing at a time is my advice.

I do, good times.
The OP should do a test strip down the thin strip between frames so he's testing for absolute black on the film base itself. Look for the last discernible change and that's the exposure that will drop everything else into line. Then deal with the matter of contrast/paper grades separately.

 

[GreenNinja67]

I do, good times.
The OP should do a test strip down the thin strip between frames so he's testing for absolute black on the film base itself. Look for the last discernible change and that's the exposure that will drop everything else into line. Then deal with the matter of contrast/paper grades separately.

Glad to see your memory's as good as mine.

We're not to old for this s***!

 

[Rodinal]

Ultimately I want to get the under lens filter set, I’ve only got the set without the halves. Ilford have a few videos on split grade which make it look fairly fool proof.

I’ll have another crack tomorrow.

Your statement that you only got a set with no half grades set the cogs whirring. Ilford MG in the ranges from version 1 to the present version 5 all had 1/2 grade filters, but there was a much earlier version of MG from the 50's/60's which in no way are compatible with the any of the later ranges and they only came in full grades. Can I ask where you got them from? Are they in a yellow box with a small picture on the top? I have seen the results from the early filters and paper and to be kind they were not very good, with no true blacks anywhere.

Also, using even the present MG filters they are graded for Multigrade paper, and although Kentmere is owned by Ilford, I don't know if they are 100% compatible. You will be better using the filters in the colour head. Inside the packet/box of Kentmere will have the filtration values included for that paper.
Kentmere always was a tad harder and faster (about 1/2 a grade) than the Ilford equivalent, so to get a grade 2+ you can just print without a filter. The exposure will be a little shorter as well.

Split grade printing is quite an advanced technique and it takes a while to master it, despite what the videos show. When it works it is good but when it doesn't, it can mean lots of wasted paper in the bin.